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Old 01-13-2020, 08:24 PM
38SPL HV 38SPL HV is offline
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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Default Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!

Here is a photo of a Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP round from one of two boxes recently purchased. Notice the excellent and pronounced firm roll crimp...rivals Buffalo Bore’s crimp. Rounds in second box were crimped in same fashion.

Now that is a crimp! Bullets are sure to stay put in your S&W J frame Airweights and LCR! Remington gets it - great job!
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Old 01-13-2020, 09:13 PM
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Geeeeze;

to me looking at the case, that is an over crimp !!


So they are a little better than your just bought Winchester "FBI"
+P loads..... huh ?

Glad they got it right.

Have fun.
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Old 01-13-2020, 09:25 PM
38SPL HV 38SPL HV is offline
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Take a look at Buffalo Bore 38 Spl std and +P 158 gr lhp loadings, they appear excessive but such firm crimps, as you know, are needed in the lighter weight revolvers. I’m willing to bet that sales of lightweight 38/357s (S&W and Ruger) dwarf sales of larger frame revolvers in these calibers - Remington got it right with firmly crimping their rounds for lightweight firearms.
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Old 01-13-2020, 09:40 PM
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But how is the performance of the Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP?
Did you chrono it? If so, what barrel lengths and what were the speeds?
I know you're reporting on the crimp, but performance is my interest.
Looking forward to any chrono report.
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Old 01-13-2020, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Zebra War Wagon View Post
But how is the performance of the Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP?
Did you chrono it? If so, what barrel lengths and what were the speeds?
I know you're reporting on the crimp, but performance is my interest.
Looking forward to any chrono report.
Paul Harrell has at least one good video on it, and likes it for snubbies.
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Old 01-13-2020, 11:10 PM
38SPL HV 38SPL HV is offline
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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Originally Posted by Zebra War Wagon View Post
But how is the performance of the Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP?
Did you chrono it? If so, what barrel lengths and what were the speeds?
I know you're reporting on the crimp, but performance is my interest.
Looking forward to any chrono report.
There is plenty of chronograph info on this cartridge, and I’m sure that there is negligible lot to lot variances. These differences are moot in my opinion when tested in a factory controlled environment. Of course differences from revolver to revolver (ie cylinder gap), temperature, altitude, which from my experience, can drive differences in velocities. I’ve gotten higher velocities in hot summer vs those obtained in the cold for instance. However, for all practical purposes this round has not changed much in terms of velocity over the years...Remington, Winchester and Federal have well defined specifications and controlled environments when testing these and their other cartridges.

There is the skeptic in everyone and I respect that, and when things warm up a bit and when I have some reloads to chronograph, I’ll take these along.

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Old 01-13-2020, 11:23 PM
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Now that is a crimp!


What do you think about the crimp on these .41 Magums?
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Old 01-13-2020, 11:35 PM
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What crimp?
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Old 01-13-2020, 11:46 PM
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What crimp?
Exactly!!!
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Old 01-13-2020, 11:47 PM
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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Those Remington bullets look like they have been heavily crimped with a Lee FCD.
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Old 01-14-2020, 12:06 AM
38SPL HV 38SPL HV is offline
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Quote:
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Those Remington bullets look like they have been heavily crimped with a Lee FCD.
This is how they came out of the box, crimped by Remington.

Next skeptic...

Last edited by 38SPL HV; 01-14-2020 at 12:10 AM.
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Old 01-14-2020, 12:09 AM
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What do you think about the crimp on these .41 Magums?
I’ve shot and loaded 41 Magnums for years. Only used lead Keith type SWCs and gave them a firm crimp in their crimp grooves. Those bullets you show have cannelures and a roll crimp should be applied to those.
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Old 01-14-2020, 02:28 AM
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This is how they came out of the box, crimped by Remington.

Next skeptic...
I never implied that they were not. I said it looks like they were heavily crimped by a FCD.
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Old 01-14-2020, 02:34 AM
38SPL HV 38SPL HV is offline
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Yes, those hummers were really crimped well for the Airweight crowd! Even Remington’s standard velocity 38 Spl 158 gr rnl lead are solidly crimped.
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Old 01-14-2020, 10:12 AM
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I’ve shot and loaded 41 Magnums for years. Only used lead Keith type SWCs and gave them a firm crimp in their crimp grooves. Those bullets you show have cannelures and a roll crimp should be applied to those.
They were new LAX ammo. I had a friend re-seat and crimp all 250 of them.
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Old 03-26-2020, 01:38 PM
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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Originally Posted by 38SPL HV View Post
Here is a photo of a Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP round from one of two boxes recently purchased. Notice the excellent and pronounced firm roll crimp...rivals Buffalo Bore’s crimp. Rounds in second box were crimped in same fashion.

