Currently I carry the slim 9mm 3913. If I were to switch to the larger 45 caliber round, what would be the smallest manufactured auto available? One final thing. I do not like "cocked and locked" carry. Never have, it's a personal thing with me. Does like eliminate any ideas for 45 carry?

Personally I would stay away from 3 and 4 inch 1911's anyway. I've owned three and had nothing but problems. But that's me.

The best is hard to say depending on how compact you want and other features.

Glock 30 or 36
M&P 45C
XD 45C
Kahr CW45 or P45
Bersa Thunder
Sig P220 Compact
Taurus PT745 or PT145
HK USP C

Don't forget about the S&W Chief Special 45. It's similar in size to your 3913 (a bit smaller, but a bit wider), with the same slide decocker/safety system so retraining would be minimal.

One of the big distributors is clearing out their remaining 3rd Gens, so I've heard of quite a few NIB CS45s popping up lately. There are 5 NIB on GunBroker right now.

Other than that, the DAO Kahr PM45 is just as small (actually a bit thinner), and has gotten pretty decent reviews.

It's not an auto, but it's a 45acp. Try the 22-4 Thunder Ranch (or non Thunder Ranch) on for size. No safety, faster reloads, and no feed issues with flat nose or hollow point rounds.

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Hastings

Have you ever considered the Star PD.45?

Star PD parts getting hard to come by, don't need to push it.LOL Great gun to have.



Didn't want cocked & locked. Maybe Glock-36 small single stack 45.

Since 2002 the Glock 36 has worked for me. It is easy to conceal and very accurate and reliable. This weapon is a fun gun to shoot.

Another vote for CS45, I have had mine for seven years and take it to the range often. Excellent firearm.

A friend has a Springfield MicroCompact. It's an excellent gun, reliable, controllable and accurate.

Since you're already familar with the operation of a 3913 then look at something along the lines of a 457 if you can't find a CS45. They operate identical to your 3913 and only slightly larger.

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183rd FBINA

Go with the Glock 30. I carry one every day in the front pocket of my pants. I use a kidex holster with it because on a Glock it is important to have the trigger covered. The Glock fits the pocket fine and no one would ever suspect it or think of finding it there. Eleven rounds of 45 acp goodness. There is nothing better.

Thanks everyone. At first glance, I like the M457 since it looks and operates like my 3913. Several other suggestions bear looking into for a small conceal carry 45.

4513 IMO. Without the idiotic rail if you can find one. Or buy a 4513TSW and remove that rail.

You know what a fan of the 3913 I am. Well since I got my PC 4513, the Shorty 45 MKII my 3913 is parked.

If you can find the funds, the Shorty 45 is the ultimate 4513. Sort of a 3913 on steroids. Regards 18DAI.

If you don't like that "cocked and locked" bit (neither do I), and don't want to mess with safeties (neither do I), you can't beat the M&P 45 Compact.

It's not so tiny I can't shoot it comfortably, but it's tiny enough to wear IWB and conceal well.

Out of all my guns, a few of which are .45 ACP, I own only 1 Glock, a 36. I use it with a Glock Block and a belt clip. 7 rds. of .45 in an extremely light, compact and dependable package.

Given your requirements, I would suggest a CS45 or the 457/4513 from S&W. You are already familiar with the 3913....
Randy

While the Shorty .45 is totally wonderful, you asked for the smallest. That honor goes to the Kahr PM45.

It is a little bit smaller than a PPKs and quite a bit lighter.


Cat

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Think for yourself.

Glock 30
~ or ~
AMT Backup

I'm another who thinks the Star PD is near the top of the small .45 ACP single-action category!

A full size 1911 is easier to tote than the dinky ones. If cocled and locked is not your thing, look at Para Ordnance Light Doubble Action. The trigger is superlativie for a DA pistol and you have all the excellence of the 1911; prooven design, excellent ergonomics, and it is only about 1 1/16th inch thick.

+1 for the CS45. I have one. I also have a Taurus PT145 that uses 10 round .45 mag's.

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For God and Country

I have been carrying a Para Carry nine double action only for a couple of years, the light trigger pull is has to be tried to be believed. They now make the same small gun in 45 ACP.

While I have never experienced this I have heard some people cannot shoot a light 45 that they react so violently to the recoil the action does not function.

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Len

I have had many, many .45 acp pistols over the last 35 or so years. I had an Colt Officer's Model and a Defender that functioned 100%. I have had a Glock 36 and 30. Neither fit my smaller hand very well. I had a Kahr 45 briefly and it was a jam-o-matic. I had a Para Companion and it was a very nice pistol and so were the S&W 3rd Gen DA/SA .45's. There have been lots of 5" and Commander sized 1911's. I prefer the lightweight Commander sized 1911 or the compact/covert style 1911( Commander slide/barrel on an Officer's frame). I have carried a cocked and locked 1911 for many years and am comfortable with that.

A friend bought a Bersa Thunder .45 a few years ago. I expected it to be junky since it was so cheap. It has turned out to be a great pistol. Its light and very compact. The trigger is very good in both DA and SA mode. It has been 100% reliable with every type of ammo used. It is pretty accurate and has been very durable. The fat grip doesn't fit my hand very well but that's the worst thing I can say about it. I now believe this pistol to be a great bargain. I rarely read anything about this pistol but its worth checking out.

