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02-19-2017, 07:03 PM
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SUPER VEL IS BACK!
Bought the new Guns and Ammo magazine...........
on page 21 there is a write up of this ammo being produced again
The ammo covers the .38 special +P, three 9mm +P offerings and
two +P loads for the .45 ACP.
Things are looking up for the speed freaks and those that want
a "Hush Puppy" loading for suppressed 9mm.
Later.
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02-19-2017, 07:20 PM
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I'm glad to see Super Vel's return, even though Lee Jurras is no longer associated with it, and it's no longer made in Shelbyville.
They've also brought back the "Hush Puppy" round...a subsonic 147-grain FMJ 9mm cartridge that comes out of the barrel at 900-something fps, and even slower in a suppressed handgun.
I want to see them bring back the big bore revolver rounds...the .44 Magnum and .45 Colt. And even the .357 Magnum. I loved Super Vel in the seventies.
Lee Jurras, by the way, is 82- or 83-years-old now. One of my handgunner heroes...where has the time gone?
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02-19-2017, 07:29 PM
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When Super Vel first came out it had no competition.Today there's lots of choices so Super Vel's return my be short lived.
I was introduced to it by Jimmy Cirillo and loaded it in my 10-6 on stake outs.
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02-19-2017, 09:06 PM
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I shot it in the 1970 era. Not much else of much added power existed. After the lead SWC-HP became available from Winchester, I preferred it. I think Super Vel's typically light bullets were not the best answer to the need.
The heavier calibers could be effective. Maj. George Nonte, a gun writer, shot a treed black bear with a 190 grain .45 ACP and killed it. I forgot how many shots were fired.
One guy took a Ruger .44 to Africa and slew a zebra and other plains animals with 180 grain .44 Magnum loads.
I think that today, Buffalo Bore has filled the niche once sought by Super Vel. Like Weatherby rifles, Super Vel blazed a trail that is now filled by products of other, larger manufacturers. But I wish them success. I think they need to chose their ammo offerings carefully. And the advertised velocities had better be accurate.
Last edited by Texas Star; 02-19-2017 at 09:38 PM.
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02-19-2017, 09:23 PM
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I think I still have some old Super Vels around. Either 38 or 357.
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02-19-2017, 09:57 PM
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Super Vel is what I used back in the 1970's.
Nothing close to it back then.
May still have some of there ammo around.
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02-19-2017, 10:38 PM
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02-19-2017, 10:39 PM
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Norma had the hottest .38 Special load of the "Super Vel" era. Pressure was way up there as well, several years before anyone had heard of +P.
There is a report on all this in HANDLOADER magazine. I think it was about 1970 or '71. There was a later follow-up article where Jurras and maybe George Nonte and/or Neal Knox (editor) made up some hot load duplications and pressure tested them in Jurras Super Vel lab.
Wish I could be more specific; I have the articles but haven't read them in a while.
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02-19-2017, 10:51 PM
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It was never gone. Its down in the gun room in its own drawer, clearly marked! Different loadings have their place. Those of you who own a Model 329 should try the 180 grain loads before dismissing them. If you were around here we could even do a test firing. I'd shoot 6 of the Super Vels and you could shoot 6 of the 300 grain rounds. Then we could let either of us fire the next 6 of our choice. Guess which we'd choose?
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02-19-2017, 10:59 PM
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I collect Super Vel..Ammo, bullets. They even made/sold primers..
Sad story is/was the demise of Lee Jurras' Super Vel..
It seems Jurras had just about cornered the police/Leo market with
His high performance ammo..Unfortunately for him, he depended on
The Big Three ammo makers on his brass and other components. Rumor is/was they
got mad because of lost Leo business .. Cut his brass and other supplies
off. Suddenly- No supplies..No Business..l think he ended up going to
NORMA for brass/components.. Sadly he never recovered his lost business.
By coincidence the Big Three miraculously stepped in with their brands of
Hi Performance Ammo to save the day.....
Last edited by sw282; 02-19-2017 at 11:00 PM.
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02-19-2017, 11:36 PM
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I remember shooting a little of that ammo back in the 70s, but I mostly shot reloads as that is what I could afford. I hope they can make a go of their comeback.
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02-19-2017, 11:41 PM
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Where are they located now?
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02-20-2017, 12:30 AM
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In addition to ammo, Super Vel used to sell component bullets for handloaders.
Anyone recall Super Vel bullets being undersize to keep pressures down? I've read that but have no idea if it's true. In defense of Super Vel, however, I still have a box of fifty 90 gr. 9mm bullets. They measure exactly .355", just as depicted on the box. I had (and may still have) a box of 110 gr. .38 bullets, but don't recall measuring the diameter.
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02-20-2017, 01:24 PM
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The author of this article was Patrick Sweeny and at a 2016
gun show, he ran into Cameron Hopkins that purchased the
trademark and has his own ammo company.
He did study's on powder types and tested ammo and got a
blessing from Mr. Jurras to make the ammo again, along with
the bright yellow ammo box.
In the future, 380 and then 40 ammo will be coming.
Later.
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02-20-2017, 01:37 PM
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In the mid seventies I carried six rounds of 125 gr semi jacketed soft points Super Vel in my pocket because we were only authorized 158 gr round nose lead. After Roll Call everyone would change to their pocket ammo.