Now that is a crimp! Bullets are sure to stay put in your S&W J frame Airweights and LCR! Remington gets it - great job!
I'm happy to report that I just received four 50-round boxes of this load. Got them from Target Sports USA for $17.99/box. Happy to get them before the supply and the pricing went nuts. Got them loaded up in my 1954 M&P snubbie.
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Old 03-26-2020, 03:12 PM
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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Thanks goodness Remington got something right!
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Old 03-26-2020, 03:32 PM
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I'm happy to report that I just received four 50-round boxes of this load. Got them from Target Sports USA for $17.99/box. Happy to get them before the supply and the pricing went nuts. Got them loaded up in my 1954 M&P snubbie.
Out of stock
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Old 03-26-2020, 03:46 PM
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Sorry, but this load has been NEUTERED recently:

JUST TESTED THE "NEW" REMINGTON HTP FBI LOAD VS THE OLD ONE

It is NOT the same, or powerful, as the classic Remington FBI load.

Buffalo Bore standard pressure .38 LSWCHP is the closest thing on the market to the real deal. Unfortunately, it’s prodigiously expensive.

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Old 03-26-2020, 04:08 PM
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Federal stopped crimping them awhile back and the bullets shake loose from the cases when fired from an Airweight.
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Old 03-26-2020, 04:22 PM
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Quote:
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Sorry, but this load has been NEUTERED recently:

JUST TESTED THE "NEW" REMINGTON HTP FBI LOAD VS THE OLD ONE

It is NOT the same, or powerful, as the classic Remington FBI load.

Buffalo Bore standard pressure .38 LSWCHP is the closest thing on the market to the real deal. Unfortunately, it’s prodigiously expensive.
If you're looking at it out of a 2" barrel, those loads probably never got more than 800fps or so out of them. There's always a significant difference between a 2" barrel and either a 4" or 6" barrel. The progression of velocities can't be extrapolated because it assumes powder characteristics that may or may not exist. Plus that thread is six years old.

For more current data from Lucky Gunner, check here. They got 800 out of a 2" and 920 out of a 4".

Frankly, the only reason I'm interested in this load at all is because my 1954 M&P can't handle jacketed loads without the barrel cracking just due to the metallurgy. I cracked one already, so I don't want to do it again. In all my other 38s, I'm using the Remington Golden Saber 125gr JHP +P. That's an outstanding load in either 2" or 4".
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Old 03-26-2020, 04:52 PM
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What with all this recurring talk on the "FBI Load" and guns of the FBI etc. I got to wondering how often FBI personnel shoot their guns other than at a range.
So from 2011-2018 or eight years.... 228 times

"Eighty-one were intentional shootings involving people or objects, 34 were intentional shootings of animals, and 113 were accidental discharges."
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Old 03-26-2020, 05:19 PM
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What with all this recurring talk on the "FBI Load" and guns of the FBI etc. I got to wondering how often FBI personnel shoot their guns other than at a range.
So from 2011-2018 or eight years.... 228 times

"Eighty-one were intentional shootings involving people or objects, 34 were intentional shootings of animals, and 113 were accidental discharges."
If you don't mind I'd like the source for these numbers. I highly doubt the FBI has fired 81 rounds in the last 25 years, much less 7 year.
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Old 03-26-2020, 05:26 PM
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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What with all this recurring talk on the "FBI Load" and guns of the FBI etc. I got to wondering how often FBI personnel shoot their guns other than at a range.
So from 2011-2018 or eight years.... 228 times

"Eighty-one were intentional shootings involving people or objects, 34 were intentional shootings of animals, and 113 were accidental discharges."
Pretty much 50/50 intentional and accidental. Frankly, somewhat typical for a law enforcement agency I'm sorry to say, or it seems that way. MSCAMPBELL, present company excluded of course.
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Old 03-26-2020, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by shocker View Post
What with all this recurring talk on the "FBI Load" and guns of the FBI etc. I got to wondering how often FBI personnel shoot their guns other than at a range.
So from 2011-2018 or eight years.... 228 times

"Eighty-one were intentional shootings involving people or objects, 34 were intentional shootings of animals, and 113 were accidental discharges."

