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  #1  
Old 03-15-2011, 03:40 PM
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Default Rifled Shotgun Slug vs Bear???

Looking for input from anyone who has actually shot larger game with a rifled slug (bear, moose, elk). How did the slug perform, and what did the recovered slug look like?

In the link below, look at the picture of the fired slug. It has flattened out like a coin. Isn't that going to be terribly detrimental to penetration? I have tested slugs on a variety of materials, and they do indeed flatten out. Anyone with practical experience on living tissue?

Federal Premium - Slug Details

I noticed that for "use", Federal recommends the round for "medium" game. In the past, they had recommended it for large game (had a picture of a moose), but no longer. Puzzling.

The reason I picked this load, is that the slug is 547 gr, 1600 fps and 3100 ft lbs of energy.....up there with the .45-70, at least on paper.

Last edited by off road; 03-15-2011 at 03:43 PM.
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Old 03-15-2011, 03:53 PM
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I don,t know where you live ? but here in Alaska the preferred bear slug is Brenneke. Some folks use 3 inch for more power but I myself and others like the 2 3/4 better less recoil means faster follow up better hits with a small reduction in power. they simply are the BEST and are bad medicine when the chips are down in my 870 Express they are Black Magic
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Old 03-15-2011, 04:15 PM
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I have some Brennekes but they are so old I don't trust them anymore. I have tested them, and they do not flatten as badly as the Foster type slugs. Haven't found them locally lately, but I can try mail order. Black Magic is the only one they seem to recommend for bear. Thanks.

http://www.brennekeusa.com/cms/blackmagic.html

Use to live in SE Alaska. Back then I carried a 4" M29 and a .444 Marlin rifle (wish I had kept that sweet rifle!). Maybe a Marlin 1895SBL is the easy answer?

Last edited by off road; 03-15-2011 at 04:22 PM.
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Old 03-15-2011, 04:24 PM
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Brenneke is the way to go, the best slugs bar none, and for that matter they are the best designed rifle bullets too. I used to be acquainted with a guy who had a Suhl drilling for hogs and black bear, 1 9.3x74 underneath two rifled 12ga barrels, the rifle for long range the 12ga for close up. From all I have ever seen, either are deadly with the Brenneke's holding up better than the Foster type.
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Old 03-15-2011, 04:24 PM
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I myself would rather have pump shotgun faster
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Old 03-15-2011, 06:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J-FRAME View Post
I myself would rather have pump shotgun faster
I will agree that a shotgun is handier than even a very handy lever action. If you are in a group, best to have a mix of both rifles and shotguns I would imagine.
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Old 03-15-2011, 06:59 PM
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I think knowledge of bears -making noise- no food in tent - being aware of whats going on around you etc is better than any firearm. Guns are for the last resort and it will be fast ,ugly and in very close. All that being said two of my friends(man and wife) sleeping in their tent VERY woods wise big rifle in the middle a teenage bear jumps on the tent while they were sleeping and killed them both so you take your chances sometimes. I have had them come up to my tent several times in the night but they just walked off. Who really knows when its your turn I guess and its the chance you take but I would feel stupid not to have some big gun around in case you need it
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Old 03-15-2011, 07:05 PM
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I know they make a mess in deer ...I'm sure it would do the same in a bear. They shatter bone very well. I have only recovered one slug from a deer and it wasnt as deformed as I thought it would be, and it shattered its pelvis in several spots. Hope this helps.
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Old 03-15-2011, 07:27 PM
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Default 1oz. Foster Slugs..

In the deer I've killed with Foster Slugs the slug isn't usually recovered. Penetration on broadside shot in 200 lbs Whitetails is typically complete.

You didn't say which species of bear you were conerned with, but the one Black Bear killing I was in on with a slug had already been wounded but was finished of handily by my old man with his Remington Model 11.

Brown Bears would be a different story I bet...
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Old 03-15-2011, 08:05 PM
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Witnessed two (300+lb)boar killed with one shot using Brenneke original.
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Old 03-15-2011, 08:20 PM
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My local mountains are full of black bears, and they aren't particularly fearful of humans! I carry a .44 Ruger Alaskan or 329NG, and don't particularly feel the need to drag around a long gun when hiking, but I do keep a shotgun in camp.

I think a Foster slug or even 000 buckshot would do the job on a black bear, but I am thinking more about the future when we might be back in griz/brown bear country once again.

