Yeah, I understand the intent of the film maker. The film was chosen as support for the question, "...are you concerned at all that the 1911's capacity might prove insufficient?" My ending question was more toward the capacity question rather than a critique of the film itself.

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Freedom isn't free.

You posted this while I was typing my reply to forrestinmathews.Yes, I concur. However, and this may sound arrogant, but I don't consider myself the "typical" home defense handgun owner. I do practice and do carry a spare mag. I must confess that I tend to blink at the report, but I'm working on it.


We've gone down this rabbit hole before. This video is a perfect example of why I think everyone, who has a gun for self-defense, should seek training and practice a lot.

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Freedom isn't free.

Someone who spends no time practicing with their home defense gun would certainly not practice having someone (wife) armed as well. My Thought was - slide locked back and I don't have a spare mag?...close the gap and take it to CQB!

Doesn't sound arrogant. Any firearms instructor who considers himself the "typical home defense handgun owner" is not worthy of any students.

If you're inside the house, it's already Close Quarters Battle. Maybe you meant hand-to-hand? (Don't ya just love semantics? )

All joking aside, this is an interesting subject. What to do when the ammo runs out?

If you've had training in empty hand combat, absolutely! Close that gap and take over. However, for the average Joe, who only has 7 rounds loaded in his gun that holds at least 10 , moving to another room might be better.

In the video his situation went from bad to horrible really fast. Stay in the house and die. Leave and there might be more bad guys. What a pickle. Grappling would probably still have cost him his life. It might have given his family a chance to get away or the police to arrive.

There really was no good thing to do at that point.

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Freedom isn't free.

The producer of this video is very skilled in his trade. I humbly offer another perspective. There are many reasons why bad guys would commit a Home Invasion-(Enter an occupied dwelling to commit a crime)
An inadvertent burglary of a dwelling thought to be empty where the BG's are confronted by the occupants.

A "Hot Prowl" burglary where the BG"S expect to find occupants- usually at night time, while you're sleeping.

Residential Robbery where the BG's want something specific from a random home and picked yours-(similar to the video)- money, drugs, property,etc.

And the Oh **** Scenario: A targeted event at you in your home.

In all but the last Scenario, the occupants are relatively safe from physical violence if they engage the threat forcefully with SPEED, SURPRISE, and AGGRESSION. The occupants would most likely prevail even without a firearm. "I threw a burglar out of a 2nd story window after his partner stabbed me in the side when I walked in on the event. The partner stared at me for a moment and ran out of my home. I was 20 at the time, in the military, highly trained and motivated. I honestly do not believe that being armed would of changed the initial event-
30 years of police work has validated this opinion.

In the targeted event, the BG's are motivated to continue their actions- the occupants better be prepared- mentally and physically.

Real crooks are pussy- cats. They will run on Dangerous Ground- Try not to make it Deadly Ground- they will fight. In a encounter with multiple crooks, deal decisively with the first, and the rest will run hopefully- if not, reload and continue....until the threat is stopped.

Again, just my humble opinion..

Mike

Yeah, the video presents a very bad scenario (in addition to its intended point). Presence of mind - and not panicking is key. My training would tell me to close the gap and settle it, WHILE TELLING MY WIFE TO GET THE FIRST GUYS GUN!

I don't think the video is a "bad" situation. In fact, I think it portrays reality for most gun owners. The intent was to show the fallacy of magazine capacity limitations and it does that. Unintentionally it also demonstrates how lack of training/practice affects people.

Here's another thought, if he had a 15 round mag, would he have shot at the first guy 10 times?

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Freedom isn't free.

The best gun is the one you have, and with which you are proficient (if you have any sense). For many reasons, the first best choice for me is my AR, set up with an Aimpoint and Surefire P3X, but I always have at least one loaded handgun readily available. To rely solely on firearms, however, is stupid. One should have a multiple layered defense system that makes your home unappealing to criminals.

Be low profile. Don't have ostentatious displays of wealth. Don't be on social media, don't let the press write articles about you (look for the story of the home hit recently which had been featured in national publications due to the "she-cave", a 3 story closet), don't let your friends and family put stuff about you on social media. FB, Twitter, and the like ARE NOT YOUR FRIENDS. All of these are fails of epic proportions.

Have a fence, with a locked gate, and post your property "no trespassing" in the manner your state law requires to be effective. Anyone who is not invited to your home should feel really unwelcome and uncomfortable. Have landscaping that does not provide concealment for bad actors. Have lighting that contributes to that. LOCK YOUR DOORS AND WINDOWS. A staggering number of unlawful entries are made into unsecured homes (I have read a lot of police reports, and responded to plenty of calls of such nature - most involved unsecured premises).