Heck they no longer use 38 special revolvers anyway. Technology marches forward!
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Old 03-26-2020, 09:54 PM
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If you don't mind I'd like the source for these numbers. I highly doubt the FBI has fired 81 rounds in the last 25 years, much less 7 year.
That's incidents, not rounds expended.

When the FBI shoots someone, including a bystander or hostage, it investigates itself
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Old 03-26-2020, 10:17 PM
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That round used to be called the FBI round and was considered the best man stopper. I have seen ballistic tests using the same ballistic gel the FBI uses AND 4 layers of denim and those bullets performed very poorly compared to some of the more modern bullets. They totally failed to mushroom in spite of the fact they are soft lead and hollow point.and they over penetrated without doing a great deal of upset damage to the gel.
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Old 03-26-2020, 10:50 PM
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FWIW, 2 years ago we tested the Remington HTP FBI load. It averaged 895 fps from my 4 inch 65-3. Chronometer about 15 feet down range. By comparison, American Eagle 357 mag 158 grain JSP measured 1271 fps from my 6 inch 27-2, and 1249.2 from the 65.
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Old 03-27-2020, 11:44 PM
38SPL HV 38SPL HV is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valmet View Post
Federal stopped crimping them awhile back and the bullets shake loose from the cases when fired from an Airweight.

Federal has been crimping this round (38G) again. Guess they got enough complaints and their quality control has taken care of things. The Federal FBI (38G) rounds which I purchased a few months ago from Target Sports USA have decent crimps.
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Old 03-28-2020, 03:40 PM
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Default Poor bullet construction

While loading up with the 2020 production of this load, I couldn't help but notice how inconsistent the hollow point cavity is. These are straight from the box.

The bullet construction is very poor. With this variation in the size of the cavity, no wonder there's inconsistency in the expansion.

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Old 03-28-2020, 05:23 PM
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Notify Remington...my recent purchases do not appear like this! Just when they fix a problem, they create another.
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Old 03-28-2020, 06:57 PM
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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Originally Posted by Borderboss View Post
While loading up with the 2020 production of this load, I couldn't help but notice how inconsistent the hollow point cavity is. These are straight from the box.



The bullet construction is very poor. With this variation in the size of the cavity, no wonder there's inconsistency in the expansion.



That's awful

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Old 03-28-2020, 07:05 PM
mikerjf mikerjf is offline
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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So, what’s the approximate cost per bad guy stopped, with these?

(And double that for the FBI, I suppose...)
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Old 03-28-2020, 07:08 PM
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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Federal has been crimping this round (38G) again. Guess they got enough complaints and their quality control has taken care of things. The Federal FBI (38G) rounds which I purchased a few months ago from Target Sports USA have decent crimps.
I’m pleasantly surprised by this news as I’ve always been a fan of this load and often Federal is what I find most commonly compared with others.
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Old 03-29-2020, 09:26 AM
stansdds stansdds is offline
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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Originally Posted by Borderboss View Post
While loading up with the 2020 production of this load, I couldn't help but notice how inconsistent the hollow point cavity is. These are straight from the box.

The bullet construction is very poor. With this variation in the size of the cavity, no wonder there's inconsistency in the expansion.

