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Old 09-26-2015, 06:26 PM
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So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot?  
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Default So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot?

As the title says- but more specifically, are 12 gauge reduced or low recoil buckshot loads in fact reduced in recoil to the perception of anyone here who's tried it, and are there any disadvantages to these loads?
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Old 09-26-2015, 06:57 PM
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So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot?  
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The ones I've shot do seem to recoil less.
They're tailored to SD/LEO use, as opposed to hunting.
You don't need as much power/range for stopping a violent felon at less than 10 yards as you do for dropping a deer from 30 yards.

People who did not grow up shooting shotguns often find standard 12 gauge buck to have rather punishing recoil.
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Old 09-26-2015, 07:03 PM
gmiller0737 gmiller0737 is offline
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So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot?  
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Compare the Pellet Count I think I noticed some of the reduced recoil loads had fewer pellets,I know a Standard 2 3/4" 12 ga. 00 Buck is 9 pellets,& 3" 00 is 15 pellets
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Old 09-26-2015, 07:07 PM
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So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot?  
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Reduced recoil buckshot loads were originally developed so the smaller statured LEO personnel can still handle the shotguns. They are available in Buck and slug and show a considerably reduced power at the muzzle and the shooters shoulder. More often than not the reduced buckshot loads have fewer pellets, normally 8 instead of 9 in 00B loads. While these loads don't cause problems in pump actions, they can cause malfunctions in guns like Benelli's M4 riot or Rem 11-87P.
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Old 09-26-2015, 07:11 PM
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So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot? So whats the deal with "low recoil" or "reduced recoil" buckshot?  
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I don't have any issue with firing buckshot....... most of it, most of the time lol. I once fired a five shot string from a turkish 12 gauge pump with a flimsy buttstock, of #4 buck, 3inch.
I was also sore from a workout the previous day.
My friend said he thought he'd have to push my eyeballs back in lol. <-- literally! lol !

I personally prefer 2 3/4 #1 buck loads.

I'm mostly curious because I somehow have to justify an ammo order and the 'ol lady has fibro. If I can arrange it so there's "something in it for you too honey"...... I'm manipulative like that.

Seriously- I want her to be able to use the 12 gauge for home defense. We have a mossy 500 pump.
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Old 09-26-2015, 08:29 PM
BMcCarthy BMcCarthy is offline
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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I have two Mossberg 500 12g shotguns and have used them in several classes. Using the low recoil buck and slugs I never had a problem with control or recoil issues. In my opinion for classes, casual shooting or home defense the low recoil rounds are the way to go.
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Old 09-26-2015, 08:31 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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To answer your question, yes. I've noticed a tangible difference in felt recoil with my Remington 870 Police Magnum. Just to give you a point of reference, I'm comparing Federal LE 132 00 9 pellet 00 Buck and the Winchester "Military" 9-pellet 00 Buck. I can also tell you that the Federal FliteControl stuff patterns very tightly in my particular 870 with an IC choke.

This is purely anecdotal, but I recall reading something to the effect of reduced recoil loads not having signifigantly reduced terminal effectiveness when used in hunting applications.

Also, not to complicate things, but have you considered a 20 ga. shotgun for the missus, especially if she's recoil sensitive? I believe that caliber is available in #1 and #4 buckshot.
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Old 09-26-2015, 08:54 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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It may not be a big issue for Home Defense but it's a good idea to Pattern the Buckshot you intend to use,If you have interchangeable choke tubes try each one,We use Buckshot for Deer due to running Hounds & I pattern My Guns @ 40 yards & currently use a Carlson Buckshot Choke Tube & Winchester 3" 000 Buck & Yes it does have quite a bit of recoil but I never feel it when shooting at a Buck!
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Old 09-26-2015, 09:55 PM
kaaskop49 kaaskop49 is offline
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoMF View Post
To answer your question, yes. I've noticed a tangible difference in felt recoil with my Remington 870 Police Magnum. Just to give you a point of reference, I'm comparing Federal LE 132 00 9 pellet 00 Buck and the Winchester "Military" 9-pellet 00 Buck. I can also tell you that the Federal FliteControl stuff patterns very tightly in my particular 870 with an IC choke.

