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Old 06-21-2016, 12:10 PM
cp2146 cp2146 is offline
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I heard a little snipet on the news the other day about a move afoot to adopt a federal license to carry that would be good anywhere and everywhere. I just heard it in passing and didn't hear any details. I realize something like this would probably never pass congress, let alone be signed into law, given our current political environment and gun control arguments underway, but it makes sense. I also realize there are some states and local municipalities that would likely never accept it. Personally, I think it's a good idea...one federal carry permit that covers the entire country. Then you could eliminate the plethora of state and local rules governing (translated as prohibiting) licensed carry. Does this make sense to anyone else?

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Old 06-21-2016, 12:13 PM
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Pretty sure there are several forum members that already have one of those . . .
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Old 06-21-2016, 12:15 PM
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A lot of things make sense. But what has common sense got to do with politics !
As far as I can tell ....nothing at all !
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Old 06-21-2016, 12:21 PM
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In my humble opinion, it's a bad idea.

1. The power to issue such a license also gives the power to not only take it away, but to confiscate your guns, assuming a future anti-rights administration.

2. You would then be in a very special federal database - and rest assured that database would include everything about you, from how many guns you own to where you normally eat your lunch.

3. You would not be a "good guy," you would only be someone who would be under special governmental scrutiny.

4. Asking the Federal Government's permission to carry a gun flies in the face of states' rights. Nowhere in the Constitution is the Federal Government given such power.

5. Far better that we have universal Constitutional carry. The first step in getting there is having state concealed carry permits universally accepted, just like drivers' licenses. Once that has been done, the road is paved for UCC.

Just my opinion. YMD.

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Old 06-21-2016, 12:26 PM
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It does or would make sense to those of us on forums such as these.
Right now, the criteria seems to, basically, be a current LEO or retired LEO after a minimum of 10 years of service.
There are some other details.
Here is more info:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_En...ers_Safety_Act

For anybody non-LEO, the bureaucracy gets even greater with several states and agencies in which to coordinate. I'd strongly consider a state which easily approves concealed carry and which provides enough interest to leave me content enough to stay, and not want to travel outside of that state.
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Old 06-21-2016, 12:26 PM
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Having worked for the Feds for 27 years and then worked with firearms training and education since, I think it is a wonderful dream that our Federal Govt work the way it should, but a monstrous political trap if it were implemented, resulting in permits being issued about like now in New Jersey.

There is no Federal driver's license, and there is no law requiring states to recognize each other's drivers licenses: they worked that out on their own.

The only reason your state carry license is not good everywhere is the anti-gun attitude of about 10 states, the same states that would most certainly make a Federal license program a restrictive nightmare.
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Old 06-21-2016, 12:38 PM
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It seems like a good idea in theory. If you still have your state license or permit in addition to a fed one, then if the feds take theirs away you're right back where you are now, so not much worry there.

If it were an 'instead of' deal then hell no.

"Let me be clear, if you like your current carry license you can keep your current carry license."
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Old 06-21-2016, 12:40 PM
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This will never, ever happen, under any administration. The states will view this as a states' right issue and so do I. If you give the Federal government the power to tell the states they SHALL honor a weapons carry permit, then you have also given them the power to revoke that authority on a whim and deny everyone the right to concealed carry. Is that what we want?
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Old 06-21-2016, 12:46 PM
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At first I fully agreed with idea of ONE permit that covered all the variances of the different states. But today I was reading my current NRA magazine about some of the proposed changes Social Security is think to assure benefit receivers that are "mental unfit" would automatically be denied the right to purchase a firearm. Sound logical at first then I read the NRA objection which shed new light.

First the Fed determines who is unfit by their definition.

2 any error done prior is classifying an "unfit" is their option to hear and/or change. The citizen has NO due process of normal legal systems.

3 It becomes a Federal Social Security administrative process and their option to change, restrict or place addition limitations on is not subject to legislation.

Assessment: Have you every seen the Federal government do anything right.

This post will probably place me on some "problem list" with big brother
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Old 06-21-2016, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OKFC05 View Post
The only reason your state carry license is not good everywhere is the anti-gun attitude of about 10 states, the same states that would most certainly make a Federal license program a restrictive nightmare.
I respectfully disagree.

You may have a concealed carry license for your state, and my state of North Carolina may recognize that license. That's called reciprocity. That doesn't mean, though, that just because we recognize your license, you're absolved from obeying North Carolina's firearms laws.

What might be legal ways and places for you to carry in your state, might not be legal here. You might can carry in a court house out there in Oklahoma for all I know. Don't try that here.

It has nothing to do with being anti-gun.

I wouldn't be so quick to label other states (or people) as "anti-gun" simply because they don't look at gun laws or their enforcement exactly like Oklahoma does.

A federal license would be a nightmare...for more reasons than I feel like talking about right now. I'd advise average gun owners to be careful what they wish for.

People can talk about and wish for a federal carry license and/or national reciprocity or whatever you want to call it for everyone until they're blue in the face. They can wear out keyboards talking about it on forums just like this one.

