When a supplier sells ammo, he/she CANNOT base their selling price on what they paid for it. It has to be based on what it will cost to buy the next order.

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FBINA, 204th Session

I rarely comment on price threads. I believe that a free market will take care of itself, even though not instantaneously, and will pretty much reflect reality. However, my LGS is selling 158gr .38 Special Magtech (good Brazilian ammo) for $22/50-rd box. Probably won't have it long. This store has never raised prices to profit from scarcity, but has occasionally limited sales to spread the joy.

No deep meaning here that I know of. Just thought I'd pass on that some stores don't "gouge" their customers. BTW, the store manager said that he expected only small (3%) price increases when this settles down.

??

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Formerly Model520Fan

Good on him, that's how a real man ought to conduct business.

That being said, most actual dedicated FFLs I have seen don't price-gouge, unless you count the usual online retailers, like a certain infamous online retailer whose name is a complete misnomer even at the best of times, for example.

Most of the price-gouging is coming from two-bit, opportunists who decided to play scalper by selling a few cheap boxes of Winchester White Box or Remington UMC they bought on sale at Wal-Mart that's been collecting dust in the back of their closet or something for a few years for several times what they paid for it. Bonus points if they post threads about it seeking approval, as if anybody but another cheap scalper would praise/complement them for successfully ripping off a few desperate, terrified folks under current circumstances.

Real gun shop owners (at least ones I've visited in my area) don't price-gouge, they price their ammo competitively based on current marketing conditions, just as they would at any other time.
When I speak of price-gouging, I'm mostly speaking of some Blue-Collar-Easy-Andy-Wannabe trying to flip some cheapo ammo he's been sitting on forever for a massive profit and likes to pretend that makes him a shrewd businessman rather than a blue-collar-highwayman.

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

Was at a store today, guy was selling 9mm for $40/box and .223 for $18/box. Needless to say, I didn't buy anything.

That's what they do but they don't have too. He buys for $1. and sells for $2. Even if it cost more to replace it he will still make the same amount of money. When he gets the next shipment at $3. then he needs to raise his prices. Larry

Why the shots at blue collar workers? There are a lot of blue collar members on this board. That's not cool.

I stopped by my LGS, operates out of home(nice out building)

I asked him about supplies, he told me the only .223 he can find is $590 per 1000 his cost, and his distributor is being inundated with 2000 calls a day. Good luck if he answers.

But he had lots of powder and some primers(they were Magnum LPP and rifle.. )

I just ordered 2000 45ACP 230gr coated bullets from SNS for $223 and I have tracking info already..reloading is the only route for me..

It's not meant as an insult, but rather to emphasize that they aren't well versed nor educated in economics, marketing, or even sales in general.

I'm not putting down blue collar workers, in fact I consider the best foundation on which to build/expand one's knowledge of business is in the field of retail sales. You can actually learn a lot of the fundamentals of marketing and sales simply by working as a cashier, a customer service representative, or a sales representative, not to mention make money doing it as opposed to 100% academic education.

So yeah, I'm not using the term "blue collar" in a derogatory sense, I'm merely stating that the majority of scalpers don't know the first thing about business or direct sales, which is especially evident with their persistent use of the term "free market" as a flimsy defense for their price-gouging as if the term means arbitrarily pricing goods or something.
As previously stated, they often fancy themselves as shrewd businessman as if they totally succeeded thanks to their overwhelming charisma and good business sense, when in fact they're opportunistic crooks who are only capable of succeeding in any business transaction in which the buyer is desperate, anxious, and off their game. Under any other circumstances, their prices would be scoffed at, and they'd be "that guy" at the Flea Market who charges way more than everyone else yet cannot understand why they can't make a sale.

Truthfully, it's not even their lack of knowledge which fails them, but rather their overwhelming greed and egotistical belief that most people are suckers who will pay whatever they charge, completely ignoring the circumstances, and attempting to write off their dishonesty as well as their economic shortcomings as if the terms "free market" is some sort of magical Get Out of Jail Free Card that justifies their complete lack of business sense and "Supply and Demand" justifies their arbitrary pricing of their wares.

That being said, you do have a point, and it was short-sighted of me too dishonor honest, hard-working blue-collar citizens by using the term Blue-Collar in relation to the dishonest, opportunistic highwaymen who price-gouge for essential goods to take advantage of folks during troubling times when everyone is struggling to make their way amidst all of the confusion and uncertainty.
If anything, it's honest, hard-working Blue-Collar men and women who are preyed upon by scalpers.

So thank you for calling me out on my poor choice of words, and my sincerest apologies to anyone whom I may have offended.

