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Old 05-27-2016, 12:49 PM
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Default .44 Special vs .45 ACP for home defense

I used to keep a 629 Classic loaded with .44 Magnum Hydra-Shoks ready for home defense. It occurred to me that my hearing would be so damaged by firing a .44 magnum indoors that I wouldn't be able to hear them testify at my trial (or anything else ever again for that matter). So I switched to .45 ACP - less noise and a good reputation. But I really feel more confident with my wheel gun so I've been thinking about switching again, this time to .44 Special like Hornady Critical Defense or other similar load. What does the forum recommend regarding .45 ACP vs .44 Special for home defense? Thanks.
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Old 05-27-2016, 12:52 PM
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I like Gold Dots and HST. I also like 45acp over 44spl because to me its not about what I like best but about what I'm better with. I'm better with a semi auto.

You won't go death from 6 shots of 44 mag......I know! Have shot 44 mag, 357 mag, 50AE, 12G and 7.62x54 in a soundproof in closed room

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Old 05-27-2016, 12:54 PM
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My take:

I want to point out that immediate hearing damage starts at about 140db

.25 ACP 155.0 dB
.32 LONG 152.4 dB
.32 ACP 153.5 dB
.380 157.7 dB
9mm 159.8 dB
.38 S&W 153.5 dB
.38 Spl 156.3 dB
.357 Magnum 164.3 dB
.41 Magnum 163.2 dB
.44 Spl 155.9 dB
.44 Mag 164.0 dB
.45 ACP 157.0 dB
.45 COLT 154.7 dB

Every handgun caliber above can and may cause immediate hearing loss. So worrying about it and choosing a lesser caliber based upon this myth is ridiculous to say the least.
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Old 05-27-2016, 12:56 PM
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Both are effective SD rounds buy .44 Special is harder to come by and more expensive if you don't handload. Get yourself a 625 and have the best of both worlds with the advantage of full moon clips.
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Old 05-27-2016, 01:17 PM
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Arik: You're right of course. And I'm more confident in my wheel guns because I'm better with them. That's why I'm thinking about giving up the .45s.

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Old 05-27-2016, 01:21 PM
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eb07: That's good information. So maybe I'm just as well off switching back to my .44 Magnum full loads. Thanks
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Old 05-27-2016, 01:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brundlseth View Post
Arik: You're right of course. And I'm more confident in my wheel guns because I'm better with them. That's why I'm thinking about giving up the .45s.
Last post here by me is a whole bunch of info on hand loading for 44 special:

http://smith-wessonforum.com/firearm...ification.html
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Old 05-27-2016, 01:25 PM
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Generally, self defense ammo is better in a revolver (more types, better functioning, etc) BUT THAT IS A GENERALIZATION. It will vary from gun to gun and load to load==Hence testing of what you keep/carry is a good idea.

Even if it works better, you also have to consider a greater number of rounds in many autoloaders.

Ballistically, my 45 AR and 44 Spl loads are the same (Same powder, same amount, same weight bullet).
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Old 05-27-2016, 01:32 PM
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There's little meaningful difference between .45acp vs .44spl per se. Its a discussion of revolver vs semi, or between specific pistols you already own.

For a tiebreaker, SD suitable ammo is commenly available virtually everywhere ammo is sold. Suitable .44 is out there, but will require searching, and probably ordering.

Since you have a M629, your options would include midrange .44Mag. The Short Barell Gold Dot .44Mag would be a suitable choice, and is from a large mainstream oem. Most other hot .44spl/ mild aka Tactical .44Mag are from smaller mfg. I'd have no qualms with CorBon , Buffalo Bore or Grizzly. But other than lmited slections of CorBon not goin to see them on local shelves.
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Old 05-27-2016, 01:32 PM
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I have a Thunder Ranch 325 loaded with Hornady hollow points and two spare moon clips. Works well for me. Added a fiber optic front sight


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Old 05-27-2016, 01:33 PM
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To me, it would be more of an issue of the guns themselves rather than caliber. The difference in noise is likely a non-issue.