This is purely anecdotal, but I recall reading something to the effect of reduced recoil loads not having signifigantly reduced terminal effectiveness when used in hunting applications.

Also, not to complicate things, but have you considered a 20 ga. shotgun for the missus, especially if she's recoil sensitive? I believe that caliber is available in #1 and #4 buckshot.
Good points, as usual, from my forum buddy CoMF! I have also read of diminished terminal effectiveness from these loads, but then, everything fails at one point or another. The reduced power loads are great to use in pistol-grip shotguns. And as to Federal buckshot, it patterns so tightly in IC or cylinder bore shotguns as to be almost unbelievable. There are YouTube videos demonstrating this.

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Old 09-26-2015, 11:02 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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And then there is Elmer-
During War Two he test fired shotguns up at Ogden.
During a two month period, he is reported to have fired over 100 CASES of shells.
How did he do it? He had lady assistants who loaded the guns.
And he was Elmer!
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Old 09-26-2015, 11:11 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Talk about recoil and "small stature" LEOs. Bonnie (of Bonnie and Clyde) favorite weapon stolen from a national guard armory was a Browning Automatic Rifle with a sawed off stock and barrel that she shot from the hip in full auto. 30-06. I think she was about 5'2" and weighed around 110#. We've become a nation of wimps -

BTW my daughter is a "small stature" Federal LEO and she ain't no wimp (just in case she or husband is reading this).
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Old 09-27-2015, 12:25 AM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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My former agency switched from our original 2 3/4 Winchester 00 Buckshot to Winchester reduced recoil version as it reportedly gave better patterns and allowed for faster follow up shots if need be. It never occurred to me that it was done to accommodate smaller coppers although that very well could have been the reason. Few Patrolmen opted to carry the Shotgun anyhow but mine went with me always. I never understood why folks would not take something that could save your Bacon.
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Old 09-27-2015, 12:56 AM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Quote:
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My former agency switched from our original 2 3/4 Winchester 00 Buckshot to Winchester reduced recoil version as it reportedly gave better patterns and allowed for faster follow up shots if need be. It never occurred to me that it was done to accommodate smaller coppers although that very well could have been the reason. Few Patrolmen opted to carry the Shotgun anyhow but mine went with me always. I never understood why folks would not take something that could save your Bacon.

Well, some substitute rifles these days.
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Old 09-27-2015, 11:28 AM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Excellent responses in this thread thus far. I'll echo what others have noted: the reduced recoil loads achieve this effect either through less shot, less charge, or both. Having played with a lot of it side-by-side with standard buckshot loads in an 870, I definitely can feel a difference.

Along with less shoulder pounding and better control, it really shines for follow-up shots -- I find I can come back on target notably faster.

The two I've settled on are Remington's Managed Recoil line of 00 buck and slugs -- not only does the buck shoot easier, but it patterns better from my shotgun compared to anything else in the Remington line-up; and Federal's several Flight Control offerings -- as previously noted, their patterning is incredible at distance, and along with their eight and nine pellet 00 buck (I prefer eight) and slugs, their new 1 buck load has finally become widely available.

There is much discussion as to how much terminal velocity is traded-off for easier shooting in these loads; if anyone finds a definitive answer, I'd like to hear it -- I've seen good gel tests and lesser, reassuring anecdotes and concerning ones. In all my shooting and research, I'm satisfied that in any close-quarters encounter reduced recoil loads will work, devastatingly. On average, standard buck loads are considered effective to approximately 40 yards, with slugs to a little more than double that. I dial those in by about 25 percent for reduced recoil loads, which still leaves me plenty of room for likeliest needs. Your mileage may vary.

