Anyone carry a 4" Model 19 or 66 with this load. I would like your impressions if you do. I am considering this combo for wilderness carry in the intermountain west.

Sorry, biggest in my 6" 357 Magnums for deer or Black bear
has been a full blown 160gr Speer SJFP .

I use a 180 or larger in my 30-06 rifle.

The Buffalo Bore HARD-CAST 180 .357 LSWC = 1375 fps from a 4" bbl. That is serious medicine from a 4" tube!

I have not personably chronographed the Federal 180 grain load above, however I have NEVER been able to get the velocities that Remington, Federal or Winchester state in their specifications - NEVER! Buffalo Bore is the ONLY ammo Company that I have ever verified personally with my own Chronograph. Sometimes I actually get slightly MORE velocity than they state.

Thanks chief38. My reasoning on the Federal 180 grain JHP was that it would likely achieve around 1000 fps out of a 4" K Frame. It would be easier for me to control and would not put too much stress on the revolver, but would provide good penetration. There are some good hard-cast LSWC 158 grain 38 Special +P rounds available at around the same velocity as the Federal round. Maybe they would penetrate better?

That is a lot of bullet for a K frame revolver. I have fired 180gr .357 Magnum ammo in a M686 and it was a handful. If you are going to carry that ammo I suggest you practice with it to he sure you can hit what you shoot at.

In a K frame I would go with a 158gr bullet, something that has an XTP bullet.

Hornady Custom Ammo 357 Mag 158 Grain XTP Jacketed Hollow Point Box of

Fiocchi Extrema Ammo 357 Mag 158 Grain Hornady XTP Jacketed Hollow

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SWCA #3437

I have shot quite a bit of both the Buffalo Bore 180 gr. and the Federal 180 grain that you are asking about. Both of those loads are a real handful out of a 4" or 6" 686. I don't think I would be too anxious to touch a cylinder full off in a 66.

I think I would look towards a good 158 grain or 160 grain jacketed soft point or hard cast for your purposes. If you look through the Buffalo Bore offerings, I am sure you will find something to fit your needs.

Several companies had a great sale on the Federal load back in the fall and I Picked up 1/2 dozen boxes. They must have had problems moving it because it was ridiculous cheap.

I agree that it's a LOT of bullet for a K Frame - however this load is for an emergency in the woods or other similar situation. It would certainly not be a regular plinking round, nor would one want to fire too many from a K Frame. A Cylinder full for familiarization and save the rest for if and when they are needed. When needed, they will CERTAINLY get the job done!

Being a reloader I have never bought Buffalo Bore stuff but I can tell you that I have fired many 180 grs cast bullet loads using W 296 , max loads using current load data . I have shot many of these in a K-frame , Model 19 w/ 4" barrel . The gun is as tight today as the day I bought it . I found the recoil very manageable and the load itself very accurate .

The best bullet in the world will do you no good unless you make good hits. Control and follow-up shots are very important.

My question is, penetrate what? Most dangerous animals in the woods are soft skinned and penetration isn't really a problem. I suggested the XTP bullet because it's tough and does not expand quickly allowing for good penetration.

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SWCA #3437

I had some rounds left from the factory Remington HTP 180gr. that I ran through my new 686+ last week and was pretty stout. Haven't found anymore on the shelf anywhere but reloading is a lot cheaper.

The reviews on the Federal 180 grain .357 JHP are good. Of all the 180 grain loads available it is the slowest at about 1000 fps. The rest seem to be at 1200 or better. I do not know what the difference in recoil impulse and muzzle blast would be between that round and a hard-cast 158 grain SWC fired from a .38 Special case at the same velocity. Obviously, it takes more to get the 180 grain up to speed than it does the 158 grain. Is there a discernible difference performance? In recoil and muzzle blast?

That should be a pretty mild load. I shoot a 190 gr at 925 fps out of my 4" 64 (.38 +P). It is an easily-controllable round, not unpleasant at all.

I don't own a .357, or have shot that round, but it seems like it's closer to a .38 +P, than a full-house magnum.

If easy to control is what you're looking for, I say go for it.

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I've shot a few dozen or so of the BB 180 .357 Mag's through K's and they are not that hard to control. Stiff yes, but I can easily keep 2 - 3 round groups within a few inches at 30 feet. This is the load I use when in Bear Country and hiking. Not setting out to hunt...... just for protection. I do not own a .44 Mag so I use a 3" M65 with these BB loads. THANKFULLY, I have never had a reason to test them out on Yogi, but have had the revolver drawn a few times as the Black Bears are less and less scared by humans it seems. They have gotten pretty darn close - closer than I like. When in the cabin, a 12 gauge loaded with slugs is what I rely on, but again, so far I have been able to scare them away - again, sometimes they are pretty "ballsy".

