I've shared in another thread about how I was attacked last month by a neighbor’s dog and how I dealt with it. Short version, while riding my bicycle on a rural country road a pack of dogs allowed to run loose by my neighbor chased and harassed me as I rode by each day. I advised my neighbor of the issue, he did nothing. One dog in particular became more brazen and eventually bit me. Afterwards I went home, fetched my 1911 and walked back down the road. As I neared where the dog lived it came out into the road heading in my direction in an aggressive manner. As it got within pistol range I shot it between the eyes. Police were called, no charges filed, dog owner was advised to keep his dogs up. The incident has since died down.

The second attack was just in the past few days and nowhere near the original incident. While riding my bicycle down a slight incline at just over 20 miles per hour I looked ahead and catch a glimpse of the familiar site of a big dog coming in for the chase. Only thing is, this one is running right at me, never waivers, and slams right into my front wheel. I flew over the handle bars onto the county road’s chip seal pavement and my brand new high dollar bike tumbles to the side of the road. As I sit up to take stock of the situation, the dog is just a yards away, the hackles on its back flared and he’s barking at me quite aggressively. With blood running down my right knee and elbow, I crawl a few feet over to my bike and retrieve my OC spray. I was not otherwise armed. The dog was just out of range of the OC spray, but I sent a couple of spurts in its direction and I guess he got the hint because he lost interest and pranced his happy self back where he came from, his mission accomplished. I was able to ride back home but as I write this I have a bandaged knee, a brace on my right elbow and my wife has me on anti inflammatory medication to reduce the swelling.

I'm giving due consideration as to how I want to follow up with this incident. Had I been armed I would have shot the dog on the spot. OC spray has been working as a dog deterrent for the most part, though I’ve been through two cans in the last two months. I'm not on a crusade to kill every loose dog in the community, but once word got out about the first incident I received a lot of positive feedback. I’m a dog owner and have been all my life, but I don’t like coming out on the short end of a meeting with someone else’s dog that that’s allowed to just run loose. I certainly don’t want my wife and son to either. I don’t plan to go confront this dog like I did the first time, though once I heal up I will be riding fully armed. I realize killing other people's dogs is not real humane, but as I look at my bandages I'm not feeling very humane at the moment. I may go talk to the dog owner if I can determine who owns it.

Just for conversational purposes I’d entertain some feedback from the forum on addressing this situation.

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My feedback is to carry your weapon. Seems like your OC was with your bike. If that dog would have came after you once you fell, you would have been his lunch.

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Don't look, reload and shoot!

i say carry your weapon with you and say your prayers regularly.

Are you sure that someone didnt glue a dog whistle on your bike someplace. I think you need to take a good look for one...

On second thought do carry steaks or bacon with you while you cycle?



I hope your wounds heal well!!

I have run in's with dogs quite regularly. I don't trust OC to work every time so I don't carry it.

Dogs have teeth and are never unarmed. I am never unarmed. Even if I'm just taking out the trash.

Too many people let their dogs run loose. And it only takes one time to experience the fear and horror of being bit not to mention the pain.

I've been bit twice. I won't happen again. I routinely carry a collapsible baton along with a gun. If I can use the baton to deter the dog, fine. If not, he gets lead poisoning.

I too am a dog owner and lover. But I won't hesitate.

My opinion is you either need to call the police and let them deal with it or you need to take matters into your own hands. What would you have done if the dog hadn't of let up? You would either be in the hospital or be lunch. If the owner doesn't put the dog on a leash or inside the fence then you have no choice. I have a dog and I keep it up and so should everyone else.

How dare you ride your bicycle on public streets that are protected by the neighborhood dog committie......

I'm another dog lover and owner. However recently while walking my 25 lbs. Cocker mix we were charged by a rotweiler that I would estimate at about 110 lbs. Fortunately he was stopped short by a hidden fence system but by that time I had my 40 caliber Sig P239 half drawn. In hindsight I should have had it out and aimed by that time but since it was a very high end residential neighborhood I was a bit slow in believing what I was seeing. It's a good thing for me that dogs owner had the forethought to install and train that dog to the hidden fence system because I reacted slow enough that I would have likely been contact shooting.

There is a lesson to be learned here. No matter how nice the area, never let your guard down.

Back in my bike riding (15 speed) days I used pepper spray. In hindsight probably not the best idea, considering some of the vicious dogs I was usually able to outrun. When I saw them coming, and knew I couldn't outrun them, I'd stop and put the bike between me and them. Given the dogs people are keeping these days, I'd carry my snubby in a holster where it was plainly visible and make sure everyone who owned one of these animals knew what would happen should I get attacked. I'm not going to be PC when it comes to a dogs teeth, I've seen to many dog bites.

