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Old 02-08-2013, 08:27 AM
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Default Why would LGS Lie to good customers faces.

just picked up three boxes at wallyworld. Gun stores are lying cause i just paid 8.97 not 19.99

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Old 02-08-2013, 08:42 AM
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they are also jacking up the price on 22's to $40.00 a brick,
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Old 02-08-2013, 08:42 AM
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The manufacturers have not raised their prices any more than they normally would. In defense of the LGS, they do not sell TV's, tires, and cheap clothing to off set the cost of standing behind the counter talking politics with some guy that's just kicking tires before he returns to Walmart to purchase a new Remchester deer rifle.
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Old 02-08-2013, 08:43 AM
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Same box as well as a white box version with an F on the end of the product ID were $8.99 at Academy yesterday.

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just picked up three boxes at wallyworld. Gun stores are lying cause i just paid 8.97 not 19.99
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:04 AM
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I'm sorry , I don't understand. Why would you pay $19.99 when you can go down the road and get the same thing for $8.99 ?

I quite often choose one store over another because of price or service.

I've seen 1000 rds. of 5.56 on GB for $1200. I've seen Pmags for $60 ea. I've seen AR's for $3000. You can ask what ever you want. But, IF people are Not willing to pay it ,..?

By the way I have a used toothbrush, I'm asking $1500 for..
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiganScott View Post
The manufacturers have not raised their prices any more than they normally would. In defense of the LGS, they do not sell TV's, tires, and cheap clothing to off set the cost of standing behind the counter talking politics with some guy that's just kicking tires before he returns to Walmart to purchase a new Remchester deer rifle.
^This. I was at a local large gun store recently and there were just two people working there vs. what used to be about ten. I guess the others are on short-term layoff as there is nothing to sell. I doubt that $19.95 would even cover their cost at the moment. Cost includes more than just the wholesale cost of the item. Wally World negotiates hard with manufacturers for best pricing. I used to sell to them, I know. Sam used to say "I don't make money when I sell something, I make money when I buy it." A Wal*Mart supplier gets paid "Everyday Low Prices" for their product. Your LGS buys in small quantities from a distributor, not the manufacturer. Wal*Mart's cost of delivery and sales is also minimized by the economics of scale (ask Wal*Mart employees about "Everyday Low Wages"). Doesn't mean that anyone lied. The LGS is at a serious competitive disadvantage and is suffering from it - especially during this system upset.

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Old 02-08-2013, 09:16 AM
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Business boils down to supply and demand. Now that supply is returning to meet demand, prices will go down.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:22 AM
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Default LGS Are liars.

A "gun store" here had umc fmj .40 S&W in sandwich baggies of 25 for 20.00 yesterday.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:32 AM
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Default Re: LGS Are liars.

I don't wanna hear any defense for lgs's. they sell guns with a 200-300 dollar markup. plus they are selling 10 times as many guns lately. There's no defense for them.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:33 AM
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Default Re: LGS Are liars.

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Originally Posted by perfectcircle1 View Post
just picked up three boxes at wallyworld. Gun stores are lying cause i just paid 8.97 not 19.99
Not really (im sure some are though)
I dont know who WM uses but LGSs use middle man/distributors. Often no two gun stores use the same distributor. Distributors charge a fee and its often based on how much the LGS can sell (today its not a problem). For instance, in the past my LGS was able to get deals on M&Ps. They were new and flying out the door for $375. Same with the FN45 tactical @ $599. Great prices but the catch was they had to buy several thousand at one time. A few miles away another LGS couldnt even come close on those prices....different distributor. Now the roles are reversed. The other LGS has plenty of ammo and until just recently was selling it by the case while the first LGS has been limited to one box per cal, per person, per day. Again different distributors, different stock, 5 miles apart.

WM might deal directly with the manufacturers. Also not all Walmarts sell guns and ammo. Closest one to me that does is 20 miles away while several near by Walmarts dont. To buy a rifle at Walmart I'd have to drive 1.5 hours and pay turnpike tolls. Walmart can offset their ammo prices with the sheer volume of sales from all other departments including such as electronics, clothing, food, home goods, their other store.....Sams Club, their new cell phone service provider (yes if you haven't seen it yet WM is not just selling cell phones but also providing cell service) the space they rent to a bank (located inside the stores). Thats a huge offset that no LGS is going to match.