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

On the local listings here I have seen 9mm prices coming down. Not many people able to afford a bulk loaded box of 1000 rounds at $700 or $800. Pretty crazy. Was working a trade for some 380 and a guy suggested that his 380 was "much" more valuable than my 9mm. I passed on that deal. Trading is the only way I will do any deal right now.

This is simple. After Dec of 2012, I didn't shoot my AR for nearly 2 years, I saved my 22LR for sessions with my then little kid.

I'll do the same thing now, if I run out of shooting ammo...well, I take up a new hobby until I can get more.

Buy something like 9mm for $6-800/case?

Not on your life.

At the OGCA show this weekend the average price for 9mm was @ $30 for 50 rounds, 380 was @ $35. 5.56/223 seemed to be @ $15 to $20 a box depending on brand and load. Primers were averaging $75 for a brick with a couple people asking $90.

I am a table holder and mainly deal with older, collectible ammo and odd calibers but I always have some amount of newer popular stuff. Often bought as part of a lot at sales or auctions. Because of the current panic I had looked around at various online prices for an idea of current prices (Some of which seem outright crazy) and tried to set my prices enough lower that I could be sure they would sell. When setting up a couple of my friends said my prices were still a little too low on the 9mm and 380 and I should raise the price a little more or some other table holder would probably grab them and double the price to put them on their table (which is a fairly common tactic at gunshows)............. So I did, though only by a few bucks (though I guess that still makes me a "blue collar price-qouger" to some).... No trouble selling any of my stuff either and surprisingly none of the usual "how much less can you sell that for?" which has been the norm at the shows as long as I can remember.

On GB, 15 rounds of Remington 12 ga. Buckshot
sold for $52.00 total....$27 for the ammo with $25.00
shipping....making it the total cost...$3.46 a round.

REMINGTON 12 ga., 3-Inch 00-Buckshot (15 Rounds Total) - Shotgun Shells at GunBroker.com : 878458540

I’m just happy with the Easy Andy reference above.

Attached Images

B48946D9-3032-400A-A859-6073F248DBEB.jpeg (67.5 KB, 69 views)

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“What you got, ain’t new.”

I haven’t been in the shooting game as long as most of you. I did well finding ammo when Walmart was selling out but still needed more to meet my weekly shooting needs, trying to plan for 2021. I refuse to pay outrageous prices online. I haven’t got into reloading yet but plan to when supplies come back.

I have put a lot of time into stopping at my local Sportmans Warehouse and have now figured out their sporadic delivery schedule. They get an ammo delivery about once every two weeks, usually Sunday-Tuesday. So I’ll start stopping everyday and when I find 9mm, pick up the max they allow daily until it’s gone at .28 cents a round including tax.

I have picked up 2000 rounds over the course of the ammo shortage but .28 a round is expensive for me so I decided to flip 500 rounds of Blazer and 300 rounds of steel case Winchester that was given to me. I was keeping it for an emergency supply but was probably never going to shoot the steel cased ammo.

I was in $560 for the 2000 rounds, sold 500 on GB for $285 after fees and shipping, started it at a penny and that’s where it went. Sold the Winchester for $125, same way. So now I’m in to 1500 rounds of Blazer and American Eagle for $150 out of pocket. Much more acceptable to me at .10 cents a round plus my time.

If this makes me a blue-collar-price-gouger...oh well.

Well, if this doesn't just illustrate exactly what I was talking about in regards to folks knowing absolutely nothing about economics, then I don't know what will...

Prices fluctuate in accordance with supply and demand, ergo monitoring the going rate of a product in attempt to estimate it's market value is most certainly NOT price-gouging, especially not if you're actually charging LESS for your wares than the competition!
That's Economics 101 and only a total ignoramus would ever label that as price-gouing, so evidently certain folks don't even understand the definition of the term "price-gouging" given the absurdity of their overtly defensive statements about how they attempt to get a feel for the going rate and adjust their prices accordingly.

Price-gougers DO NOT charge less than the going rate, they charge substantially more, hence why it is called "price-gouging".

Furthermore, scalpers don't strictly adjust their prices based on the current market value in accordance with supply and demand, but attempt to manipulate it through buying up as much of a product as they can in order to create or worsen a shortage, thus enabling them to artificially inflate their prices and reduce competition by depleting the local supply.

TL;DR: If you aren't deliberately charging well over the established market value beyond a margin of error, then you aren't price-gouging and thus have no valid reason to be offended by what I'm saying.

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

I noticed prices have dropped dramatically in just the last few days, so I think you got lucky with that 500 rounds of steel case ammo for $285. On Sunday on GunBroker, 500 rounds of brass case CCI Blazer 9mm 115 FMJ was only bidding up to $230 per 500. So that's a good 30-40% less than what the same ammo was selling for 2 weeks ago. I't was only a few auctions, but I hope that it is indicating the ammo panic is finally starting to end.

