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  #1  
Old 02-02-2011, 03:17 PM
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Default K Frame vs. J Frame

In a CCW role ( carried a lot and shot a little) do you really think the size and weight of the K frame is worth the extra round over the J frame?

The more I play with the two, the more I'm leaning towards the J. Especially when we start talking airweights.

Opinions?
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Old 02-02-2011, 03:32 PM
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I'm in the extra-round-isn't-worth-the-extra-weight camp.
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Old 02-02-2011, 03:35 PM
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I'm in the extra-round-isn't-worth-the-extra-weight camp.
Same here.
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Old 02-02-2011, 03:57 PM
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I'm in the extra-round-isn't-worth-the-extra-weight camp.
I agree with Frailer, but recommend you have at least one reload with you, no matter what you carry. When carrying my j-frame, I have either a speed loader, (HKS 36) or speed strip (Bianchi or Tuff Products) with me.
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Old 02-02-2011, 03:59 PM
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My advice,worth every penny you are paying for it, is the old suggestion: Carry the biggest, most powerful gun, with the most rounds, that you will ALWAYS carry. If that is a 5-shot J, so be it; just carry a few speedloaders and/or speed strips along with it. If it is a K, L or N, so much the better. But that 629 in your safe won't help you when three skells decide to carjack you at the Phillips 66 station.
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Old 02-02-2011, 06:12 PM
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As I get older (senior citizen) the K is just too big for daily carry by a retiree. If you believe the 6th round is important get a Colt Cobra or Agent. I have a Cobra that I carry on occassion but my daily carry is one of the airweight Js.
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:06 PM
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I'm in the J frame camp. I have a super slick mdl 64 NY-1 but it is relegated to my wife's use at the house. I usually carry my 640-1 and a lightweight J frame, OR my 396NG and a lightweight J frame. I'm also with the "quickest reload is another gun" crowd. When I only carry one it's usually a full size SIG. Sometimes I carry a Kahr K9, but then usually have a lightweight J frame with it. I never carry a J frame by itself, even with a reload.
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:14 PM
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I have carried both off duty and as BUG on duty.
I prefer the "J" Frame.
I recently installed Pachmayr "Decelerator" grips on my Model 638 which improved my accuracy vastly. Also these grips gives more grip when drawing and added no more "Bunk" for CCW.
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Old 02-02-2011, 09:04 PM
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In my opinion, the difference is which is a "shooting" gun, and which is a "comfort" gun. The J-frames are much smaller, more compact, much lighter in weight. The K-frames are much easier to shoot well, especially under stress.

I have used both for many years, and I won't feel unarmed with either one on me. If I know that I am going into dangerous circumstances I will choose the K-frame every time, and carry it as a back-up to my Remington 870, my M1 Carbine, a couple of 1911's, and anything else that I can bring along.

If I am running down to the corner store to pick up a quart of milk, I don't mind slipping my old Model 37 Airweight Chief Special under my shirt.

6 rounds or 5 rounds? This makes less difference to me than "first round in the 10-ring, second round in the 10-ring, etc, etc, etc."

For defensive use I suggest that you carry what you are comfortable and competent with. If that is a K-frame, and you want a 5-shot revolver, just leave one chamber empty (under the hammer, preferably).

Best regards.
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Old 02-02-2011, 09:39 PM
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My first carry piece was a 2" bbl. RB Model 10. I carried it faithfully for about a year and finally decided to get a 2" M60 J-Frame. They both shoot the same bullets, both will handle +P's, and the J-frame is sooooooo much more comfortable and capable of pocket carry that I sold the M10.

The J-Frame will take a little more getting used to, (recoil) but is quite manageable with the use of a Tyler "T" Grip in place. I have NEVER regretted the switch.

Where the K frame comes into its own is with the Model 65 3" bbl, or the Model 66 2 1/2" bbl. which is chambered for the .357 Magnum. If a Magnum round is what you want to carry, these are your guns.