Comparing the two is like apples and cheese steak.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:38 AM
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I don't wanna hear any defense for lgs's. they sell guns with a 200-300 dollar markup.
Glad the shops around here aren't gouging us. Well,3 of the 4 aren't at least. The 4th guy has been gouging for 30 years. He did sell about 600 guns to Gander Mountain not too long ago.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perfectcircle1 View Post
I don't wanna hear any defense for lgs's. they sell guns with a 200-300 dollar markup. plus they are selling 10 times as many guns lately. There's no defense for them.
Let's see... You publish the "fact" that they are liars and don't want to hear how there may be another explanation. And you posted why? To express your know-all end-all command of the situation?

Maybe we should teach them a lesson and put all of them out of business. We can do to ourselves what the anti's were unable to do by legislation. They sold "ten times as many guns" for 'bout a week. That bolus is spent.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:47 AM
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Default Re: LGS Are liars.

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I don't wanna hear any defense for lgs's. they sell guns with a 200-300 dollar markup. plus they are selling 10 times as many guns lately. There's no defense for them.
Ok sure. One goes to a middle man the other directly to the manufacturer. One owns their own delivery trucks the other has to pay UPS. One can stop selling ammo and still be fine, the other has to call his distributor, see if anything is available and pay more then the other LGS or get in line and wait.

$200-$300 dollar mark up? Ok my LGS was charging $1100 for a basic Colt 6920 AR. Today, to buy one from a DISTRIBUTOR, its closer to $1600 and sell for $1700-$1800. So to you the markup is $800 +/- but the LGS is making the same $$ as before but not being able to restock as fast or at all. Meanwhile they still have to pay employees, electricity, rent if any, pay people who want to sell their guns. The buying frenzy really lasted about 2 weeks or so. In that time EVERYTHING was sold. Now what trickles in gets snatched up quick. But all that other stuff still has to be paid.

There are only so many manufacturers (who by the way were already behind before all this) and with the span of a week EVERY LGS IN THE country is placing large orders for EVERYTHING. All 4 LGSs within a 10 mile radius of me have not seen 223/556 ammo in weeks. One managed to get a case of AE 223 and was selling it for $15/box. I think the ammo lasted 1/2 a day

Im sure there are some who are gauging prices but that seems to be an exception.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:54 AM
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Walmart knew to not put all its eggs in one basket. It makes up in cheap clothing what it loses in ammo. Simple Business Economics 101.

Small gunstores with limited financial resources and inventory cannot compete under these conditions for very long. The playing field is not level in the business world.

A company can make $100 selling one gun, or another can make $10 for the same gun but sells ten of them. Who do you think will survive?
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Old 02-08-2013, 10:10 AM
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People are acting like idiots, as long as you have enough ammo to defend yourself and hunt with which aimt much, forget about the gun thing for a while and find sometjing else to do. Screw them all.
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Old 02-08-2013, 10:25 AM
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Default Re: LGS Are liars.

I know all the scenarios. I own my own business. I was told by a very close friend of mine that works at a store distributor prices has not changed on ammo meanwhile at the store that i visit the most and am friendly with its operators, looks at me right in the face and says "distributor prices has gone way up". That is a bold face lie.
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Old 02-08-2013, 10:34 AM
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Default Re: LGS Are liars.

Oh one more thing i forgot. Stores like WM can actually sell small items at a loss and still make money. Ammo is a very small part of their sales and they can take a loss in it if it means more foot traffic. Say that they are selling ammo $5 less then they paid. You had no plans on going there at all but find out this and tell your wife youre gonna run down to WM and pick up a few boxes. Since you are already ging she decides to go with you. While there she finds stuff for the kids, the house, maybe for her mother or sister. You go up to the register and pay $50 for your total. Because they sold the ammo for a $5 loss they didnt actually loose $5 but instead made $45. That is $45 more that they made if they had no ammo and you had not come in.

Huge businesses can do this and generate more money then they would if they hadnt done it. How do you think they can sell 50in tv's for $50 on black friday. They know its a loss but the sheer number of people that will show up will buy other stuff and more then make up for the difference

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Old 02-08-2013, 10:37 AM
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Unless you are looking at their invoices and balance sheets, you have no idea what the costs are involved with selling a gun . Every item sold has freight, electric, water and sewer, payroll, property taxes, and a a host of other costs associated with it, including the chunk the govt and the owners take home. If they are charging too much, there will be plenty available to sell on the counter. If they are not charging enough, the counter will be bare. There is really no reason to sell it if you can not make a profit, and if you sell for $5 and it costs $6 to replace, you are not ahead.