Tough job, but somebody has to do it. Not every loose dog, of course, but every loose dog that attacks humans. I will say that I used to ride a bicycle a lot, and kept the end of a fishing rod velcroed across my handlebars (at a different stage, I kept it velcroed to my top tube), and that was sufficient for the one or two times a dog approached while I was mounted. But these were domesticated dogs, so maybe that wouldn't have worked in your case.

Dog won the first round....

I have no time for bullies -- people, dogs or cats. Prepared is 99% of your personal defense posture.

We had Kitty for 21 years and Snuggles is 14.

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S&WHF 366

I'd recommend the same medicine a good buddy of mine gave to the dog that attacked him, in the presence of his wife and two lovely little girls... double tap to the head with a .45. The dog's owners called the county sheriff who, after seeing the tracks in the county road as the dog charged, told the owners to go home. Good ending to what could have been a disastrous story.

Ever thought of spinning class instead of riding outside? If you want to ride outside, carry your gun and shoot Fido before he crashes you.

I would say the batton would be a good idea and then keep the pistol as a backup if he doesnt get the point.

And just to keep this in perspective, when we're talking about having to shoot a dog we're speaking not of a 30 pound Fido but 100 + pounds of teeth bent on snacking on your leg. That's the mutt that gets the bullet just before he gets you.

You know, that was the same opinion of the owner of the dog I shot.

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Never wise to try to outrun a dog, but I've done a bit of it, too. Back in my riding days, I was out on fairly rough country roads usually riding 15-20 MPH. I had one really bad incident with dogs and another one that could have been even worse (a Great Dane pushed me across the road into on-coming traffic, but lucky for me, the motorist saw what was happening and was able to get stopped in time).

These two incidents gave me reason to give a lot of thought to the matter. My conclusion was that I would rather shoot the idiot owners than the dogs. (I happen to love dogs and generally understand their "motives." For the most part, they think they are just doing their "job." And it is a noble one - protecting their homes and families.) It is their stupid, inconsiderate owner that needs the treatment.

I am not about to get into shooting some little boy's or girl's dog (they can't help it that their parents are irresponsible idiots), and I generally do not believe lawsuits over such things are much of an answer. Any threats of consequences (yes, I have made a few) for the idiot owners for not controlling their dog usually just ends up with something like, "OK, smartxxx, I'll just shoot the dumb dog myself."

The problem is as old as bicycles, and there is no good answer - since it is illegal in most states to shoot the stupid owners.

I would be visiting the police to file a complaint and then sue the dog's owners for medical expenses.

This...^^^ it is lawyer up time also since it is unlikely to be the last time. I would say the dog should be put down if it is attacking people.

having owned several dogs, and having been bit by the strange mutt or two, i am a firm believer of wearing some nice boots and packing a gun. dogs are as good as the person who trains them. as we all know there some idiots out there. i dont go downstairs to see my in-laws without slipping my 442-2 in my galco horsehide pocket holster. other than shooting the dog a good swift kick to the chops, or ribcage should do the trick. i once sprayed a german shepard with old school mace... didnt work to good. was like seasoning on my arm i guess. a good shot to the ear got him off me and running home. the owner and i had a nice little chat, and all was forgivin(told next time a lead pill would be administered instead).

Shooting a dog that is attacking you is appropriate and probably legal. Going back after leaving the scene of the crime and shooting the dog may be pushing the envelope on legality.
If you have been chewed up, the law provides remedies that effect the dogs owner and getting reimbursed for medical expenses is more meaningful than losing a gun for illegal discharge. An understanding cop is great, but he's not always the one who shows up.

Or, you can do what this armed citizen did, if necessary:

A wheelchair-bound 70-year-old man says he shot a stray pit bull in self-defense

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MotorCityGun

The only way to handle large aggressive dogs is to shoot them. If you are in a rural area and are a halfway decent shot, shooting them shouldn't be too troublesome. In an urban environment I will wait until they are almost on me and shoot once carefully. The price of missing and hitting somebody who doesn't deserve it is very high. If the dog is actually chewing on you, you need to be very careful that you don't accidentally shoot yourself if the bullet fully penetrates the dog. Only the most hardcore dog will continue fighting after being shot once anywhere. Stray dogs (especially pit bulls) are a huge problem in the 'hood. Tasers work very well but hitting them is not a sure bet for a variety of reasons. If I see a large dog running toward me with malice in its eyes I will choose lead instead of voltage.

