Smith & Wesson Forum

Go Back   Smith & Wesson Forum > Ammunition-Gunsmithing > Ammo
o

Notices

Ammo All Ammo Discussions Go Here


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-10-2018, 03:00 PM
Cal44 Cal44 is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Northern California
Posts: 3,568
Likes: 5,473
Liked 6,418 Times in 1,861 Posts
Default Hang fires -- a real problem?

Yesterday, at the range I had a light strike problem with a revolver.

I went on and pulled the trigger again, had a second light strike.

Then it occurred to me that if I had a hang fire after the first light strike, I might have destroyed the gun if I had a hang fire after the cylinder rotated.

By hang fire, I mean when a round is struck, doesn't fire immediately, and then 10, 20, or 30 seconds or so later does fire.

Is this a real problem?

Has anyone actually experienced a hang fire as I defined it?

Or is this a rare problem that once happened to a guy in 1896, and hasn't happened again to anyone in over 100 years?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-10-2018, 03:15 PM
Redcoat3340's Avatar
Redcoat3340 Redcoat3340 is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Washington State
Posts: 1,405
Likes: 614
Liked 1,719 Times in 628 Posts
Default

We used to have to wait 5 minutes if we had a hangfire before we could do anything!

Of course we were dealing with a 3 pound Revolutionary War cannon. If we touched off the powder and the round didn't go BANG, we had to wait 5 minutes before we doused it with water down the tube and then emptied the mess from the barrel. UGH.

I seem to recall we used 1/4 lb of black powder double wrapped in heavy duty tin foil; rammed it home; pierced the foil with a prick and then filled the touchhole with either more powder or a fuse. Add a burning linstock and BANG! (We were Royal Artillery Battery "W" out of Annapolis, MD part of the Maryland Loyalist Battalion.)

I just loved that cannon. (And we rarely had hangfires.)

And I too worry about a hangfire in a revolver...and maybe based on my cannon experience, usually wait 5 or 10 seconds before I try to correct the problem.
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Like Post:
  #3  
Old 10-10-2018, 03:30 PM
Rpg Rpg is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Denver area
Posts: 6,221
Likes: 20,240
Liked 13,057 Times in 4,157 Posts
Default

In 60+ years shooting (some years quite a lot of shooting) I’ve never experienced a hangfire nor do I know anyone who has.

Of course, I don’t shoot black powder cannons or muzzle loading small arms.
Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Like Post:
  #4  
Old 10-10-2018, 03:37 PM
Sevens Sevens is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Ohio
Posts: 7,822
Likes: 9,389
Liked 14,740 Times in 5,023 Posts
Default

I have had a hangfire, but it wasn't for a long stretch. It was more like a click-BANG. Happened twice with the same loads, so I stopped after the second one and pulled the rest of the loads apart.

This was in .460 S&W Magnum and while I cannot be certain, I believe the issue was far too little crimp which allowed the slug to jump forward from the primer blast. My other theory was that I might have had tumbling media stuck in the flash hole which greatly impeded the flame from the primer.

I'm not 100% sure, but it was a scary wake-up call.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #5  
Old 10-10-2018, 03:39 PM
rockquarry rockquarry is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 7,552
Likes: 4
Liked 8,885 Times in 4,121 Posts
Default

I've experienced hangfires, but only in rifles. These have occurred with handloads where I used a powder that may have been recommended in a load manual but was not the best powder choice for the load combination, or perhaps the powder charge was the recommended minimum.

Most of the time this has been with cast bullet loads where much lower powder charges are recommended than the suggested charges for jacketed bullets. In every situation, the "hangfire" fired very quickly after I pulled the trigger; the lapse between pulling the trigger could not be measured in seconds. It would be a much smaller measurement unit than seconds, whatever that is called.

A round firing after ten or twenty seconds? Possible, I suppose, but unlikely. I've never experienced it in more that fifty years of handloading a lot of rifle and handgun cartridges. As I recall, I think I had a hangfire or two with some old factory or military ammo, but that's been a while.

The best example of a hangfire I can recall was more than ten years ago when developing some cast loads for a rifle in .375 H&H Magnum. This is a huge case and whatever powder I was using should have been suitable but the load was susceptible to hangfires. Switching to a magnum primer solved the problem in that instance.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #6  
Old 10-10-2018, 04:02 PM
k22fan k22fan is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,835
Likes: 5,161
Liked 5,242 Times in 2,483 Posts
Default

While modern self defense instructors teach jam and missfire clearing drills with no regard for the possibility of hangfires, NRA safety rules and hunter safety classes teach hangfire safety precautions.