I'm all for getting your girlfriend on board for an ammo purchase by whatever rationale necessary , but if I understand you correctly she has fibromyalgia; I don't think I'd encourage any 12 gauge use for her regardless of load -- with that condition, it's likely to be painful and off-putting no matter what. As CoMF noted, 20 gauge might be considered, but you have to choose your weapon and load with care: most 20 gauge shotguns are lighter than their 12 gauge counterparts, so even with the lighter 20 load, you end of with the same kick as a 12 because there's less weight to absorb the recoil; also, there's significantly less defensive ammo to choose from in 20 compared to 12. If you or she (or both) are truly intent on getting her into defensive shotgun use, I would not rule out .410 bore -- with some of the 00 and 000 buck defense loads in that caliber (designed for Governor-type handguns), out of a shotgun you're getting serious terminal velocity in a platform that kicks negligibly, as in .22LR rifle territory.
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Old 09-27-2015, 10:06 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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I really like low recoil buckshot and slug loads - I can shoot 30-40 rounds with no discomfort. Some numbers off the top of my head:

Rio 00 Buck Low Recoil 9 pellets at 1200 fps
Fiocchi 00 Buck Low Recoil 9 Pellets at 1150 fps
Hornady TAP 00 Buck Low Recoil 8 pellets at 1100 fps
Federal #1 Buck Low Recoil 15 pellets at 1150 fps

Standard loads give about 1300 fps with much more recoil. The Fiocchi load is my favorite. The Hornady load is really light, if you're very recoil sensitive. The Federal #1 load is interesting, but has significantly more recoil because 15 #1 buckshot weigh about 20% more than 9 00 buckshot. Repeat shot control is much better with the reduced recoil loads, making them much better in a home/self defense setting (in my opinion).
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Old 09-27-2015, 10:20 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Originally Posted by Ramikrav View Post
As the title says- but more specifically, are 12 gauge reduced or low recoil buckshot loads in fact reduced in recoil to the perception of anyone here who's tried it, and are there any disadvantages to these loads?
A vocal group of LEO's notified somebody that they couldn't handle the recoil of regular high brass loads fired from short barrelled shotguns . . .
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Old 09-27-2015, 11:14 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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I've used a lot of the Fiocchi stuff. It falls between target loads and a full powered buckshot for recoil.

My 18" Remington 1100 has no problems with that or any load.

I think of it as better suited for two legged critters than four and it's a lot of fun to shoot without being punishing. I've fired as much as a couple hundred rounds of it in one session.
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Old 09-28-2015, 02:42 AM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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We've considered the 20 bore, but to be honest, its a balancing act; while I don't want to be on the other end of such a gun, we can't have the possibility of her needing to go "hands on", which would be worse then the recoil of a 12 gauge.
Its good to hear that the reduced recoil loads are in fact reduced recoil but are not so watered down that the power of the 12 gauge is still there.

Of course, there's a magnum of OC/CS Sabre around as well as she's always got her .22 bobcat.

The 12 gauge is a last ditch option, for both of us, a last resort; and I think I'll keep it loaded with a few rounds of low recoil on the top, #1 buck after.......

again folks- thanks for your help!
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Old 09-28-2015, 12:01 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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The company's just want to make it where the...........

kids and lady's can also play....................
Very nice of them, don't you think ?
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Old 09-28-2015, 04:02 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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The company's just want to make it where the...........

kids and lady's can also play....................
Very nice of them, don't you think ?
lol.

Personally I am very pleased that this is so.
First and foremost, because women, the elderly, and children should not be subject to physically more powerful men, especially the type who like to victimize and prey on the weak.

How was it the quote goes? "G-d made men, Sam colt made them equal" ?

I'm all for that sort of equality.

Secondly, it seems like alot of women folk appreciating the ability to defend themselves on equal terms with a 200lb man aren't inclined to vote for progressive socialists who want to make that harder for them to do.

