What makes everything in the .40 Caliber range so polarizing?

Today I realized something of a strange phenomenon in the firearms community, everything in the .40 Caliber range being a love it or hate it affair.

I'm not just talking about approximate .40cal projectiles like .40 S&W or 10mm Auto either, but literally everything between .40 and .50cal.
.38-40, .40 S&W, 10mm Auto, .41 Magnum, .410 Bore, .44-40, .44 Special/Magnum, .444 Marlin .45 Colt, .45 ACP, .454 Casull, .45-70 Govt, .458 SOCOM, .460 S&W Magnum, etc, you name it.

People either love them or hate them all in equal portions in a way that seems out of proportion compared to other cartridges in the .20 Caliber or .30 Caliber range which seem to receive a lot more approval from folks in general.

People tend to "demonize" that which is different from what they have chosen. If they choose a 9 or a .38, everything else "sucks". People want to feel that the things they have chosen are "the best".

Never had use for anything bigger than a "36" caliber (9mm-.357 Mag). They get done what I need done...for the price. But I don't "hate" everything else.

In fact, I once owned a .40 S&W. If ammo was as readily available as 9mm and as affordable, I would probably use that caliber. Of recent, I like the idea of the .41 Mag. Same there. If ammo was as available and affordable, I might pick up a double action .41 Mag.

Being of limited means and somewhat geographically isolated, I stick with what is affordable and available. It is for that reason that I drive a domestic automobile. Nearest repair shop for rice burners is 80 miles away.

.40 is "newer" (relatively speaking) and a "compromise" (also relatively speaking) - two things that people just love to hate!

As many times as I have heard ".40 is obsolete!!!" you would think all the ammo I have stashed would simply stop firing from sheer embarrassment.

I like ALL calibers, but prefer to shoot only a handful. To each their own.

I was of the mindset that 40 was an answer to a question no one asked.. I had 9/38 & 44/45 why have anything else.. but when they began dumping on the market I ended up with a modular Sig kit.. well.. I have ended up with a few more.. they are not evil... and besides, variety is the spice of life..

I think the thing that has upset the apple cart so much in regards to calibers is the advancements in bullet designs. For the average shooter and/or CCW person, smaller calibers are good enough because new bullet and powder developments have closed the gap in caliber effectiveness. The .380, once considered very marginal for self-defense has now sold like hot cakes and fills the role of primary defense weapon for many.

The .40 is supposed to be the in between that covers all the needs and solves all problems and makes the smaller and larger obsolete. But it just ain’t so. The .40 is the in between that offers no advantage over the smaller or larger and is the one destined to become obsolete.

The 40 S&W is a great round and will be for decades to come, it's just not the current flavor of the week. In fact, I see more 40 delivered to stores than 45 acp, with both selling just as fast. 40 and 45 are still significantly more expensive than 9mm.

I think someone should do their PhD thesis on why people hate the .40 S&W.

I've never heard anyone say "I HATE THE .38/40", though it is essentially the same cartridge - .40/180/950. In fact, old timers who would kneel at the feet of Elmer Keith say it is a "good mankiller" and "it shoots hard".

People love to say the "answer to a question nobody asked" line. That's not true. Someone asked - how can I get a bigger diameter bullet than a 9mm without going to a .45-sized gun? Someone answered - how about this one? And then the .40 was the standard LE pistol round for 20 years.

So then the .45 guys said - its the .40 Short and Weak!

And later the 9mm guys said - Owwwww! Its so SNAPPY!

But for 20 years cops put bad guys in the dirt with it. I worked a bunch of .40 shootings and I have no doubt it works really, really well.

Why the change?

I was there when the .40 was adopted by the FBI, and was one of the field firearms instructor called to the Mothership to shoot all of the wannabee FBI guns. I picked the HK USP Compact, but nobody listens to me and we wound up with the Glock 22/23.

Twenty years later I was ready to retire, and the announcement was made we were going back to the 9mm. Why oh why?

Because in 2001 19 scumbags with box cutters changed the world in general and the FBI in particular. Our number one priority became preventing another attack.

We spent a gazillion dollars on computers and nerds to squint at them. The ammo budget stayed the same. I mean literally the same dollar amount. Not adjusted for inflation.

We went from unlimited ammo for practice to here's a box to a guy handing out just enough ammo to qualify and shooting our carry ammo only once a year.

Somebody noticed 9mm was substantially cheaper than .40, particularly in practice ammo. 14,000 agents times 1,000 rounds a year for quals equal 14 million rounds a year. Every year. Guns are cheap compared to that.

Whenever you hear someone say "advances in bullet technology" just nod and replace that in your head with "9mm will work and its cheaper". I was there.

My buddy is an otherwise normal person who loves to shoot. He was looking for a truck gun and I found a .40 SV thing for $135 brand new and texted him to ask if he wanted me to pick it up for him. He texted back I HATE THE .40!!

I was in a gun shop years ago and a woman was shopping for a gift for her husband and the guy showed her a nice .40 cal. She said MY HUSBAND HATES .40s!!

I just don't get it. I think it threatens peoples manhood somehow.

I like it. It ain't going anywhere.

No one mentioned the .400 Cor-Bon. Am I the only one who likes it?

I love my .40s I don't expect anything more from them than I do from any other cartridge. But I don't expect any less either, and don't get it. They function just fine for SD use, with plenty of close range power. Is 9mm better? Who cares, I have those too and have never found them to do anything better than the .40 does. I have 45acps too, and 45 Colts, and lots of .38, .357, on and on. My feeling has always been that if you don't like it for real reasons, don't buy it. If you don't like it because others tell you not to, then you are a fool and easily led by the nose.