The self defense instructors I've discussed this with called hangfires with modern cartridges too rare to concern themselves with. However, to me it's like the presumption that guns will not slam fire when a spring drives the bolt or slide into battery. Working at ranges I've seen too many examples of both and had both things happen with my guns too many times to share their confidence. I once had a neighbor who had a real chrome plated toilet paper holder inlet into his Honda above the rear bumper. It held a fake plastic roll of TP over the bumper sticker "**** happens." Spend enough time at ranges and you are going to see and or experience "rare" events. In the heat of a timed match I take the risk but not while casually target shooting. Is putting your expensive S&W revolver at risk worth saving 20 seconds? It is your gun.

After reading Redcoat3340's cannon story I can not resist retelling an old story that my uncle told me. He volunteered to dynamite stumps on the site my parents were clearing for a house. A charge did not go off. He was so afraid to go near it that he stayed and helped them hand dig the well for two days.

Last edited by k22fan; 10-10-2018 at 04:49 PM. Reason: rockquarry made a good proof reader.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #7  
Old 10-10-2018, 04:12 PM
Erich's Avatar
Erich Erich is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: High Desert of NM, USA
Posts: 6,235
Likes: 9,320
Liked 8,811 Times in 2,554 Posts
Default

I've had hangfires in a few of the thousands of rounds of many-decades-old surplus rifle rounds I've fired. None since the Nineties, but most of that garbage has been shot up.



Not Soviet stuff, by the way.
__________________
Now go make God proud...
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-10-2018, 04:25 PM
rockquarry rockquarry is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 7,552
Likes: 4
Liked 8,885 Times in 4,121 Posts
Default

Hangfires and misfires aren't the same.
Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Like Post:
  #9  
Old 10-10-2018, 05:47 PM
Fishinfool's Avatar
Fishinfool Fishinfool is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Central PA
Posts: 4,550
Likes: 8,201
Liked 11,436 Times in 3,018 Posts
Default

Never experienced a hang fire with a modern centerfire or rimfire arm, but have a couple times when firing cap & ball or flint weapons. Did have a black powder revolver "triple" on me once. That wakes you up.

No proof, but hang fires may have been more prevalent back during the days of the switch to cased ammo, hence the warning.

Larry
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-10-2018, 05:55 PM
Erich's Avatar
Erich Erich is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: High Desert of NM, USA
Posts: 6,235
Likes: 9,320
Liked 8,811 Times in 2,554 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rockquarry View Post
Hangfires and misfires aren't the same.

I don't know if you're talking to me (your post was right after mine), but in case you were, I know what a hangfire is.
__________________
Now go make God proud...
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 10-10-2018, 06:02 PM
epj's Avatar
epj epj is online now
US Veteran
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Birmingham, Alabama
Posts: 4,481
Likes: 227
Liked 2,397 Times in 1,081 Posts
Default

Haven’t had one in years, but hang fires were not too uncommon with older rim fire ammo.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #12  
Old 10-10-2018, 06:06 PM
shocker's Avatar
shocker shocker is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,482
Likes: 550
Liked 1,427 Times in 666 Posts
Default

Maybe 1 dud centerfire primer I can remember in many thousands of rounds shot. Never a hangfire even with very small amounts of powder in rifle cartridges. Like 6 gr of fast pistol powder in a 30-06.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #13  
Old 10-10-2018, 06:10 PM
rockquarry rockquarry is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 7,552
Likes: 4
Liked 8,885 Times in 4,121 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich View Post
I don't know if you're talking to me (your post was right after mine), but in case you were, I know what a hangfire is.
No, didn't see your post until after I posted mine.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #14  
Old 10-10-2018, 06:11 PM
andy52's Avatar
andy52 andy52 is offline
US Veteran
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Missouri
Posts: 2,929
Likes: 3,902
Liked 6,802 Times in 1,851 Posts
Default

Never had a hang fire with a cartridge weapon, have had several with muzzleloaders and it seems a old term that really doesn't apply to cartridges.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-10-2018, 06:33 PM
HamHands's Avatar
HamHands HamHands is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Highlands, North Carolina
Posts: 1,522
Likes: 2,096
Liked 2,202 Times in 883 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by epj View Post
Haven’t had one in years, but hang fires were not too uncommon with older rim fire ammo.
That is the only hangfire I've ever experienced; was with Remington "ThunderBolt" ammo... Imagine that! I'll shoot Golden Sabre but anything UMC, or Green Box, isn't worth the box its shoved in. It's ruined at least one gun of mine in the past and tried to ruin an otherwise sunrise reliable M&P40 (mid-size)...