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Last edited by chief38; 02-02-2011 at 09:41 PM.
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Old 02-02-2011, 10:02 PM
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Usualy I just pocket carry my model 40. But ocasionaly I have started packing my wifes 3" model 36. If I am in the boonies rideing quad I go .44 special. I have a half dozzen or so .357s and 38s but it seems I skip over them. I like light.
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Old 02-02-2011, 10:10 PM
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To me, there's nothing handier than an Airweight 642 in a jacket pocket. I often carry a 649 additionally in a pants pocket. Same speedloader works for both. I fine the Hogue Bantam grips pretty much tame the recoil.
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Old 02-02-2011, 11:41 PM
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I have the 5-shot model 60 and would go to the 1911 if I want more fire power. I carry a Kimber Ulrta carry II in .45 ACP most of the time. The model 60 is for times I feel like a revolver. I also carry two speed strips. I wish I had a 4" Model 29 for the range and mountain trails.
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Old 02-03-2011, 09:07 AM
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I don't mind carrying pocket guns that are a bit on the heavy side (my 2" 940 is about as heavy as a true pocket gun can be) so I'm probably in the minority when I say my 64 snub is a viable pocket gun. It DOES fit into a pocket, with or without a pocket holster, though it prints more than the J Frame. The 64 is easier to shoot well, has a somewhat smoother action that will still fire all commercial primers and of course has the extra round. And I find that a K Frame .38 speedloads somewhat quicker than a J Frame .38. All said and done, the 2" K Frame does have some advantages, but the weight will definitely be more of an issue than the size.

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Old 02-03-2011, 09:31 AM
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I've been carrying a 642 for the past couple of years and it is easy to just put in my pocket when heading out. It's an easy "always along for the ride" gun. But... I just bought a Model 66 3" and I plan to "try" to make that my EDC gun and maybe carry the 642 in the pocket as a backup. I'm going to whip up a belt holster for the 3" 66 and see how well it will conceal for me.

For deep pocket concealment... I like the 642 and sometimes go as wimpy as the Ruger LCP.
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Old 02-03-2011, 02:25 PM
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Default K Frame vs. J Frame

The J frame is more versatile. It's light,and compact, for pocket or belt carry, however it kicks like a mule with 357 loads so I generally load it up with LSWHP 38 +Ps.

If my 4" K frame had a 3" barrel I'd definately give it a whirl for IWB carry. No pocket carry with this one. Added weight for dampened recoil is a plus. The longer sight radius, although pretty insignificant in an in your face confrontation, is better for longer shots. That sixth shot may be just the thing to let you know you have'nt practiced enough or your up against more adversaries than you can handle! I definately would rather have the 357 round workin for me. Oh and the heavier gun would make a better bludgeon too!
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Old 02-03-2011, 03:43 PM
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Talking bludgeon indeed!

Oh and the heavier gun would make a better bludgeon too![/QUOTE]

That is true. Nothing says "pistol whip", like a K, L, or N frame. Maybe thats how the top strap got bent on another post I saw?
Peace,
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Old 02-03-2011, 04:25 PM
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I went to the range yesterday and having just acquired my first K frame, a 4" model 10, thoroughly enjoyed shooting it for the first time. When I finished a box of 38's I picked up my 649 and spent the next box fine tuning the CT laser grips, also with a box of 38's - 125 grain gun show special reloads. My right thumb is healing from a fracture and is still very tender but the 649 was just as comfortable to shoot as the model 10. This is probably due to the extra weight vs an Airweight and the quality of the CT grips also contributes to a comfortable hand.

I would rather carry the 649 with its additional weight than deal with the increased snappiness of an Airweight. BTW: Another recommendation for the Lobo Gun Leather Enhanced Pancake holster that I use for my 649. At 3:00 it tucks high and tight and is completely accessible when driving as the shoulder belt is forward of the grip...but I digress. (o; I like the way the Model 10 shoots but it is too heavy/bulky (with the 4" barrel), for me to consider it a carry piece. It will however serve me well as my new truck gun, backed up with a Bianchi speed strip. YMMV

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Old 02-03-2011, 04:43 PM
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Another vote here for the 649. I just got one, and I really like it. I've had several J frames, including a couple of airweights, and they were just too light for me. I like the steel frame, and option to cock the hammer for SA if I want to. Mine doesn't have the Crimson Trace grips, it has the full size J frame grips on it...which I like very much. They feel about as good as the grips on my 686!
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Old 02-03-2011, 06:39 PM
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I seem to be in the minority here...

