If someone were to be involved in a self defense shooting and was carrying two firearms but only used one in the shooting, would both firearms be confiscated? To take it a step further, could firearms at home in the safe be taken also? I'm guessing lots of variables (location, blame, what judge...) will have lots of different results. Just curious.

Stay safe, John

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Luke 23:34

There is a different answer to that question(s) for every different jurisdiction and every potential scenario.

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

Let's keep this simple. You're right about variables, including these:

First, a lot depends on how clear the self defense shooting was. For simplicity, let's say very clear.

Second, a lot depends on the jurisdiction you're in, your local police chief and district attorney, etc. But let's assume a very clear, justifiable case of self defense. You don't have a judge to deal with if the police don't arrest you. You don't have a judge to deal with if you go to the station house for questioning and then they send you home. It's still a law enforcement issue, not a courtroom issue, not unless the DA goes for an indictment.

BUT!

If you're involved in a self defense shooting, I suppose you can be circumspect and speak to the officers on the scene and if they send you home and say come back to the station house in the morning you can skip comments about your hidden gun - I wouldn't, but if you think you're going home you might get away with that unless they ask you - in which case do not lie. The problem lies in the fact that LEOs take a very dim view of "handling" someone who is armed and they don't know it. If you go to the precinct you're probably facing an electronic entry so you'll have to "fess up" eventually. If you're going to show up "tomorrow" then you can gamble but I wouldn't. That's just me. I can replace the two guns I'm carrying and I'd rather not have "P---oed" police officers to deal with.

If the shooting is justified they'll likely never ask you what other guns you own but even if they do they're not coming to your house to get them. The other guns were "not involved" so they are legally irrelevant. Your second gun is not really involved, either, but why irritate the LEOs? Further, if they do arrest you because you turned out to be a jerkwad and didn't reveal the other gun they WILL very likely confiscate your other weapons at home.

The only case I am aware of that I can relate to was in Dallas, the shooter was justified but fled, got himself arrested, had all of his guns confiscated, and after being "no billed" he had to pay a lawyer to fight for the return of his other weapons.

The rest is not written in any statute, just the custom of the LEOs to take weapons from shooters. Be nice to cops and they'll be nice to you.

***GRJ***

Kind of expected to be in muddy waters on this one, thanks for the responses. If my or those I care about lives were saved I could care less about anything I own, ultimately.

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Luke 23:34

Truer words are rarely spoken. You can replace all of those guns.....

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Just so you know, have you ever seen that scenario in a movie or a TV show when someone, anyone, who is not clearly one of "them" has a gun, and at least one cop sees it and shouts, "GUN!!!" and everyone draws and points weapons at the
poor, good guy whom they do not recognize? That's what you're asking for if they find a gun on you that you didn't disclose. If the smoke settled and you won the fight it's time to cooperate, not the opposite.

***GRJ***

Probably both would be seized. What's really shameful is the number of people in LE and prosecution who do not understand that the firearm is not evidence in an intentional discharge. An armorer level inspection will show that there is no defect (for the negligent shooting claim, or the unprepared doofus who did exactly what he should have and fired for effect but is then so startled that s/he says something stupid), and it should generally be returned. Some of that will vary by local political climate, of course, since in some places there is no ability comprehend that the shooting was good and they'll make an arrest and the prosecutor will file as a matter of course.

Even then, it is not evidence, but can't be returned due to the charge. (Federal prohibition on possession if one is charged with a felony or a DV.) A reasoned reading of the evidence rules shows that the firearm itself cannot be evidence, but weak academic lawyers don't get that. It is not mere malpractice, but misconduct to assert otherwise, and any command officer who takes such a position with an officer's firearm should be fired for incompetence. This is not complex.

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NHI, 10-8.

This is a distillation of the best advice I’ve heard on this topic over the years.

Getting arrested after a SD incident isn't the big deal, getting convicted is. Here are some things you can do to help protect yourself.

Before A Shooting Occurs
The last thing you want is some huge post count anywhere on the net in which every other post is about how you will have no mercy on BGs. Watch the content of your posts.