OP, your problem was probably due to your strain screw needs a little tightening!
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-10-2018, 07:39 PM
TX-Dennis TX-Dennis is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: The Rugged Llano Estacado
Posts: 3,599
Likes: 21,376
Liked 5,422 Times in 2,234 Posts
Default

Never in many tens of thousands of rounds fired. I know it's theoretically possible, but it has to be very rare.

I have had a few "duds" though - primers that did not fire despite a heavy firing pin mark on them.
__________________
Or something like that . . .
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10-10-2018, 07:57 PM
GypsmJim GypsmJim is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,233
Likes: 22
Liked 5,547 Times in 1,940 Posts
Default

I've never had a hangfire with any commercial, handloaded or surplus military ball made as far back as 1935. However, .303 British surplus made with cordite is brutal stuff. I made the mistake of buying a few boxes of the stuff on the cheap, and found at least 50% were hangfires.

After shooting a few rounds I broke all of them down and disposed of them.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10-10-2018, 08:00 PM
mauser9 mauser9 is online now
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Northeast
Posts: 3,164
Likes: 8,321
Liked 2,808 Times in 1,682 Posts
Default

I have. Some older military 8MM rounds probably from the 50s. Got rid of that junk fast.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 10-10-2018, 08:40 PM
ch1966 ch1966 is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: SW Oklahoma
Posts: 35
Likes: 2
Liked 12 Times in 8 Posts
Default

Yes I had a hang fire once shooting Winchester silvertips through my model 66.
It was an old partial box of ammo that iirc came from a garage sale.
CLICK ....1001....1002....BOOM
Be careful with old ammo.
Stuff happens.

The next round was a squib that wedged in the forcing cone and locked up the cylinder.
I had to drive the bullet back into the cylinder with a wood dowel to open it.

The rest of that ammo ended up in the creek.

Last edited by ch1966; 10-10-2018 at 08:45 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:54 AM
BLUEDOT37's Avatar
BLUEDOT37 BLUEDOT37 is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: N.E. OKLA.
Posts: 6,460
Likes: 5,857
Liked 9,264 Times in 3,478 Posts
Default

I had a couple hang-fires shooting 45 Colt (+P) loads using AA9 powder in my Ruger SRH 454. Also once when I was experimenting with reduced loads using H110 in my 500 S&W.

As long as you don't have a stuck bullet in the barrel (squib) before the hang-fire it's biggest danger is hitting something you weren't originally aiming at because you were distracted by it.

.
__________________
Waiting for the break of day
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 10-11-2018, 03:41 AM
tozan tozan is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Reno / Tahoe area
Posts: 27
Likes: 12
Liked 25 Times in 12 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cal44 View Post
Yesterday, at the range I had a light strike problem with a revolver.
I have built and tuned a lot of revolvers and when testing I would on rare occasion have a light strike when this happens I would hold the trigger and just fan the hammer back once or even twice to get it to fire. If I had already released the trigger I would just give it 30 seconds before rotating the cyld back and cocking it again and firing it.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 10-11-2018, 04:44 AM
one eye joe's Avatar
one eye joe one eye joe is offline
US Veteran
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: New England
Posts: 4,190
Likes: 3,543
Liked 3,996 Times in 1,627 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rpg View Post
In 60+ years shooting (some years quite a lot of shooting) I’ve never experienced a hangfire nor do I know anyone who has.

Of course, I don’t shoot black powder cannons or muzzle loading small arms.
I MUST SIMPLY ADD A "DITTO" TO THIS POST, WORD FOR WORD ! ! !

MY EXPERIENCE HAS BEEN THE VERY SAME, IN MY 60 YEARS OF SHOOTING......
__________________
'Nam 1968-69.DAV,VFW,NRA Inst.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #23  
Old 10-11-2018, 04:49 AM
yeti's Avatar
yeti yeti is offline
US Veteran
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Illinois
Posts: 2,350
Likes: 2,854
Liked 2,765 Times in 1,160 Posts
Default

No, but I always give it at least a five count.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 10-11-2018, 05:08 AM
ImprovedModel56Fan ImprovedModel56Fan is offline
US Veteran
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MA
Posts: 7,330
Likes: 7,502
Liked 5,556 Times in 2,547 Posts
Default

Twenty-some years ago I experienced several hangfires with commercial .38 Special ammo which, as I recall, may have once been owned by Uncle Sam. Mixed brands, I believe, all given to me by a LGS owner friend, less than a box. Questionable storage, but probably not even forty years old, and externally decent condition.