When out and about, I often carry a revolver(since can usually leave the scene), but for home defense(will most likely have to make a stand), I really do like to have a reliable high capacity semi-automatic available to me. I do still use a snub revolver at home for things such as investigating a strange noise or just checking the house since those would likely be reactive close-quarter events. If your .45 ACP is a M1911, then you really aren't gaining much capacity(just faster reloads) and I would honestly just probably stick to the wheel gun, especially since you're more comfortable and confidant with it. Something like a Glock 21 however would offer a substantial increase in firepower and would make a good home defense choice IMO or at the very least, be a nice weapon to just have handy for worst case scenarios. The 629 doesn't offer quite the same close-quarter advantages like an enclosed hammer snub does, but it would still likely be better than an auto in those scenarios depending on barrel length(or at least probably make a better impact weapon), so I would say both guns have their place.
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Old 05-27-2016, 01:38 PM
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You're over thinking this, IMHO. Get a weapon that you can make accurate hits with under combat conditions, choose a modern hollow point, practice often and hope you never have to use it.
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Old 05-27-2016, 02:00 PM
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45 ACP vs 44 Special!!!

I love this discussion already.

Wait, wait!! I want to make popcorn!
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Old 05-27-2016, 03:25 PM
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.44 Spl. In a revolver. With a heavy hollowpoint.

And a backup autoloader in .45, like maybe a G21. (You know, in case it gets real outta hand.)
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Old 05-27-2016, 03:32 PM
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If I'm going with a wheel gun....

It's gonna be a .44 Special, W-W 210 gr. Silver Tip HPs.

In a self loader, .45 ACP, it'll be W-W Ranger 230 gr. HP.

I do believe in.....





.
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Old 05-28-2016, 03:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old cop View Post
You're over thinking this, IMHO. Get a weapon that you can make accurate hits with under combat conditions, choose a modern hollow point, practice often and hope you never have to use it.
You're right old cop and thanks. First things first. I guess it's like the best carry gun question: it's not about caliber or type, the best carry gun is one you'll actually carry.
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Old 05-28-2016, 07:25 AM
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Why not just load your 629 with .44 Specials?
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Old 05-28-2016, 07:58 AM
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Quote:
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You won't go death from 6 shots of 44 mag.....
Well...maybe not, but it would hurt like hell.
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Old 05-28-2016, 08:14 AM
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Why not just load your 629 with .44 Specials?
Thanks pete - actually, that's the plan. Sorry I didn't make that clear.
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Old 05-28-2016, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brundlseth View Post
eb07: That's good information. So maybe I'm just as well off switching back to my .44 Magnum full loads. Thanks
The db scale is a log scale. 10 db = 10 times louder.

44 sp will be much kinder to the ears than a 44 mag.
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Old 05-28-2016, 08:24 AM
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Thanks pete - actually, that's the plan. Sorry I didn't make that clear.
Nope, my fault, I see it now. Here I thought you were drumming up an excuse to buy a new wheelgun (which should never be discounted).
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Old 05-28-2016, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arik View Post
I like Gold Dots and HST. I also like 45acp over 44spl because to me its not about what I like best but about what I'm better with. I'm better with a semi auto.

You won't go death from 6 shots of 44 mag......I know! Have shot 44 mag, 357 mag, 50AE, 12G and 7.62x54 in a soundproof in closed room

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While you may not go COMPLETELY deaf, you WILL suffer some type of hearing loss. BTW, what in the world compelled you to go into a soundproof room and shoot those rounds without ears???

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Old 05-28-2016, 10:02 AM
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Quote:
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The db scale is a log scale. 10 db = 10 times louder.