I prefer to carry my model 66-5 k frame over a j-frame.
Of course.... I don't own a j-frame!

I like the .357 round, and do like six rounds in the cylinder.

Maybe all my years spent as an infantry soldier, humping all that gear, has made me immune to "weight"?

For me, a Beltman belt combined with a good holster (offset belt loops to spread the weight), and I am feeling no pain.

I know lightweight is good, but I always think about if I need to actually draw and fire... and I like the k frame for that!
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Old 02-04-2011, 12:45 AM
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If you're going to lug a K frame around, put it in the safe and lug a Glock 19 instead.

The Airweight J frame is the best solution for the mission it was designed to do. The Glock 19 does a much better job than a K frame for the mission they were designed to do.
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Old 02-04-2011, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Photoman44 View Post
If you're going to lug a K frame around, put it in the safe and lug a Glock 19 instead.

The Airweight J frame is the best solution for the mission it was designed to do. The Glock 19 does a much better job than a K frame for the mission they were designed to do.
I'm actually already doing that, but it's a Glock 23.
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Old 02-04-2011, 12:14 PM
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Default Easy to carry without printing

My wife packs a M36 with wad cutters. I generally carry a M1903 Colt in .32ACP. Then again I carry when ever I can-and I don't want alot f weight and don't want the thing to print--its in my pocket. If I were to use a revolver, it would be a J frame-the lighter the better. Recommend that you carry various types around for a few hours-try out holsters, always think about "how can I get hold of the pistol"-Shoulder holsters under shirts don't work well for me.
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Old 02-05-2011, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Photoman44 View Post
If you're going to lug a K frame around, put it in the safe and lug a Glock 19 instead.

The Airweight J frame is the best solution for the mission it was designed to do. The Glock 19 does a much better job than a K frame for the mission they were designed to do.
I hear ya.. but...

I don't see that the K frame revolver and the Glock 19 were designed for the same "mission".

I "lug" around a K frame snubby for the six sure shots of .357 magnum.
Glock 19 is a 9mm... and as much as Glock does strive for "perfection", I am better served with my K frame.

I also have and occasionally carry a Glock 27 (.40 cal), but have experienced occasional failure-to-feed when working it hard at the range (firing from awkward positions, loose grip, etc..)

For me, for self defense purposes, the k frame is king!
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Old 02-05-2011, 07:07 PM
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A Glock 19 does not fit into a front pants pocket, as does a 2" K Frame. The Glock 27 might fit, but I'm reluctant to carry any Glock in a pocket. The 2" K Frame might not be the perfect pocket gun, but it will certainly perform that role adequately if nothing else is available.

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Old 02-05-2011, 11:00 PM
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A couple of thoughts in response...

The Glock 19 and the K frame are both medium size service guns. Both were designed for the same job (belt carry, sidearm).

Comparing a 2" K frame and a Glock 19 is a bit apples and oranges. A better comparison would be a 2" K frame and a Glock 26. The G26 can be carried in a pocket.
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Old 02-06-2011, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Sinko View Post
A Glock 19 does not fit into a front pants pocket, as does a 2" K Frame. The Glock 27 might fit, but I'm reluctant to carry any Glock in a pocket. The 2" K Frame might not be the perfect pocket gun, but it will certainly perform that role adequately if nothing else is available.

Dave Sinko
Hey Dave,
I hope you are talking coat pocket..? My model 66 snub would pull my pants down, if I attempted to carry it in front pocket!
And i am with you on the Glock in the pocket thing... not for safety reasons (you can get good pocket holsters, that cover the trigger), but for the blocky, thick shape of the glock.
Anyway, now that you mention it... I am not much for pocket carry!
Thanks,
PT
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Old 02-06-2011, 07:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Photoman44 View Post
A couple of thoughts in response...

The Glock 19 and the K frame are both medium size service guns. Both were designed for the same job (belt carry, sidearm).

Comparing a 2" K frame and a Glock 19 is a bit apples and oranges. A better comparison would be a 2" K frame and a Glock 26. The G26 can be carried in a pocket.
Hey Photoman44,
Sorry, looking back, I see the comparison you were making (G19 vs K-frame 4"), and you are right on in your statement (I still like .357 over 9mm..) but... being that you use 44 in your username.. I think you know what I mean.

