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Old 01-07-2017, 10:59 PM
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Default Jacketed Hollow Point ?

My friend gave me some new ammunition for my new S&W M&P Shield 9mm Laserguard.

Its Remington High Terminal Performance Jacketed Hollow Point and is 147 Grain.

I have never used any ammo like this with such high grain.

Is it alright to use this ammo for self defense in my new Shield 9mm ?


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Old 01-08-2017, 12:00 AM
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147gr is fine for self-defense, in fact, it's the "preferred weight" of many knowledgable people. The heavier bullets tend to get greater penetration, but be carful with that particular Remington ammo. I've seen videos where it consistently DID NOT expand when fired into ballistic gel.

147 use to be the heaviest weight available for 9mm until earlier this year when Federal came out with it's HST round (designed for short barrels like the shield) in 150gr. It has less recoil and muzzle flash. I have shot a box of it and keep 2 boxes in my safe. It's my current carry ammo.
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Old 01-08-2017, 12:18 AM
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The 147gr is the new heavy weight for the 9mm, now.

All bullets do well, just that some expand better than others.
Soak some tied together news paper in a 5 gal. bucket of water
and soak over night then dump the water out and take it to a
spot to shoot a few rounds into it.
Most rounds will penetrate about 8" into the wet news paper.
Hopefully the bullet will have mushroomed as designed to do.

Later
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Old 01-08-2017, 01:07 AM
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I use 147g for carry ammo in a shield.
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Old 01-08-2017, 03:06 AM
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Another Remington hollow point round, Golden Saber 147g, has worked very well in my Shield 9mm. I've fired over 200 rounds of it with only one failure to eject. It is also the most accurate round of all the rounds (HP or target) that I've fired with my Shield, and I've fired a bunch of different ammo--nearly 5000 rounds worth.
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Old 01-08-2017, 12:50 PM
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Now I'm a little hesitant to use the Remington Hollow Points. If it doesn't expand or fails to eject I don't want to use for self defense.

My friend bought me Remington because he knew that is what I have always used for my other guns.

What are my best options for self defense ammo in my Shield ?

Federal HST, Remington Golden Saber 147 ?
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Old 01-08-2017, 01:04 PM
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I use Gold Dot short barrel 124gr in my Shield. Your best option is to try some of the popular defense rounds and see how you do in shooting to POA, expansion, reliability. Nobody guarantees your gun will like the same ammo I use.
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Old 01-08-2017, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OKFC05 View Post
I use Gold Dot short barrel 124gr in my Shield. Your best option is to try some of the popular defense rounds and see how you do in shooting to POA, expansion, reliability. Nobody guarantees your gun will like the same ammo I use.
Absolutely true. Many Shield 9 owners love HST 124g +P SD rounds. My Shield 9 hates them. I had three failures to feed and one failure to eject in the first 31 rounds I tried. My Shield was well broken in at that point, with over 3000 rounds.

On the other hand, in addition to the Golden Saber 147g rounds (227 fired with one FTE) that I mentioned in my previous post, I've had good experiences with Speer Gold Dot 124g +P (147 rounds fired with no failures), and Hornady Critical Duty 135g +P (174 rounds fired with no failures).

Bottom line is that you've got to experiment some with different SD ammo to find what works best in your Shield. I will not carry any SD ammo until it has fired a minimum of 100 consecutive rounds without any failures. Is all that testing expensive? Yes, but my life is worth it.
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Old 01-13-2017, 04:50 PM
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You might check out the new Inceptor Polycase ARX Self Defense ammo. it is not JHP and comes in a variety of weights, I use 107gr SW .40 for my Shield. This ammo is rated for penetration, through several layers of denim, or leather. Meaning it won't clog up with cloth like a JHP. This round is rated at 1350 fps, 433ft lbs.. Take a look online at the round.

