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  #51  
Old 03-09-2015, 06:50 PM
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Looks pretty good to me Phil...
When ya gonna do the 3Yd, 5Yd and 10Yd parts?
(Ducking for cover...)
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  #52  
Old 03-09-2015, 07:17 PM
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I has been too cold and nasty here to get out and play. But, I found this B34 REV target that I shot at a local indoor shoot in 2008. S&W m60 , 10 shots, 10 yds., standing, two hands, double action.
The 10 ring measures 2"x 3".
I know the one shot got a bit wide. But I'm old and can't see as good as I use to. Does that count ?

If it ever warms up here. I'll get out and play the game.
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Old 03-09-2015, 08:16 PM
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I just got home from work and this was the first thread I looked at. I'm very excited to see that at least a few are trying it.

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Originally Posted by RobzGuns View Post
The 1st target was shot 'cold' (no Warm Up).
For the record, I shot my target "cold" too. This is how it is normally done at the class. I'm not opposed to allowing a warm-up, but I haven't ever done that and no one has asked to. So, to be as accurate a representation of what happens in my class as I could, my target was the first 20 shots I took that day.

I'm impressed with the targets I've seen so far. This is good shooting, all of you. Yes, all of those hits will stop the bad guy.

Phil, I've shot an LCP before. I'm pretty sure I couldn't keep in on the paper at 7 yards. He's right, that gun has a ridiculous trigger and little bumps on the slide that are Ruger's excuse for sights. To get a group like that with that gun is very good shooting indeed. I'd like to see what you could do with a different gun and actually shooting the whole course of fire.

Protected One,
I'm not surprised at the number of participants. The weather over in the East is really horrible so, that's a factor. Also, most aren't used to this style of shooting. This is the self-defense forum after all. And, we all have lives beyond this forum. It will take a little while for some of us to filter our way to the range.


While there has been some good shooting posted, no one has beat me yet!
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Old 03-09-2015, 08:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Rastoff View Post
A police officer that doesn't have access to a range? That's just wrong on so many levels.

Thanks for posting the qualification test. I'd just like to see guys do the one in the OP first. Then we can move on to other tests.
*
Retired. I would not be doing a LEOSA qual if I weren't; I'd still be doing the duty qual. This is the BUG/Covert course I think they call it.

From the ready, yeah, that's imperfect and your concerns are reasonable, but i think the underlying assumption is that especially for a BUG course, that at distance one would have drawn. I am not sure that's a valid assumption.

Yes, I do it cold.
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Old 03-10-2015, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rastoff View Post
I'm impressed with the targets I've seen so far. This is good shooting, all of you. Yes, all of those hits will stop the bad guy.

Protected One,
I'm not surprised at the number of participants. The weather over in the East is really horrible so, that's a factor. Also, most aren't used to this style of shooting. This is the self-defense forum after all. And, we all have lives beyond this forum. It will take a little while for some of us to filter our way to the range.


While there has been some good shooting posted, no one has beat me yet!
I'm sure you're right about the weather (although an attack could occur in cold weather too).

It doesn't take much prodding to get me out to the range - regardless to weather. And a "challenge" is MORE than sufficient!

Coming soon: The target that beats Rastoffs
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Old 03-10-2015, 02:48 PM
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i need to get to the range soon to try this out as it looks like fun (great idea Rastoff). Not worried about weather as i shoot indoors this time of year and the range is close by; just finding the time to sneak over is a hurdle lol.
I'm pretty confident considering my skill level up to the 7yd area (last weekend at that distance I ran a mag full from my 9c and all rounds ended up in a 1.5"x2" spot) but 10 yds and beyond the old eyes seem to play tricks on me and all bets are off.
Well, i'll gladly post my results once done, good or bad i always like to hear input here which help this newbie get better.
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Old 03-10-2015, 03:46 PM
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Thank you for the challenge. I followed the protocol for shots and distance. I just put a laser sight on it today. I adjusted the laser to the sights on the gun and took it outside in the bright daylight. No problems seeing the dot until 10 yards, I thought the battery was dying. Then I could not find the dot at all, so I started at my feet and went up to the target with the dot. Sights on the gun were showing WAY over there. I didn't fire the last round. Maybe I can do it with 20 shots and Iron sights.