I do like my Glock 27, but pocket carry has never worked for me (unless it's an anemic caliber mini gun...say 380 LCP type, and I ain't going there), although I am saving for a true pocket gun... the J-frame! Want a model M&P 340 (love the front sight), but my budget says 642/442 no-lock!

Anyway, thanks your your knowledge and input! I appreciate this forum for it's experienced participants and civil attitude.
PT

Last edited by wheelyfun66; 02-06-2011 at 07:29 AM. Reason: added info
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Old 02-06-2011, 08:50 AM
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I went sledding with the kids yesterday and had my 2" Model 64 in the front pants pocket without a pocket holster. After a while it started to hurt where the cylinder was rubbing against my leg, so I took it out and put it in my jacket pocket. The biggest problem is the thickness of the six shot cylinder and frankly the weight just isn't a big deal to me. For years I've been carrying a 4" Redhawk and N Frames concealed so the weight of a K Frame is not an issue.

I'm sure that under those conditions my 940 (or any other J Frame) without a pocket holster would've hurt too. The 64 fits into the same Nemesis holster I use for my 940, but depending on the dimensions of the pocket the grip might stick out of the pocket when the holster is used. So for me one of the sticking points of K Frame pocket carry is the thickness of the cylinder and not the weight.

The Model 66 snub has a longer barrel and adjustable sights which in my opinion add too much bulk for any kind of pocket carry.

The J Frame is best but the K Frame is acceptable, especially if it's all you have.

Dave Sinko
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Old 02-06-2011, 11:23 AM
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What brought this up originally, is I started carrying my 3" 66 to back-up my Glock 23. The 66 was heavier and only carried 6 shots vs. my G23 which was lighter with 14 shots of .40. And probably just as concealable.

As I usually carry my J frame 340 M&P, I just didn't see the extra weight and bulk of th K necessary for the extra round. Especially in a back-up gun.

Now maybe that's not the best comparison (Steel vs. Scandium). I think a better comparison would be the discontinued 315 NG vs. the J, but S&W doesn't make K lightweights anymore?

One thing I've got to give to the Glock 26/27 over the J frames (for me anyway) is shootability. I can shoot these much better than a J. And you also have the option of down loading the mag to reduce the weight.

For my primary, I've always prefered 10 to 15 rounds in a semi-auto over 6 rounds in a revolver. Especially when the semi-auto is lighter and I shoot it better.

But for back-up, nothing beats the weight and reliability of a lightweight J.
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Old 02-06-2011, 01:09 PM
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For me the strength of the J frame is lightweight and stealth.

When I'm dressed heavy, it's in the coat pocket. When I'm dressed light, it's IWB.

Anything larger, I would be in the Glock Family or shopping in the S+W PC center for an eight shot...
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Old 02-10-2011, 09:24 AM
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I would choose a jframe.It's what they are made for.
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Old 02-10-2011, 09:43 AM
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If I need super discreet I carry a Seecamp LWS 380 (12 ounces) otherwise a M&P 340 with CT grips (13.3 ounces empty) in a Mika Roundcut pocket holster does the job. I have a 642-2 with CT grips and found it at 16 ounces a bit on the heavy side for pocket carry.

Next in the lineup is a Kahr PM9 (16 ounces). Those items cover all my pocket carry contingencies.
I would like a nice K Frame but it wouldn't ever be a pocket carry. If I OWB a revolver right now its a 686 3 inch or Walther P99AS in .40.

Last edited by DAdams; 02-10-2011 at 09:46 AM.
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Old 02-10-2011, 10:16 AM
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For me, it is one of my Centennials, daily.
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Old 02-11-2011, 12:56 AM
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For me,it is revolvers. the reason why,disabled and an wheelchairbound amputee. Prosthetic leg in shop for repair and new socket. I carry a Model 10 in 2 inch or 4 inch barrel in a fannypack fro Maxpedition. Both my revolvers have been parkerized and no wear on it yet from carrying it concealed or in the fanny pack.
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Old 04-18-2013, 11:31 PM
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Default It isn't about *the extra round*

The 5 vs 6shot is the smallest factor. Even with the proverbial "carried lot / shot little" is not the same thing as "carried lot/ shooting (hitting) doesn't matter" .

