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Old 07-22-2014, 07:04 AM
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Has anyone fired Underwood +P 40 cal ammo? Another shooter let me shoot 10 rounds they sound and recoil more than a 45acp I never had hand sting shooting my 40 reloads at higher than starting recommendations . What gives them that much power? The box said 1500fps, are they just using a higher load? I cant remember what the head stamp was but it was an unusual brand marking.
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Old 07-22-2014, 07:13 AM
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I've shot some Underwood before as well, and I found it to be VERY warm. I know that +P rounds are supposed to be hotter than standard, but these are some of the hottest +P rounds that I've sampled in recent memory. I do, however, find that they are quite accurate and my Sig 239 funtions flawlessly with them.
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Old 07-22-2014, 12:12 PM
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Underwood +P ammo should ONLY be used in weapons that are in GOOD or better working condition.

This is TRUE +P ammo.

Otherwise look but don't touch......................

Post 4
you guys all know I shoot a 357 mag......
but there is a +p 45..... I was called on that, saying there was no +p.
I do not indulge in the 40...........but they do make maximum loads hotter than most.

Sorry about that.

Last edited by Nevada Ed; 07-22-2014 at 10:46 PM.
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Old 07-22-2014, 09:27 PM
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Once again, there is no such thing as a 40 S&W +P.

Any company who sells such ammo is perpetrating a fraud upon buyers.
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Old 07-22-2014, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by CTG_COLLECTOR View Post
Once again, there is no such thing as a 40 S&W +P.

Any company who sells such ammo is perpetrating a fraud upon buyers.
This absolutely correct! There is no SAAMI +P standard for .40 S&W, just like there is no +P standard for any of the Magnum cartridges. .40 S&W is already operating at a Maximum Average Pressure of 35,000 PSI, there is nowhere to go for +P!!!

If you find .40 S&W, 10mm, .357 M, .41 M etc. advertised as +P, stay away from it!!!!
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Old 07-22-2014, 10:36 PM
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I just checked underwood's site, no +p 40SW listed. Unfortunately buffalo bore is listing 40 +P and 44 mag +p+. In their information they state they are using - blah-blah-blah powder which give them "Higher velocity" with "lower pressure"???? Though this will anger some, I think they should learn the meaning of terms before using them. Too bad that a respected company will use total BS. Higher velocity with standard pressure- great sign me up, but when you list something as +P+,+P then state that it is "lower" pressure you are showing your ignorance. I guess they can also put 15 lbs of lead into a 10 lb box. Be Safe
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Old 07-22-2014, 11:12 PM
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Hard to understand why anyone needs +p in what's supposed to be an adequate caliber handgun.

Ball 45 acp is pretty efficient.

If standard 40 isn't adequate, you're better off moving up to standard 45 rather than increasing pressure in an already uber pressure round like the 40.

Try the 45 acp: very pleasant and more effective in standard loads than the hyper calibers.

Just my opinion, of course.
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Old 07-23-2014, 12:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alk8944 View Post
This absolutely correct! There is no SAAMI +P standard for .40 S&W, just like there is no +P standard for any of the Magnum cartridges. .40 S&W is already operating at a Maximum Average Pressure of 35,000 PSI, there is nowhere to go for +P!!!

If you find .40 S&W, 10mm, .357 M, .41 M etc. advertised as +P, stay away from it!!!!
Well put!

People must realize that +P means added pressure above standard pressure for the given cartridge.

If a manufacturer advertises a specific caliber as being +P then that load should actually be higher in pressure above the standard pressures as outlined by SAAMI. If it is not actually higher in pressure then the manufacturer is lying and committing a fraud. If it IS actually higher in pressure than the standard pressures then it is being dangerously overloaded and is just an accident waiting to happen. If that 40+P (or 380+P, 44Mag+P etc) is already over standard pressure, just a few more grains of extra powder can easily turn that cartridge into a miniature hand grenade.
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Old 07-23-2014, 12:34 AM
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Ok , I get it that there are only a handfull of " +P " designations that are SAAMI recognized. I get it also that certain mfg sell ammo that they readily admit is not within SAAMI ( or CIP ) limits. It then falls on the Mfgs to be upfront about actual pressures and/ or specific recomendations as to what gun to use or not use their ammo. The consumer is then trusting upon the integrity of the Mfg w/o any other testing body to certify said ammo.

