Hello everybody. In the meantime I have bought my .40 smith&wesson m&p and know I am looking for an good defense load. Here in in austria I can get these loads

federal hydra schocks in 155, 165 and 180 grain configuration
remington jhps in 165 und 180 grain configuration
and 155 grain winchester silvertipps.

Witch of the above mentioned loads would you recomend or what would you recomend something else?

Thanks for your help in advance

Greetings from Austria.

Agent, if you go to http://proarms.podbean.com/ (scroll to the bottom of the first page click on "previous entries", then scroll down the page that that pops up. It will be there), there is an old podcast that you might find interesting. It's A Conversation with Keith Jones. Keith is the winner of four deadly force encounters as a police officer, a firearms enthusiast and shares his opinions on the best loads in .40 S&W.

Unfortunately I have a bit of experience with the .40 S&W and I do not like this cartridge at all. It lacks velocity and the better hollow points (including the bonded core) just don't penetrate enough. If I had a choice, I'd rather carry the Speer 180 gr. FP that we use for practice instead of the Gold Dot.

Dave Sinko

"just don't penetrate enough"

Seriously? The .40 penetrates about the same as every other service caliber round available, and more than many loads that one can buy for 9mms/.38/.357mag/.45


Kieth is a good guy and knows his stuff (and actual repeated gunfight experience should be listened to), but he and I disagree on this one, I like the 180gr .40s, he doesn't.

Agent00, I think any of the 165 or 180 grain loads you have available to you will work fine. I tend to stay away from the lighter bullet weights in any handgun intended to be used for defensive purposes.

Winchester 165 grain SXT chronographs 1083 fps out of my G27; I was surprised to see it was running that fast in a 3 1/2" barrel. I haven't tried it in either of my G22's, but the extra inch of barrel should put it well over 1100 fps.

Thx for the great infos. @cjw3 I am also the opineon that the heavier bullets are a better choice for sd. Concering the winchester sxt? Are the sxt rounds a better choice than the ordinary winchester silvertipp, or ist there no difference at all. The SXT rounds would also be available here in austria, but they would cost more then the silvertipps.

Others may want to have input, but I'm guessing that there would not be much difference between one brand of jacketed hollow point ammunition and another. There is a lot of competition between the companies to manufacture good ammunition, particularly for self defense, and if some load doesn't measure up they will not sell much of it.

We have used 165 grain and 180 grain SXT's on a few occasions to kill feral hogs where I used to work, some of them as large as 200 pounds. Some fell over with one shot, some ran a distance before dying, so it all goes back to the importance of shot placement. I wouldn't necessarily recommend a .40 to hunt hogs, but they were our issued handguns (Glock 22's) and that is what we could get to in a hurry when a hog would be seen crossing the road, etc.

+1! I've clocked rounds over 1000 ft/sec from my g27 with JHP penetration of 14 inches.

That's.. pretty good to me!

Of those mentioned as available to the OP, my preference is the 155gr. Hydra Shok. It is loaded fairly hot, expands reliably, and should penetrate plenty.

Thx again for the information. I have done some furhter investigations and it would be possible to order some speer gold dot rounds.I think will order the speer ammo, because it seems that the gold dot rounds have a very good reputation on the street.

Check this out;

Service Pistol Duty and Self-Defense Loads - M4Carbine.net Forums


The short answer is that it's hard to find a bad .40 load.

I use the Speer gold dot 165 gn HP, I like this bullet weight in the .40 and it shoot great in my MP.

I use the Speer gold dot 165 gn HP, I like this bullet weight in the .40 and it shoots great in my MP.

I stick with the 180's. Sectional density for this cartridge is as good or better than anything else in common duty pistol calibers. All other things being equal, better sectional density will produce greater penetration. Pretty much in every caliber I shoot, my preference for bullet weights is at the upper end of what is available.

Out West

I carry with a Speer Gold Dot 155gr HP

Speer Gold Dots are very good. I carry Winchester Ranger T-Series 165gr which is basically the same as the Winchester SXT. Most brand name defense loads work very well. Test the ones you can find and see which is the most accurate out of your M&P.

Federal Hydra-Shoks, 180 grain

The Speer Gold Dot is the best not "restricted to law enforcement only" round available IMO. I would go with the 180 if you can get it. If not, get the 155 but be prepared for a very snappy recoil. You will not have a problem with insufficient penetration with either of them. The rest of your choices are all about equal, not nearly as good as the the Gold Dot, and I'd go with the 180 grain weight in the ones you mention.

I'm not a Hydrashok fan, we used to issue the 155 and were unimpressed with them in several OISs. The 155 Federal Tactical and 155 Gold Dot seem to work well.

Good luck and please let us know what you decide to go with.

Thx again for the infos. In the meantime I have ordered some 155 grain gold dots. They should arrive in two weeks. Mayby I can even get some 155 grain federal tactical rounds via germany. But i don' think that the 155 grain federal tactical would offer some advantages for my needs.I only need an good indoor defense load, because I am only an civilian and I have carry permition, so it is very unlikly that I need on good barrier penetration load.

Gold Dots and the Federal HST ammo should both do well through auto glass, I'm not sure about other barriers with the Gold Dots, but my hunch is that they both will do fine. Use whichever is easiest to get and/or you and your gun shoot best with.