When A Shooting Occurs
The best advice I've gotten from these threads is that your hands had better be spotless you had better not have done anything to escalate the situation and it would be best that the local cops not have a half dozen "Man W/ a gun" incident reports on you.
Comport yourself accordingly

Post Shooting

Best advice I've heard
1. Call the police

2. Report the Shooting W/out implicating yourself (“There was" not” I did")

3. Do NOT have the gun in you hand when the cops show up

4. Give the cops a victim statement “He attacked me I was forced to shoot"

5. Get checked out by EMS

6. you're pressed for a statement tell the cops that you're really shook up right now & that you'd like some time to confer with your lawyer before making a statement.

Odds are the police will take you into custody. Once you’re in custody make a short “I’m the victim statement” IE “Officer that man tried to kill me, I was forced to shoot in self defense”. Tell them you’d really like EMS to check you out (You’ll need it anyway) and that you really want to cooperate but you need time to get your wits about you and you’d like to consult your attorney, then shut up.

If they really try to push you into making a statement get concerned, at that point you really need to calmly and firmly assert your rights. If at any point in the proceedings they Mirandize you, go into full defense mode and do not say another word without your lawyer present.

After you have consulted your lawyer have him prepare a statement and give that to the police at no time should you agree to an interview of any kind with out your attorney present.

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Retired Career Security Guard

I would immediately call my girl friend and not answer any questions by law enforcement until she arrived. No matter how justified the shoot. I would follow the advice of the dean of Harvard law and not answer question us without an attorney, if interviewed by law enforcement even if innocent. My girl friend is attorney.
O

Can you please cite any actual case law to confirm this. Just curious as I have never heard this asserted as logic or legal argument anywhere.

Call an attorney and get checked out medically to include a blood test for alcohol and drugs. Retention of your gun will be the last of you potential problems but I would expect it to be returned after the local prosecutor makes a final decision on the legality of the shooting if declared justified. If the shooting is borderline, the prosecutor may present to a grand jury which gives him an out for not charging upfront.

I agree - I have no idea what this means:

Every firearm involved in a shooting is evidence. Any firearm ancillary to a shooting is not evidence with respect to the shooting but is evidence for a lot of other reasons.

There is a lot of good advice above and plenty on this Forum. Someday one of us is going to be involved in a shooting - there are thousands of members. It's statistical; it has to happen. If you act like a jerkyou'll be treated like a jerk. If you have written posts claiming the fact that you're the best gunsel this side of the Mississippi and can't wait to get mugged so you can plug the perp you'll pay for such language.

As for me, the last thing I EVER want is to be involved in a shooting or even anywhere near a shooting. I might be prepared but preparation is for when TSHTF - far better to avoid that situation by being alert, know who is around you, know where you are, and behave.

But if it happens I'm back to what I said earlier - don't be a jerk, and do cooperate with the police. Watch what you say but don't lie, don't make stuff up, don't whine and make excuses, act like an adult and expect to get treated like an adult.

Life is simple when you do that.

***GRJ***

Apparently the guy in Montana who was just convicted of murdering the German exchange student had previously posted about sitting up nights and laying a trap for the kids who were breaking into garages. Not to say he would have walked free, but it sure didn't win him any votes in the jury room.

Don't forget some states require you to notify LE you are carrying a firearm when you show you license, both vehicle and CCW. Which I'm sure you will have to do after a shooting. Once they know you have another firearm on you I'm sure they will tell you what they want you to do with it. Also with all the shooting to protect yourself threads that have gone around one thing that has hardly come up is protect the scene. You don't want a BG's friend removing evidence. You never can trust a BG's acquaintance not to remove evidence and without a weapon present you may be in more trouble then you think.

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Psalm 23:4

Depending on an infinite number of unknown factors in this situation, very likely any and all guns on your person will be taken control of until officers can make an assessment on the situation. Regarding your firearms in home safe how in the world would they even know you have them?? For me if I'm involved in a self defense situation I will immediately exercise my rights and insist on speaking to attorney without exception. This simply protects me from any misinterpretation of what actually happened.

