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Old 09-28-2020, 07:34 PM
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Default General Rule of Thumb For Bear Loads

I recently saw somewhere on one forum or another someone's general rule of thumb for bear handguns but can't find it now. Thought someone here may know. Went something like "caliber begins with a 4, bullet grain weight starts with a 3 and velocity starts at 1400". Can anyone help out??
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Old 09-28-2020, 07:58 PM
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Cartridge selection? Well, I really believe any handgun you bring to any fight should have a name that starts with at least a 4. That’s really important if you are fighting a bear! I think the rule of “4-3-1” should apply: a bullet diameter that starts with at least a 4, a bullet weight that starts with at least a 3 and a muzzle velocity of at least 1000 fps.

American Hunter | Packing Pistols In Bear Country
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Old 09-28-2020, 08:05 PM
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Defense Against Bears with Pistols: 97% Success rate, 37 Incidents
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Old 09-28-2020, 11:01 PM
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Default General Rule of Thumb For Bear Loads

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I recently saw somewhere on one forum or another someone's general rule of thumb for bear handguns but can't find it now. Thought someone here may know. Went something like "caliber begins with a 4, bullet grain weight starts with a 3 and velocity starts at 1400". Can anyone help out??


4-3-1 Rule For Bear: 4x caliber, 300 gr, 1000 FPS

Hard cast lead


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Old 09-28-2020, 11:44 PM
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Fascinating, totally fascinating. May it never happen to any of us.......
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Old 09-28-2020, 11:46 PM
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I've always thought that a .357 would be good, if loaded hot with 180 grain hard cast. It would penetrate the skull and do the job.
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Old 09-29-2020, 02:21 AM
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Big, heavy, loud and fast...............
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Old 09-29-2020, 02:28 AM
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How about a Glock 10mm loaded with FMJ. Lots of chances to penetrate to the CNS. At least you get lots of chances to stop the bear before you use that last round on yourself.
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Old 09-29-2020, 02:59 AM
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How about a Glock 10mm loaded with FMJ. Lots of chances to penetrate to the CNS. At least you get lots of chances to stop the bear before you use that last round on yourself.
I hate I am contributing to another bear thread. However, a lot of people in Alaska are relying on Glocks in 10mm for that very reason. A friend in Alaska said 10mm ammo is very plentiful, or was, in Alaska. They are easy to carry, easy to shoot, and relatively reliable with low maintenance.
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Old 09-29-2020, 08:27 AM
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The best bear load is anything that one can shoot effectively, has the momentum, and the bullet construction to do the job.
Side note, Dutch Sirius dogsled patrol uses the Glock 20. Not sure which manufacturer or projectile type they use, never been officially published.
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Old 09-29-2020, 10:13 AM
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Big, heavy, loud and fast...............
That applies to grizzly bears as well...
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Old 09-29-2020, 10:16 AM
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I hate I am contributing to another bear thread.
It’s akin to rubber-necking the wreck on the side of the freeway—sometimes you just can’t help yourself. I took the bait hook line and sinker, but will try to spit the hook next time.
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Old 09-29-2020, 10:22 AM
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Bella Twin.

(I guess I have to provide a link, now that the "Bella Twins" are world-famous... :P)

Bella Twin, the .22 Used to Take the 1953 World Record Grizzly, and More
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Old 09-29-2020, 10:31 AM
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I love a bear thread!
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Old 09-29-2020, 10:31 AM
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Sounds like bears are not as tough as the keyboard commandos would like us to believe.

Rosewood
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Old 09-29-2020, 11:13 AM
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Default Absolutely correct you are.

