Traffic Stop
 

Driving down town this morning on my way to the range, a traffic light turned yellow as i was just about under it. I went on through it and a state trooper lit me up. When i handed him my D.L. & Reg, i also handed him my cc permit. He asked if i had my firearm on me and i told him yes, its on my hip. He then asked if i would lay it on the passenger seat?? wth. I had kept my hands on the steering wheel the whole time. Then he asked if his partner could open the door and get my firearm. I guess i should have said no. His partner then took my gun, and they both went back to their cruzer for about ten min. Came back, gave me a warning ticket and the other trooper opened the pass. door and just threw my gun back on the seat. wth???? I need to read some more on WV. carry laws.

That's a bunch of ****

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I would like to think I would decline. Whether or not we like to admit it, it's hard to stand your ground on the matter. I lucked out in that the officer I handed my permit to replied "I don't need this" when I handed my permit to him the one time I've been in that sort of situation. I keep my mouth shut about it when I'm not in my home state(one of the few states I can reply "that's none of your business" if an officer asks)

I don't live in a state where I have to inform so I don't. I did once and it created a huge hasslr

I preface what I am about to say with the point that I am willing to be taken to jail.

If have not been pulled over while carrying, but I would certainly notify the LEO that I was. But also, I would specifically not consent to any searches or seizures. In other words, when he said, do you mind if the other office takes you gun, I would decline.

Andrew

Since I'm not required to inform a police officer that I'm carrying at a traffic stop, I don't. That'd just give them something else to harass me about.

In OK you have to inform the officer that you have a concelaed weapon when stopped. I always have and they have never asked to see or take my weapon from me. It has been a non issue for me.

By the time I retired (2001) CCW was not common place as it is now. On the few occasions I stopped a driver who informed me they were CCW, I asked to see their permit, and asked where the weapon was. I then asked/informed them to leave the weapon where it was, and we went about our business and everyone went home happy.

Perhaps I’m being naive but I just don’t see any reason to detain and perhaps harass someone who is in compliance with the law.

Georgia law does not require that I notify LE if I'm carrying in event of a traffic stop. But I would hand him/her my GA WCL along with my DL and registration.

Might have been a Training Officer showing a rookie how to run a gun through Dispatch to determine if it was stolen. I can't think of any other reason why they'd take the firearm. Check the law in your state, but IMO "asking" indicates to me that he didn't have valid probable cause to take possession, and needed consent.

Sadly, there are plenty examples of LEOs that do not hold the same view as you.

Andrew

If you didn't tell him you had a gun he wouldn't have made you remove it, he wouldn't have asked you to allow his partner to open your vehicle and take it, and he wouldn't have taken it back to his cruiser.

Why tell?

Each state is different, so this may not apply to WI. In TN, when they run your DL, they will know if the person has a carry permit. So once they know you may be armed, they will ask you if you are or not. If I am not carrying, then there is no issue. If I am, then I don't want ot lie and say that I am not.

So in order to preempt that whole conversation, if I am carrying, I will let them know ahead of time, as I sign of good will.

Andrew

Wi doesn't require notification, and I keep hearing all the BAD stories of letting the officer know.

How about I don't say anything, but if he asks or if he asks me to get out of the car, THEN I tell him I am armed and have a permit.

When he asks where it is, I'll say "Well officer, I have a 9 on my hip, a .380 in the cubby there, a .45 in the console, a rifle behind the rear seat, and a .38 in my pocket".

Think he'd call for backup or just be cool?


.

I can't say how any LEO will react, but if you tell him all that, he might freak! LOL

There have been plenty of cases of over-reaction in "gun friendly" states. I suspect that since CCW is relatively new in WI, that is causing some anxiety with LEOs.

When they run your DL, will they know that you have a carry permit?

Andrew

I don't know.... I'll have to look it up!

ETA: I checked, and Carry Permits are NOT accessible by a WI plate number. The police could ask the dispatcher to see if the owner has a permit, but they have to have a specific reason to ask.

He ran the serial number to see if it was stolen. Fishing.

That's correct checking if stolen. In WV if you have a WV CCW they already know when they run you tag before they get out of the car usually, the dispatcher will tell them you have a CCW. I hear it on the scanner all the time when they pull over a WV CCW licensee. Weather you are carrying on not they don't know , they may ask, may not. WV is also a open carry state. It sometimes creates a problem telling you are carrying but if you don't and a partner or them see it could raise their eyebrows. The call is yours WV is also a not required to notify state. You are not statutorily required to inform law enforcement you are carrying a weapon in the state of West Virginia.

If I was a cop I think I would have them leave it be. Or if its out ask them to clear it perhaps? Our ccw teacher said he always appreciates it when someone informs him they are carrying. No surprises makes everyone safer.

I would inform I think, especially if Im carrying on my hip. If you reach for your bill fold and his parter sees a gun on your hip... I would rather not have 40 sw bullet rattling around in my cranium.