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02-20-2017, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas Star
Where are they located now?
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l
Las Vegas
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02-20-2017, 06:07 PM
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I looked over the 'new' Super Vel site back in December. Some good background/history/info there.
I collect Super Vel and Norma handgun ammo.
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02-20-2017, 10:20 PM
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This has to be classified as a nostalgia play. Super Vel was the only high-performance ammo back then. Now there's a plethora of performance ammo available. Further, how many of the younger shooters care about Super Vel??? I certainly will never do business with Cameron Hopkins(knowingly) in view of his past mistakes.
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02-20-2017, 11:38 PM
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The other problem is that Super Vel played on the supposedly reliable findings of the NIJ and its Relative Incapacitation Index (RII), which emphasized the temporary wound cavity, which said that light, fast bullets out-performed all loads. This wasn't the experience of folks in the real world, but because it was based on computer models and high tech stuff, many people ran with it.
Once the light, fast theory was disproven (again), people went to bigger calibers.
Even now, the loads that were the big deal with Super Vel and the NIJ are not what is shown to be the best performers in the FBI ammo tests.
Now, if anyone wants to dispute the FBI tests, that is fine with me, but I will take proven loads over a box label and nostalgia. Everyone else is free to have their own opinions.
Last edited by shawn mccarver; 02-20-2017 at 11:46 PM.
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02-20-2017, 11:44 PM
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Super Vel wasn't the only high performance ammo back then, at least in .38 Special. There were two hotter loads, at least according to advertised figures. While Super Vel 110 JHP (1370) may have been the best seller, there was also the hottest factory load, the 110 Norma JHP (1526), the Remington 125 JHP (1370) and the Speer-DWM 125 & 140 JHPs (1150 & 1050). May have been a couple of others.
"Real" muzzle velocities of all these were likely less than advertised, but it didn't really matter because few handloaders had chronographs then and there was no way to verify.
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02-21-2017, 12:41 AM
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l shot my first deer w/handgun using Super Vel 180gr JHP 44s..
My SILH match director had just gotten a chronograph by Powley
or 0ehler l think...Anyway after the mess it made of the deer asked
him to clock the sped of those with his new gizmo...They averaged
1803 FPS for 5 shots from my 8 3/8''Model 29...
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02-21-2017, 02:03 AM
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That's indeed pretty fast.
Speer used to have a section in their loading manuals where they chronographed velocities of contemporary loadings for popular handgun and rifle cartridges. In the #9 manual (1974), they list a Super Vel .44 Magnum 180 JSP but not a JHP. Advertised muzzle velocity was a speedy 1995 fps (unknown barrel length). Speer chronographed it at 1623 fps from a 6 1/2" M29. Certainly a discrepancy, but that's still a decent velocity from a handgun barrel.
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02-23-2017, 04:11 PM
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I had a 6" barrel Mod 19 back in 72 and fired a box or so of Super Vel 110 gr .357 through it. One day while cleaning it I noticed slight dimpling of the inside of the chambers adjacent to the cylinder locking notches. Not sure if the Super Vel was responsible but I quit firing it in the Mod 19.
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02-23-2017, 04:45 PM
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Used to carry the Super Vel 137's in a 4" model 19 back in the day. Could punch through a windshield and a car door without going out the other side of the car.
Also made a dynamite racoon load on the late night, county back roads patrol duties.
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02-25-2017, 07:10 PM
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Gee more "boutique" ammo. Load up a light weigh JHP to +P pressure and charge a bundle for it!
$40 for 20, 90 gr 38 special +p
supervel
I already carry 185 gr +p JHP 45 acp
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02-25-2017, 07:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rule3
Gee more "boutique" ammo. Load up a light weigh JHP to +P pressure and charge a bundle for it!
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Well, in its heyday, Super Vel was anything but a boutique brand. It was a serious market competitor that had companies like Winchester and Remington gnashing their teeth in the beginning.
Although I was a dedicated hand loader in the seventies, it was nice to be able to buy high quality high performance ammo in quantity for my .357s and .44s at what was then a reasonable price to me. Saved me hours at the loading bench.
Not sure I'd buy a lot of the "new" Super Vel now, since I don't shoot as much as I did back then, but I'd probably pick up a few boxes.
And I still buy the vintage Super Vel whenever I stumble across some at a decent price. That red and yellow box brings back memories of happy times.
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02-25-2017, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shawn mccarver
The other problem is that Super Vel played on the supposedly reliable findings of the NIJ and its Relative Incapacitation Index (RII), which emphasized the temporary wound cavity, which said that light, fast bullets out-performed all loads. This wasn't the experience of folks in the real world, but because it was based on computer models and high tech stuff, many people ran with it.
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Lee Jurras founded Super Vel in 1963. Kinda don't think there was a whole lot of computer modeling going on back then. Not much high tech stuff, either, I don't think.
I'm not sure Super Vel and Jurras played on NIJ findings. I believe what it played on was shooters' desire and need for high performance handgun ammo...and that included law enforcement at the time. This is just my opinion, mind you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawn mccarver
I will take proven loads over a box label and nostalgia. Everyone else is free to have their own opinions.
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What's wrong with nostalgia, especially (in this case) if the product is a proven performer?
Besides, nostalgia is one of the biggest factors that fuels the collector market, whether it's guns, ammo, leather goods, whatever. Again, my opinion.
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