Anyway, I had a few barely perceptible hangfires, at least one for a large fraction of a second, and perhaps one even longer. I have no idea why.

Hangfires exist.
__________________
Formerly Model520Fan

Last edited by ImprovedModel56Fan; 10-14-2018 at 07:39 AM. Reason: typo/brain fart
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 10-11-2018, 06:13 AM
alwslate alwslate is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Indiana
Posts: 6,605
Likes: 3,691
Liked 7,168 Times in 2,996 Posts
Default

Some years ago I bought a bunch of old US .45 ACP ammo headstamped
1918 at a gun show that the seller had tumble cleaned to make it shine.
It was in heavy plastic bags and I didn't look at it closely until I got it
home. All of it fired but there were a very few slight hangfires, just click
and boom, nothing like what happens sometimes with muzzle loaders.
No big deal and the only hangfires I have experienced with center fire
ammo.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 10-11-2018, 08:00 AM
shocker's Avatar
shocker shocker is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,482
Likes: 550
Liked 1,427 Times in 666 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HamHands View Post
That is the only hangfire I've ever experienced; was with Remington "ThunderBolt" ammo... Imagine that! I'll shoot Golden Sabre but anything UMC, or Green Box, isn't worth the box its shoved in. It's ruined at least one gun of mine in the past and tried to ruin an otherwise sunrise reliable M&P40 (mid-size)...

OP, your problem was probably due to your strain screw needs a little tightening!
For the record, I've shot a lot of Thunderbolt and 9 mm UMC recently, without a hitch.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 10-11-2018, 09:52 AM
Erich's Avatar
Erich Erich is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: High Desert of NM, USA
Posts: 6,235
Likes: 9,320
Liked 8,811 Times in 2,554 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rockquarry View Post
No, didn't see your post until after I posted mine.

Cheers, brother!
__________________
Now go make God proud...
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 10-11-2018, 10:05 AM
THE PILGRIM's Avatar
THE PILGRIM THE PILGRIM is online now
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: ALBUQUERQUE, NM
Posts: 13,846
Likes: 8,067
Liked 25,338 Times in 8,518 Posts
Default

misfires, yes.
Never had a ‘Hangfire.’
__________________
NRA LIFE MEMBER
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 10-11-2018, 10:52 AM
rockquarry rockquarry is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 7,552
Likes: 4
Liked 8,885 Times in 4,121 Posts
Default

Someone mentioned rimfire ammo. I shoot a lot of this stuff and buy CCI standard velocity by the case. Generally, I've found misfires (never had a hangfire with .22 LR ammo) are to be expected occasionally with cheap, bulk ammo.

After years and many thousands of rounds of CCI SV in rifles and handguns, I've had only one misfire, about a month or so ago. You pretty much get what you pay for with .22 ammo. I like to spend just a little more and get more dependable ammo.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 10-11-2018, 01:04 PM
desi2358 desi2358 is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,108
Likes: 35,798
Liked 917 Times in 487 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GypsmJim View Post
I've never had a hangfire with any commercial, handloaded or surplus military ball made as far back as 1935. However, .303 British surplus made with cordite is brutal stuff. I made the mistake of buying a few boxes of the stuff on the cheap, and found at least 50% were hangfires.

After shooting a few rounds I broke all of them down and disposed of them.
I've had hangfires with more than a few old military and commercial rounds over the years. 7m/m Mauser, 7.5 French (also prone to not going off at all!), various old 22's and others. Even though I collect old ammo I have tried various odd loose rounds from time to time just to see if they would still fire. Always suspected that the classic click---bang hangfire was due to a weak primer most often (smoldered before fully igniting) but really don't know for sure.