Last edited by Dvan34; 01-13-2017 at 04:51 PM.
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Old 01-13-2017, 06:43 PM
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About the search for "the best". Honest forensic folks who examine (fatal) wound tracks can't tell the difference between calibers much less brand names of any of the quality JHPs from the major makers. I'll also note that shot placement is far more important than diameter, weight, bullet design, velocity, degree of expansion or phase of the moon.

Find something readily available locally that's reliable and reasonably price and have at it. FWIW, the Remington standard JHP as found in their yellow box line and elsewhere will feed as well as ball ammo. It doesn't expand quite as well as some others, but it's reliable. Federal C9BP is also an oldie and goodie. Gold Dot and Federal HST work well but may be much more expensive and occasionally hard to find.

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Old 01-13-2017, 09:31 PM
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147 grain works just fine in my pistol.

I couldn't find much about 147 gr HTP except someone claiming that it is an older design with a new name. If that is correct then I would recommend upgrading to a newer load.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dvan34 View Post
You might check out the new Inceptor Polycase ARX Self Defense ammo. it is not JHP and comes in a variety of weights, I use 107gr SW .40 for my Shield. This ammo is rated for penetration, through several layers of denim, or leather. Meaning it won't clog up with cloth like a JHP. This round is rated at 1350 fps, 433ft lbs.. Take a look online at the round.
Please avoid gimmick ammunition like fluted bullets, fragmenting bullets, and bullets that expand to ridiculous sizes. Some examples are Glaser, ARX, Lehigh extreme penetrator, G2 RIP, DRT, Liberty, etc. They do not perform properly.

Before asking "What ammo should I use?" you should ask "What should ammo do, what shouldn't it do, and how is it tested?" I recommend the following:
Handgun Wounding Factors and Effectiveness from the Firearms Training Unit of the FBI
Basic Wound Ballistic Terminal Performance Facts by Dr. Roberts (DocGKR)
Ordnance gelatin test assessment for rifle and pistol calibers by Dr. Roberts (DocGKR)
What's Wrong With The Wound Ballistics Literature And Why by Dr. Fackler

For specific recommendations I start here:
Service Caliber Handgun Duty and Self-Defense Ammo by Dr. Roberts (DocGKR)
Then here (for 9mm and 380):
9mm Ammo Quest on Youtube by ShootingTheBull410
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Old 01-14-2017, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Protected One View Post
147gr is fine for self-defense, in fact, it's the "preferred weight" of many knowledgable people. The heavier bullets tend to get greater penetration, but be carful with that particular Remington ammo. I've seen videos where it consistently DID NOT expand when fired into ballistic gel.

147 use to be the heaviest weight available for 9mm until earlier this year when Federal came out with it's HST round (designed for short barrels like the shield) in 150gr. It has less recoil and muzzle flash. I have shot a box of it and keep 2 boxes in my safe. It's my current carry ammo.

Yes , you must always remember when you are attacked by a rogue block of ballistic gel to shoot it several times to make up for the possible lack of expansion of the 9mm bullet. Or just scrap the 9 and hit them with a .44 spl double tap !

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Old 01-15-2017, 01:26 AM
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Remington HTPs have horrible and inconsistent expansion
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Old Today, 03:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevada Ed View Post
The 147gr is the new heavy weight for the 9mm, now.
The old Black Talon was 147 gr in the 1980's, 147gr not new was considered "the " weight back then, by many.
The remington htp 9mm 147 is quoted @ 990 out of a 4" barrel, it will be less out of the shield, so it is unlikely to expand consistently.
If you have to carry a 9mm, you may want to look at Speer
Pocket Guns and Gear: Gel Testing Speer 9mm Gold Dot vs. Gold Dot Short Barrel. This link is for speer 124gd and 124 +p GDSB, in a SW shield- 14" of penetration. I carry Ranger 127 gr +P+ in all 9mm's that I might carry, it's street record was good.

If you want a real heavyweight you could go to Fiocchi 158 gr FMG, it is subsonic and suppressed it is quiet and very accurate out of the Glock.
Be Safe,
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