By the way, I don't have anything against so called "price gouging." To me it's just letting the free market work between a buyer and a seller at whatever price they agree upon.

When I bought my GT350R, the dealer had a 'Market adjustment' sticker on the window. $15,000. I told them, "If you get it, it's a market adjustment. If you don't, it's obscene dealer markup."

I paid 3,000 under MSRP. $18,000 less than window price. That was the market price at that time.

I have a hard time accepting "price gouging" laws. If the seller doesn't sell, no one is harmed. If he does sell, the buyer considered the price acceptable. Government should stay out of it.

A nearby gas station got a big fine for "price gouging" in a declared emergency a few years ago. When there is an emergency situation now, they just close. Their gas stays in the tanks, helping no one.

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I've still got it made.

People all over the world buy things and try to sell them and make a profit. I'm not selling or buying any ammo but if a person can buy for $10. and sell for $40. I think he's a smart business person.
The few people I know that are complaining about the price of ammo are the ones that never kept an extra box because they didn't want too tie their money up in something that they may never need. Now they think they need an extra box and they call it gouging because the price has gone up. It's just the law of supply and demand. Larry

10-4, tops. Much better for you to have your inventory on the shelf at Cabelas. As long as they have it.

If I lived on the Atlantic/Gulf coast, I'd keep a dozen sheets of plywood around all the time, in case a hurricane threatened. I'd be immune from opportunists charging 50 bucks a sheet.

But for some, it might be worth 50 bucks a sheet for not having to keep their own inventory.

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I've still got it made.

The whole concept of price regulation is completely unacceptable, not to mention hypocritical since it completely undermines the capitalism which was (for better or worse) what the nation as we know it was largely built upon.

I may be against price-gouging on necessities such as food/water, fuel, medical supplies, and to a lesser extent ammunition because it's straight up immoral to grossly overcharge for a product just because you can get away with it knowing that the public cannot very well refuse.
However, I do not believe that prices should ever, under any circumstances be regulated. If people want to be blatantly evil by jacking up the prices of essential goods during a crisis then let them, eventually their bad deeds will catch up to them one way or another regardless. The last thing anybody needs is for the authorities to but in and start regulating how much things ought to cost.

I was never against the concept of capitalism or free market, merely the ignorant, elementary-school-esq unilateral definition of free market that scalpers attempt to use as a flimsy justification for their price-gouging.
Free market on it's own is a good thing, but much like any other liberty, foolish or otherwise wicked people use it to do wrong by others then turn around and act as if they've done nothing wrong just because there are no laws against them doing so, as if laws in general were scripture and morality only extends as far as what is punishable by law.

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

Where I draw the line on "price gouging" is essential supplies like food, water, and maybe fuel, during real emergencies. Many states actually have laws on the books against price gouging for essential supplies during emergencies.

As much as those of us here think of ammo as "essential," I don't believe it makes the cut as truly essential. Let prices for ammo fall where the free market decides. Price regulation is a slippery slope.

High prices are a signal that demand has exceeded supply. People, seeing an opportunity - and wanting to help (!), will get more supply. They will go to extreme lengths to get it. Like drive their pickup up to Atlanta to buy some plywood to drive back down to Florida to sell for 50 bucks a sheet. Or drive a gasoline tanker all the way to Texas to get some gasoline to bring back in a shortage.*

Price gouging laws on essential supplies means people will die.

*The southeast is totally, dangerously, dependent on the Colonial Pipeline for gasoline. Should it be interrupted, the southeast will be in big trouble within 2 days. I have long argued that we should have a refinery in Charleston or Savannah to have a backup source.

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I've still got it made.

My son and I had about 20,000 extra rounds of 9 mm and a few thousand rounds of other calibers. We got most of this stuff for $3-4.00 for a box of 50. It came to a local salvage store by way of an Academy Sports that had been flooded during Hurricane Katrina. The water apparently wasn't deep enough to get the ammo wet. We also took advantage of the discounts Walmart gave when they discontinued some of their calibers. A friend running a Louisiana gun show called me and asked if we had any ammo we could sell at his show as nobody was going to have any there. He gave us free tables just to bring it over there. We charged $30.00 per box of 50, $25.00 if you bought more than four boxes. We discouraged dealers until our stock got low. We sold out in less than three hours. Other folks were getting $40-50.00 a box for the same stuff at other shows. We sold some of the ammo for $15.00 a box if you could prove you were a full time LEO, limit two boxes. I've still got enough to last me for most of the rest of my life that isn't for sale. If the price comes down again I'll buy some more because sooner or later it's going back up.