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Fascinating, totally fascinating. May it never happen to any of us.......
You are correct.
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Old 09-29-2020, 11:14 AM
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Default My iIntent was not to be a bear thread, I was just trying to find

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I love a bear thread!
some info I had seen in the past.
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Old 09-29-2020, 12:25 PM
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Just for the sake of the bears, how about 454, with 300 grain XTP, in a 460V. The only bad thing is it's heavy as heck to lug around, the AR 15 in 50 Beauwulf weighs a lot less and is easier to carry with a proper sling.
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Old 09-29-2020, 01:43 PM
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Why stop with something beginning with a 4 when you can get a 5. Won't come much closer to breaking your wrist than some of the 4's.
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Old 09-29-2020, 02:48 PM
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If you aren't confident with what you are carrying either it isn't big enough or you aren't good enough with it. Only one condition can be fixed with hardware.
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Old 09-29-2020, 03:38 PM
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All you need is a .22! When the bear jumps out, shoot your buddy in the knee and run away as fast as you can!
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Old 09-29-2020, 04:17 PM
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One cool customer. That took nerve and confidence.
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Old 09-29-2020, 07:19 PM
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When I lived there it was 44.Mag. and 4-3-1. We differ on the 1,
we always said the 1 was for yourself so you wouldn't feel the pain
of the bear eating you alive, (applies to Brown Bears only).
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Old 10-01-2020, 09:17 AM
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The 10mm always comes up in these threads and it demands at least two questions be asked. One if you have time to empty an entire magazine of 10mm at the bear how much of an eminent danger was it? Chances are in a real scenario you'll only have time for a shot or two. And second, 10mm does nothing the 357 Magnum won't. So if the 10mm is viable then so is the 357 Magnum. I know 10mm fanboys typically refuse to admit the latter, which is fine, just know you are wrong...
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Old 10-01-2020, 10:09 AM
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It’s a good thing bears generally avoid coming into human occupied dwellings... they would have the additional chore of spitting out computer keys used in defense against them.

Rule 1 avoid close contact with bears.

Rule 2 if you are unable to follow rule 1, bring the biggest gun you can carry in your vehicle.

Rule 3 stay in your vehicle.

Rule 4 if you ignore rules 2 & 3, revert to rule 1.

Rule 5 if you insist on ignoring Rules 1-4 and are specifically hunting bears for sport or livestock defense, bring a large, big bore rifle with lots of ammo and several friends with large big bore rifles and lots of ammo.

Caveat, you don’t have to be faster than the bear, just faster than your slowest friend(s).

Froggie
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Old 10-01-2020, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by uncleted327 View Post
The 10mm always comes up in these threads and it demands at least two questions be asked. One if you have time to empty an entire magazine of 10mm at the bear how much of an eminent danger was it? Chances are in a real scenario you'll only have time for a shot or two. And second, 10mm does nothing the 357 Magnum won't. So if the 10mm is viable then so is the 357 Magnum. I know 10mm fanboys typically refuse to admit the latter, which is fine, just know you are wrong...
Sometimes peace of mind is worth a whole lot. Extra rounds give me peace of mind whether I need them or not. And I would not feel underpowered with a 357 mag either.
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Old 10-01-2020, 11:13 AM
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What we really need now is a general rule of thumb shark load thread

: )
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Old 10-01-2020, 12:10 PM
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What we really need now is a general rule of thumb shark load thread

: )
Maybe it should be "rule of Leg".
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Old 10-01-2020, 12:27 PM
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Rule of thumb is to carry a 444 Marlin or a 45/70 or a 12ga with slugs.
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Old 10-01-2020, 12:42 PM
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All you need is a .22! When the bear jumps out, shoot your buddy in the knee and run away as fast as you can!
This has been a joke for years, but is it true? Wouldn't a bear chase someone who's running?
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Old 10-01-2020, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike, SC Hunter View Post
Rule of thumb is to carry a 444 Marlin or a 45/70 or a 12ga with slugs.
We went on vacation to Alaska a couple years ago, and this 870 is what I carried, loaded with seven 1 oz. slugs. Also had a Ruger SRH as a back-up.