Oh, and you want to keep the gun on you, and not on the bicycle.

Dave Sinko

I appreciate your feedback. The only problem is this is out in the country in the Arkansas Ozarks. There'll be no police reports or getting lawyers involve to solve this issue.

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Some, not all, but some of the people that allow thier dog to run loose and terrorize the neighborhood are losers anyway.

Suing them would be a waste of your time and money.

Ride your bike. Enjoy your ride. Shoot the pooch if needed.

Sorry, but it's brutally that simple.

I agree completely - except for the praying part (that won't work on dogs)........just carry your firearm!!!!!!!!

To add; I walk in the morning. I am armed. But I also carry an ASP baton in my back pocket as I said before.

The reason is, if I can deter without shooting, great. If not the baton buys me a little time by serving as a "buffer" between me and the dog. If he bites the baton, good. At least it's not my arm. As he's biting, I shoot.

The baton has already worked twice. First time I swung at the dog and he got the hint. Second time, different dog. Hit him as hard as I could on top of the head. Knocked him silly and he turned and ran.

I would strap one to your bike.

Just a couple of non-lethal methods I've used before on charging dogs were a collapsible portable umbrella.The sound of it extending and visual of it opening scares the **** out of dogs, stops them in their tracks and other method is let dog see you bending down and looking like you picked up something and then throwing it at him. Dog doesn't know if you had anything in your hand but will think you threw something at him. I used these methods alot during my meter reading days. Sticks & stones or ? use what ever works best for you.

Carrying an ASP was what occurred to me, also. If the dogs are that bad I'd carry a paintball gun --- mark the dog --- then call the Cops. Maybe they'll find the dog and talk to the owner; if not, at least you've tried to remedy the situation thru lawful means. I'd say shooting someone's dog, even under the circumstances you've mentioned, will only "ramp up" the situation and could cause BIG reprisal. It wouldn't be worth it to me. Hard to believe a can of Bear Spray wouldn't turn a dog ---- but it is expensive. Sometimes, it's not about being right ---- it's about considering the problems your actions might cause. PS: I'm NOT a dog owner.

Well, I'm a motorcyclist, so I don't know how much this would apply to you, but.....

There was a dog on a regular route of mine that was occasionally allowed loose. He was one that would hide out at the end of the driveway and wait to the very last second to come out barking and chasing bicyclists and motorcyclists. He once got so close to my front wheel and causing an accident, that it threw me into a fit of rage.

I stopped and pulled a U-turn... the dog ran back onto his owner's driveway, stopped and stared at me.... I rode up into the driveway... the dog ran up on the lawn, stopped and stared at me.... (I was still absolutely livid)... I rode up onto the lawn and chased him.... he ran a full loop around the house and I chased him, on the lawn, all the way, honking my horn and hooting/hollering at the top of my lungs. The dog's face was priceless as he turned back and looked at me every ten yards or so.

No chance I was ever going to catch him, so I cut the chase and left. I never ever saw that dog give chase again - either he learned his own lesson, or the owner witnessed the spectacle from inside his home and locked that mutt up for good. Either was OK with me .

(FWIW, this was a Lab of some kind... no 100lb Put Bull, although I was in such a rage, I don't know if it would have mattered.)

Personally, I've seen enough inhumane antics from humans for me to really give a damn about busting a cap in an aggressive animal. I despise people who let their anamials run loose just about as much as the ones that let their animals **** in my yard. People really need to take a little bit responsibility and take care of their animals.

<<Rant mode off>>

UPDATE: A week after the 2nd incident I was able to determine who might be the owner of the dog. Based on my investigation, I drove up the gravel driveway to a rural home sitting on a couple of acres near where my incident occured. As I got out of the my car, my arm still in a brace, a man in his mid 30's was mowing the yard on a riding mower. He cut the engine and came over to speak to me when I got out of the car.

I introduced myself and asked if he lived here; yes it was his place.

I asked him if he owned a medium sized gray dog. He looked puzzled and said he did but not anymore. Now I was puzzled. I told him I'd had a run in (literally) with the dog last weekend, explained the situation, and told him I wasn't looking for anything other than to advise him of the issue and that it was a problem letting the dog run loose like that.