Any dog that is alert and makes noise is of value. A big one that makes big deep barks is of more value. No one wants to be bitten, but a small dog that is easily be overcome by an intruder is another victim. The desired to be bitten by something that sounds like 100+ pounds of hate is even more rare, and 2 or more big (the smallest I would consider are Ridgebacks and Rottweilers, as a rule) protective dogs are pretty hard to overcome unless you are targeted by professionals. They will likely come prepared to shoot those dogs.

That last category likely will apply to only a few of us. Targeting by professionals is not random. Something attracted them. You may be a high value target due to your occupation (a prosecutor's father was abducted by gang members a few months ago because of her work, and they lived hours apart as I recall). I know of an officer who had a shootout in his yard on Christmas Eve most of 20 years ago because of his agency's work on a gang - the hit team was sent from hundreds of miles away. Your relatives really need to understand that they never get to discuss or acknowledge your work if you are this type of target. Of course, all mail to a PO Box, no listed phones, etc.

However, most targeted invasions seem to be related to poor lifestyle choices. Being a criminal (like a pot grow) or allowing your idiot criminal cousin to hide at your home when he annoys his fellow criminals - fail, and maybe you need the educational opportunity.

There is no "one size fits all" here. Most times, "one size fits none" is more correct. Assess your locale, your life, and your options, and make the risk smaller and the effort for bad guys harder. The more of them you drive off to other targets, the better off you are.

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NHI, 10-8.

How high is up?

I doubt he would have.
Rastoff: I sent you a p.m.

I wonder if the FBI is distinguishing "Home Invasion" from other residential burglaries. Since they have categorized burglaries as "non-violent" (which is an absolute load of fertilizer), yet seem to be saying something different about home invasion events (a deliberate entry targeting people who are present, shall we say), it would explain the statistic of 3 invaders as an average.

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NHI, 10-8.

The Governor with all the choices 410 45colt 45acp whats not to like

Several years ago, when the Feds were throwing money at State and Local Law Enforcement, the Crime Stat coding procedure changed. It became very complicated. For instance, a robbery which resulted in death,aka murder was coded as a robbery. A Domestic Violence involving great bodily injury was coded as a DV and not an Aggravated Assault or ADW. If the victim died later as result of the original DV assault- it was still coded as a DV.

In the early 2000's, San Francisco's murder rate was approaching 100. The City Fathers and Mothers had the department manipulate the coding and changed the stats. I was in charge of our Operations Center and had the true numbers-

"Believe nothing that you read and only half of what you see."

Mike

The term "Home Invasion" was made up by the media. There is no official definition and it is often used for any crime at a home.

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Freedom isn't free.

I think "home invasion" is pretty much limited to a forcible entry into an occupied home. Years ago my home was broken into and robbed while I and the family were out at a high school football game. At the time I called it a burglary, but the LEO's called it a "break in" since the house was empty when it occurred.

There is, or was, a crime in Illinois called "Home Invasion". The closest thing we have in WA is 1st degree burglary.

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NHI, 10-8.

[QUOTE=NE450No2;136229245]Random thoughts...
Best handgun for home defense.
Desires:
Short barrel, harder for the attacker to wrestle it away from the home owner in a Grappling situation.
Powerful enough to strike a hard blow, with only one hit.
Controlable recoil, enabling multiple shots, and hopefully mulitple hits.
Sights you can see in low light.
Quick to reload.

As far as HOME DEFENSE I think this one would be hard to beat.

djh

....besides that it goes on forever.....which tickles me....is that the question is SO OPEN ENDED - what's best for you is not the best for the next guy - and everyone's house is different.

Do you live in a house?

Big one or small one?

Farmhouse or zero lot line?

Brick walls or wood frame?

Are you in an apartment/condo?

What's between you and the next apartment? Cinder blocks/cement or wood frame/sheet rock?

Do you own one gun or dozens of guns? Lots of choices? This thread didn't specify "if you only own one gun", did it? Besides, who here only owns one gun?

Before you get to best home defense gun you need to paint the scenario, the surroundings, the people in the next room or the lack thereof, then you can discuss caliber, type of weapon, lights or no lights, back up weapons, etc.

Scenario:

95% of the time I am home alone. Maybe 97% (she might change that).

Small home, some exterior wood walls, some brick, neighbors next door have a brick wall, other neighbors are across the street. Over penetration is a limited problem - it exists but it's not as bad as it is for some people.

Skillset - fired expert with rifle and pistol when the Navy tested me and that's not as long ago as you might think. I retired in 2004. Old guy, but still good with his guns when tested. Licensed CHL instructor, Level 3 combined instructor. So some folks rate me as pretty well qualified without me bragging about it. That's a "no brag, just fact" type of thing.

I own many handguns; plenty of revolvers and pistols. I am good with all of them and I practice.

That is NOT the same scenario for other people so what works best for me will not be the same as it is for other people.

