Recommendation/Input Requested

[The Real Jason]

Howdy all. So my da (who's in his mid-70s) had his home defense pistol stolen (long and sad story involving wayward family member...nothing to see here). It was a 1970s era nickel Ruger Security Six .357. Great pistol, but since this is a S&W forum, I thought I'd ask to get input on a quality replacement for it. I have a line on a quality Model 19 Combat Magnum, but I've been told that some of the newer S&W models are better. Not sure I'm there yet, so I'd like to solicit opinions.

Criteria are as follows:
- Revolver (mild arthritis prevents racking slide on auto)
- .357 magnum
- 4"-6" barrel
- Relatively easy to handle (medium frame, not too heavy)
- Smooth trigger pull/hammer draw
- Reasonably priced (not looking to pay $1500 for some Dan Wesson monstrosity)

Thanks in advance!

Cheers,
Jason

[427mach1]

686+, 7-round capacity, shoots very nicely...

[g8rb8]

Any of the below should fit your specifications:

K-frame:
Fixed sights:
Model 13 (blue or nickel)
Model 65 (stainless)

K-frame:
Adjustable sights:
Model 19 (blue or nickel)
Model 66 (stainless)

L-frame:
Fixed sights:
Model 581 (blue or nickel)
Model 681 (stainless)

L-frame:
Adjustable sights:
Model 586 (blue or nickel)
Model 686 (stainless)

A 686 will probably be the easiest to locate and, as mentioned by 427mach1, the 686 can be found with 7 round capacity, referred to as 686+, (in addition to 6 round capacity).

[crazyphil]

If your Dad has mild arthritis in his hands it won't get any better. It will
gradually get worse. (Been there done that). I don't think He will enjoy
the sting of a .357. My wife had exactly the same problem. I found her
a S&W Model 10 with 4" barrel. .38 Spl. Had an action job. Trigger is very
smooth and easy. Practice with 148 Gr. Wadcutters. Standard pressure
Hornady FTX for home defense. Before you buy a .357 I suggest your
Dad try some to see how it feels.

[gunnails]

I think the model 19 or a Model 66 are logical replacements in S&W.

But the most obvious would to get another Security Six.

[Mister X]

A Ruger LCR could be something else to consider, especially since he already had and liked a Ruger.

It has a relatively light double-action trigger pull compared to other revolvers. There is a .357 version, but I'd recommend loading it with .38 special.

They do make one with an exposed hammer and slightly longer barrel if so desired, but the enclosed hammer snub-nose model might actually make more sense...

An exposed hammer and the ability to cock to single action is simply not needed and could be a safety liability as well as tactical disadvantage.

A large percentage of the home invasions I've come across and studied involving the elderly take place at extremely close or even contact distances or eventually end up there at some point during the incident. I assume this is may be more common with the elderly due to slower reaction times, mobility difficulties and perhaps a greater propensity to trust strangers to some degree.

A light, compact enclosed hammer snub revolver offers numerous advantages in these close-quarter scenarios such as being very quick to bring into action, excellent weapon retention and no hammer to get blocked or fouled.

It is also easier to carry on your person at all times should he sometimes opt to "carry at home" which isn't a bad idea depending on the totality of his circumstances and considering nearly half of all home invasion occur during the day. It's not likely an elderly man will be able to sprint and retrieve a gun from the bedroom or possibly from across the room if someone suddenly gained access to the home. More on this particular concept from Michael Janich... Concealed Carry Tactics to Neutralize a Home Invasion

[Kevin J.]

Ruger LCR for the reasons stated by Mr.X above. But....a model 19 is IMO the best SW revolver made. Just load it with .38 special instead of .357 to minimize recoil.

[Muss Muggins]

Originally Posted by Kevin J.

Ruger LCR for the reasons stated by Mr.X above. But....a model 19 is IMO the best SW revolver made. Just load it with .38 special instead of .357 to minimize recoil.

An LCR with .357 magnum rounds, or even anything more than target .38 Spl rounds, will be quite a load for a fellow with hand issues. Better to buy something all steel, like a 19, 66, 686, etc., and shoot .38's . . .

[cmort666]

I'd stick with the pre-lock Model 19.

Make sure you check the forcing cone. Excessive use of light bullet magnum loads can cause cracking.

[THE PILGRIM]

Have you considered loaning him one of your guns?
That way, he could try it, if it don't work,
Just loan him another one.

[bigwheelzip]

Originally Posted by 427mach1

686+, 7-round capacity, shoots very nicely...

Agree.

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...ducts_id/26266

The rubber grips and the medium weight let me shoot 158gr FMJ .357 from the 4", comfortably and without any sting. Very accurate also.

[Kanewpadle]

Since he is familiar with Ruger, try an a SP 101 three inch with 38 +P.

[Watchdog]

Originally Posted by The Real Jason

Howdy all. So my da (who's in his mid-70s) had his home defense pistol stolen...It was a 1970s era nickel Ruger Security Six .357. Great pistol, but since this is a S&W forum, I thought I'd ask to get input on a quality replacement for it.