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Regards
Paul

I've been doing writing and teaching on legal aspects of use of force for quite a while now (first article was published ... 30 years ago, more or less). My co-author does a lot of work with both agencies and plaintiffs, and I assist him with the legal aspects of such things as I can. The amount of both ignorance (on both legal and technical issues) and intentional misconduct directed at officers at the manager/executive levels in LE is staggering. I've had to correct, rather brutally, more than one low functioning soup sandwich with stars on his collar and delusions of adequacy. As for lawyers, I'd be surprised if there as many as 2000 in the whole U.S. who actually know enough about use of force to have a valid opinion, let alone litigate a case.

I wrote this elsewhere a couple of years ago. At that time, the commentary from Nyeti written on a forum now closed was itself a couple of years old. Yes, it is the same Nyeti who posts here under that name. He is very savvy and has a lot of experience in investigating OIS(es). I am leaving out the direct/quoted commentaries from he and others because a) such is not generally allowed here, and b) I don't have permission to post them.

"Nyeti wrote a great analysis of this on another forum a couple of years ago. After reading it, I gave some consideration to the evidence rules, specifically those pertaining to relevance. (ER 401, 402, and maybe 403.)

ER 401:"Relevant evidence" means evidence having any tendency to make the existence of any fact that is of consequence to the determination of the action more probable or less probable than it would be without the evidence.

ER 402: All relevant evidence is admissible, except as limited by constitutional requirements or as otherwise provided by statute, by these rules, or by other rules or regulations applicable in the courts of this state. Evidence which is not relevant is not admissible.

ER 403: Although relevant, evidence may be excluded if its probative value is substantially outweighed by the danger of unfair prejudice, confusion of the issues, or misleading the jury, or by considerations of undue delay, waste of time, or needless presentation of cumulative evidence.

Having done so, I concluded he was right. The condition of the firearm at the time of the shooting should be addressed by a complete armorer/forensic exam that is done promptly. As long as there is no issue with the function of the weapon(s), and the projectiles are properly connected to any involved weapon(s), the actual firearm will not address any issue that needs to be proven. As Nyeti noted, the few cases where there may be an issue should be evident pretty quickly, but they will be rare. More than 2 working days to conduct that analysis and return the firearm is approaching clownshoe level. Retaining a firearm for some stupid period and having it damaged as a result is a good way to create department liability for that damage."

(Condition at the time matters in case of a subsequent allegation of negligence. Having been documented, the value of the firearm itself as evidence is nil in an intentional shooting, as there will be no question as to who fired, from what firearm, etc that cannot be proven without the firearm.)

A further response from my later in the string:
"The problem here is that like many aspects of legal stuff for LE, there is a mix of technical knowledge and legal knowledge that impact the way things are or should be done. Communication between people with those skill sets is often poor, at best. Anything to do with use of force tends to really show the disconnect, and most lawyers are clueless; even prosecutors. Also, as noted by other posters, logistics/resources can play a part. The lab here is so underfunded that anything that gets done in a timely manner is damned near a miracle. (I had a firearms exam I needed for a case and the ETA for results was about 9 months after the expiration of the time for trial. The examiner had NO CLUE of the time limits - not his fault. Like most of LE, the training for cops and these lab folks about the realities of trial tends to be on the far side of poor.) My best guess is that an appropriate exam for these purposes can be conducted in a couple of hours, depending on the platform, but I'll want for someone more savvy on such to chime in; maybe I'll contact a firearms examiner I used in a recent trial who did a hell of a job for us and ask him, if I get time this week.

Rules of Evidence: Being as I am in Washington, I use the links from the Washington Courts' website: "www.courts.wa.gov". On the left side of the page is a collection of links, one of which is court rules. On that page, look for rules of general application; the ERs are on the bottom of the list as I recall. (This is one of the websites I have saved on my issued iPad for use in court; the link to the jury instructions helped me out a LOT in a trial a few days ago while we argued about a specific jury instruction the defense sought.)

I am pretty sure one can easily find via Google the Federal Rules of Evidence; most of the states and the Feds model on each other since we are talking about a couple thousand years of evolution from Roman times through Anglo-Saxon jurisprudence. I'd guess that in any given state the RoE are in the rules of court. Often you will find that a law professor or other serious nerd has written a state practice specific treatise with annotations; I carry my copy of Tegland's Washington practice commentaries to trials. Any variation from state to state, and from the Feds, will be modest at most, and a decent commentary will show any difference between the ones applicable to your state and any more typical rule."

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NHI, 10-8.