Around here, all we have is black bear, and I figure a .44 Magnum will work just fine.
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Old 10-10-2020, 07:43 PM
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For a bear attack, my preference would be to be behind the cannon of a tank ... which coincidentally would place me inside a tank for the duration of said angry bear encounter.
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:23 PM
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I thought long an hard on this and have read every article above and then some... Bears(black/brown) have been killed with .22lr and 9mms on top of everything else, but to each is own and my choice for this side of the the Mississippi would be my 1026, 10mm loaded with 200/220 Underwood hard cast. Makes for great follow up shots and can stay on point in a panic. If I'm headed west of the Mississippi ill carry the same, but with the addition of my 1895sbl and some 430gr hard cast +P in .45-70gov..... I think that would well protect me for anything this side of the planet...
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Old 10-11-2020, 12:05 AM
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..
but with the addition of my 1895sbl and some 430gr hard cast +P in .45-70gov..... I think that would well protect me for anything this side of the planet...
Any side of the planet.
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Old 10-13-2020, 11:45 AM
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Groo here
Rule of thumb.
Flat nose bullet that will not fall apart if it hits something.
Sectional density of at least .175
Speed from "your" gun 1000 fps.....
This will meet the "Keith " design AND the 45 colt BP loading known to go through a horse or deer at extended range.[aka 100 yds or more]
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Old 10-14-2020, 04:12 AM
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Big Bore and belt fed. Frank
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Old 10-14-2020, 06:25 AM
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Groo here
Rule of thumb.
Flat nose bullet that will not fall apart if it hits something.
Sectional density of at least .175
Speed from "your" gun 1000 fps.....
This will meet the "Keith " design AND the 45 colt BP loading known to go through a horse or deer at extended range.[aka 100 yds or more]
..exactly what I was going to write...

SD on a 10mm 200 grain bullet is .178, exactly the same as a 210 grain .410.

Since there are several commercially available 10mm loads on the market that crack 1200 fps and from a 4" .41 Magnum most 210 grain commercially available loads are in the mid to upper 1200s I would feel just fine with a 10mm...

Bob
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Old 10-14-2020, 08:11 AM
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..exactly what I was going to write...

SD on a 10mm 200 grain bullet is .178, exactly the same as a 210 grain .410.

Since there are several commercially available 10mm loads on the market that crack 1200 fps and from a 4" .41 Magnum most 210 grain commercially available loads are in the mid to upper 1200s I would feel just fine with a 10mm...

Bob
My handload in my P16-10 is 200 Grain WFNGC at 1225FPS from the 5" bbl. 16 rounds, 18 if I use the +2 mag. I wouldn't feel undergunned at all with it.

Rosewood
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Old 10-14-2020, 10:09 AM
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I can only speak for myself and I try to keep my bear kills down to 2 to 3 a week. On blacks seems any magnum or 40+ cal handgun works fine. The odds of running into a Griz or Polar Bear in SE Ohio are slim. If I was going somewhere to worry about this I believe I would be loading the jacketed bullets they make for steel silo shooting.
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Old 10-14-2020, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loyaljeeper View Post
I hate I am contributing to another bear thread. However, a lot of people in Alaska are relying on Glocks in 10mm for that very reason. A friend in Alaska said 10mm ammo is very plentiful, or was, in Alaska. They are easy to carry, easy to shoot, and relatively reliable with low maintenance.
In that case, one of my 610's should do the job.
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  #41  
Old 10-17-2020, 08:44 PM
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Just remember to file the front sight down flush with the barrel.

Very important.
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  #42  
Old 10-19-2020, 11:40 AM
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Groo here
The big thing about autos in the "Great White North"
is , they are easer to strip and dry out when they get wet...
[notice I did not say "if"]...
Revolvers can handle heaver loads but are larger , heaver
and can ice up and you need heat to free them up.
The number of shots is of little import as is speed of reload..
The fight will be over when the gun goes dry, either because of
Jam or empty.
You either win or-------------------------------------
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Old 10-19-2020, 11:45 AM
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Biggest part of my Griz and Polar bear attacks have not happened under the glare of lights in Mall parking lots in lower 48. But these days I can see you need to be prepared for anything.
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