The lead used for these bullets is very soft. You can get deformation during shipping if the bullet contacts the tray. Put a speed loader or speed strip filled with this ammo in you pocket along with a set of keys and see how they look in a week.
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Old 03-29-2020, 02:53 PM
Borderboss Borderboss is offline
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The lead used for these bullets is very soft. You can get deformation during shipping if the bullet contacts the tray. Put a speed loader or speed strip filled with this ammo in you pocket along with a set of keys and see how they look in a week.
I'm going to open them up with a Philips's head screwdriver. Maybe it'll help them expand more too.
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Old 03-31-2020, 08:02 AM
stansdds stansdds is offline
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I'm going to open them up with a Philips's head screwdriver. Maybe it'll help them expand more too.
Good luck with that. Expansion is a bit "iffy" with this ammo, plain and simple. I know a lot of people still think this ammo is the bee's knees, but I feel there are better options with modern loads.
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Old 03-31-2020, 08:14 AM
white cloud white cloud is offline
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While I am sure the Buffalo Bore stuff is great, I was disappointed that the BB stuff I bought did not have sealed primers. I am not planning on swimming with my J frame but these guns and their ammo get exposed to a lot of perspiration and humidity.
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Old 03-31-2020, 09:37 AM
Borderboss Borderboss is offline
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Good luck with that. Expansion is a bit "iffy" with this ammo, plain and simple. I know a lot of people still think this ammo is the bee's knees, but I feel there are better options with modern loads.
I absolutely agree. As I mentioned up-thread, I'm only interested in this ammo because I only want to use lead bullets in my 1954 M&P. For my more modern .38s, I use Remington Golden Saber 125gr JHP +P ammo. That stuff is just about the best available for short barrel .38s IMHO.
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Old 04-01-2020, 09:23 AM
stansdds stansdds is offline
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I absolutely agree. As I mentioned up-thread, I'm only interested in this ammo because I only want to use lead bullets in my 1954 M&P. For my more modern .38s, I use Remington Golden Saber 125gr JHP +P ammo. That stuff is just about the best available for short barrel .38s IMHO.
Uhhhhhhmmm... I don't think I would shoot +P in a revolver that pre-dates the S&W model numbering system. S&W improved the heat treatment and the uniformity of that treatment on cylinders when they introduced the model numbering system. +P ammo will not cause a catastrophic failure with these older revolvers, but it will wear them out much quicker.
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Old 04-01-2020, 09:53 AM
Borderboss Borderboss is offline
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Uhhhhhhmmm... I don't think I would shoot +P in a revolver that pre-dates the S&W model numbering system. S&W improved the heat treatment and the uniformity of that treatment on cylinders when they introduced the model numbering system. +P ammo will not cause a catastrophic failure with these older revolvers, but it will wear them out much quicker.
I use standard pressure lead loads in this gun to practice. I carry the +P loads.
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Old 04-01-2020, 10:05 AM
stansdds stansdds is offline
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Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!! Remington 38 Spl +P 158 gr LSWCHP - top rate!!!  
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I use standard pressure lead loads in this gun to practice. I carry the +P loads.
Then you should be ok. A steady diet of +P in those old 38 Specials is not recommended. An occasional cylinder full is usually ok.
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Old 04-01-2020, 12:36 PM
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This is a prime example of someone opening up a box ammo, seeing the “pretty bullets”, and exclaiming the load as “top rate!”.

Same thing with all the folks on gun shop sites giving 5 star reviews on guns saying “I haven’t shot it yet but it’s PURDY!” and skewing the ratings, offering no insight whatsoever to the true performance of the item in question.
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Old 04-01-2020, 01:33 PM
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This is a prime example of someone opening up a box ammo, seeing the “pretty bullets”, and exclaiming the load as “top rate!”.

Same thing hwith all the folks on gun shop sites giving 5 star reviews on guns saying “I haven’t shot it yet but it’s PURDY!” and skewing the ratings, offering no insight whatsoever to the true performance of the item in question.
They rated “tops” in my chronograph tests, low ES and SDs...I respect skeptics since I’m one also.
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Old 04-02-2020, 01:30 AM
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Buffalo Bore 158gr LSWCHC +P is the stuff of legends. Worth the coin.

Underwood is right on par and in some loads, cheaper.
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Old 05-01-2020, 12:54 PM
Maciosaig Maciosaig is offline
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Default Remington 158 +P LSWCHP

That's great ammo! BB is overpriced boutique ammo, their 10mm ammo was the least accurate when I tested a few different brands of 10mm out of a G20.
To date there is no record of/from anyone complaining they were shot with the Remington over BB or any other round!
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Old 05-10-2020, 12:54 AM
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I'm happy to report that I just received four 50-round boxes of this load. Got them from Target Sports USA for $17.99/box. Happy to get them before the supply and the pricing went nuts. Got them loaded up in my 1954 M&P snubbie.
I did not know that +P ammo was Bueno in a '54 M&P snubbie.
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Old 05-10-2020, 11:46 AM
Borderboss Borderboss is offline
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I did not know that +P ammo was Bueno in a '54 M&P snubbie.
Larry
Not a steady diet, but it's ok for carrying.
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