And thats another win in my book.

If my physically disabled wife can defend herself from multiple hopped up home invaders, which is the worse scenerio we can think of, with the power of a 12 gauge, GREAT!

Winners all around.
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Old 09-28-2015, 04:24 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Hey, now. I happen to be one of those "smaller statured" folks, Ed. I actually have a 12" LOP stock on my 870 because it's the only way I can work the action without doing a goofy impersonation of a chicken.

I appreciate when an ammo manufacturer accomplishes more with less. You mean I can have 9 pellets of 00 buck in really tight patterns AND the benefit of less recoil/faster follow up shots with little to no reduction in terminal effectiveness? Who wouldn't want that?

I know your jest wasn't meant maliciously, but there are many reasons to sing the praises of these new loads.
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Old 09-29-2015, 12:58 AM
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CoMF;

+1.........

If you read some of my post, I do major "Low end" loads and test on ammo in my rifles, shotguns, pistols and revolvers.

Many think a "Full Load" is needed but some of the best shooting loads are starting loads.

For trap I went from a 3 dram load down to a 7/8 oz. 12 Ga. at only 1135 fps.
My steel duck loads with BB's are only going 1295 fps.

As mentioned, a SD load at just ten feet can be reduced and still work. However there is a limit to a light load.

Sorry I got you all upset.
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Old 09-29-2015, 02:21 AM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Old 09-29-2015, 07:49 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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It really is a tricky question, on one hand lighter recoil allows for superior, faster follow up, yet at the kind of close ranges you will be using a buckshot load, relying on one good hit might be the best, or sometimes only option. In self defense, overkill does not exist, stopping the threat is all that matters. You're never quick enough and never hit hard enough, so we are back to the endless classical dog chasing its tail of "recoil vs. power". In truth, both loads have a valid argument, and it is up to the shooter and gun as to which you see as advantageous.

Personally, I think that the power argument is absolute the correct one. With shotguns you are relying more on one or two carefully placed shots, and it is more important to make sure your devastating weapon devastates. You choose the shotgun for its hard knocking, hard hitting, hard killing power, don't gut it out, because that is the entire advantage and point of the choice of weapon. You don't buy a 5 ton truck and start putting lighter duty shocks on it, so why do you want to shoot light loads out of a defensive shotgun? If you want a lot of quick, easy, low recoiling follow up shots, stick with your carbine, otherwise, stick to the big rounds for the big gun. You start taking a pellet and 150 fps out of a 9 shot full power buckshot load, and you really don't have the same thing.

The argument that it is as effective is very complex. At longer ranges, buckshot, as well as all birdshot, starts to see an evening out of energies as range progresses. The difference between a pellet of #4 buckshot fired at 1350 fps and 1200 fps out of the muzzle might come very close to even at 60 yards. Some hunters don't mind lower velocities in order to raise pellet count, i.e. low velocity 15 pellet 00 buckshot in 3 inch 12 gauge magnum vs. the higher velocity 12 and 9 pellet 00 loads. Factory 3 1/2 inch magnum 10 gauge shells with 18 pellet 00 buckshot has been 1150 fps, yet has been a time proven, well regarded hunting load. Are you getting the extra power advantage at hunting ranges from higher velocity loads vs recoil? Ask people who do it and see their answers.

That being said, at close range, the velocity does matter, because the short range means very little speed/energy bleed off, so you get your recoil and money's worth out of the heavy load. When you hit an attacker, or anything else for that matter, at very close ranges, with a direct hit with a shotgun, especially full choke, they get every last bit of hate you put into that shell. Apples to apples, you do hit any bad guy harder, and always better, by choosing the faster, higher energy load. This is why full power is recommended, because you can slam the attacker harder, get your full worth out of the big bore gun you carry. Shotguns, unlike pistols, have enough "whump" to stun and knock back things (no not through plate windows, or throwing people back 5 feet like the movies). Heavy shotgun loads can "shove", "heave", and shock someone. People may not know if they are hit in the torso with a handgun round, but nobody will ignore being hit direct center mass by a 1 1/8 oz load of lead at 1350 fps. If you take enough heat out of the load, you lose this critical advantage.