I do not know much about the Federal load, but I do trust the BB implicitly! At over 1300 feet per second from a 3" tube (1400 fps from a 4") and almost 800 foot pounds of energy I feel confident with it for Black Bears where I hang out. AGAIN, maybe it's NOT the ultimate Bear round - I got that, but the M65 is so convenient to carry it's always with me. Remember, the best gun to have is the one you HAVE ON YOU rather than having a "better gun" back at the cabin.

For big critters that eat people a heavy hard cast flat tip bullet 1000-1100 fps. Penetration is queen! That's all I use to hunt with, hollow points for what?

Hey franzas, that load sounds ideal. I just looked at the 190 grain hard cast .357 bullets at Midway. Do you mind sharing your load data? I have a lot of .38 special cases. I do not reload currently, but this could persuade me to start.

PM sent

10 char

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Thank you for the data franzas. I appreciate it.

No problemo

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I primarily used that Federal 180gr from 20 rifle. Velocities were high 1400's. Wild guessing would be aprox 1000fps from 4 inch.

Meanwhile, I'm trying to focus upon the OP's desired characteristics. What I Think I'm seeing is two part of plenty of penetration and medium-ish recoil. To me, that would call for a 158gr cast at 1100-1150 fps .

Grizzly or Buffalo Bore, or both offer this in .38spl cases. Handloading this in .357 cases is a cinch with several powders.

Chief, I expect that is because the Majors tend to use longer barrels for their testing because so many shooters shop by this number. Personally I have clocked the American Eagle 158 grain SJSP at 1260 fps which is 10 over the stated velocity but I did that with a 6 inch barrel on my Dan Wesson 15-2 with the B/C gap set to 0.003 inch. So, the numbers on the box are probably truthful but I would expect that many are also "hyped" by the use of longer than typical barrels and in some case barrels selected for producing exceptional velocity.

I've also shot that same load out of my 4 inch 620 and would recommend if the OP wants to use a heavy hitting 357 Magnum he has an excellent "excuse" to shop for a good model 27 or 28 4 inch "shooter". Because out of a 4 inch model than Buffalo Bore load would not be even in the same state as Comfortable. Flat out it would really hurt to shoot.

Biggfoot44. You mentioned the Grizzly brand. They have a 158 grain flat-nosed lead .38 Special round that is listed at 975 fps. Have you (or anybody else) shot this round?

scooter123. Yes, a Model 28-2 would be the cat's pajamas for heavy .357 loads. The problem at the moment is...I do not own one. If anyone would care to donate a "shooter" Model 28-2 in either a 4" or 6" barrel, it would be gratefully accepted. Even if it needed "fixing".

In my 357 mag 4" guns i seem to get lil over 1100 fps with a 180gr XTP or rem 180gr sjhp, this is with almost max charges of w296. i dont see how you can best this speed unless your way high on pressure. even with 6" of bbl i barely hit the 1200 fps mark.....

Hard cast or lead bullets. They're more "slippery" than copper

Example: In my 5" 1911 10mm-
180 FMJ gets 1330 with a max charge of Longshot
180 hardcast coated gets 1375 with a min charge of Longshot

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I have been chrono-less for several years . This past weekend while manning the booth for my state's premier grassroots 2A group at a major regional Gun Show, the vendor in the adjacent booth had a NiB Shooting Chrony & Indoor lighting kit for half of msrp, so I rectified my situation.

Meanwhile, the major ammo mfg's create their published velocity numbers from Test Barrels. The four inch Vented test bbls now commonly used in certain revolver cals are closer than the previous solid test bbls . But all test bbls are made to SAAMI minimum chamber and bore dimentions. This generally increases velocities and pressures to worst ( best) case scenario.

This is a Good Thing in a cpl ways. Insures safe pressures in any in spec gun. Also insures a more or less apple to apple comparison*between major ammo mfg's* . What this doesn't do is represent real world velocities from actual pistols.

Many smaller mfg's don't have their own expensive test bbl setups, and use independent labs for necessary testing. They then use actual guns for advertised velocities. This is good in that it * might * give the purchaser a close expectation of what g velocities they can expect . The weakness is individual guns have +/- tolerences of chambers, throats, cylinder gaps, bore dimentions, etc . When a mfg has several examples of same gun, or at least several similar guns with same bbl length it increases the confidence in their advertised numbers. But that can certainly end up getting expensive also.