The old story about the retailer, at his going out of business sale; I knew I was selling below cost, but I though volume would carry me. Walmart, because of their size and aggressive bargaining with suppliers, can and does get special pricing from many vendors. But the 6 members of Sams family, together, have more wealth than the 100,000,000 people in our lowest income category, and expect to maintain their standard of living.(TV special "Secrets of the Manorhouse www.pbs.org/about/news/archive/2012/manor-house/ will explain how this works)

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Old 02-08-2013, 10:43 AM
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Default Re: Why would LGS Lie to good customers faces.

Omg! if some of u would please read the thread in its entirety you would see what im sayin
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Old 02-08-2013, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perfectcircle1 View Post
I know all the scenarios. I own my own business. I was told by a very close friend of mine that works at a store distributor prices has not changed on ammo meanwhile at the store that i visit the most and am friendly with its operators, looks at me right in the face and says "distributor prices has gone way up". That is a bold face lie.
I don't know about your LGS. I don't like being gouged or lied to either.

The last motorcycle I purchased, I went to a dealer, he tried to gouge me. So, I went down the road to another dealer and ordered the same bike for a price I was willing to pay.

Not all MC dealers are the same. Not all LGS are the same.

ps: I have read the entire thread.

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Old 02-08-2013, 10:56 AM
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it really doesnt matter what the LGS or the Wally Worlds do now, people are gonna find fault in it...the problem is simple -- it's a stressful time, and during stressful times, people get upset...our local walmart set out a case of .223 the other day, with their 3 box limit, and 8 or 9 guys lined up...i was 3rd...the guy behind me was complaining that they were putting a 3 box limit on it, that it should be first come, first serve...i laughed, and said "you should be glad they are doin the limit, otherwise you'd be outta luck, cause i'm in front of you"...
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Old 02-08-2013, 11:06 AM
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Titegroups is right. Find something else to do. Everyone mad cause they can't burn up 400 rounds a day. Like that was normal? Or moaning cause they can't find an AR anywhere. While they have 4 in their safe. I reloaded everything I could. Now I'm cleaning the reloading area up. Amazing the stuff you find. Found doubles of things,things I no longer have a use for or are broken,etc. Clean it up, sell it, or toss it. Save your money for when prices turn good again(cause they will). Just think we get to buy all fresh stuff. Old product has been cleared from the pipelines. Also I'm too cheap to pay current prices.
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Old 02-08-2013, 11:12 AM
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Default Re: Why would LGS Lie to good customers faces.

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Omg! if some of u would please read the thread in its entirety you would see what im sayin
Ok lets reread ...
"
just picked up three boxes at wallyworld. Gun stores are lying cause i just paid 8.97 not 19.99["

...You said gun stores are charging $19.99 per box of ammo but WM is only asking $8.97 thus the gun stores are lying about price and availability. About right?

Everyone else just explained to you why, with a host of other factors, the ammo prices are not the same and why LGSs cannot compete with WM. Apparently you still dont get it

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Old 02-08-2013, 11:21 AM
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FWIW , Walmart , Cabelas , Bass Pro , Dick's and other large chains do not buy thru the same distributor channels that small independant gunshops buy thru like Jerry's Sport Center , Nationwide , Camfour and others. Their huge volume buying power means they buy direct from the manufacturers and use their own distribution network.

Places like Midway , Brownells , Natchez , and other big on-line ammo & reloading componant sellers are the same way. They buy direct.
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Old 02-08-2013, 12:19 PM
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if you remember a few years ago then 22's were very hard to find, no one had any. but when i did find some the price was the same as befor the shortage, how they are hard to find again and when you do the cost is 3 times higher that is how it is at the LGS in my area
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Old 02-08-2013, 01:02 PM
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again, you failed to miss my second post on this thread.

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Old 02-08-2013, 01:03 PM
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Ok lets reread ...
"
just picked up three boxes at wallyworld. Gun stores are lying cause i just paid 8.97 not 19.99["

...You said gun stores are charging $19.99 per box of ammo but WM is only asking $8.97 thus the gun stores are lying about price and availability. About right?