It ain't gonna happen.

If wishes were horses, we'd all be ridin'.
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Old 06-21-2016, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by CATI1835 View Post
If you give the Federal government the power to tell the states they SHALL honor a weapons carry permit, then you have also given them the power to revoke that authority on a whim and deny everyone the right to concealed carry.
Just out of curiosity, why did you default to believing that you would have to give up your state carry license in order to get a federal one?

I guess I see a federal license (if there were such a thing) as an accessory to my current WA CPL. If the feds want to impose training and qualification and it wasn't outrageously expensive I would consider jumping those hoops. It would be nice to be able to carry anywhere I travel and WA doesn't reciprocate with very many states. If the feds revoke it then I'm back to where I am now.

Last edited by Mainsail; 06-21-2016 at 01:25 PM. Reason: ...to add
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Old 06-21-2016, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by WATCHDOG View Post
I respectfully disagree.

What might be legal ways and places for you to carry in your state, might not be legal here. You might can carry in a court house out there in Oklahoma for all I know. Don't try that here.

It has nothing to do with being anti-gun.

I wouldn't be so quick to label other states (or people) as "anti-gun" simply because they don't look at gun laws or their enforcement exactly like Oklahoma does.
Of course you have to follow the laws of the host state; that is not an issue.

You missed the point of my post.

I am talking about the about 10 states like HI, NJ, NY, MD, etc that are MAY ISSUE, and the average person simply CANNOT GET a carry permit, while the political connected can. Aside from the high probabililty that they collectively would prevent any Fed carry license, they would undoubtedly cram it with restrictions, and possibly even IGNORE it, such as NYC and NJ now IGNORE the Federal Firearm Owners Protection Act. On appeal a Federal Court recently upheld the NJ case that negated the FOPA in NJ. Several locations (like MD, DC) now only honor the FOPA if the wheels are turning, but NOT if you stop for any reason. People are being puled over, vehicle searched, and arrested for transporting in accordance with the FOPA, the state simply ignoring the Fed FOPA. What would stop these same states ignoring a Fed Carry License law?

My post had nothing to do with the comments you made and you criticism that I should not call states "anti gun" is entirely irrelevant. States that deny the right to Keep and Bear arms to the average citizen are anti gun.
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Old 06-21-2016, 01:25 PM
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There will be no Federal full carry permits as long as NY,NJ, Conn,Ill,Calif,Mass,and a few others are still in the Union. They will fight it tooth and nail and they hold all the cards(votes). That being said, I think that constitutional carry should be the law of the land. We have it here in Arizona, the anti-gunners cried there will be blood in the streets,the only place I see blood running in the streets is Wash D.C. and Chicago.
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Old 06-21-2016, 01:30 PM
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The original 2A effected only the federal govt. States could do what they wanted. Founding fathers saw guns as a counterbalance to an over reaching federal government-one where money was speech and corporations were persons. One where there was a dept of Homeland Security and a Patriots Act. One where super PACs could run an election, and one where there was a 1% with over 90% of the wealth.

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Old 06-21-2016, 01:33 PM
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. . . and one where there was a 1% with over 90% of the wealth.
I would be very surprised if that wasn't also the case in the 18th century in this country . . .
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Old 06-21-2016, 01:42 PM
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We already have a national carry law: the Second Amendment. Article VI paragraph 2 declares that the United States Constitution the supreme law of the land. No state has authority to abridge the rights guaranteed to us by the United States Constitution. No law is valid that contradicts the United States Constitution.

We've screwed up the second we're bought in to the spurious bull sugar that our rights to bear arms can be abridged.
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Old 06-21-2016, 01:48 PM
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We already have a national carry law: the Second Amendment. Article VI paragraph 2 declares that the United States Constitution the supreme law of the land. No state has authority to abridge the rights guaranteed to us by the United States Constitution. No law is valid that contradicts the United States Constitution.

We've screwed up the second we're bought in to the spurious bull sugar that our rights to bear arms can be abridged.
I think clearly that ship has sailed . . .
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Old 06-21-2016, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by dougb1946 View Post
and one where there was a 1% with over 90% of the wealth.
Bit of thread-drift here.....but the 1% with 90% of the wealth is a situation you find in every country and every governmental system , be it a democracy/republic, socialist/communist, monarchy/dictatorship.

Socialist/communist the upper members of the ruling party are the 1%. In a monarchy/dictatorship the ruling family and associates are the 1%. In a democracy/republic it can be entrepreneurs and their families (Sam Walton family, Warren Buffet, Bill Gates, the Rockefellers, etc..).

The main difference is that in a democracy/republic anyone with hard work and ingenuity has the opportunity to better themselves and perhaps become part of the 1%.

