I know the 38/44 was developed so a hotter .38 load could be
used. How hot was it? Does any manufacturer have it available
now? Would Buffalo Bore be close?

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In Omnia Paratus

I believe it was a 158 gr lead bullet at 1100-1200 fps.

I think I have read that a 158 gr. bullet at 1150-1175fps. I have loaded 12 grs. of 2400 and it does 1194fps. with a 6 in. Python. I understand why S&W came out with a "N" frame .38 Spec. Larry

I thought the original .34/44 was a 200gr. hardcast load intended to deal with bad guys hiding behind thick-skinned car bodies.

PC

You are thinking of the .38 Special "Super Police". It was a 200 gr. blunt RN bullet that was swaged. No bullet loaded in a major factory cartridge that I am aware of, with the exception of relative recent Federal "Cast Core" ammunition, has ever been loaded with any form of cast bullet! Published velocity was 725 FPS, but three strings I have chronographed of older W-W Super Police ammunition ran from 621 to 685 FPS in two 5" and 6" M&Ps. Hardly "Super" anything! This has not been loaded for quite a few years.

The .38-44 was loaded to between 1115 and 1175 FPS from varying barrel lengths. It was loaded with several bullet types, the most common being 158 gr. RNL, a 158 "capped" RN, and 158 gr. "Metal Piercing". With the possible exception of some "Boutique" loaders like Buffalo Bore there is no equivalent factory cartridge currently being loaded. It has been guessed by many that the factory .38-44 was loaded to pressures approximating or exceeding 25-30,000 CUP. Some believe that some loads may have actually equaled the later .357 Magnum pressures!

In a 6-6 1/2" barrel 11.5-12.0 gr. 2400 behind a 158 gr. cast bullet will approximate published .38-44 velocities!**

** My 6 1/2" "Outdoorsman" runs very slow. .38 Spl. loads that run around 1125 FPS in my 6" "Highway Patrolman" only chronograph around 1025-1030 in the "Outdoorsman".

Another thing about the .38-44 loading. During the late 1930s, after introducing the 2" M&P, S&W directly stated in advertising that the .38-44 was an acceptable loading for use in this model! So much for the general fear that .38 Spl. +, at 20-25% less pressure, will do dire damage to a pre-war M&P, or any steel K-Frame revolver of any later period for that matter!

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Gunsmithing since 1961

Generally, the revolver is called the .38/44 and the ammunition is called .38-44. However, I am not sure that anyone other than Remington had the ammunition boxes labeled as .38-44, and even then, not always. So .38-44 ammunition often went by other names. Remington initially used the name .38-44 Special Hi-Speed, and in later price lists, .38 Special Hi-Speed. Winchester called it .38 Special Super Speed. Western used .38 Special Super-X. Peters called theirs .38 High Velocity S&W Special, and in later Peters price lists, .38 Special (38-44). Almost always, the loads shown were available with both 158 grain lead bullets and 158 grain metal capped bullets (not FMJ). Western and Winchester also offered a 150 grain .38 Special Metal Piercing Super -X/Super Speed load. This bullet had a heavy conical metal cap, unlike the the 110 grain zinc alloy metal piercing bullet offered by Remington as the Hi-Way Master. Muzzle velocity is usually given in catalogs as being in the lower 1100 ft/sec range. My old Lyman reloading manual recipes do not call it .38-44 or anything of that nature. They use ".38 Special for heavy frame revolvers", with the typical 1100+ ft/sec MV. Interestingly, they recommend only Hercules 2400 powder for such loads. I personally have achieved MVs similar to the .38-44 using .38 Special handloads with 158 grain FMJ bullets and 8.0 grains of Unique, and have fired them with no adverse consequences in an older K-frame revolver.

Ammunition catalogs provide no cautions against using .38-44 ammunition in revolvers other than the S&W Heavy Duty, other than to advise that it will produce greater recoil in smaller frame revolvers.

Don't forget Elmer Keith's 358429 (173 grain); the first "Keith-type" bullet.

I don't believe it was ever a factory load.

I shan't list the loads here (or anywhere else!)

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and what his trumpet saith

Why??? This bullet has absolutely nothing to do with commercially available .38-44 ammunition, regardless of what it was called by different manufacturers! (And DWalt is absolutely correct, in all points!) So why even mention this?

It's like saying the .38-44 can't compare to .44 Magnum, so what!

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Gunsmithing since 1961

The 358429 was never factory loaded for the .38-44.
But it is a great .38-44 load for an Outdoorsman, a Heavy Duty, or Model 27/28.
And it's a great bullet whatever load you use in the .38 Special.

__________________
and what his trumpet saith

I think the role of the .38-44 has been largely superseded by the +P. Factory production of the .38-44 (by whatever name) ceased not long after the +P hit the market. But for those who wish, for whatever reason, to duplicate the ballistics of the old .38-44 loads, it is very simple to do by reloading. My favorite .357 Magnum load provides the performance of the .38-44, but in a .357 case.

There are two loads that come close. The Buffalo Bore "Outdoorsman" and the Double Tap 158 grain SWC. They are both rated +P.

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I believe in the wadcutter.