My choice for my bedroom/night gun is a 2.5" Model 686+ loaded with .38 Special ammunition - I might have a +P or two in there; offhand, I forget because I change my mind routinely. However, as I don't tote that around with me, I keep a 4" Model 10 in the living room, and a 2.5" Ruger Security Six in the bathroom (the most vulnerable room in the house - where you routinely are the most vulnerable!). The latter two are loaded with .38 Special HPs; typical defensive rounds.

I do tote one of those into the computer room with me, or I might just take my daily carry gun in there, a Model 642. I don't keep a gun in the guest room - it's unnecessary.

Notice - all of these guns are revolvers. I have pistols; I like wheelguns better. No lights attached. I do keep tactical flashlights handy but they're not attached to any guns. I also keep loaded shotguns and rifles handy (in closets) but that's not the subject of this discussion.

When I'm old and feeble and can't handle pistols any more it won't matter - I'll always be able to handle revolvers.

Best home defense handgun - a very subjective question indeed!

I'm not going to say it's the best, but my preference for my main HD handgun is an M&P 9fs with night sights and a streamlight TLR-1HL mounted on the rail. JMO.

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J Dyer
2 Cor. 5‬:‭17‬

I've been contemplating a response to this thread for a while now. To my mind the best is what you have to hand and are proficient with.

Earlier this week my wife woke me at around 03:30 saying there were people trying to get in at the back. She'd heard a bump and the dog let out a single bark. The dog is inside. I have two safes, one in our room with rifles and another in the spare room with the pistols.

I went for the nearest safe, tossed an unloaded .303 No. 4 onto the bed and grabbed my 7.62 SLR, slammed home a 20 round clip and racked the action. One up the spout, thumb hovering over the safety, trigger finger above the trigger, on my knee, rifle low ready. My heart rate is up but I'm at ease.

I tell my wife to call the police. She can't raise them, and switches on the yard lights. This all happens in seconds. I check through the windows, nothing. I call the police and then go to the second safe, get the Glock 19 and two spare mags. Cycle the action, failure to feed. Next clip, loaded!

I call my neighbour to check out my yard and his. He has an elevated position. The yard is clear. I check and there's evidence one of the windows has been tampered with. The police don't pitch. Not happy but situation under control.

Immediate actions thereafter. All Glock magazines capacity reduced by 5 rounds. Glock stays under the pillow and now lives in our room safe. Neighbours advised of intruders and neighbourhood alert status upgraded. Dog now sleeps under the verandah in order to provide more of a warning.

Home actions. All Glock magazines emptied and rotated with fresh ones, all magazines capacity reduced by 5 rounds. Rifle safe repacked with .303 at the back and SLR loaded with 10 round clip with 8 rounds placed in front. The SLR can't fit into the safe with a 20 round magazine. S&W M28 relocated to rifle safe and loaded with 3 additional speed loaders on hand. Madam can use either the Glock or M28 well.

Further actions. Investigate costs associated with installing galvanised spikes on the external walls and reinstalling the alarm system with passive sensors in the yard to allow earlier warning when intruders enter the yard.

Not a great position to be in but it highlighted the deficiencies and lack of readiness to respond to a threat at home. I don't really want to use the .357 in the house due to blast and noise, I prefer the 9mmP with Corbon ammo. The 7.62 is actually illegal to use in an urban environment and it's difficult to manoeuvre in confined spaces. I think we all should review our state of readiness and address any shortcomings as necessary.

My home defense is a M&P .40 with a flashlight/laser attached.
Its accurate, has good stopping power, the light is unbelievably bright, the recoil is moderate and easy to control.
All in all, I am very satisfied with my decision.

The Best Handgun, Period. - YouTube

This oughta do the job!

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CPT, Armor (Ret)
Luke 22:36

I was a law enforcement officer and certified academy firearms instructor for many years (right in Smith & Weson's county) and here is my personal favorite for home defense.

Serbu Firearms

I have complete confidence in these firearms for my home defense needs ( one always within reach depending on where I'm at in the house). Glock 21 45acp, SIG P320 40 cal, Beretta PX4 Storm 9mm, Benelli Super Nova 12 gauge. N for the unexpected home defense crisis...... My M4 with 30 round Pmags.

There's no one size fits all answer as where you live, the layout of your house/apartment and where you'll keep the gun all factor in. Plus you kind of have some conflicting qualities on your want list.

You've got me thinking about electronic muffs.