Target should say 19 shots.

Colt Lightweight Officers ACP 3.5" 200 gr 845 fps.

David

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Old 03-10-2015, 04:20 PM
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Cool. This looks like fun.
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Old 03-10-2015, 06:36 PM
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The weather got less cold enough for me to go out and try this a little. I'm a bit embarrassed to show my sorry targets. Using my model 10 I shot DA with a two handed hold at a little over 7 yards. As you can tell, my accuracy is just about the width of the paper. And this was my first time out since a couple of months. The right target was done at somewhere at about 5 yards. I only had two rounds left so I decided to try something different. I walked(trudged. Little over ankle deep snow) away from the target then I turned, drew and fired them by just pointing and not using the sights. Both barely made it onto the paper, but did manage to get two hits. Ill definitely give longer distances a try sometime.
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Old 03-10-2015, 09:05 PM
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Quote:
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I didn't fire the last round.
I'm sorry you didn't take that last shot. The group you posted is dangerously close to what I put up in the OP. I didn't actually measure my group with a ruler. I honestly didn't think anyone would post a group that was inside the orange. Based on knowing the size of the center and making a quick measurement off that, I can tell that my group is right at 2". Drop that top most hole and yours is better. Excellent shooting my friend.

What's better, and more impressive, is your honesty. With that group you could have said that you fired all 20 shots and no one would have questioned you. You sir, can shoot with me any time.
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Old 03-10-2015, 09:08 PM
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Comming soon: The target that beats Rastoffs
Bring it on brotha! I don't think you can do it. That's right, I said it. Whatcha gonna do 'bout it?
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Old 03-10-2015, 09:26 PM
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Thank you for the kind words. You have inspired me to find a few B27 and re enter with a model 15-3 combat masterpiece or use the irons on the 45.

This is a blast!

David
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Old 03-10-2015, 09:58 PM
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Hey, Mr. Rastoff!

As you may have noticed, I usually enjoy supporting your forum challenges.

Most Tuesdays, several of us "older" guys share a morning session at the Pima Pistol Club shooting rifles at 100 yards. I only have one rifle, an M1 Garand, but I usually shoot at least a couple of 8 round clips of my own 30-06 hand loads, clean the barrel, and then head home. Admittedly, the camaraderie is the biggest attraction.

But, today I have to start with an apology. I was excited enough about "the challenge" to print out your first post planning to follow the instructions to make an entry, but somehow the printout did not make it to the range with my gear and my aging memory cells did not retain much detail from my quick read the prior evening.

In the spirit of participating, I walked over to a nearby pistol range with my favorite "bicycle gun", a Kahn PM40, and a box of .40 S&W JHP. Absent the instructions, I only fired two six-round magazines rapidly at 10 yards.

I have no excuses. We reliably have temperatures in the mid to upper seventies this time of year. Arizona's sunshine is justifiably famous for reliability year round and tomorrow will probably reach eighty degrees.



Today's targets appear above. If this thread survives long enough, I will try again.
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Old 03-10-2015, 09:59 PM
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After my cataract surgery next month I'll try it with my Glock mod 22 with Ameriglo TCAPs.
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Old 03-10-2015, 10:12 PM
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Quote:
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Today's targets appear above. If this thread survives long enough, I will try again.
Good shooting TucsonMTB. Rest assured, the thread will live on. I look forward to the next target.
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Old 03-10-2015, 11:41 PM
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No chance I'll beat Rastoff, but I'll qualify just the same with my cataracts and arthritis. B27 & I will meet Thursday night at the range. Still debating VP9 vs C3 (.45 1911). Depends on how bad I'm willing to hurt Friday ;(
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Old 03-11-2015, 06:59 AM
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Shooting in my driveway. A LOT of snow has gone already. I was shooting this match in the afternoon when I heard a diesel engine. I turned around and it was the school bus. There I stood firing at the targets. I stopped, he drove away.





This was taken from the 7 yard line. Those were the first 10 shots of 19.


I like a challenge, I will be doing this one again.