At that point he told me the dog was dead. It had been run over by the UPS delivery truck that runs the route in this area. He said the dog belonged to his cousin that recently shipped out to the Sand Box and he was keeping it for him 'til he got back. He'd only had it a couple of weeks. His cousin had lived in a rented house in town and his back yard was fenced in so the dog was not used to running loose, and once it got "out in the country" it just ran wild. The dog ran out in front of the UPS truck which hit it. The UPS driver stopped but the dog was DRT.

He apologized for my trouble, we shook hands, and agreed the problem was resolved.

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There re three ways to cure a dog forever of chasing. Well, the 4th way is to kill him.

First, if the owner will cooperate, a shocking collar. The collar and the transmitter are expensive, but one could find a hunter and borrow.

Coon, fox and rabbit hunters use them all the time to break dogs of running deer. So do bird hunters use them to cure their dogs of pointing trash game.

The second way, and I guess I should have put it in 1st place, is to get some dog spray. Bicycle shops carry a good grade and it does work if it is not too windy.

The third way, and what would be the easiest and best for shooters is to get a .22 and load it with rat shot.

About three or so encounters with rat shot will cure any dog.

It would be the preferred method for anyone on a bike.

Of course, the dog owner will think you are using real bullets and so there is a need for a frank discussion with the owner.

I have more than 20 foxhounds, so I know what I am talking about. I use the combination of shock collar and rat shot.

Glad your injuries are not to severe. Before you decide to carry a gun for protection, please check your local laws in order to determine your ability to do so. This is especially important since you are in a populated area.

Now if you were in my area and shot your gun, neighbors here would have a contest trying to fiqure out what caliber was used.

Continue to carry pepper spray and maybe a weighted stick until you decide to carry a gun or not.

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NRA Certified Instructor

"The dog ran out in front of the UPS truck which hit it. The UPS driver stopped but the dog was DRT."
Sir, that is called KARMA....
I carry a NAA .22 mini revolver with two rounds of ratshot and three 22LR, mainly for Mr. Noshoulders but they will work on feral dogs.

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"Life is short, hunt hard"

I realize that letting one's dog run loose and being a danger to the public is not humane.

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Centennial Every Day

A couple of years ago in GA we had several people killed by packs of feral dogs in their neighborhoods. NOT the woods. Not the middle of nowhere. But in subdivisions. Dogs running wild is just not acceptable anymore. they breed with coyotes and other feral dogs and the issue just compounds itself.

Sorry that dog got a bad deal by the guy who it was left with. But I would have shot it myself.

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One gun is never enough...

Faulkner,

You are a heck of a nice guy, that is for sure.

I am a bicyclist and have plenty of trouble with dogs and a scar to prove it.

You did right by talking to the guy and fortunately the dog is dead. I am glad that it all worked out for you.

I almost always bring pepper spray or my Kel Tec P32 or both. The almost part of the above is because I am absent-minded and forget, that is when my neighbor's abused pitbull broke its chain and bit me while I was still on the bike. Forgetfulness is costly sometimes.

If I lived in Arkansas I would find it an honor to ride with a man so even-tempered as yourself.

Best regards,

Terry

The aggressive dogs I've encountered are either barkers or biters. The former make a lot of noise but pose no imminent threat. The latter group is the problem. Any biter over 30-40lbs can be a serious problem, one that requires lethal force more often than not. My first choice is a pistol ... then spray. The baton isn't practical IMO as using it means the man vs. dog confrontation is now hand to paw, and way too close for comfort. A well placed shot or two will prevent the altercation from getting into CQC. If I was encountering threatening canines on a regular basis, I'd consider the Governor with mixed .45 & .410 loads.

If I were the dog's actual owner, I would be seriously ticked at my cousin when I got home from the sand box. Doubt he realized his dog would be left to run loose...

The baton can also be used as a break stick.

A Governor? 410? No disrespect but I think you underestimate mans best friend and just how hard it is to hit a moving target at full speed. No 410 for me. If I had to shoot it would hard hitting 45 Colt not wimpy 410.

