What do I have here? Its a white box with black lettering marked 'Winchester Q4296 .38 Special +P+ 147gr. JHP 50 Centerfire Pistol - Revolver Cartridges'. Also marked 'For Law Enforcement Use Only' and 'Not For Retail Sale' and 'Pressure Levels Exceed Industry Standards'. I assume this will be fine in a .357 magnum chambered revolver, what will it do a J Frame model 38 or 60 no dash? Anyone have any pressure data on this? I've searched the internet and only found a few fleeting mentions of +P+ without any real detail.

S&W doesn't warrant their guns for non-SAAMI ammo and there is no SAAMI standard for +P+. The ammunition was no doubt loaded for some PD that signed a waver. It would loosen up any gun you chose to shoot it in much quicker than would regular .38 special ammunition. Shooting it in .357 guns should be no problem.

I believe this load was made under contract to the federal government as a replacement for the original FBI load, the 158 grain .38 Special LSWCHP +p. The load the OP wrote about was the Winchester version; I started a similar thread on the Federal 147 Gr. +P+ Hydra-Shok .38 Special very recently- I think both loads would have met requirements of the contract, but I know less about the Winchester and have not personally seen it.

Can anyone clarify this for both the OP and me?

Mike

I found these numbers on another site

Here's the numbers:

Winchester 147gr. hp +p+ for law enforecment only lot #q4296.

2 1/4" sp101:
Ave: 880.3
Es: 51.63

3" speed six:
Ave: 927
Es: 41.1

7.5" Redhawk:
Ave: 1022
Es: 29.26

I have several boxes of this and have shot it out of my M 36 and 642. Nothing earth shaking about it. Its kick was not all that harsh. 158 gr SWLHP +p seems to kick just as much or even more.

__________________
A Snider squibbed n the Jungle

I used to shoot quite a bit of it when it was commonly available at gun shows and my local shop.
I chronographed it many years ago, used a Taurus 85 TT ( ported 2")
3" mod 36, 2.5" model 242 and 4" model 15-2 were used.
The Taurus Chrono'd in the low 900's
The 242 in the 970's
The 3" j frame went 940's
The 4" K frame 1030-1040fps
Warm day, in the 80s.
This stuff usually has a flash bulb-white kind of flash, but not horrible recoil in any steel gun. The fed version seems to be about 30-50 fp's slower from what I've seen of other people's chrono numbers.

I believe what you have here is the last 38 Special round issued by the FBI before they went to semi-autos. The FBI used Model 13 revolvers, but allowed agents to carry all steel J frames, such as the Model 60.

This round is fine in any S&W .357 Magnum, and its limited use in any 38 Special (including Airweights) will not cause any problems. Extensive use will cause accelerated wear. There is no danger, assuming the ammo is properly manufactured, and assuming the gun is in proper shape, of a catastrophic failure.

"This round is fine in any S&W .357 Magnum, and its limited use in any 38 Special (including Airweights) will not cause any problems. Extensive use will cause accelerated wear. There is no danger, assuming the ammo is properly manufactured, and assuming the gun is in proper shape, of a catastrophic failure."

It' was the 'catastrophic failure' thing that had me concerned. Thanks for the info.

What are the lot numbers on the inside flap? The Q number is a stocking number.

The Lot Number is 6PD61

4/16/99 is the date of manufacture

The only other printing on the flap of the box is 'Carton No. CT468 E123602'

That's a number for the box used.

I assumed that was a carton number. I opened up all 10 other boxes I have and the only stamp in any of them is 6PD61.