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Old 12-20-2011, 05:13 PM
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Default Wallet Holster with trigger Finger Hole ???

This may have been covered before but did not turn anything up with 'Search'.

What is the legality of wallet holsters with trigger finger hole so you can shoot your firearm without removing it from the holster? I was always under impression this was not legal. Now see all kinds advertised. Is there a fine point in design that makes some of these now legal or are they pushing the edge?

I know pocket holsters and wallet holsters where you draw the firearm to fire are OK. I ofter pocket carry a .380 when I do not feel like IWB my Colt Defender, Colt CCO or a baby Glock.

Thanks
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Old 12-20-2011, 05:45 PM
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Try searching "AOW." (As in Any Other Weapon.)
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Old 12-20-2011, 06:10 PM
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Thanks on the AOW. Short search seems to say license/tax required much like I what I thought was the standard. Does not seem to be mentioned as an issue in all the new ads for this type holster.
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Old 12-20-2011, 07:19 PM
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I purchased one for my LCP...to me it is comfortable to hold...more so than the pistol without it. The ENTIRE SLIDE IS EXPOSED and only the frame of the pistol is covered and has two finger holes.

I cannot find anything in BATFE's website in regards to this type of holster falling into the AOW category...so I throw this out there to the forum.

Would this be considered an AOW?
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Old 12-20-2011, 07:29 PM
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Wallet holsters are illegal in California. I don't know about other jurisdictions, it is a state thing.
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Old 12-20-2011, 10:14 PM
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A good alternative is a pocket holster with an exposed trigger. This way, even if it comes out with the gun, you are good to go....
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Old 12-21-2011, 11:30 AM
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Pocket holster with exposed trigger defeats my purpose for a holster, firearm accidentally discharging. Might as well carry with no holster.

Apparently what seems to be the BATF ruling is if the firearm is disguised by the holster and can be fired without removing, it is an AOW. If the design exposes sufficient parts of the firearm to show it is a firearm (exposed slide, grip, etc) it is legal.

No guaranty your local LEO or BATF will agree on your particular wallet holster. I still do not like the idea of the exposed trigger on the wallet holster but might be less chance of AD in the back pocket compared to a loose front pocket where you might accidentally drop other things into that pocket.
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Old 12-21-2011, 02:22 PM
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Wxl, I think that you have correctly interpreted the batmen's position on the issue.
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Old 12-21-2011, 03:20 PM
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Default wallet holster

This area is a bit complicated. A pistol, to be a "pistol, under federal law, must also have a handle ("short stock") set at an angle to the barrel, and below the barrel. Therefore, the law currently does not define a pen gun as an NFA weapon because the gun is hinged, and the hinged portion is designed to be bent away from the barrel before it can fire. Thus, the hinged portion becomes the "Handle" which is set below, and at an angle to the barrel. In April 2005 when ATF applied to change the defination of "pistol" to eliminate pen guns, wallet guns, belt buckle guns, and pager guns, the chnage would affect 27 CFR 479.11, but to date - nothing's happened. Assuming your once legal firearm suddenly becomes an NFA weapon, you will have a grace period to register it as "any other weapon". So, for now, you're OK. To make it simple, if you have any weapon that discharges a shell by use of an explosive, the weapon can be concealed on your person, and that weapon does not hve the normal configuration of a pistol or revolver - it probably is "any other weapon" under federal law. Similiarly, a derringer that can be fired from within a concealing holster becomes "any other weapon" only when placed in such a holster, (wallet Gun), because the angled grip extending from the barrel is no longer visible. Same thing with a gun rigged to be discharged from inside a briefcase. As long as the handle is set at an angle slightly below the barrel. Even that slight angled grip to the barrel brought it within the definition of a pistol, according an ATF ruling. However, if the definition ever changes - it"s "any other weapon". So, if you have a derringer with a special wallet holster, are you illegal? Sort of! Once you put the two together ATF says you consider then as a "unit". The unit has now lost the "angled grip" it should have to be a pistol. You have a potential ten year federal felony! 26USC 5871. Hope this helps. It is a lot to digest and it is not worth the hassel.

Nick

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Old 12-23-2013, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hobby-gunsmith View Post
This area is a bit complicated. A pistol, to be a "pistol, under federal law, must also have a handle ("short stock") set at an angle to the barrel, and below the barrel. Therefore, the law currently does not define a pen gun as an NFA weapon because the gun is hinged, and the hinged portion is designed to be bent away from the barrel before it can fire. Thus, the hinged portion becomes the "Handle" which is set below, and at an angle to the barrel. In April 2005 when ATF applied to change the defination of "pistol" to eliminate pen guns, wallet guns, belt buckle guns, and pager guns, the chnage would affect 27 CFR 479.11, but to date - nothing's happened. Assuming your once legal firearm suddenly becomes an NFA weapon, you will have a grace period to register it as "any other weapon". So, for now, you're OK. To make it simple, if you have any weapon that discharges a shell by use of an explosive, the weapon can be concealed on your person, and that weapon does not hve the normal configuration of a pistol or revolver - it probably is "any other weapon" under federal law. Similiarly, a derringer that can be fired from within a concealing holster becomes "any other weapon" only when placed in such a holster, (wallet Gun), because the angled grip extending from the barrel is no longer visible. Same thing with a gun rigged to be discharged from inside a briefcase. As long as the handle is set at an angle slightly below the barrel. Even that slight angled grip to the barrel brought it within the definition of a pistol, according an ATF ruling. However, if the definition ever changes - it"s "any other weapon". So, if you have a derringer with a special wallet holster, are you illegal? Sort of! Once you put the two together ATF says you consider then as a "unit". The unit has now lost the "angled grip" it should have to be a pistol. You have a potential ten year federal felony! 26USC 5871. Hope this helps. It is a lot to digest and it is not worth the hassel.

Nick

1
So say you buy that neat little derringer holster at the gun show, one that looks like a wallet, had finger holes for firing, and is really a holster, now what?

If I understand your post, if you then go out and buy a derringer for your new holster, they become a "unit" when you put them together. The unit then becomes "any other weapon" and requires registration as such via BATFE Form 4 (assuming 4 is the correct form).

It would seem that if you own both pieces, better keep them far away from each other as in two seperate houses or some such, until such time as you have approval from the BATFE; vis a Form (? 4 ?).

Do I understand what you posted correctly? I also understand that the BATFE may interpret everything differenty depending on who you talk to.

rayb
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Last edited by rayb; 12-23-2013 at 11:52 AM.
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