I have 2, 40 cal. 686s, a 4" and a 6". I like them both! The 4" is my IDPA gun, and I shoot it quite a bit. They are great with the moon clips, essentially like a 3/4 size 625. A bit smaller, lighter, and still have good punch with 180 or 200 gr. bullets.

I don’t mind the .40. I carried one for most of my career. I also shoot them in USPA competition so I’ve shot upwards of 250,000 rounds over the last 26 years. I guess I just don’t find them interesting anymore.


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Great question. .40 S&W dose seem to be particularly polarizing. I remember some controversy of 9mm vs .45 back in the day, but nothing like to .40 vs 9mm. Of course, I was born in 79 so I missed a lot of the 9mm vs .45 conflict. I've heard stories of Jack O'connor and another gun scribe going back and forth about light and fast vs slow and heavy hunting bullets, but it was before my time.

I think the fire got fanned by the large number of gun magazines available back in the late 90s and the advertising extoling the virtues of 10mm and .40 S&W. Naturally there was the usual backlash against something new. Plus several of the .40 fanboys I ran across had the .40 cal master race mentality. Then the internet started fanning the flames and we find ourselves here.

For many buyers I think it does come down to money. Many can not afford to own several different guns and when faced with a choice of the world standard 9mm and it’s relatively cheap ammo or the snappy controversial .40 with potentially more expensive ammo and shorter gun life with NO advantages over the 9 they’re going to go the practical route and try to get the best bang for the buck.

Jon651 said:

.40 is "newer" (relatively speaking) and a "compromise" (also relatively speaking) - two things that people just love to hate!

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I think there’s a lot to this. Makes sense to me.

I am not among either the lovers or haters. I’m perfectly comfortable with the .40, depending on the gun. (Not so much in 1911s.) My theory is 15-16 .40SWs is obviously preferable to 17-18 9mms in the typical modern full-size duty pistol, but that seems to be the minority view.

I don't know, does this look polarizing to you?



There are plenty of nice PC guns in .40S&W that most people wouldn't mind owning. It was S&W's new round about the time the PC was started, so .40S&W got a lot of attention.

All depends on "where you're coming from."

The FBI did a pretty good job of defining a testing protocol for comparing ammo effectiveness, and to them the .40 S&W pretty much equaled the .45ACP. Only the forties were all big clunkers that wouldn't fit my hand anywhere near as well as a 1911, and my hand, while certainly not large, is a lot bigger than most women, whom it seems many law enforcement agencies are bound and determined to hire. Also, the .40 S&W is a HIGH PRESSURE cartridge, compared to the .45ACP.

So, it shouldn't be hard to see why some .45ACP fans don't like the .40 S&W pistols that were offered.

Now, some folks may have liked 9mm pistols, although from my point of view, probably only the Browning HP and a few single-stack pistols were worth considering. Of course, they used the Parabellum cartridge which the FBI had just decided was responsible for all of their screw-ups in the Miami debacle. The forty was supposed to cure all that. Of course, it was complete BS. Dishonest. Waste of taxpayer money. All proved to be true when the FBI changed back. Of course, they needed to cover that, so they made up a story about improved ammo effectiveness being the critical factor. Nope - they were wrong in the first place, on pistol size and on need for a new cartridge.

So. Unnecessarily high-pressure ammo. Bulky pistols (although they didn't need to be). Money wasted on a "solution" that didn't last. What's not to hate?

This is not a criticism of the .40 S&W cartridge itself. It certainly has as much legitimacy as the .45 GAP. But its history provides reason enough to be pissed off every time one hears the name. At least Glock paid for the .45 GAP; we're all paying for the .40 S&W.

To sum it up..........I don't give a rat's behind what ANYONE thinks about the calibers I shoot. Ain't worth arguing over So I ain't

ImprovedModel56Fan said:

All depends on "where you're coming from."

The FBI did a pretty good job of defining a testing protocol for comparing ammo effectiveness, and to them the .40 S&W pretty much equaled the .45ACP. Only the forties were all big clunkers that wouldn't fit my hand anywhere near as well as a 1911, and my hand, while certainly not large, is a lot bigger than most women, whom it seems many law enforcement agencies are bound and determined to hire. Also, the .40 S&W is a HIGH PRESSURE cartridge, compared to the .45ACP.

So, it shouldn't be hard to see why some .45ACP fans don't like the .40 S&W pistols that were offered.

Now, some folks may have liked 9mm pistols, although from my point of view, probably only the Browning HP and a few single-stack pistols were worth considering. Of course, they used the Parabellum cartridge which the FBI had just decided was responsible for all of their screw-ups in the Miami debacle. The forty was supposed to cure all that. Of course, it was complete BS. Dishonest. Waste of taxpayer money. All proved to be true when the FBI changed back. Of course, they needed to cover that, so they made up a story about improved ammo effectiveness being the critical factor. Nope - they were wrong in the first place, on pistol size and on need for a new cartridge.

So. Unnecessarily high-pressure ammo. Bulky pistols (although they didn't need to be). Money wasted on a "solution" that didn't last. What's not to hate?

This is not a criticism of the .40 S&W cartridge itself. It certainly has as much legitimacy as the .45 GAP. But its history provides reason enough to be pissed off every time one hears the name. At least Glock paid for the .45 GAP; we're all paying for the .40 S&W.

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