44 sp will be much kinder to the ears than a 44 mag.
Thanks to you too shocker. I didn't know that the db scale was a log scale. My experience has been that the Special was a lot quieter than the Magnum. Looks I'm back to the .44 Special. Confidence counts for a lot.
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Old 05-28-2016, 10:07 AM
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Nope, my fault, I see it now. Here I thought you were drumming up an excuse to buy a new wheelgun (which should never be discounted).
Nope - not buying anything new but I might have some .45s to sell after a while.
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Old 05-28-2016, 10:22 AM
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For a number of years a Smith & Wesson transition 3rd. Model .44 Spl. sat on my night stand. Now a Glock 30SF .45acp sits on my night stand.

The switch had nothing to do with the caliber or revolver vs. semi-auto. It wasn't about ammo capacity or how well I shoot either one. It had everything to do with the thought of which one I wouldn't mind having sit in police evidence locker.

The Glock, is just a Glock. The Smith & Wesson is a work of art.
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Old 05-28-2016, 10:34 AM
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Quote:
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I used to keep a 629 Classic loaded with .44 Magnum Hydra-Shoks ready for home defense. It occurred to me that my hearing would be so damaged by firing a .44 magnum indoors that I wouldn't be able to hear them testify at my trial (or anything else ever again for that matter). So I switched to .45 ACP - less noise and a good reputation. But I really feel more confident with my wheel gun so I've been thinking about switching again, this time to .44 Special like Hornady Critical Defense or other similar load. What does the forum recommend regarding .45 ACP vs .44 Special for home defense? Thanks.
Unless you reload (which opens an entirely different can of worms), .44 Special is cost prohibitive to maintain proficiency, at least around here. Stick with the .45 ACP. Lots of great factory loads out there . . .
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Old 05-28-2016, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
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It occurred to me that my hearing would be so damaged by firing a .44 magnum indoors that I wouldn't be able to hear them testify at my trial (or anything else ever again for that matter). So I switched to .45 ACP - less noise and a good reputation.
The unprotected human ear isn't going to be able to tell the difference between a .44 Magnum and a .45 acp that's fired inside a home or even in a confined space, take my word for this. Especially if you're firing multiple shots. You're going to damage or impair your hearing, either temporarily or permanently. In a home defense scenario, you may come out alive, but your ears are gonna hurt.

Ever shoot a .22 Magnum indoors, or even under a tin roof at an outdoor range without ear protection? Hurts, don't it?

There really is no "versus" to this, no pro or con regarding noise levels of large calibers. Use whichever caliber you wish...your ears aren't going to know the difference.
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Old 05-28-2016, 11:22 AM
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Some experienced writers have suggested keeping electronic hearing protectors near your defense gun; amplifying minor noises and suppressing damaging levels seems to be a good idea.

By the way, the decibel scale is not linear as correctly noted above, but an increase of + 3 dB is double the intensity from a lower number.
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Old 05-28-2016, 11:24 AM
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Some experienced writers have suggested keeping electronic hearing protectors near your defense gun; amplifying minor noises and suppressing damaging levels seems to be a good idea.
Almost every time I get my electronic protectors out of the bag, the batteries are dead, either on their own or because I left them on accidentally . . .
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Old 05-28-2016, 11:25 AM
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When I have my 4" 29-2 out of the safe, I have 200gr. .44 Special Gold Dots in it. I have no doubt that anybody who gets a couple of those in the chest is going to have to lie down and rest for a while. I've found them both accurate and completely controllable. The target in my avatar was shot with those, one handed at 50' from that same 4" 29-2.

I consider the .45acp and the .44 Special (with modern self-defense loads) interchangeable. Of course you could always get yourself a 4" Redhawk in .45acp.
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Old 05-28-2016, 11:52 AM
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When I have my 4" 29-2 out of the safe, I have 200gr. .44 Special Gold Dots in it. I have no doubt that anybody who gets a couple of those in the chest is going to have to lie down and rest for a while. I've found them both accurate and completely controllable. The target in my avatar was shot with those, one handed at 50' from that same 4" 29-2.