Everyone else just explained to you why, with a host of other factors, the ammo prices are not the same and why LGSs cannot compete with WM. Apparently you still dont get it

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again, you missed my second post on this thread.

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Old 02-08-2013, 01:04 PM
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I don't wanna hear any defense for lgs's. they sell guns with a 200-300 dollar markup. plus they are selling 10 times as many guns lately. There's no defense for them.
This?

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Old 02-08-2013, 01:08 PM
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I know all the scenarios. I own my own business. I was told by a very close friend of mine that works at a store distributor prices has not changed on ammo meanwhile at the store that i visit the most and am friendly with its operators, looks at me right in the face and says "distributor prices has gone way up". That is a bold face lie.
this one arik

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Old 02-08-2013, 01:09 PM
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At the last gun show around me Bricks of 22LR were selling for $50 and so if you get lucky and Walmart happens to have some you are getting a much better deal from them. The big problem is my Walmart hasn't had a 500 count brick of 22LR in over 3 months. They did receive a few 325 round boxes last week and they were sold out in 10 minutes with a limit of 3 boxes per customer.

It's the same with reloading components as when you find primiers they are $45 to $50 per thousand and they were $25 before this all started. I've have had two orders for JHP 9mm bullets on order for 4 weeks and so far none has arrived so those guys are buried and trying to catch up.
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Old 02-08-2013, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by perfectcircle1 View Post
I know all the scenarios. I own my own business. I was told by a very close friend of mine that works at a store distributor prices has not changed on ammo meanwhile at the store that i visit the most and am friendly with its operators, looks at me right in the face and says "distributor prices has gone way up". That is a bold face lie.
Ohhh you ment this!

Yep prices all stayed the same but ALL the LGSs in the whole country got together and decided to raise prices. Conspiracy!!!! Only WM stood up for us! :banghead:

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Old 02-08-2013, 01:33 PM
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Perhaps I'm throwing cold water on this discussion, but I hope and pray we're contacting our legislators to encourage them not to accede to the anti-gun hysteria currently being propagated by the media. This may be more important than the current prices of ammo. Even if we know these legislators are anti-gun, we MUST convey our views to them. This especially goes for areas not currently afflicted by harsh gun laws. We cannot be over-confident; I know, I used to live in NYC.
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Old 02-08-2013, 01:37 PM
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Yep prices all stayed the same but ALL the LGSs in the whole country got together and decided to raise prices. Conspiracy!!!! Only WM stood up for us!
Conspiracy ,,,Now, I understand .
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Old 02-08-2013, 01:46 PM
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in the words of "smokey" robinson….."mama told me, you better shop around"…
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Old 02-08-2013, 02:07 PM
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It is possible that your LGS's distributors priceing went up. But walmarts cost stayed the same because they buy from manufacturer.
It is well known that Walmart only marks up guns and ammo 10% over cost at least in this area. I too have had a run in with a LGS 4 years ago. His powder prices went from $22/lb to $35/lb. He told me that you can't find it anywhere else and his cost went up so that is the price. Problem was the powder on the shelf was old product and his cost was no different on it. I understand the cost of replacing enventory, I deal with it all the time. I just left and waited for the prices to come down.
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Old 02-08-2013, 02:56 PM
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We have only ourselves to blame for the recent madness. Somebody in front of a TV camera yells, "Ban guns!", and we respond by racing all over town buying up all of the ammo that we can afford, as well as an extra gun or two, just in case. Sometimes, we're our own worst enemy.
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Old 02-08-2013, 04:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perfectcircle1 View Post
I don't wanna hear any defense for lgs's. they sell guns with a 200-300 dollar markup. plus they are selling 10 times as many guns lately. There's no defense for them.
Now the LGS's have no guns or ammunition to sell. The employees will have to be put on furlough. Minimum staffing will be kept simply to keep the place open. Taxes, gas, electricity, water, maintenance and other overhead will still have to be paid.

If you truly own your own business, you should be well aware that the profits made during the good times have to carry you during the bad. The past couple of months have been like the holiday shopping season for gun store owners. During the holiday shopping season, most businesses do 1/4 to 1/3 of their total yearly business in one month.

As you take issue with LGS not selling merchandise for the same price that Walmart does, you apparently must price the goods or services you sell to the lowest common denominator in your market. To do otherwise would be hypocritical. I look forward to one day shopping at perfectcircle1*mart.