I make an effort to communicate with the owner if possible, I was raised that way, especially when the dog is a yard bound barker, and they don't seem to care. I try to be polite, but tell them plainly that their dog is a problem. In a couple of cases, I have filed the paperwork to have annimal control fine, and eventually cause the owner to appear in court to possibly have the dog taken away. There is a progression of increasing fines-starting with 50 bucks and doubling each subsequent time. The animal control guys will tell you that "hitting them in the pocket book" is a sure fire way to get their attention. But here, you have to have 2 people sign, and many neighbors are reluctant to sign. Animal control can and should be called in the case of roaming dogs. The report of a loose dog here gets a priority response, and it also is helpful if you do have to do something, to protect your self after the fact. I don't like to harm the dog, because as one poster said, I understand what the dog is doing. I used to live in the mountains of Georgia, and had 2 mountain bred shepherd-retrever mix dogs-a brother and sister. They were sweet pups, unless you were intruding on their turf. I had put on an old knit cap one winter day, and gone out to walk around the road, which horse shoed around a deep draw, that the dogs just cut right through to come up on the other side. They didn't know I was out, so when they came up out of that draw and saw me, I got a taste of what a stranger had to deal with. Whoa!! I was glad they were mine, and they were embarassed when they found out old Dad had "tricked" them. So I try to talk to folks. I had a dog several houses up from us that would run down the street and challenge me right at my front door. At the time, I had doctors orders to walk my wife around the block, and when I did, I had to deal with this dog almost every time. I finally found the wife home one day, out in front, with the dog loose, and naturally, it came after me. I asked if her husband was home, and she said no, so I told her who I was and where I lived so that her husband could find me, and asked her if she thought is was ok for her dog to challenge me right at my front door? No. Then I told her about walking my wife around the street, and I told her that the next time their dog came after us, I was going to hurt him, real bad. Then I asked her if she understood what I had said. Yes. Never saw the dog again. I am an animal lover from for ever, but I can and will do what I have to do to protect others. I have had cases where I just gave a strong command to a dog, sometimes in the name of Jesus, and that was all that was necessary. Flapjack.

Carry and be careful! I carry when I ride or walk since I cannot run any more due to a busted ankle. I almost had to kill one a few years ago it came running out in a aggressive manner and I had my daugher who was 8 at the time with me. I grapped her and set her in the back of a parked pick up that was on the street and crowned it with my solid brass headed cane. After that I always carry my Snubed nosed 38.

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Protected by Sigma 40VE

invested in Bond 45/410 just for that reason. When they get to close, unleash the 410. Tested #6s and very large pattern. Planning to try #4s. Would be devastating at point contact.

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Tommy

I agree with MC5AW: For those of you who don't own or have not shot a Smith & Wesson Governor, I own one and have recently shot over 100 rounds through mine. Not a lot, but enough I can give a reasonable assessment of what effect/patterning they have. Now, I will/would not critize anybody for their choise in caliber. I believe (as I have for over 25 years of teaching firearms) that you should carry the gun/caliber you shoot the best, then shot placement is the key. That said, my Governor will put (in just one round) four 000 buck rounds - per EACH round - in a four inch circle at 25 yards, and I believe that an aggressive dog (or any other "animal") would be much closer. I walk my puppy on a leash at night and the Governor is my choise of weapons (and I have "several" to pick from). I put two rounds of Winchester .410 PDX, then two rounds of the Federal .410 (four shots per round) 000, then two Gold dot .45 colts. Anything that attacks at 10 yards or closer is not going to attack again. Be safe.

From what I have read those multiple shot balls essentially act as one bullet. Thus there seems to me to be no real advantage of a handgun that shoots buckshot over a conventional handgun loaded with HP ammunition. My 200 grain GDHP also shoots a one shot in a 4" circle at 25 yards.

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Hook686

Hook686: It depends on the situation. The Governor can shoot "just" one round of .45 colt, .45 ACP or .45 GAP, however when you have a moving target (bird or animal, or whatever) and you shoot .410 four bullets each time you squeze the trigger, you have a much better chance of hitting the target. An example would be if we both get five inch groups and yours is just a bit left or right, you may miss. If I have four round going to the same area, I have a better chance (75% better) of hitting the target - based on my four rounds vs your one. No, I'm not advocating "spray and pray", just a specific gun/load, for a specific purpose - like walking the dog late at night, responding in your own home late at night, less penetration, etc. with the 000 buck rounds. Just some examples, there are (I'm sure) lots of others.

Sorry you got hurt, but you sir are a very good writer. Your style of writing is entertaining.

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Man of Steel

The problem with that is that these days, bicyclists are facing an increasing danger of TWO legged predators. Bicyclists have been the victims of several recent gang attacks. I don't want to save an aggressive dog's life at the cost of my own in the event of a violent robbery.

...because you ARE using "real bullets".

Rat shot is every bit as much deadly force as a Mini-mag. If you were to unlawfully shoot a human being with rat shot, that would be a felony, indistinguishable from shooting them with a plated hollowpoint.