This little beauty just rocks. Never a hiccup, easy to conceal, and accurate as hell.

On my hip every day for the last two years.
I shoot it regularly. Reliable and accurate.
Mags from my full size work for reloads.

A little chunky, but I've always been intrigued by the Sig 245 and 220 Compacts.

I have a box stock Colt Officer's ACP. Feeds and shoots Winchester Ranger HP all day long without a hitch. Only wish it was a LW version.


Colt OACP between a Colt LW Commander and Colt Gov't pocketlite .380

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Memory of Randy Freas-Rimfired

I believe the Kahr PM-45 is the smallest, and they make great guns (I've got 2 Kahrs, and have never had a FTF...). My Colt Defender is my favorite carry .45, nice and slim with it's VZ slim grips, it's been 100% reliable, and accurate. I also like my Sig 245, it's a little larger, but still conceals well; very good trigger, accurate, and also 100% reliable.

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NRA Life Member

I had an AMT BackUp in 45acp. It worked which I hear is rare but had the heaviest DAO trigger I ever shot. I traded it on a nice S&W Model 27 and some money on my part.

I have a Kimber Ultra CDP series one that is a great little pistol and two FTF form the stock mag in 500 rounds and retired that mag. I undestand some don't like cocked and locked but fine with me and my Colt Mustang.

I've heard praise for the S&W CS45 and may be my next purchase too.

star pd:

A Kahr PM45 is a nice carry.

I have a Para CCW model. Commander size with the LDA trigger.
Mine has been completly trouble free. Very Accurate. Very easy to carry in a Milt Sparks Summer Special IWB.

My choice....Kimber Stainless Ultra Carryll....Shoots as good as it looks....Carried in a Cozy Partner IWB

Attached Images

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4th SQD 7th CAVALRY

Since you asked I'll put in my 2 cents. I love my Glock 36 its easy to conceal and very accurate. I carry it in a Side Guard Double Snap whenever I'm not carrying my 637 Smith. The Kahr .45 is the smallest but I would rather trust my life to a Glock!

These pics show the size of the Kahr.





It's sitting on top of my model 60.

It did take some work to get it to work right, and you can limp-wrist it easily so a firm grip is required. But to me it was worth it. I'm mean that's such a tiny .45 package. It also shoots very accurately. Like two to three inches at 25 yards.

Now if Kahr would just make a flush mag, it would truly be a pocket peice. At least for me it would.


Cat

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Think for yourself.

I had a 4553 TSW. Great little carry weapon. Sold it to get a K-22. Wish I still had it.

4516 or 4513 will be VERY similar to what you have.
Did you guys not read his post about NOT wanting c&l carry? Lots of 1911s here. NOT what he wants.

For all of you who recommended 1911 style autos, next time, please read past the first sentence....you too Mickey..

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Thirty characters. Exactly...

I have several friends who carry Bersas and without exception they love them. I'm planning on picking up a Thunder Ultra Compact in .40 or .45 myself.

The Kahr CW45 is ideal-reliable-easy to conceal and carry on the belt-very accurate-shoots all defensive rounds in mine-but I also like your original pick-given the right loads the 9mm is every bit as good as a 45ACP-sorry fellows its true-read Marshall/Sanow they have the facts-45 or 9mm-its just a choice-the real trick is the shooter and how good you are

I like my Para CCW. It is small, reliable, does NOT have to be carried cocked and locked. Excellent choice.

Doc

My 457 arrived today and it sure looks like it has potential!!!!!!!

S&W M&P 45 Compact is the size of the Glock mid-frames. It is very concealable and you get 8+1 capacity. You can also tune the trigger.

Let me add another vote for the ParaOrd Companion. Better accuracy than I ever expected from a 3.5" barrel. Best out of the box D/A trigger pull you will find. Heavy enough to attenuate recoil somewhat. Something no one else has mentioned, full size, 8 round single stack magazines fit the gun and function perfectly. Your current 1911 mags will probably fit. Saves money.

Glock 30sf.

Since you said no for the cocked and locked - I say the S&W CS45 too. I have had one for years. Great little shooter.

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For God and Country

I'm glad I'm not the only one that noticed this.

Cheers,
Sam

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Beware the man with one gun...

Beauty! I really like this!

Anyway, I'll stop drooling & get on w/the topic @ hand!

I carried a Kimber Ultra Carry (all black, .45) for about 10 years until I decided to switch to a S&W Airweight w/.38 +P... I always carry small of back, horizontal holster & it works for me... I've tried everything, ankle, hip, pocket, etc..., but, w/both of these pistols, I just found my best comfort w/a small of back, horizontal holster...

Anyway, my dealer calls me up yesterday to let me know he just got in a brand new Kimber Crimson Ultra Carry & "put it under the counter" until I could take a look at it...

Went by this morning & about 20 minutes later, walked out with her. Also picked up another horizontal small of back holster for it & can't wait to take it out tomorrow & put some rounds through it...

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JW-N AZ
Lifer - NRA & SCI

A lighter version of my 4516 would be great, such as 4513 or 457. The cream of the crop would be the scarce CS45, I'm keeping my eyes open for one. I wouldn't want to get any smaller. I'm also considering the M&P45c.

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Fast is fine;accurate is final

The Para Ordnance guns a pretty fancy & small! I've also heard great things about their double action trigger.
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