Hammering down weight is the worst of all things. Shotguns are useful at close range because they throw a lot of lead, a lot of pellets, a lot of mass when talking of birdshot at extreme close range. With tight, full choke patterns and close range, shotgun rounds will always hit like slugs, and at are full effectiveness. Taking down the weight kills this slug like effect slowly, till the load is too light to be effective. When talking of individual pellets, its simple to understand that less pellets mean less holes put into an attacker. Experienced hunters tend to shoot heavier loads of buckshot, because there really is never a big enough piece of buckshot, or enough pellets of it. That extra piece of 00 that you left out in the 8 pellet reduced load might have been the one to fly wild into the attacker's aorta putting him out, and where are you without it?

As far as LEO's are concerned, high power buckshot is the best choice when considering barriers and obstacles. If using a buckshot load against a criminal in a car, or other means of reducing the bullet's energy towards the target, the extra energy/velocity in those pellets never hurts, once again.

As far as buckshot size goes, I've heard and seen things that suggest that 00 has become a standard for good reasons. #4 may work in a pinch, and can be very effective at closer ranges, it is small and light enough to fail in some circumstances, especially with range and barriers. At a mere 21 or so grains, it can easily get deep enough in many circumstances at close range, yet might easily fail in the most extreme and unusual ones. Add a little bit of shot angle and distance, then some lower velocity, the buckshot might not be able to hit deep enough to kill. #1 is a much better choice, especially for those considering the 20 bore.

I've probably gone on too long as it is, but I'll wrap up that there is a lot to think about. Depending on you, your gun, and other choices and circumstance, there are a lot of options and advantages/disadvantages. I myself have been tinkering with the 10 bore lately for fun, as a hunting gun for all sorts of things. But, as I've made my own reduced loads, 15 pellet 00 around 1200 fps, I've found that my BPS 10 pump kicks less than 9 pellet 00 out of my 12 gauge pumps at higher velocities. Not sure if I'm going to press my big bore shotgun, too big and heavy perhaps, into self defense, but it provides the last tip; consider a heavier gun.
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Old 09-30-2015, 01:00 AM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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We chose a shotgun because we don't want the liability of rifle rounds going thru the house and into neighboring structures.

There's alot of children around here........ and I put a premium on not hurting innocent people.

A point made above is very valid- we chose the shotgun as well, because of its actual, dyed in the wool, stopping power.

No way anyone can convince me, after reading about the Moros, WW1, and Blackjack Pershing, that a 12 gauge shotgun isnt the best medicine going for close quarters defense. The 1911 in .45 acp is a beloved weapon to me, for very personal reasons, but the real stopper of hopped up Muslim insurgents in the Philippine insurrection was the Winchester 1897, and in the brutal trench warfare of WW1, the M97 made the Kaiser, he of the mustard gas, cry foul.

I have more confidence in a 12 gauge in close defense then anything except maybe a hand grenade or a flamethrower.

An added bonus for the civil home defender is that the pellets become much less lethal at ranges past where self defense is required.

So long as its an effective load, and by comments here it seems that way (i will be going over to brassfetcher to look at some gel shots hopefully he has some of the low recoil stuff) and my lady can handle 'em, I'm happy.