These posts make a lot of good points. I have a 12 ga but am more comfortable with a handgun until I shoot the shotgun more. I am concerned with capacity. Last time I checked, LE personnel averaged approx 25% hit ratio in gunfights (and they weren't just wakened from a sound sleep). If one must anticipate fending off more than one aggressor, and you consider the possibility that 75% or more of your shots may not go where you want them to, I think a revolver starts to look light on the rounds. You'd better be practicing your reloads, or keep a backup revolver. I have used a Sig 250 in 45 acp with 10 round mag, and a light that points pretty close to POA. Now that I have a Glock 29 10 MM, and I've found some appropriate defense rounds for it, I'm going to try it with 15 round mags. If that works, I'll probably start using it. It has a laser grip (all of my CTC laser grips are plenty bright in lighted rooms, and I've never had a problem getting them sighted in at normal distances). It was mentioned that semi-auto guns require a bit more thought or effort to bring into play. I leave my chamber empty in the bedroom (I have an alarm, partly to give me time to wake up and assess what is going on before someone appears in my bedroom). If I'm not awake enough to rack the slide (or flick a safety off some other type), I am not awake enough to make shooting decisions, IMO.
By the way, those of you that have connected commercial alarms, Get your money's worth. Make sure you have system smoke detectors on each floor. I know people who had devastating fires while they were not at home.

I would guess that any firearm discharged inside a home, with the possible exception of a 22, will be loud enough to cause hearing loss, at least temporarily. I doubt that the switching from 357 to 38+p would be that significant from a noise perspective, indoors, with both being devastating. Maybe I need to consider a silencer on a semi instead of my Model 19 with 357Mag ammo.

8 3/8" S&W Model 500. I want to be sure.

I'm a very, very light sleeper.

The first alarm defence wise is the dogs. If you hear a noise the dog let's me know if it's time to arm. Listen to the dogs change in its bark. At night I'm up at the first growl. During the day it's mainly deer or turkeys but I'm armed looking anyway.

Trust the dog first.

The best in-house weapon is a Mickey Mantle home run slugger loaded with a piece of steel inside the big ended. A loaded bat even in a short snappy swing in the forehead will sit anyone down.
Of course the dog is on his leg first.

I don't think I would shoot but with the dog on him and me with the bat, the third line of defense is my gun. Last resort.

The baseball bat is better because there's no time to put the muff's on.
Ever think about your families hearing?

IF YOU ARE STANDING BEHIND A WEAPON WITH A MOUNTED LIGHT, IN A DARK ENVIRONMENT, YOU ARE MAKING A TARGET OUT OF YOURSELF. IN FIREFIGHTS IN VIETNAM, WE WOULD RETURN FIRE ON MUZZLE FLASHES--THE SAME PRINCIPLE. IT IS MUCH SAFER TO SWEEP A ROOM WITH A FLASHLIGHT HELD IN A HAND EXTENDED OUT FROM THE SIDE OF YOUR BODY….

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'Nam 1968-69.DAV,VFW,NRA Inst.

FOR HOME DEFENSE AND SELF DEFENSE, I FAVOR THE 2 1/2" 686+, BACKED UP BY THE 642. BOTH ARE STUFFED WITH 135 GR GOLD DOTS, LOW FLASH, FOR SHORT BARRELS. THEY WILL GET THE JOB DONE….

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'Nam 1968-69.DAV,VFW,NRA Inst.

[QUOTE=BigBill;138446626]I'm a very, very light sleeper.



The best in-house weapon is a Mickey Mantle home run slugger loaded with a piece of steel inside the big ended. A loaded bat even in a short snappy swing in the forehead will sit anyone down. QUOTE]


IMHO, a mistake just waiting to give you a long jail term. Here's why. A bat/club is 'enough' defense weapon by itself as far as an ambitious district attorney goes. If you deliberately make it even more lethal/damaging, that is premeditation in their thinking. And if you are not currently 'using' said bat its presence alone could also be premeditation. So, here is what us old duffers who want to depend on a bat as our first choice in home defense (I don't) could do. Have a grandchild? Get a T-Ball bat, a suitable glove, a T-Ball stand and a ball. Now, everything is in place for the grand-kid to come over and play T-Ball with you. But, a home invasion or burglar comes by and the first thing you 'happen' to pickup to defend your home/family is the T-Ball bat. I know from experience and experimentation that I can hit the practice dummy as hard or harder with the T-Ball bat as with my PR-24 or my ASP. AND, there is no basis for premeditation.

I lived in Atlanta, GA and bought a Harley in New Jersey. I flew up without a handgun because I wasn't a LEO at the time. I bought a T-Ball Bat, Glove and gift card at the first Walmart I came across for one of my stepsons. I laughed all the way home. I didn't feel as secure as I would have if I had my CCW handgun, but better than with nothing. ........

I alternate between .410 and hollow points...

There is no perfect house gun,the one you can use and hit with will do,get there the first-est with the most-est. Be safe

IMO the best handgun for home defense is one that:

1. Has high capacity mags to limit reloads in a gun fight
2. Has a rail to allow for a weapon mounted light and laser
3. Everyone in the home can manage to shoot accurately

Not a tactical expert here, but these were my priorities when I chose a Gen 4 Glock 19 to fill the role.