Remember that if you don't like the prices in one store you can always shop someplace else. That's the real beauty of a free market society.
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Old 02-08-2013, 05:00 PM
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What's the LGS going to sell next month(s) when they can't replace stock they sold you below market price.

It's not like Walmart and they're going to sell underwear.

If you want your LGS still there next year this is the cost of it.

Emory
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Old 02-08-2013, 05:30 PM
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Wow a bunch of dislike on Small Business, Locally we have a couple of shops that have pricing all over, 1 was selling 223 for 20.00 a box 2 others at the usual cost maybe a slight increase over a few months ago,
Just remember the shops that gouged ya! Or tried to!
In a few months there will be a plethora of black rifles on the used market! and maybe a good deal on some Tupperware semi autos,
Like I posted a week or so ago the LGS I worked at pulled all the 22LR
and 223 ammunition from the shelves only limited quantities, and also only for those that where buying firearms in those calibers. How do you sell a firearm and not have anything to feed it? Also too many enterprising individuals wood try and buy all he had and then resell on the internet or in other shops.
Kinda strange when you have folks show up to buy cases of ammunition that never shopped there before? And say I will buy all you have & whip out a CC And then get pissy when they got shut down.

Just sayin

Remember to be prepared for tough times, like others say shoot 1 and buy 2

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Old 02-08-2013, 07:28 PM
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Default Re: Why would LGS Lie to good customers faces.

Wow, some of you really don't get it. local lgs's have tons of ammo in stock, mostly at really great prices. The more popular stuff, over priced by way more than double. In my town, walmart shelves are bare. Understandable given the circumstances. They are receiving shipments everyday. It flies off the shelf at record pace. One lgs in my area, stocked right up even with 223. Why you ask? cause its frigan overpriced. Sales are up over 50% at that store daily for almost 3 months now. What is making a petty 10 bucks on a box of ammo gonna do for them? Its gonna make them lose customers over the long run thats what. Customers whom at one time bought all their ammo from them.
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:31 PM
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Im so done with this conversation lol
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:43 PM
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I don't understand how a local gun store selling ammo at panic prices is lying.

If they can sell it at those prices, more power to them. I'm going down the street and buying it for less.
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rakstr View Post
Same box as well as a white box version with an F on the end of the product ID were $8.99 at Academy yesterday.

Stll is. I've been making a daily run to pick up my daily allotment of 5.56.
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perfectcircle1 View Post
Wow, some of you really don't get it. local lgs's have tons of ammo in stock, mostly at really great prices. The more popular stuff, over priced by way more than double. In my town, walmart shelves are bare. Understandable given the circumstances. They are receiving shipments everyday. It flies off the shelf at record pace. One lgs in my area, stocked right up even with 223. Why you ask? cause its frigan overpriced. Sales are up over 50% at that store daily for almost 3 months now. What is making a petty 10 bucks on a box of ammo gonna do for them? Its gonna make them lose customers over the long run thats what. Customers whom at one time bought all their ammo from them.
Do you have access to your LGS books so you can say for sure how much his mark up is? I heard it from a friend doesn't count, do you have real fact or are you are just blowing smoke?
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Old 02-08-2013, 08:09 PM
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I missed your 2nd post.

Well why would you be so unprepared as to need to buy ammo now.
(my 2nd post)

And I never bought ammo from the LGS anyway when on line and Walmart / bimart were so much cheaper.

Emory
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  #46  
Old 02-08-2013, 08:18 PM
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Do you have access to your LGS books so you can say for sure how much his mark up is? I heard it from a friend doesn't count, do you have real fact or are you are just blowing smoke?
I don't need look at any books. They told me. The owner, manager of another store that didn't lie to me about the mark up. They said, it is what it is

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Old 02-08-2013, 09:18 PM
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I don't need look at any books. They told me. The owner, manager of another store that didn't lie to me about the mark up. They said, it is what it is

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Old 02-08-2013, 10:00 PM
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Are you in the market for a bridge?
?????

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Old 02-08-2013, 10:42 PM
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Those damn LGS owners! I went to my LGS today and he had just got some KimberPro 1911 magazines in and was putting them out for sale. They were the same price as before the panic buying started. I told him I would take one. He said, “Here, it’s yours. You’re a good customer.” The guy wouldn’t take my money. What kind of way is that to run a business?
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Old 02-09-2013, 01:50 AM
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Im so done with this conversation lol
I thought the above may have let this one die a natural death.
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