With 303 it was Pakistani made stuff that seemed to be the worst. Had a bunch of it (it was cheap) and did find that laying it in the sun for a while before shooting seemed to reduce the number of hangfires. I finally broke the last hundred down and since I had figured out a workable but slow way to re-load the cordite tried transferring it into new commercial cases. With new primers it shot fine, no more hangfires.
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 10-11-2018, 01:05 PM
Muss Muggins's Avatar
Muss Muggins Muss Muggins is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: bootheel of Missouri
Posts: 16,853
Likes: 6,981
Liked 28,083 Times in 8,897 Posts
Default

I've never seen one . . .
__________________
Wisdom comes thru fear . . .
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 10-11-2018, 01:09 PM
dave1918a2's Avatar
dave1918a2 dave1918a2 is offline
US Veteran
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Black Hills of SD
Posts: 2,757
Likes: 2,150
Liked 4,167 Times in 1,778 Posts
Default

Our rule is if the gun goes "click", keep the muzzle pointed down range or in a safe direction. Count to thirty, and try to see what happened. Sometimes there is no round in the chamber, or a light strike primer in a revolver. NEVER get in a hurry. I have had several hang fires --- in My flintlock. Just keep the muzzle in a safe direction. Never rack the slide or open the cylinder imediatley after a click. The result could be a disaster.

Last edited by dave1918a2; 10-11-2018 at 01:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #33  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:00 PM
JayFramer JayFramer is offline
Banned
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 4,596
Likes: 6,989
Liked 9,331 Times in 2,759 Posts
Default

Has some hangfires with questionable 7.62x54mmR tracers by buddy bought, and some inconsistencies in recoil forces an audible signatures.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:07 PM
gwpercle's Avatar
gwpercle gwpercle is online now
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Baton Rouge, La.
Posts: 6,838
Likes: 7,390
Liked 8,045 Times in 3,651 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rpg View Post
In 60+ years shooting (some years quite a lot of shooting) I’ve never experienced a hangfire nor do I know anyone who has.

Of course, I don’t shoot black powder cannons or muzzle loading small arms.
50+ years for me , NRA Bullseye Match , practice , plinking, hunting ( also some years a lot) have never experienced or seen another shooter have a "hang fire" they would go bang or not go bang. At the range , waiting one minute was the protocol . But none of the no bangs ever went off later....still a good idea to wait 30 seconds ...just in case !
Gary

Last edited by gwpercle; 10-11-2018 at 02:10 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:29 PM
Papaw Papaw is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Arkansas USA
Posts: 304
Likes: 959
Liked 362 Times in 113 Posts
Default

Never had a hangfire. I have had misfires. And just a couple weeks ago I had a squib 45 Colt which got a bullet stuck in a gun barrel.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:40 PM
double-dipper's Avatar
double-dipper double-dipper is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Kansas
Posts: 720
Likes: 1,917
Liked 1,143 Times in 454 Posts
Default

In 56 years of shooting and hunting I have only seen 1 in loaded ammo. I've had/seen many hang fire in black powder guns. It was a reloaded 12 gauge Federal paper hull shotgun shell. The hang fire was only a spit second from primer snap to boom.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:50 PM
younggun22 younggun22 is online now
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: IL
Posts: 1,700
Likes: 693
Liked 2,841 Times in 578 Posts
Default

I found some old 45 Auto Rim at a shop I used to work at with plans to shoot it up for the brass so I could reload it. I shot 1 cylinder that was fine and then the next cylinder the first 3 rounds didn't ignite and the 4th didn't either ... and then it did.

Luckily for whatever reason I thought to myself that I was going to wait just to make sure. Really glad I didn't destroy a really nice Mod. 25-2 and I proceeded to pull the rest of it.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 10-11-2018, 04:42 PM
Sebring Pop's Avatar
Sebring Pop Sebring Pop is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 224
Likes: 75
Liked 97 Times in 54 Posts
Default

Was in old or new ammo or reloads you purchased or reloaded yourself??
What revolver did you use??
__________________
IN GOD WE TRUST     ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 10-11-2018, 09:21 PM
2152hq 2152hq is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,724
Likes: 1,633
Liked 9,091 Times in 3,362 Posts
Default

A few of the early 20th century pump repeating shotguns had a 'hang fire safety' in their mechanism.
The designers/mfg'rs thought they were important enough for some reason or another to keep the shooter from opening the action too quickly after a 'click' on a loaded round.

On most common pump action shotguns and some of that time, dry firing or in the instance of a dud round,,the action of the gun is free to be opened by simply cycling the pump action.

With a hangfire safety in the mechanism (a counter weight that worked under recoil from the shot to allow the bolt slide to unlock),,, a dry firing or dud round still leaves the action locked.
That natural instinct to quickly cycle the action open is prevented and the possible 'hang fire round' is still secured at least for that time in the chamber of the locked action.
In order to open the action, the shooter must depress the slide latch an then the action can be cycled.
That extra time needed to do that was what they wanted to intervene betw the dud round and some time to think about the hang fire possibility.
They simply did not trust the shotshell ammo of the period.