David

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Old 03-11-2015, 07:51 AM
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Quote:
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Bring it on brotha! I don't think you can do it. That's right, I said it. Whatcha gonna do 'bout it?
What???? ...I didn't say it was coming from ME...I just said it was coming soon! Sike!!! I am going to the range on saturday, so enjoy your few remaining days as owner of the best target.
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Old 03-11-2015, 02:32 PM
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What???? ...I didn't say it was coming from ME...I just said it was coming soon! Sike!!! I am going to the range on saturday, so enjoy your few remaining days as owner of the best target.
HAHAHAHAHA! I ain't a skeert o you! I still say you can't do it.

I'm so confident, I'm putting this shirt on the line:


It is brand new. I just had the logo added last week. This one is size large, but I'll have another made if you need a different size. This goes for anyone on this forum who posts a group better than mine. The stipulations are already posted in the OP. It's on your honor so, just follow the spirit of the challenge and this could be yours.

Edit: I only have one so, the best group wins.
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Old 03-11-2015, 04:36 PM
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This is gonna be fun. Going out on snowshoes to shoot the match way out back.

David
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Old 03-11-2015, 06:36 PM
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HAHAHAHAHA! I ain't a skeert o you! I still say you can't do it.

I'm so confident, I'm putting this shirt on the line:


It is brand new. I just had the logo added last week. This one is size large, but I'll have another made if you need a different size. This goes for anyone on this forum who posts a group better than mine. The stipulations are already posted in the OP. It's on your honor so, just follow the spirit of the challenge and this could be yours.

Edit: I only have one so, the best group wins.


You better hang on to that shirt for at least a week 'til I get my Range Officer back from the 'smith.(I'll need an XL)
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Old 03-11-2015, 06:39 PM
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I blew it.

About a dozen shots the laser went haywire again. One target over, twice in a row same spot.
I called crimson trace today and they had already given me a return authorization number and said they would fix it.


So I used the irons and ... welll... the jerk behind the trigger.. 2 1/4 X 3 1/2. The black is 3"



It was about shot # 17. Then the pressure was off.

I was holding on the X with laser and 6:00 with irons.

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Old 03-11-2015, 06:48 PM
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This is the Texas CHL course of fire:

https://www.dps.texas.gov/RSD/CHL/Li...QualCourse.pdf

I, too, am a CHL instructor. Last time I took this test was with a 9mm SIG SP-2022 pistol and a rare S&W M10 HB .357 Magnum revolver. I scored 246 with the pistol and 250 with the revolver, my first perfect score. Can I submit those for this challenge!!!!

***GRJ***
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Old 03-11-2015, 07:39 PM
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Quote:
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HAHAHAHAHA! I ain't a skeert o you! I still say you can't do it.

I'm so confident, I'm putting this shirt on the line:


It is brand new. I just had the logo added last week. This one is size large, but I'll have another made if you need a different size. This goes for anyone on this forum who posts a group better than mine. The stipulations are already posted in the OP. It's on your honor so, just follow the spirit of the challenge and this could be yours.
J
Edit: I only have one so, the best group wins.
Hehehe. As the bodyguard said to the son of the Russian mob boss who had just said he wasn't skerrt of John Wick...."You should be!"

Size XL please, and I already know which pants I'll be wearing it with. Just put it aside for a day or two - I'm going to the range TOMORROW!!!
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Old 03-11-2015, 07:52 PM
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That shirt is my color and size. All I gotta do is.......

I looked up gauntlet. Stay tuned. I picked it up.

David
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Old 03-11-2015, 08:42 PM
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Shooting in my driveway. A LOT of snow has gone already.
I don't think there is this much snow on the ground at the North Pole in the middle of March!
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Old 03-11-2015, 09:56 PM
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Can I submit those for this challenge!!!!

***GRJ***
You may submit those for this challenge. However, realize that a perfect score on a B-27 won't necessarily beat my group. Remember, my group fit completely inside the center oval. Did your score do that?

Don't fret though. I have another idea and will do that this weekend.
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Old 03-12-2015, 12:43 PM
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Old 03-12-2015, 04:53 PM
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I will give it a go later but can only shoot as close as 7 yards at my range, so I'll split my shots between 7 & 10 yards.
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Old 03-12-2015, 05:39 PM
AnthemBassMan AnthemBassMan is offline
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I'm gonna have to try this gauntlet challenge sometime. Here's a target I shot a few weeks ago. This is approx 80 rounds through a Glock 19, 26, and my SD40VE. There was some spraying going on, but the most time between shots was Maybe two seconds. And there was some rapid fire shots going on here and there. But these will tighten up with more range time.