First, welcome to the forum.

Second, if it was a Security-Six, I'm pretty sure it was stainless steel, as I don't believe Ruger nickel plated its Six-series guns at the factory.

If you're looking for a quality replacement, why not just go with another Security-Six? They're all over the auction sites at what I consider to be reasonable prices. You might get lucky and find one in an area gun store, but I've only seen one or two for sale locally in about three years now. But even the Security-Six's variants like the Service-Six and Speed-Six are easily found online...except the Service and Speed might be a bit more expensive.

And even though I'm not fond of rubber grips, you could put a set of Hogues or Pachmayrs on it which would probably help your father with any arthritis-associated pain when he fires it.

A huge advantage of the Six-series revolvers is that you don't need even one tool to totally disassemble them for cleaning. Long as you have a dime in your pocket to remove the grip screw, you're good to go. No screws to bugger up, no sideplate to remove.

Might be something to think about. Good luck with your search.

[scooter123]

As someone with moderate Arthritis in both thumbs and the right radial styloid process I have to point out that this particular disease is a LOT more individual that many here have assumed. For example while I cannot rack a slide using a pinch grip with thumb and forefinger that does not limit my ability to rack a slide by pinching it between the palm of my hand and four fingers. In addition even though the Arthritis in the radial joint in my wrist can make writing very painful at times I have yet to experience any pain while shooting. Point is the OP really needs to find a range in his area that offers rentals and spend to time with his father test shooting different pistols to see what will work for his father.

BTW, one favorite that has been mentioned frequently is the model 19 or 66 Combat Masterpieces. Either of these loaded with a modern 38 +P Defense load should prove fairly effective for Home Defense as long as his father can shoot it well enough to hit an assailant.

BTW, as I am also suffering from aging eyesight I now spend much of my range time practicing what I call Weapon Guided Point Shooting. Because in the somewhat reduced lighting typical in most home I cannot see the sights on my pistols. Which is another discussion but I can see the day coming when my Home Defense choice will be my 20 gage 870.

[Bugkiller99]

IF you not going to load .357 mag in it, why get a .357? Model 10, police trade in, is a quality firearm at a good price. Typically lots of carry, not lots of shots through them.

[Muss Muggins]

Originally Posted by Bugkiller99

IF you not going to load .357 mag in it, why get a .357? Model 10, police trade in, is a quality firearm at a good price. Typically lots of carry, not lots of shots through them.

For an arthritic fella', the extra weight of most revolvers designed to shoot .357 would soften the blow of .38's . . .

[Bugkiller99]

Originally Posted by Muss Muggins

For an arthritic fella', the extra weight of most revolvers designed to shoot .357 would soften the blow of .38's . . .

True.

We could carry that to a recommendation of a Highway Patrolman. Not necessarily a bad idea either.

It all comes down to finding a balance of recoil vs weight, and in a price range the OP and Dad can agree on.

[shouldazagged]

I don't know how old your dad is, or how severe his arthritis is (though I'm willing to bet he downplays that, as most men do). I'm sneaking up on 79 and have considerable arthritis in both hands. Shooting .357 Magnum ammo is just not something I will attempt anymore. Way too painful.

If he is still able to handle the .357 stuff, I'd go for a Model 65 or 66, which he could load with Magnums until time to switch to a good .38 Special defensive load. I'd probably choose the 65 because I like fixed-sight revolvers, but that's just my preference.

Something as light as the LCR, even if it met your size specs, would likely be uncomfortable for arthritic hands to shoot. I wouldn't even consider it myself. The heft of steel is very comforting to my old mitts; and as was noted above, your dad's arthritis will almost certainly progress.

[Rastoff]

One question that seems to have been overlooked:
If he can't rack the slide, can he pull the trigger on a revolver? I mean even a light one at 12lbs is tough.

[Marvin Gardens]

Hi.

IMHO new S&W's are not "better" than ones built twenty or thirty years ago. If the 19 you have is in good shape, there you go. It would be hard to find a better revolver for your father.

When Dad was living alone and asked me for a gun, I gave him a 70's vintage 4" Model 19.

Regards.

Bob

Originally Posted by The Real Jason

Howdy all. So my da (who's in his mid-70s) had his home defense pistol stolen (long and sad story involving wayward family member...nothing to see here). It was a 1970s era nickel Ruger Security Six .357. Great pistol, but since this is a S&W forum, I thought I'd ask to get input on a quality replacement for it. I have a line on a quality Model 19 Combat Magnum, but I've been told that some of the newer S&W models are better. Not sure I'm there yet, so I'd like to solicit opinions.

Criteria are as follows:
- Revolver (mild arthritis prevents racking slide on auto)
- .357 magnum
- 4"-6" barrel
- Relatively easy to handle (medium frame, not too heavy)
- Smooth trigger pull/hammer draw
- Reasonably priced (not looking to pay $1500 for some Dan Wesson monstrosity)

Thanks in advance!