I consider the .45acp and the .44 Special (with modern self-defense loads) interchangeable. Of course you could always get yourself a 4" Redhawk in .45acp.
Reminds me of the story when someone poo-poo'd my bud's 9mm for SD.Said that he needed a .45.My friend's response? "After I put two in your forehead,you won't know the difference."
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Old 05-28-2016, 11:59 AM
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Reminds me of the story when someone poo-poo'd my bud's 9mm for SD.Said that he needed a .45.My friend's response? "After I put two in your forehead,you won't know the difference."
A .45's better, but a 9x19mm with 147gr. JHPs will do.

I'm carrying my Glock 19 until I can make a decent holster for my 3 1/2" M1911.
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Old 05-28-2016, 01:07 PM
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In terms of ballistics, there is no important difference between the 2 rounds. The decision comes down to skill with the platform, and logistics. if you are truly better with the revolver under stress, using measured testing (timer, specific course of fire, etc), then the platform is a huge factor. You also have to consider your home layout and defensive layers (fence, dogs, etc.) , the realities of LE response time and how that might impact your need to hold out longer and or reload, etc. You also need to consider one handed shooting due to injury or using a flashlight; the greater ease of mounting a quality light on an autopistol, and similar ergonomic issues.
As a revolver goes, I would be satisfied with a good .38 SWC in either my M66 or K38 - properly delivered to the right places on a body, effective enough and much more controllable. I have a 629MG and a 296; while I have a few Magnum rounds, the vast majority of my ammo is the 200 grain Gold Dot, and I buy almost all of my ammo in bulk for lots of reasons.
If you have a budget that makes it necessary to buy smaller lots of ammo, say a box at a time, the .45ACP is by far the better choice in terms of logistics. It is far more common, there are several rounds that have done well in the objective testing by Doc Roberts (google his test results or search this forum for links to them), and you can feed both an auto and revolver (I have both in 45ACP) the same ammo.
My EDC for lots of reason is a G33; nasty little thing, but always present. Away from the settings that make that a good choice, a chopped G17.

Home defense should be layered. Fencing (6 foot minimum, with LOCKED gates), floodlights, dogs, etc. If anyone who feels comfortable coming to your home uninvited, there is something very wrong. Fix it. The point is to make potential problem children go away and pick someplace to do their nastiness. If they get in, you have a clear shooting situation, of course - that can't be anything but unlawful assaultive violence.

In reality, while I have guns in several places, the all around best choice is my AR. Ballistically better than any pistol, has an Aimpoint and a Surefire PX3, easier to shoot accurately and fast, and while over penetration is over rated as a concern for a lot of reasons, less likely to have that problem with a human torso and the house walls.
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Last edited by Doug M.; 05-28-2016 at 04:15 PM. Reason: Typos
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Old 05-28-2016, 01:32 PM
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.44 specials Win Silvertips are kept in our old Charter Bulldog & have been since 1985 or so... they work..without excessive recoil or muzzle blast. But the WinW .45ACP FMJ's or Silvertips or Speer Gold dots in .45ACP are dern good medicine too.

For typical home defense loads/self defense loads you have to worry about over penetration wounding/killing your own loved ones or neighbors/bystanders....I'd seek a decent .44spec Silvertips for that caliber, & the same or a standard loading (not heavy) for .45ACP like Silvertips or Speer Gold Dots.....The choice of handgun is only yours to make.

Using heavy .44mag loads might sound cool to you or some internet warrior... but sound like a terrible choice to a jury hearing a civil suit/criminal case if one or more of them over penetrated walls/car and either hurt or killed a neighbor or bystander...You have to consider this in your choice of ammo.... choose a load that is enough... but not too much....

.44mag full power loads will have a lot more recoil/muzzle blast than typical factory .44 spec loads...the same hold true for heavy loads in .357mag over .38spec.
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Old 05-28-2016, 01:40 PM
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I suggest for you, that you get a Charter Arms 5 Shot 2 1/2" Barrel, .45acp Pitbull Revolver, no moon clips needed.