L8R,
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Old 03-12-2015, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
The course of fire is:
  • 4 shots from 3 yards
  • 6 shots from 5 yards
  • 6 shots from 7 yards
  • 4 shots from 10 yards
I will do this on my next range trip. But why 4/6/6/4? It's very unfriendly to snubbies; 5/5/5/5 would be much simpler.
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Old 03-12-2015, 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Waywatcher View Post
I will do this on my next range trip. But why 4/6/6/4? It's very unfriendly to snubbies; 5/5/5/5 would be much simpler.
HEY, Shshhhh. That last target I posted, the 4 shots out of the group were from 10 yards (the last 4) and now you want to make it 5?

Love my model 15. Maybe I should try it with the model 25 next.

David
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Old 03-12-2015, 10:09 PM
schgsd schgsd is offline
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Haven't been able to run across any B27 targets locally. So I created this just now. The inner ring is regulation 2" x 3" per the challenge. Print full size to 8 1/2" x 11" paper.
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Old 03-12-2015, 10:38 PM
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I will do this on my next range trip. But why 4/6/6/4? It's very unfriendly to snubbies; 5/5/5/5 would be much simpler.
Unless you have a K snub!
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Old 03-12-2015, 10:55 PM
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Update: Got a couple more shots off this week. Hope to be done Sunday.
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Old 03-12-2015, 11:11 PM
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I will do this on my next range trip. But why 4/6/6/4? It's very unfriendly to snubbies; 5/5/5/5 would be much simpler.
You know, I discovered this in my very first class, but then forgot about it. One of my students had an LCR. Because there were other students in the class, I just had him load one extra round at 5 and 7 yards.

If you want to shoot 5, 5, 5, 5, it's OK with me.

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Haven't been able to run across any B27 targets locally. So I created this just now. The inner ring is regulation 2" x 3" per the challenge. Print full size to 8 1/2" x 11" paper.
Thanks for that. This makes a standardized target that anyone can use. Of course, any group is fine as long as it's measured. properly.

Now, David R has picked up the gauntlet with a vengeance. David, you have made me get out my ruler. Your first group was close enough to make me get out the "power" tools.

First I broke out an actual target and measured the orange with better precision:
The height is 2 15/16"


The width is 2 1/16"


Then I got out the computerized group measuring tool:

Here's my group:


Here's David's:

(Ignore the MOA indication. It is invalid because of the changing distances. The group size is what it is, but MOA is calculated based on distance.)

The proper way to measure a group is center to center. This eliminates any caliber bias. As you can see, David is dangerously close to beating me. His group is 1.73" while mine is 1.68". Without the resolution the computer aide gives us, they can't be told apart.

So, as you can see, it can be done. Now, someone DO IT!!
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Old 03-12-2015, 11:31 PM
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I went to the range tonight. First trip since a major overhaul to my trifocal prescription, arthritis is kicking me while I'm down, new chemo started yesterday.

Did good for an almost-dead old fart, but not good enough to make any challenge here.

I'll give a photo a try tomorrow. I can be rightfully shamed by the best of them.
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Old 03-13-2015, 12:53 AM
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hoc9sw,
First of all, you have my prayers and sympathy. Cancer is no joke. Thanks for being here.
Second, you are far ahead of most on this forum; you did it. Most won't even try.

If you want me to post a pic for you, email it to me: rastoff1@gmail.com
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Old 03-13-2015, 02:06 AM
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Hehehe. As the bodyguard said to the son of the Russian mob boss who had just said he wasn't skerrt of John Wick...."You should be!"

Size XL please, and I already know which pants I'll be wearing it with. Just put it aside for a day or two - I'm going to the range TOMORROW!!!
Well? It's tomorrow and I don't see any pics from you. Why not?
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Old 03-13-2015, 03:03 AM
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I work in IT, but am about as useless for the internet as one can be. I am your guy for protecting real servers.