Cheers,
Jason

[crazyphil]

scooter123 have you considered a laser for your point shooting? I have a
Ruger Sp101 with Crimson Trace and I load it down to standard pressure
.38 Spl. hollow points for home defense. Laser also helps when practicing
dry fire.

[DD357]

Another vote for a 19/66/65/13; I would consider a 3" in the 13 or 65 as well.

[scooter123]

Originally Posted by crazyphil

scooter123 have you considered a laser for your point shooting? I have a
Ruger Sp101 with Crimson Trace and I load it down to standard pressure
.38 Spl. hollow points for home defense. Laser also helps when practicing
dry fire.

Currently I can keep everything on a 5 inch Shoot-n-c at 30 feet in rapid fire and at 50 feet in slow fire so I don't see any need to use electronics. Down the road, who knows, my arthritis or eyesight may push me into finding alternate solutions.

[Donn]

The only problem with a Model 19 is they're approaching safe queen status, I know mine is The 66 and 686 would be a better choice.

[The Real Jason]

Thanks for the input, gang. To clarify a few points:
- He's been shooting that security six since he won it in a raffle back in the 70s. He knows the .357, and is quite proficient, so I think I'll keep in that caliber. Besides he has a Henry lever action chambered for .357, and I don't want him having to buy a bunch of different ammo.
- After growing up in the mining towns of West Virginia and spending 30+ years in the service, first as an Army door gunner in Vietnam, then as a USCG rescue swimmer (before that was an actual rate), I'm not too worried about his combat mindset or ability to act quick and decisively. ;-)
- His arthritis is localized to his thumbs, and only a problem in certain tasks. While pulling a hammer back is not a problem, racking a slide is, as is the thumb safety and obstruction of the beaver-tail on my Dan Wesson 1911 that I let him borrow. Autos are out. His trigger finger still works just fine :-)

Again, thanks for all the great input. I was hoping to narrow it down to 2-3 different models. He's kind of old school (currently using my Ruger Blackhawk while traveling), and likes the classics, so I think we're down to another Six series, Model 19, or 686+. I'll take him to the range and see which one makes him feel all warm inside. Cheers!

[BB57]

I think you are on track sticking to those choices.

A J frame sized .357 like the Model 60 or an SP 101 is a bit more of a handful in .357 Mag or even .38 +p than a K or L frame sized revolver with the same length barrel.

A decent set of rubber grips (Pachmayrs are my recommendation as Hogues tend to interfere with speed loaders on a K frame) will also help make the revolver much more comfortable to shoot.

And of course, if the arthritis does get worse, you can back off from a full power .357 to a loaded down .357, to a .38+P to a .38 Special, and in a 4"-6" barrel, all of them will get the job done.

----

In my experience, oddly enough, the Model 19 and related revolvers like the Model 13 have a slightly longer trigger reach than the slightly larger/heavier Speed/Service/Security Six series. If your dad has smaller hands, switching to a S&W might not be as smooth as just staying with the Ruger revolvers.

----

Price wise, you're looking at two different price ranges.

A very good to excellent 4" Police Service Six or a 4" or 6" Security Six can be found for around $350 to $400 in blued and stainless respectively.

A 4" or 6" Model 19 is going to cost you significantly more than that - plan on starting around $650 for one in similar condition and $750-$800 would not be surprising.

A used 686 or 686+ is going to cost about as much as a used Model 19 - but probably won't have the heirloom appeal and may not retain it's value as well as a Model 19. It really depends on where S&W takes the 686 in the future.

[Whitwabit]

Something very important in my opinion is being over looked and that is what will he be able to use tomorrow and then next week and next month and next year .. everyone has been talking of the condition your dad is in today and what he is able to shoot today .. but what about in 6 months .. unless he is willing to go through the process several more times over the next several years get him something he will still be using in 5 years .. think as much about future use as present use today ..

Good Luck in finding a suitable firearm for your Dad!

[Mister X]

Originally Posted by The Real Jason

- His arthritis is localized to his thumbs, and only a problem in certain tasks. While pulling a hammer back is not a problem, racking a slide is, as is the thumb safety and obstruction of the beaver-tail on my Dan Wesson 1911 that I let him borrow. Autos are out. His trigger finger still works just fine :-)

I think the revolver is probably the single best option considering the totality of the circumstances, but if his thumbs are the only issue, I would think racking the slide of an auto would only be a problem using the slingshot method. The overhand method shouldn't pose any problems for him since it doesn't really involve the thumbs. And there are plenty of options besides 1911's that do not have thumb safeties and beaver-tails. I love my revolvers, but for home defense, I really like to also have a high capacity autoloader(Glocks in my case) available to me.

[gwpercle]

If it is reasonably priced and in good shape , I would jump on it.
I actually prefer the older "classic" designs but have trouble finding one "reasonably priced" . Your Dad can get by fine with standard 38 special and +P loadings in it !
I say go for it!
Gary