I Personally feel that ammo is essential, albeit to a far lesser extent than food/water, medical supplies, or fuel. You don't need much if any of it to get by under ordinary circumstances, but crisis tend to bring out the worst in certain people, driving them to extremes which they would otherwise never even imagine depending on how desperate the situation may become.

I think that to some folks in certain states, living near certain major metropolitan cities may disagree that ammo isn't essential right now.
Just saying, it's easy to say that ammo isn't essential if you live in a relatively safe place with little crime, especially if you already have some ammunition on-hand. For folks who only just recently purchased firearms in response to increased incident of violence and limited intervention by law enforcement, a box of ammunition may seem as previous as a well filled with clean water, and the scalpers know it.

So regardless of whether or not ammunition is a tangible necessity, there are folks who are desperate enough for ammunition to pay large amounts of money for it, and taking advantage of desperate people and profiting off of their fear is wrong. That's my issue. It's one thing to be the jackals who go out and buy up a bunch of fancy electronics or toys during the Holiday Season and sell them on eBay at a jacked up price, but to buy up something that folks feel like they really need and are willing to pay a dramatically marked up price for out of fear for the lives of their loved ones and themselves, then sell it to them at a jacked up price knowing full well that you are depriving them of money that they may need for more tangible expenses is completely despicable.

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

Where you been Snake? You take a little vacation? We've missed your words of wisdom here. I was afraid something had happened to you.

[citation needed]


May need?

My, so melodramatic, Mr Wesson.

My metric is a friend, originally from Chicago, who recently bought a gun, after much difficulty. I have no doubt that 6 months ago he would have banned my gun ownership. Now he's desperate. I haven't sold him any ammo, but I wouldn't consider $100 a box too much. You can't go from Leftard ban guns to help me with ammo. Sorry, there is a price for an anti liberty position.

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I've still got it made.

I recently had a ...well let's say acquaintance... call and ask me to sell him a gun. Any gun. He WAS one of the types who was, if not, anti gun could not see why anyone NEEDED a gun. I actually said what??!! you want a gun? You vote for those who not only want but will take our guns from us and now you want/need a gun. Then I told him not only won't I sell you a gun...it is illegal for me to sell you one. You want to buy a gun without a background check? He was a bit PO'd! Then I told him to go apply for a purchase permit from the state and then go look for one in the local gun shops. Also told him he had been looking at all this stuff unfold this year and he should have been proactive and considering the future. I have told him for years to think of the future. The worst part is...he is a college professor and a good one who has spouted the anti freedom type rhetoric for years...and now he's scared. He lives in Maryland. And to be honest I do like the guy and love his wife.

On a similar note I recently had a very liberal lawyer call me asking advice on what kind of firearms he should get. To my knowledge he has never owned any kind of firearm. I helped him find a 12 gauge riot gun and a Browning Hi-Power and ammo for both. He's supposed to come to my little backyard range in a few days and get me to help him learn to shoot. Any time I can convert a lib into a gun owner I'm going to do it. It only helps the rest of us in the long run. I plan on talking to him about a few other things when he gets here.

WILL YOU PLEASE STOP THE POLITICS ALREADY!
Posters: #76, #77, #78

What politics? I just reported about a person who all of a sudden(check another thread about that in the lounge) that thinks he needs a gun...as did the posting numbers 76 and 78. Their posts reported that we have 2 more gun owning members of society. The one I reported may not be so lucky. I am sorry if we have disturbed you with those revelations...but I consider it a good thing to have more gun owners. Stop your screaming!!

Some people have more dollars than cents (sense)

You know, if I lived closer to that part of IL I would shoot with you. Effingham is about as close as I get.

After the last 100 or so emergencies, I've stockpiled enough of everything I need to the point that I can resist panic buying. But I am waiting for the next buyers market. Bring on the zombies.

I don't see politics here. What I see are potential allies and new gun owners. Let's welcome everyone who wants to own a gun into the fold. Help them make responsible decisions and get the training they need. If they truly want to own a firearm, everything else will take care of itself in time. V

Ok, I will stop with the over-sized fonts (none here). However, why do you think it is important to point out why your buddy/acquaintance (well over a thousand miles away on the far East Coast of America) has a particular "bumper-sticker" or why they voted for a particular candidate in the past? All of this, while you live in Wyoming, one of the least restrictive States in America? Add your pro-log about "his" attitude/purpose, it just compounds the politicization of your original post. And just HOW does this have to do with buying a firearm in the first place?

Please just stop. Just stop.

I woulda told him you can buy one, very easy, on the Internet

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Sure you did