That will give you, a revolver guy, the best of both worlds!

BTW, IMHO, .44mag is way, way, too powerful for in home defensive use!

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Old 05-28-2016, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug M. View Post
In terms of ballistics, there is no important difference between the 2 rounds. The decision comes down to skill with the platform, and logistics. if you are truly better with the revolver under stress, using measured testing (timer, specific course of fire, etc), then the platform is a huge factor. You also have to consider your home layout and defensive layers (fence, dogs, etc.) , the realities of LE response time and how that might impact your need to hold out longer and or reload, etc. You also need to consider one handed shooting due to injury or using a flashlight; the greater ease of mounting a quality light on an autopistol, and similar ergonomic issues.
As a revolver goes, I would be satisfied with a good .38 SWC in either my M66 or K38 - properly delivered to the right places on a body, effective enough and much more controllable. I have a 629MG and a 296; while I have a few Magnum rounds, the vast majority of my ammo is the 200 grain Gold Dot, and I buy almost all of my ammo in bulk for lots of reasons.
If you have a budget that makes it necessary to buy smaller lots of ammo, say a box at a time, the .45ACP is by far the better choice in terms of logistics. It is far more common, there are several rounds that have done well in the objective testing by Doc Roberts (google his test results of search this form for links to them), and you can feed both an auto and revolver (I have both in 45ACP) the same ammo.
My EDC for lots of reason is a G33; nasty little thing, but always present. Away from the settings that make that a good choice, a chopped G17.

Home defense should be layered. Fencing (6 foot minimum, with LOCKED gates), floodlights, dogs, etc. If anyone who feels comfortable coming to your home uninvited, there is something very wrong. Fix it. The point is to make potential problem children go away and pick someplace to do their nastiness. If they get in, you have a clear shooting situation, of course - that can't be anything but unlawful assaultive violence.

In reality, while I have guns in several places, the all around best choice is my AR. Ballistically better than any pistol, has an Aimpoint and a Surefire PX3, easier to shoot accurately and fast, and while over penetration is over rated as a concern for a lot of reasons, less likely to have that problem with a human torso and the house walls.
Thoughtful and thorough, thanks Doug.
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Old 05-28-2016, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eb07 View Post
My take:

I want to point out that immediate hearing damage starts at about 140db

.25 ACP 155.0 dB
.32 LONG 152.4 dB
.32 ACP 153.5 dB
.380 157.7 dB
9mm 159.8 dB
.38 S&W 153.5 dB
.38 Spl 156.3 dB
.357 Magnum 164.3 dB
.41 Magnum 163.2 dB
.44 Spl 155.9 dB
.44 Mag 164.0 dB
.45 ACP 157.0 dB
.45 COLT 154.7 dB

Every handgun caliber above can and may cause immediate hearing loss. So worrying about it and choosing a lesser caliber based upon this myth is ridiculous to say the least.
Like many others you've neglected to consider that Sound Intensity DOUBLES with every 3 db increase. What this means is that the increase in volume between 155 and 164 db is equal to an increase of 2^3, or the Sound Intensity at 164 db is 8 TIMES louder than the Sound Intensity of 155 db.

As someone with a moderate amount of hearing loss from a "miss spent" youth fooling with racing engines and attending rock concerts I do all I can to insure I keep what is left for as long as possible. One aspect of this is that I now use ear plugs when cutting my grass or just using a weed whacker. It also means that I don't ever wish to have the need to use a firearm to defend myself in my own home. However, if the need arises I will do that and my choice would be the 45 ACP because I believe that it would cause less damage than a higher pressure caliber such as the 9mm or 40 S&W.