It is a topic of free debate as to the benefit of such ammo , but I'm not seeing any fraud.
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Old 07-23-2014, 01:35 AM
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Ok , I get it that there are only a handfull of " +P " designations that are SAAMI recognized. I get it also that certain mfg sell ammo that they readily admit is not within SAAMI ( or CIP ) limits. It then falls on the Mfgs to be upfront about actual pressures and/ or specific recomendations as to what gun to use or not use their ammo. The consumer is then trusting upon the integrity of the Mfg w/o any other testing body to certify said ammo.

It is a topic of free debate as to the benefit of such ammo , but I'm not seeing any fraud.
Merriam Webster defines Fraud, in part as:

b : an act of deceiving or misrepresenting

Any company/manufacturer that advertises and/or selling certain caliber ammunition marked as +P is, in fact, deceiving or misrepresenting that ammo (ammo that legitimately does not exist); ammo that is not recognized nor approved by SAAMI and the rest of the mainstream sporting arms and ammunition manufacturers.

Companies that make non-SAAMI approved ammo marked as +P are preying upon the ignorance of those who don't understand the intricacies of metallic cartridges and those firearms that shoot it, people who may think that the 40 S&W cartridge is great, so a hotter +P loading in that caliber must be hella better!

If people want to use such non-SAAMI approved ammo from companies that make it, that's up to them. I would only hope that they do so with the full understanding that they do so at their own risk.

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Old 07-23-2014, 03:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CTG_COLLECTOR View Post
Once again, there is no such thing as a 40 S&W +P.

Any company who sells such ammo is perpetrating a fraud upon buyers.
Not only is it a fraud they are playing with your safety. The 40 S&W has a pressure limit of 35,000 PSI, the same as the .357 Magnum. If they are loading their 40 S&W ammo above 35,000 PSI they are selling you ammo that's above the safe limits of the handguns being manufactured for that 35,000 PSI standard. (yes I know the guns are tested for higher pressures but still, it's abusive to the handgun and possible not safe in some guns)

You see a lot of threads all the time on this and other forums asking if it's safe to shoot .38 Special +P ammo in one revolver or another because they barrel isn't marked +P. If everyone is so concerned about that why no concerns about pushing the limits above established SAAMI limits where there is no +P rating?

If 35,000 PSI isn't enough for you in the 40 S&W move up to 37,500 PSI and shoot a 10mm instead.
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Old 07-23-2014, 08:48 AM
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40 Smith & Wesson +P Ammo - 180 gr. F.M.J
Aggressively sold by Buffalo Bore!

Here is an excerpt from their website: ...........40 S&W WARNING!

"This data is intended for use in firearms which fully support the cartridge in the chamber. Use of this data in firearms which do not fully support the cartridge may result in bulged cases, ruptured cases, case head separation, or other conditions which may result in damage to the firearm and/or result in injury or death of the shooter or bystanders."
mb
https://www.buffalobore.com/index.ph...t_detail&p=117
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Old 07-23-2014, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CTG_COLLECTOR View Post
Once again, there is no such thing as a 40 S&W +P.

Any company who sells such ammo is perpetrating a fraud upon buyers.
They may have removed it from the website but here is the box. I just shot 5 rounds in his gun a Sig 229 wouldn't use them my self
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Old 07-23-2014, 10:20 AM
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Old 07-23-2014, 12:12 PM
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"WHO LET THE DOGS OUT" !!


per post #3
I stand, corrected..........thank you NJM15.

Last edited by Nevada Ed; 07-23-2014 at 12:15 PM.
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