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Old 03-15-2011, 11:58 PM
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Pilots are required to have a firearm and ammo as part of a survival kit in Alaska. We could carry anything we were comfortable with and big revolvers were generally preferred (you could break an arm in a forced landing, so shoulder weapons might be problematic) One guy I knew of carried a 20 gauge with slugs for "bear medicine" (though if a broken arm is a likelyhood, I hate to think of what would happen to a thin walled shotgun!) Pilots flying in from the lower 48 couldn't bring our handguns across Canada, so I flew with a 30-30 with 170 gr. soft points aboard.
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Old 03-16-2011, 12:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt C. View Post
Witnessed two (300+lb)boar killed with one shot using Brenneke original.
One shot each? Or was it a "Quigley?"
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Old 03-16-2011, 06:19 AM
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If you are goung to use slugs use the brenneke! They are are made from Harder lead and Super Accurate. I had a Benelli slug gun that would print cloverleaf groups at 50yds. I only used the 2 3/4" standard loads, I think They make 2 3/4 in magnum. I think I saw something somewher about taking African big game using the Brennekes.
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Old 03-16-2011, 08:34 AM
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Quote:
Pilots flying in from the lower 48 couldn't bring our handguns across Canada, so I flew with a 30-30 with 170 gr. soft points aboard.
Oh come on, please don't tell me you can't fly over Canada with a handgun!!! That is totally ridiculous! In the air even... Oh Please!
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Old 03-16-2011, 11:42 AM
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Oh come on, please don't tell me you can't fly over Canada with a handgun!!! That is totally ridiculous! In the air even... Oh Please!
Did'ya ever think they might have to land in Canada for fuel?
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Old 03-17-2011, 02:53 AM
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Quote:
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Did'ya ever think they might have to land in Canada for fuel?
Wow, just Wow!
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Old 03-17-2011, 03:14 AM
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We did have to land and clear with Canadian Customs. BTW, the customs officer informed me that hollowpoint ammunition wasn't allowed either (fortunately I packed soft points!)
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Old 03-17-2011, 08:27 AM
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[QUOTE=yaktamer;135873115]One shot each? Or was it a "Quigley?"[/QUOTE

Two with one shot. Unintended though.
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Old 03-18-2011, 02:57 PM
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I finally settled on Brenneke Black Magic. I will load 2 3/4" in black bear country, and 3" for anything bigger.

Black Magic
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Old 03-18-2011, 04:51 PM
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In Alaska, the highway workers will have a guy on the crew with a 375 H&H standing guard. A lot of people up there are fond of the .45-70 Marlin lever guns (the "cowboy" model with the generous magazine underneath) If I every go back I'm taking a Marlin.
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Old 03-19-2011, 04:56 PM
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Thanks for the post; I was going into "bear thread" withdrawal.


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Old 03-19-2011, 04:57 PM
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But seriously, I would imagine that slug pictured in the link in the first post deposited a LOT of energy before it stopped; the fact that the tip of it is flat doesn't bother me.
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Old 03-19-2011, 05:09 PM
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My brother in law hunts black bear in Carolina, has got at least 3 that I remember, I think I asked him about slugs or buckshot and he said "Naw, you don't want those." He uses a 444 (or 450?) Marlin ported guide gun with a 4x scope.
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Old 03-23-2011, 10:54 PM
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DixieSlugs Home

Here are some interesting options...
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Old 03-23-2011, 11:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason68 View Post
My brother in law hunts black bear in Carolina, has got at least 3 that I remember, I think I asked him about slugs or buckshot and he said "Naw, you don't want those." He uses a 444 (or 450?) Marlin ported guide gun with a 4x scope.
All I am interested in is sheer knockdown power, at short range. He most likely was considering other issues like longer range shots, etc.