Last edited by scooter123; 05-28-2016 at 02:18 PM.
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Old 05-28-2016, 02:58 PM
Old Arkansawyer Old Arkansawyer is offline
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I have both 44sp and 45 acp with 4 in barrels. 240 grhp with 44 and 230 grhp with the 45. The 44 sp hp will expand and penetrate, in packed paper, a little better than the 45 acp. Both only to be used until I could get to my 12 gauge with 00 buck.
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Old 05-28-2016, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
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Like many others you've neglected to consider that Sound Intensity DOUBLES with every 3 db increase. What this means is that the increase in volume between 155 and 164 db is equal to an increase of 2^3, or the Sound Intensity at 164 db is 8 TIMES louder than the Sound Intensity of 155 db.

As someone with a moderate amount of hearing loss from a "miss spent" youth fooling with racing engines and attending rock concerts I do all I can to insure I keep what is left for as long as possible. One aspect of this is that I now use ear plugs when cutting my grass or just using a weed whacker. It also means that I don't ever wish to have the need to use a firearm to defend myself in my own home. However, if the need arises I will do that and my choice would be the 45 ACP because I believe that it would cause less damage than a higher pressure caliber such as the 9mm or 40 S&W.
That wasn't my point it doesn't matter that it's louder my point is to show that they all can cause immediate hearing damage.
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Old 05-28-2016, 04:03 PM
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Default I'd like to keep my hearing....

I used low end .357s in the house because full magnum would probably do permanent damage and I don't think full .357 is required at HD ranges. I wouldn't even begin to consider a .44 magnum in the house.
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Old 05-28-2016, 09:37 PM
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I used low end .357s in the house because full magnum would probably do permanent damage and I don't think full .357 is required at HD ranges. I wouldn't even begin to consider a .44 magnum in the house.
I wouldn't use a .44 magnum unless it were loaded down like my '.357' rounds.
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Old 05-28-2016, 09:53 PM
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. . . However, if the need arises I will do that and my choice would be the 45 ACP because I believe that it would cause less damage than a higher pressure caliber such as the 9mm or 40 S&W.
I don't let the potential for hearing loss dictate my choice of self defense caliber, especially since I don't get to pick the bad guy's caliber. Of course, if I did, mine would always be louder . . .
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Old 05-29-2016, 12:40 AM
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I honestly can't see .44 Magnum as a good choice for most defensive situations, including on the street. To me it's a hunting round, and gross overkill for use on humans.

I'd be happy with either .44 Special or .45 ACP for home defense, but I live in an apartment and consider .38 Special +P as high as I want to go. So that's what I have.
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Old 05-29-2016, 05:47 AM
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If you like revolvers, just buy a Mod 25 or a 625. Once you shoot a 45 in a revolver, you will sell that auto loader.
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Old 05-31-2016, 01:44 AM
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Why not look into a suppressor for one of your .45's?
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Old 05-31-2016, 05:31 AM
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Default 45acp

The best of both worlds, a 45acp and a revolver, the model 1917. It is what sits on my bedside table with 2 moon clips. It is my first line of defense past the two German Shepherds. However, I do have several strategic placements of 44spls throughout the house.
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Old 05-31-2016, 11:28 AM
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"Freeze, or I'll deafen you"
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Old 05-31-2016, 12:06 PM
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"Freeze, or I'll deafen you"
Not bad Kid!
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Old 05-31-2016, 12:56 PM
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Default 44 vs 45

There is no appreciable difference balistically between a 44spl and a 45acp. Both offer projectiles of the approximate same weight and depending on barrel length the same velocity. Although my "go to" at home is a 1911 in 45acp, I own several 44 special's and would not feel under-gunned whatsoever were I to choose that caliber for self-defense.
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Old 05-31-2016, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
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There is no appreciable difference balistically between a 44spl and a 45acp. Both offer projectiles of the approximate same weight and depending on barrel length the same velocity. Although my "go to" at home is a 1911 in 45acp, I own several 44 special's and would not feel under-gunned whatsoever were I to choose that caliber for self-defense.
Thanks Stan - I guess a little reassurance was a big part of what I was looking for. I'm pretty sure I'll be going with the 44. That 629 Classic was my first love and we're still pretty sweet on each other!
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