ETA -

CoMF,
Were looking at the Houge Overmold 12" LOP, both because I know it'll be easier for her to get behind it, and it'll make it that much better for me. I'm "ok" with the 14.5" LOP standard, but 12" would be better.
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Old 09-30-2015, 03:41 AM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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At the average gunfight distance it won't matter if you use what is certainly the new standard in 12 ga. defense loads: Federal Flite Control #1 buck. Nothing else comes close. Because of their sphere size the #1 has 50 gr. more lead = more mass on target w/o losing energy by being too small. This was discovered ages ago by African Big Game hunters when using a 12 ga. to finish off wounded soft skinned game, e.g., lions & leopards (SSG better than SG).
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Old 09-30-2015, 09:52 AM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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As to the "problem" part of the question with the 12 Gauge Federal reduced recoil premium slugs. I had fit's trying to zero my Mossberg SPX at fifty yards. Ran out of elevation adjustment front and rear with the impact still way too high. Then it dawned on me, reduced recoil means reduced velocity! Got some full power Remington Slugger's, cranked the front and rear sights back to mid adjustment and got nice cloverleaf three shot groups smack in the center "POA" where I wanted them.
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Old 09-30-2015, 12:39 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Yeah I myself like full power #1 buck.

I don't have a problem with recoil, I'm an average sized American male in my prime and stay in shape with weights and martial arts.
I'm not a hobbyist or collector- my guns are pretty much strictly for self defense.

I cannot imagine us ever having to use this defensive shotgun past indoor home ranges.
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Old 09-30-2015, 01:32 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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CoMF,
Were looking at the Houge Overmold 12" LOP, both because I know it'll be easier for her to get behind it, and it'll make it that much better for me. I'm "ok" with the 14.5" LOP standard, but 12" would be better.
That's what I have on my 870, and it's a great stock for the money. You'll need a really long socket extension to install it, however.

A little tip if you do decide to get it: The cone washer installs convex side facing you. I found that out the hard way.
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Old 09-30-2015, 01:46 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoMF View Post
That's what I have on my 870, and it's a great stock for the money. You'll need a really long socket extension to install it, however.

A little tip if you do decide to get it: The cone washer installs convex side facing you. I found that out the hard way.
Yeah we have plenty of tools around, I used to work as a mechanics assist. with an older friend of mine before he passed on. He liked to use me when he had to do stuff like pull engines/transmissions. He was a certified SAAB mechanic and I learned alot from him.

I suppose I get to see what this cone washer is all about, hopefully soon. If I have any questions I'll ask you directly. As of right now, last night we replaced the vacuum cleaner after my attempt to repair it failed, as well just now the printer decided to do the same thing.

Looks like the standard furniture will be remaining on the gun for awhile longer.
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Old 09-30-2015, 02:01 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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According to "The Box of Truth"

At close range, reduced recoil loads seem to shoot a tighter pattern. But the difference is small, i.e., 1 3/4 to 4 inches. As always, you have to aim a shotgun at close range. The patterns are tight.

Good comparison with some different 00 buck loads
The Box O' Truth #20 - Buckshot Patterns - The Box O' Truth
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Old 09-30-2015, 02:15 PM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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I can see where such tight patterns would be useful for police in hostage situations, like the cop that used a shotgun to end the rampage of the crazy who shot up a concert. (I love pantera, thats why I bring this up).

"Dude, his head is gone"

ETA- that cop did the RIGHT thing, and I don't care what they say about cops these days, some of us citizens are behind you all the way.
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Old 12-14-2017, 05:03 AM
Bill Lear Bill Lear is offline
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramikrav View Post
As the title says- but more specifically, are 12 gauge reduced or low recoil buckshot loads in fact reduced in recoil to the perception of anyone here who's tried it, and are there any disadvantages to these loads?
Generally such loads are about 200 fps slower with fewer pellets - 9, which is perfectly adequate for CQB with a 12 gauge.
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Old 12-14-2017, 07:20 AM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Zombie thread. I imagine the OP has worked it out by now . . .
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Old 12-20-2017, 07:31 AM
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So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot? So whats the deal with &quot;low recoil&quot; or &quot;reduced recoil&quot; buckshot?  
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Fiocchi reduced recoil 12 gauge buckshot 12LE00BK does not hurt my shoulder. Makes practice fun instead of painful and less likely to develop a flinch

12leobk fiocchi - Google Search
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