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Old 06-16-2012, 04:18 AM
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Default 145 Grain Silvertip .357 Info

Member Wayne Dobbs posted here that the Dallas police found the 145 grain Winchester Silvertip .357 to be extremely effective against human opponents. That was back when revolvers were common there.

Have any of you got data about it, especially on how it fares against deer at 50 yards or less, pigs, coyotes, etc., or other combat reports?

I'd be especially interested in any reports that can compare it to the Federal 158 grain Hydra-Shok load. A Federal PR man told me some years ago that the Hydra-Shok works very well on whitetailed deer at reasonable range. I don't think a .357 is a great deer hunting item, but that may or may not suggest how it'd perform on men. And a .357 might have to be used on bears, cougars, etc., as well as deer that present suitable targets in season or who attack people, which happens more often than one might think.
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Old 06-16-2012, 07:31 AM
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I hunt our SW deer with a .357, and it also serves for an occassional coyote or pig. No bears. I've used various loads, mostly handloads.

Anything you catch broadside inside 75yds can be taken down with anything from 125gr up, it seems to me. However, I prefer 158gr softpoints for the less than perfect angles, especially pigs. Expansion is nice, but penetration is vital, and I hate to have to track down crippled animals. Shot placement is key.
Compared to my .270, the .357 does not produce enough shock to matter, and the animal dies from blood loss, unless the bullet hits the spine and drops it right there. YMMV
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Old 06-16-2012, 07:59 AM
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One of my shooting buds has been a handgun hunter for many years.

He is a devout fan of the 158 gr LSP .357 round. He has numerous trophies
on the wall he has taken with it.

I guess it works just fine.
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Old 06-16-2012, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldafsp View Post
One of my shooting buds has been a handgun hunter for many years.

He is a devout fan of the 158 gr LSP .357 round. He has numerous trophies
on the wall he has taken with it.

I guess it works just fine.

I don't understand, "LSP". Do you mean a jacketed softpoint with lead tip, or the original lead SWC that has a rep for leading-up bores in short order?

Or a handload with a lead bullet with a gas check on the base?

Your point about whatver it is working well seems clear, but I 'm puzzled by the exact load. Sorry; guess I'm a little dense.

If he uses factory softpoints, ask which brand. And if they show any expansion. I realize that he is concerned more with penetration in a hunting load.

My concern is whether the 145 Silvertip and the JHP Hydra-shok will work well on both men and game.
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Old 06-16-2012, 03:57 PM
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T.S., I have taken a large javelina with the 145 Silvertip and it worked just fine. I believe that either the Silvertip or HS load, properly placed, would work just fine for Texas whitetails or two legged critters.
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Old 06-16-2012, 04:39 PM
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Thanks. I know that HS has gone through several tweakings to get it to open up sooner. I suspect that it'll still penetrate adequately for such needs.

I'd probably be using it from a four to six-inch barrel. But I've seen the Silvertip clocked at 1175-1200 FPS from even three-inch barrels. That's good velocity, and might make a wise choice for my SP-101, if not too vigorous on recoil. Haven't shot any .357 ammo in that gun yet.

But 140-145 grainers may be the optimum balance for three-inch barrels.
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:47 AM
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I still have part of a box of Win 145 gr Silvertip HPs that I bought
several years ago. I quickly became disgusted with the quality of it
when I chronographed five rounds through three different guns, two
4" and one 6". Extreme spread for five shots in all three guns was
at least 125 fps. If I wanted good full power .357 JHP loads I would
load my own.
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Old 06-17-2012, 05:15 PM
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I have at least a thousand rounds of 145 Silvertips laying around here. I'm going to chrono it from my 681, 27 and 24 inch Rossi when I get the chance. I suspect it'll be good coyote medicine from the Rossi, but I'm very interested in what velocities I get.

I've seen several folks here state that the Silvertips are good for less flash and blast than the usual 125 grain SJHPs, but that has not been my experience. I can actually feel the blast of the Silvertips on my face when I drop the hammer on one. The Rem SJHPs aren't that bad.
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Old 06-17-2012, 05:24 PM
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Sorry about the confusion. Semi jacketed lead soft point is what I was referring to.
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Old 06-17-2012, 05:52 PM
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Texas Star,

I cannot give you hard, substantial use data but here's my beliefs on the Winchester 145 grain Silvertip.

I load and shoot a lot of .357 bullets. I have only killed one javelina and that with the Speer 140 grain hollow point. I have killed no other game.

But, as I said above, I do load and shoot a lot and therefore study the .357 a lot. I like the Speer and Sierra 140 grain hollowpoints and Winchester 145 grain hollowpoints. Because they weigh less they can be driven fast enough to hopefully achieve quality expansion. That may be difficult with any 158 grain bullet, hollow point or not.

The 158 has a sectional density of around .177 and the 145 sectional density is not available to me but the Speer 140 is .157. That, in a handgun may not be much to alter penetration capabilities. And of course the weight difference is only 13 grains between the 158 and 145.

I have read in several places and times that achieving good expansion in many handgun rounds is considered by some to be a "sometime" thing, especially in shooting humans. I have read here, on this forum, whereby a number of experienced shooters actually prefer a good lead semi-wadcutter in .357 of a weight from 158 grains and up. According to them the semi-wadcutter design does a lot of damage because the bullet cuts a clean, sharp hole and induces more bleeding. But it may or may not expand that much. I think they may be correct. For my "heavy" .357 load I use the old Speer 160 grain jacketed, lead-nosed semiwadcutter. I can shoot it as fast as possible with no leading, I may get good expansion because of the large amount of exposed lead, and I might get good clean-cutting wounds due to the design.

The Speer 135 grain Gold Dot hollow point is well described and demonstrated by "hickock45" on Youtube. It is destructive and appears to penetrate very well. BUT, it is supposedly designed for the .38 Special and may go to pieces on game in a top end .357 load. You may want to go there and google "speer 135 grain". He also does the same for the famed "FBI" load using the lead 158 grain semiwadcutter. Of course both of his videos are using .38 Special factory loads.

If you go to MidwayUSA.com and read the reviews for the Winchester 145 grain Silvertip you may find more answers to your question. it looks to me like a reliable deer and small hog bullet.

From what I have read about big hogs and black bears that are angry and charging I would not trust ANY .357 load. If I had to carry only a handgun it would be .41 or .44 Magnum.

I apologize if this is a bit too extensive and that you may have done some of this research already. I just love the .357 and enjoy conversing about it. It's a favorite cartridge for me.
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Old 06-17-2012, 10:09 PM
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I don't know much about how well Win Silvertip ammo compares to the other ammo available today but I do know it is scary accurate in my S&W M640. That's all that I carry in that revolver when I can get it! (when it's loaded with .357 Magnum ammo)
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Old 06-20-2012, 01:06 AM
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This was recommended to me by Gary Roberts as an adequate load for my purposes. Anyone got a decent source for case lots?
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Old 06-20-2012, 02:25 AM
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I worked as a cop on the Ft Worth PD during the 80's and the USBP later on. The 145 STHP was my favorite load for the 357 Magnum. It works very well on people, skunks, coons, and dogs.
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Ammo Thread, 145 Grain Silvertip .357 Info in Ammunition-Gunsmithing; Member Wayne Dobbs posted here that the Dallas police found the 145 grain Winchester Silvertip .357 to be extremely effective ...
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