Dads friend (ya one of those stories : p ) Said a state trooper almost put one in his head one day. Hes also law enforcement and was carrying a gun in his breifcase... with his ID... and forgot it was there. He reached over flipped the top up and heard a "Dont you Fing move" and had a gun to the side of his head.

I was stopped one night coming home late (after midnight) by a deputy sheriff. I gave him my DL, IC & CC permit. He asked me where was the gun. I said there is a .45 in the glove box. He asked could he see it. Went to the passanger side & took the pistol with him.
Came back after some time & said, "just as I though, it's yours. Like the engraving on it."
Gave me a warning & let me go.
Engraving was: Be not afraid of any man no matter what his size If danger threatens call on me and I will equalize

My God, why do we think cops are that trigger happy? So they see a gun. Lots of people have guns. It's a long way from on your hip to pulled and pointed in your direction...

And why would cops think everyone wants to shoot them anyway? Everyone who carries a permit is willing to kill a cop to get out of a speeding ticket?

Are cops that jumpy at a shooting range too? Everyone is carrying a gun.... :confused:

When the state of IOWA passed the Shall Issue law in 2008 they specifically included that you DO NOT have to notify the officer(s) if you have a weapon. The CCW database will NOT be linked to the drivers license database.

A permit to carry a weapon has nothing to do with a license to drive a motor vehicle................

Don't complicate things by telling information that is not relevant to the process at hand.

I knew that here in WV. that i did not have to inform them that i was armed, i've heared that its the courteus thing to do. It will not happen again. Lesson learned!

In WA you do have to tell them if you have a gun if stopped.... :(

West Virginia.

Some states require you to notify a officer that you are carrying some don't know the laws of the states you are traveling in it could save you a lot of problems. If you don't notify in a must notify state and they decide to do a search legal or illegal you a** could be in for a world of hurt. Sure maybe you could sue but it will cost you and all you would have to have done is keep hands on steering wheel, officer approaches, "officer I have a CCW I'm carrying, it is on my hip or whever you carry, where my license is how would you like me to proceed.” (also notice I didn't say any of the bad words, gun, firearm, weapon, explosive, rocket launcher, cannon, etc) or don’t tell in states that require notification and take a chance. Some officers on this forum have stated they wanted to know some said they didn't decision is up to you, and the laws of the state your in. Non notify state I wouldn't tell unless they ask me to get out of vehicle.

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Master Chief, what leads you to believe that? I know of no such statute.

This is exactly what happened to me the one time i was
stopped and approached by an officer while carrying.
I handed over registration and when i was getting my DL
out of my wallet he noticed my carry permit. He asked if I
had a weapon in the truck and i said i did, in the console.
He then very politely asked me to not reach into the console
while he was present. No problem.
These guys are just trying to stay alive.
I fully understand that.

Chuck

I may be wrong on that but it seems safer that taking a chance.
Only 3 times in the last 20+ years & all the time it has worked out OK for me. Then again having a SP card & NRA & Navy retired stickers on the back window may have also helped....:)

In SC we are required to present our CWP with our license only if we are carrying on our person. That lets the officer know you are carrying . If it is in the console we do not have to notify the officer. Depending on the situation I might be inclined to inform the officer of the presence of a firearm to avoid a problem. Either way my hands remain on the wheel and if at night the interior light is on. They just want to go home to their family after their shift. Its a tough job and everyone they stop is not a law abiding citizen.

Ive been pulled over once. I have tinted windows in my car. The state trooper had his holster unsnapped and hand on his gun while walking up to the window. What would have happened if I had been carrying and reached towards a gun? Or opened the glove box and had a gun sitting under my registration and insurance info?

I dont blame him at all. I could have had a gun pointed at him through the window waiting for him to get closer or had a passenger in the back seat doing the same thing. What ever makes the police feel safer and get home to their families Im alright helping out a little.

Haven't been lit up yet so I do not know what rection I will get, however most LEO'S in my area that I talk to are pretty understanding. It is however the law in N C you must inform. Don't know if it comes up when they run you plate but it certainly does when they run your Lic. since your premit No.and DL No. are the same.

FL is not a "must notify" state, and, if I were to be stopped, I would not notify unless asked to exit the vehicle (and I've never been asked to exit a vehicle for any stop).

As for traveling through other states, I don't try to memorize which ones are/aren't must notify. If I were to get stopped, I'd notify. Easier than forgetting which one requires.

I would, of course suggest that if your state/local laws require you to make an officer aware you are armed, then you should comply. What concerns me more is the sloppy gun handling described at the conclusion of the traffic stop when the officer returned the pistol by tossing into the front seat. I do not know what various departments are teaching in terms of encountering a CCW holder during a traffic stop, but there are already tools in the LE tool box for dealing with an armed suspect in a car once it is determined that the traffic violator is more than just a guy or gal driving with his/her head up some other place. Asking someone to place a pistol on the passenger seat during a traffic stop must makes the gun that much more accessible in my opinion.

I recall years ago a co-worker with an agency I worked for got stopped in an official vehicle for some traffic infraction. The co-worker identified him/herself as LE, and that the unmarked vehicle was LE. The next question was, "are you armed?" "Yes." "Well place the weapon on the roof of the car and get back in."