That said, the .444 is one of my all time favorites, and more than enough gun for a black bear. I wish Marlin would chamber it for a wider variety of their guns.
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Old 03-24-2011, 03:07 AM
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DIXIE SLUGS!!!
Nothing else even comes close to the stopping power! They make Brenneke's look like a cork fired from a air rifle Google it!
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Old 11-24-2011, 08:01 PM
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I have used slugs to kill two black bears, both of which were over 300 lbs. using 3" Brenneke Black Magic Slugs. I have also taken a 710 lb moose with the same slugs. All three were one shot quick kills. One of the bears and the moose were complete pass throughs after breaking one shoulder. The other bear was also a shoulder shot. Both shoulders were broken and I found the slug right under the hide on the far side. Believe me when I say that with the 3" Brenneke Black Magic slugs, penetration is not a problem! The muscle and bone that make-up a 360 lb black bear's shoulder is not insignificant. To penetrate the hide, fat, and muscle and still break both big shoulder bones is no small thing for any slug to do on a 360 lb. boar bear.
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Old 11-24-2011, 08:18 PM
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There is a fellow that posts over on the leverguns fourum from NW montana IIRC. Some time ago he had a problem with a grizz raiding his chicken coup. His son went out one night when the bear paid another visit armed with some form of remington 20ga loaded with your standard foster slugs. Outcome was 20ga 1 bear 0, IIRC it took two shots to put the bear down IIRC.

Speaking of black bears check out this biggun' shot with a Marlin lever action, probably a 30-30. Paco Kelly's Leverguns.com • View topic - 746 lb. PA Black bear!
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Old 11-24-2011, 08:26 PM
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Default Flying over canada armed

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArchAngelCD View Post
Oh come on, please don't tell me you can't fly over Canada with a handgun!!! That is totally ridiculous! In the air even... Oh Please!
AA: I agree If I am flying over canada , it will be with a loaded 4" 500 SW and Marlin 1894 45-70 also loaded. If I go down I am not going to be scrounging for ammo in the wreckage. I guess they could start shooting at the plane, which would cause all kinds of other repercussions, that they would regret. MOLON LABE
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Old 11-24-2011, 08:33 PM
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Default 444

Quote:
Originally Posted by off road View Post
All I am interested in is sheer knockdown power, at short range. He most likely was considering other issues like longer range shots, etc.

That said, the .444 is one of my all time favorites, and more than enough gun for a black bear. I wish Marlin would chamber it for a wider variety of their guns.
The 444 is nice for a long barreled 44, better with some Garret 300 gr, but I would rather carry my 629 and a real rifle caliber.
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Old 11-24-2011, 08:35 PM
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Well OFFROAD, it seems from a quick read that only one person has actually shot anything over 300 pounds using a slug. I as well have wondered about foster slugs. I have talked to a wild game processor from back east and he stated that at the end of the year he had a coffee can full of slugs that had stopped in deer. One poster states he has shot completely through 200 pound deer broadside with foster slugs. I have done the same with a 380 ACP. I hope some more experenced BIG game hunters will respond.
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:12 AM
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Long story.

About 30 years ago my parents got some land out in the middle of nowhere. The state of Alaska was giving away the land free. All you had to do was stake it out and file some papers.

Little did we know that the cabin we built was just yards from a well used game trail. It was also very close to a slough where king salmon spawned.

The cabin was raided several times by bear until we made some upgrades. We also had to clear the brush out to 50 yards or so to see the bear coming.

The only way to get there is by boat or float plane.

I later went into the military and didn't come back for three years. When I did return to the cabin I saw a brown bear rug on the wall. Estimated at 600 pounds.

My father shot it with a Brenneke 12 ga slug at 30 yards. He tried warning shots to no avail. My mother was at the outhouse and the bear was between the cabin and outhouse.

Not wanting too, my dad shot him.

Slug went through the top of the right shoulder downwards and exited under the left shoulder. The bear fell right where he stood but did not die. Another slug and he was done.

Dad skinned him and put him in the smoke house.

When I was much younger, I saw an old timer with a side by side 10 ga. He only used slugs.

We were camped on a sand bar on a fishing trip. While away fishing a black bear raided our camp. Ate EVEREYTHING and bit holes in the cooler, pots and pans.

Next day we went fishing and the old timer stayed behind. Couple hours later we heard a shot and knew the bear returned. Old timer shot him in the head. The slug exited and there wasn't much left of the bears head.

Slugs work well. The harder the slug the better. But I've also seen 45-70's and 444 Marlin work just as well.

That being said, growing up hunting and fishing in Alaska, we always had a 12 ga close by. It was one of the first firearms I learned how to use other than a Ruger Blackhawk 44 mag.
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Old 11-25-2011, 10:16 AM
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[QUOTE=off road;135872453]I have some Brennekes but they are so old I don't trust them anymore.

Why don't you trust them anymore? If they have been stored properly and show no signs of deteriation, they should be good to go. If you have doubts, take some out and see if they still fire.
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