This was in the time from before WW1 till right up to WW2.
I think it was something to do with the cross over betw BP and smokeless shotshell ammo which was taking place at the time (early 1900) and perhaps some hesitation about the pump action itself.
It was a fairly new thing, not trusted yet in the way that the all American single shot and SxS was. Just my opinion of course.

Stevens used a hangfire safety in early production Model 520. This in the 1912 to 1915 period.
All the Marlin Hammerless Pump shotguns made had a H/F safety in them.
I believe the Remington Model 17 had this type of mechanism also where you had to use the slide latch to open the action even if the gun was dry fired or a dud round. Might be wrong on that one though. Don't have my M17 to check it out anymore.

H/F safety not to be confused with the sear disconnector style used in many of the early pumps that allow the so-called 'slam fire' (a misnomer but the most popular description anyway).

Some early designs didn't have that 'slamfire' sear disconnector and can not be fired continuously by holding the trigger back and cycling the action.
But they also did not have a hang fire safety in them either.
The Remington Model 10 (1908-1928) is one.

The orig Winchester Model 12 never had a H/F safety mechanism and always had the 'slamfire' type sear disconnector.

The Japanese/Browning repro Model12's have a full sear disconnector,,so no slam fire feature. So do the repro Model 42 shotguns.
This most likely a gift of the Legal Dept/Lliability Research Div of Browning to help keep you and children of the world safe at night.

For me personally I have seen but one gun damaged from a hangfire round,,and it was a pump shotgun. A HighStandard (102?). 12ga, the round went off with the breech unlocked and partially opened to eject a dud-round.

That Pakistani mfg 303 ammo mentioned earlier had a lot of hangfires to it.
Yes it was cheap, but you knew why when you went to use it.
Great for Flintlock firing simulation. Anywhere from a second to perhaps as long as 2+seconds between the firing pin click and the round going off. Not every one,,but enough of them that they were just laughable to use.
'POF' Pakistan Ordnance Factory was the mfg of the stuff.
We crowned it Pride of Frankenstein ammo.

Probably should have just pulled the bullets and scrapped the stuff, but hey, it somewhat went bang!

Last edited by 2152hq; 10-11-2018 at 09:29 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #40  
Old 10-11-2018, 11:05 PM
Ribwizzard's Avatar
Ribwizzard Ribwizzard is offline
Member
Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem? Hang fires -- a real problem?  
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Tampa/miami
Posts: 685
Likes: 35
Liked 1,049 Times in 311 Posts
Default

About 29 years ago, I was messing with this girl and her ex came in and started tearing the place up with an axe, she lived with her Dad and he had an old 20 guage side by side hanging on the wall. I got to it , broke it open to find only one shell in it. By that time he was right up on me with axe cocked back ready to swing so I pointed mid chest and pulled the trigger. He froze, axe still raised and poised to stick down on me. Click, nothing. Now...cant say how long the exact delay actually was, but I remember going ....oh ****...looking down at the gun, looking up at his eyes, looking down at the gun and back at his eyes again to see the hesitation expire and the movement of the axe proceed in the upswing. As I pulled the shotgun from me shoulder and began the transition to use the gun to block the down swing of the axe, the gun finally fired and put a few bird shot pellets in his right thigh. The axe was dropped, the guy started a one legged dance and hop, and ran out the door, hooting and hollering as he ran off down the road. Later her dad had told be that the shell was about 20 years old.and had come with the shotty when he bought it.
That's my only experience with a hang fire, that I remember.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
696 worries... real or no problem? PetersCustomLeather S&W Revolvers: 1980 to the Present 41 09-15-2018 12:42 AM
Never Mind Forest Fires or Firearms: The real danger: Straws HOUSTON RICK The Lounge 26 08-16-2018 10:07 PM
I got a real problem...... CAJUNLAWYER The Lounge 74 12-22-2013 11:39 AM
Problem with miss-fires - off center strikes sniper_26 S&W-Smithing 7 02-26-2013 05:26 PM
First real problem with one of my M&P's! Houdini1953 Smith & Wesson M&P Pistols 18 12-05-2012 02:26 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
smith-wessonforum.com tested by Norton Internet Security smith-wessonforum.com tested by McAfee Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:48 AM.


Smith-WessonForum.com is not affiliated with Smith & Wesson Holding Corporation (NASDAQ Global Select: SWHC)