MI is a shall disclose state. I don't react any differently when I stop someone with a CPL, and unless there is a really good chance that I will be arresting them or they are acting weird I never disarm them. I would much rather everybody's pistol stays in the holster then have a bunch of weapons out.

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Actually, it is not that "long" once one considers that "action beats reaction". Cops are taught that they always have to be ready for a conflict, for a lot of other also valid reasons.

I'd be hesitant to seek to disarm a person on a traffic stop, for a lot of good reasons, not the least of which is it pisses people off for no good reason. While we have solid case law about the lawful ability to disarm a person during a Terry stop for a crime, I would not argue extending that to a traffic stop unless it is criminal traffic (a traffic stop, even for what we call an infraction here, is technically a Terry stop).

The other thing that scares me is that a lot of cops are so ignorant of firearms that they will do stupid stuff. The worst I ever heard of was of an officer from an agency that has delusions of adequacy who for some reason took a 1911 off a driver and then came back and told the driver that the decocker did not work.:eek:

A friend at that agency told me he found that story believable due to their poor training on the law and the fact that they were at the time stuck with an issue sidearm with a slide mounted safety/decocker along with other heinous ergonomic traits.

I think that would have generated an IA complaint if I had been the driver, for a lot of reasons.

Doug thats exactly why I prefer everybodys pistols stay in the holster. I used to work with a guy that always wanted to take possession on a traffic stop. He ended up touching off a round trying to clear a citizens pistol. I know many cops who would do the same thing if handed a 1911.

I got stopped in CO by a Sheriff and I DIDN'T tell (didn't know I had to) and when he came back after running my license, he was hugging the side of my Explorer like he was on Mission Impossible. : ) He barked about me not telling him I was armed. I said I didn't know I was supposed to tell and that was that. They have computers, so if you're supposed to inform, better do it.

In OR I hand the CC with the papers and it's never been an issue. They never want to see it. They just ask where it is.

I would also decline. If they want my gun they can arrest or detain me. Then deal with the consequences.

No way I'm touching my gun in the presence of police officers for any reason.

Not the smartest rock in the box but when did they start putting de-cockers on 1911 models? What did I miss?

That was the point. LEO was a dullard who should have been detailed to the replica gun squad.

It seems there is so many of those. They normally end up as SGT's or Executives.

I have many co-workers I wouldn't trust with sharp eating utensils.

#1: dont go under yellow lights.
#2:dont offer info you dont need to.

Police officers dont care about permits. There is a reason they carry a gun. Alot of speculation in the replies. How many of them carried a badge everyday? Cops definitely have a reason to be a little jumpy with or without a permit in hand. Unless you live in a state that says you must inform, dont. Makes for a better transaction. We are law abiding citizens rights? Apparently not if you got lit up and pulled over.

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I prefer the INFORM route over not telling them. Last thing I want is their gun in my face because they see my pistol(s) during a traffic stop or some other legal interaction.

I have twice declared concealed weapons and twice I had NO PROBLEM with the officer, one of them being today as I managed to inadvertently trespass on federal prison property. The first time was a state trooper, he did take my pistol but it was for his safety until he was done giving me a $110.00 ticket for speeding. At no time have I had issues or problems with law enforcement, then again the first thing I do after first interaction is declare my weapon.

These videos you see on the internet are in typically bating police into a confrontation or people not declaring their weapon from the beginning like they should regardless if they are required to or not. If the officer is being an *** then be as professional as possible and deal with him through his superiors later. If I would've acted like I see some of the YouTube hero's I would have been arrested for both trespassing and federal weapons crime since I was concealed on federal property.

Basically what I'm trying to say is keep your cool, declare your weapon(s) and fully cooperate with police and give them the utmost respect regardless of how they treat you. If they get out of line the law will take care of them.

panhandle, did you ever find out what the law says about them taking your gun like that? These state laws already have cleared you to carry a concealed weapon. When they ask you to give up that weapon, it is like they are saying they don't really respect your rights.

I'd rather err on the side of respect for the LEO.. to help take a few degrees of tension out of the stop. Sounds like there are more than a few "Barneys" out there, but the CPL/CCW gives you a cleared legal status to carry. I think its also wise to drive a bit more on the conservative side when carrying. Your response and attitude often has a lot to do with how things turn out. Also appreciated the advice we got in CPL class about NOT storing a fire arm in the glove box with your insurance and registration!!

To Trauma1, I did'nt break the law, i was past the point of no return as the light turned as i was under it. LEO was just a jerk. I have a very clean driving record and we have all been pulled over,including you!

No, have not found any material on the laws of that nature. I did talk to a city cop and he said in the last 6 months there have been 6 LEO related shootins here in this county.

About every person a warden encounters is armed especialy durring hunting season. While probley a few have been killed in the last 100 years its super rare.

Ive always thought that could be a very stressful job at times... but they are usually not the ones pulling people over in the middle of the night or walking into dark alley ways looking for bad guys either.