I used to carry an AirWt .37 religously ... As a BUG . To me a J frame is a specialized gun , specifically for ankle and pants pocket. Carried in a decent belt holster the wt of a K frame is negligable. So much so I will often enough carry two on my belt. If not two K fr's , a K and somthing else of *real* size .

And a K fr with either a grip adapter or Boot Grips is just as concealable under a shirt as a J frame with oversize grips.

I remain in my infatuation with 2in RBs ( M10, M64 ) because I like the feel and balance , but a 2.5 or 3in would belt carry similarily.
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Old 04-19-2013, 06:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelyfun66 View Post
I seem to be in the minority here...

I prefer to carry my model 66-5 k frame over a j-frame.
Of course.... I don't own a j-frame!

I like the .357 round, and do like six rounds in the cylinder.

Maybe all my years spent as an infantry soldier, humping all that gear, has made me immune to "weight"?

For me, a Beltman belt combined with a good holster (offset belt loops to spread the weight), and I am feeling no pain.

I know lightweight is good, but I always think about if I need to actually draw and fire... and I like the k frame for that!
Just revisited my own opinion from 2011, and found that, even though I now DO own a J-frame.....I still much prefer to carry my K frame snub.
Last weekend, I attended a snub gunfighting workshop, and was the only one using a K frame. Everyone else had j-frames or Ruger LCR.
My accuracy and speed was far better than the other 9 participants, as well as reloading speed.
The trigger on a K is SO much smoother, and that 6th round sures feels good when all I heard from the others was a clicking sound!
I do carry the j-frame when going to a social function where the hugs and backslaps are expected....
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggfoot44 View Post
The 5 vs 6shot is the smallest factor. Even with the proverbial "carried lot / shot little" is not the same thing as "carried lot/ shooting (hitting) doesn't matter" .
If you look at the top left you will see the date of the thread postings....

Back when this thread started we were still using flintlocks....
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Old 04-19-2013, 10:18 PM
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As an N-frame onlooker to the J-K debate, I find it interesting, when so much of the day is spent outside the house, out -- as the grandfather from Witness would say -- among the "English." That's where the threat is; that's the place you're statistically more likely to need a gun, so why anyone would pick degrees of comfort over degrees of security, I couldn't say. Sure, another round isn't much, but an ounce or two isn't much either. I could shave a few bucks off my car insurance premium, but at the cost of shaving hundreds of thousands off the liability coverage. That's fine, until something happens. I'd go Model 66 if those frame sizes were my only choices.
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Old 04-20-2013, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Dump1567 View Post
In a CCW role ( carried a lot and shot a little) do you really think the size and weight of the K frame is worth the extra round over the J frame?

The more I play with the two, the more I'm leaning towards the J. Especially when we start talking airweights.

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Carrying my 15 oz Model 38 is great; but I don't for one minute think that I'm as likely to survive a gunfight as I would be when carrying my 2 1/2" Model 19. The extra round has very little to do with it!
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Old 04-22-2013, 09:27 PM
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I've been carrying my M19 2 1/2" everyday for about the last 8 months in all kinds of weather and clothing, in a DeSantis pancake holster. Having cut my teeth on semi-auto carry guns and off duty guns, I will say that the M19 has been a refreshing change and I find a great deal of comfort in the feel of it on my hip, a speed strip in my pocket, and a Safariland Comp II speedloader in a pouch on my belt. I have put in many hours of both shooting from the draw and presenting the gun and I find that it points very naturally. There's definitely something magical about the feel of a K frame with a set of Pachmayr grips. I don't feel outgunned or weighed down by it. I feel reassured...
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1911, 340, 629, 640, 642, 649, airweight, carbine, ccw, concealed, glock, hogue, j frame, k frame, kahr, maxpedition, model 10, model 37, model 40, pachmayr, parkerized, remington, scandium, sig arms, speedloader

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Concealed Carry & Self Defense Thread, K Frame vs. J Frame in General Topics; In a CCW role ( carried a lot and shot a little) do you really think the size and weight ...
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