So my real camera photos sort of suck. No, worse.

Both -
9 ring (the red zone) is 5.6 inches.
10 ring is (about) 3.25

Fired the Rastoff spec round, first with a Shield 9mm (have to have an S&W here) with Remington UMC 115g JHP.
Then with my Sig C3 (1911 .45acp, Federal 230 FMJ from the 100 round bulk pack).

I got nothing on most of you. I did qualify expert marksman in 1968, but I'm in trifocals with cataracts and an unhealthy dose of arthritis and cancer these days, so time has taken its expected share.

I won't win any contests, except with the guy who wants a piece of me.
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Old 03-13-2015, 03:10 AM
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I'll add - I asked the RO to be my judge, and we took the first target with each pistol. I might have done better later, but a test is a test, and the guys were happy just the same. Seems that they see worse.
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Old 03-13-2015, 07:35 AM
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I too haven't been able to find these B27 targets around here. I would like to participate but I don't need any other supplies right now that would justify the hefty shipping charge I would incur by ordering these targets by themselves. I will check a few other places, but if anyone has a suggestion I would welcome it. I could draw a rectangular mark of the correct size with a felt-tip marker on a sheet of paper if that would be acceptable.

Regards,
Andy
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Old 03-13-2015, 12:56 PM
hoc9sw hoc9sw is offline
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WalMart should have the B27 in a 10 pack for just under $10. I forgot mine, so shot with what I had. May try again this afternoon.
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Old 03-13-2015, 03:23 PM
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Andy,
You don't need a B-27, any piece of paper will do. The only thing I ask is to have some kind of reference so I can measure the group. In fact, the one made by schgsd above would be prefect.

I'm just glad to see guys getting out and shooting.
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Old 03-13-2015, 09:33 PM
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Default Finally got a chance to post pics...

The target below was shot with my EDC (Shield 9mm), and the results, while good for combat shooting, was not as good as I expected. I shot one target and discovered that I was not seeing it well enough at 10 yards to put all rounds inside the ring. So I reversed the drill and started at 10 yards, working my way in. The hope was that a unfired on target might improve my visibility. I don't know that it helped, and the shorter barrel length and sight radius didn't help either. All the rounds outside the small oval were the 10 yard shots.

I may shoot the drill again tomorrow, but I think I'll tip my cap to Rastoff and say - "You the man"

Ironically, I went to the archery range today and was "money" from 10 yards.
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Old 03-13-2015, 09:50 PM
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Nice shooting there Protected One. Still, a little short of the mark.

I'm really glad to see several of you getting out and shooting. That's really what this is all about; challenging yourself.

I'm gonna let this run through the weekend then the shirt will be given away. If someone tells me to give them a little more time, I will.

Tomorrow I'm going to start working on a new challenge. It will be better than this one!
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Old 03-13-2015, 10:00 PM
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Man! I sure expected alot more people on this forum to participate. Guess we have more "talkers", than "shooters", huh?
I just found this thread, and will do it next week when I go to the range. In fact I'll do it with three different guns. But I will do it all at 7 and 10 yards. I don't like to shoot at the range at the 3 yard mark. I always laugh at the girls and guys doing that. Since we can't "draw" from the holster at the indoor range(their rule) trying to simulate self defense shooting at 3 yards is useless.

I'll use my smith and wesson M&P 40c which is one EDC. I'll use my ruger SP101 which is the other I use. And either my Model 15 or just for giggles I'll get out my Hi Pointe .40 S&W and shoot it.
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Old 03-13-2015, 10:02 PM
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Here's another target you can use. I just made this and if it's printed on standard 8.5"x11" paper it will yield a 2"x3" center to shoot at.
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Old 03-13-2015, 10:09 PM
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Sigh, I so wanna just get out and ventilate some paper.
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Old 03-13-2015, 11:25 PM
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And, we all have lives beyond this forum. It will take a little while for some of us to filter our way to the range.
That would describe me, sir.


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I'm gonna let this run through the weekend then the shirt will be given away. If someone tells me to give them a little more time, I will.
I have no interest in your shirt, but I won't be able to get to the range until sometime next week. That's just the way things are in my situation. I'll see what I can do.

Thank you, sir.
Andy
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