Don
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Old 06-21-2016, 01:55 PM
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Thanks everyone. Great points, all. Of course this is something that will never happen because there are too many anti-gunners holding political office at the state and federal level. Besides, as someone said, this is the federal government we are talking about. They do tend to screw up most things they get involved in. Yes, I know we have the 2A and that it is supposed to be the ultimate law of the land, but we all know that it is under a major attack right now. In a perfect world, it would be nice to have just one carry permit with a uniform set of requirements and rules that all states had to recognize and abide by. But again, too many anti-gunners on the loose to ever let something like that come about, especially since they are trying as hard as they can to do away with the 2A and/or anything having to do with lawful gun ownership and carry. Was just a thought.

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Old 06-21-2016, 02:03 PM
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> Does this make sense to anyone else?

Not at all. One more point of control for the feds. I can see them rubber stamping denials.
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Old 06-21-2016, 02:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by P-229 View Post
We already have a national carry law: the Second Amendment. Article VI paragraph 2 declares that the United States Constitution the supreme law of the land. No state has authority to abridge the rights guaranteed to us by the United States Constitution. No law is valid that contradicts the United States Constitution.

We've screwed up the second we're bought in to the spurious bull sugar that our rights to bear arms can be abridged.
But, but, we compromised! It's just common sense!

I concur totally and the sooner we get back to the "law of the land" actually being the law of the land, the better.
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Old 06-21-2016, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by apollo99 View Post
There will be no Federal full carry permits as long as NY,NJ, Conn,Ill,Calif,Mass,and a few others are still in the Union. They will fight it tooth and nail and they hold all the cards(votes). That being said, I think that constitutional carry should be the law of the land. We have it here in Arizona, the anti-gunners cried there will be blood in the streets,the only place I see blood running in the streets is Wash D.C. and Chicago.
Yeah, they did the same thing here in Texas when OC (with a permit) became legal. So far, I haven't seen one gunfight on the courthouse square...well, at least none as a side effect of OC being legal.

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Old 06-21-2016, 08:20 PM
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I would trust the Fed as far as I can throw an Angus bull.....
I want no part in a Federal License to Carry. We, the people, have already allowed our ... government, to expand far outside the boundaries of The Constitution. We have got to stop.

A wise man once said"... those that would trade freedom for security, will soon have neither"
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Old 06-21-2016, 08:23 PM
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Considering the government's special ability is being able to screw up a wet dream.....

No,just a whole lot of no.
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Old 06-21-2016, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
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I would trust the Fed as far as I can throw an Angus bull.....
I want no part in a Federal License to Carry. We, the people, have already allowed our ... government, to expand far outside the boundaries of The Constitution. We have got to stop.

A wise man once said"... those that would trade freedom for security, will soon have neither"
Just another way to "control" us law abiding citizens. With me, it makes no difference anyway since I lost all my guns in that dreadful "boating accident".
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Old 06-21-2016, 11:36 PM
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Quote:
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We already have a national carry law: the Second Amendment. Article VI paragraph 2 declares that the United States Constitution the supreme law of the land. No state has authority to abridge the rights guaranteed to us by the United States Constitution. No law is valid that contradicts the United States Constitution.

We've screwed up the second we're bought in to the spurious bull sugar that our rights to bear arms can be abridged.
Ding ding ding... we have a winner!

States are making good progress. Shall Issue swept most of the country during the past 25 years, now Constitutional carry is slowly coming around. Idaho just became the 9th Constitutional carry state. Here in Tennessee we're moving in that direction slowly... recently it became legal to carry loaded guns in vehicles absent a permit.

The Feds have no Constitutional authority to be fiddling with the right of the people to bear arms, and no good will come of it.
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Old 06-22-2016, 06:13 AM
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Quote:
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I respectfully disagree.


I wouldn't be so quick to label other states (or people) as "anti-gun" simply because they don't look at gun laws or their enforcement exactly like Oklahoma does.
Not calling states like NJ, NY, CY, CA and others "anti-gun" would just be wishful thinking.
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Old 06-22-2016, 08:31 AM
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I agree a "federal" concealed carry permit has pitfalls. One would be that it would exist at the whim of each new administration or congressional majority.

But the issuance of a "Federal" permit hasn't been the idea behind proposed national carry bills.

Instead, those bills have promoted the idea of having common federal standards for permits and a federal requirement for an appropriately issued state permit to be honored in all 50 states - or at least in all states that offer concealed carry permits. (Although I'd personally prefer the Fed flex it's muscles and extend shall issue concealed carry permits as a requirement for all states as an application of the second amendment).

It's the same as the expectation that a state issued VDL be honored in all 50 states - at least until the visitor becomes a resident, and then it's just an administrative process to trade the out of state VDL for an in-state VDL.

It's also similar to the concept used in sharing UI wage data, where the federal government develops the overarching agreement that states then sign to allow the process to happen. It's legitimate role for the federal government to take in coordinating interstate activities.

To make that happen however, there would have to be agreement on permit requirements, such as a finger print based back ground check, a mental health back ground check (just a check for prior involuntary committals in the state), classroom training in firearm safety and the use of deadly force, was well as range training and a qualification component.

There would be some debate over the number of classroom hours and rounds fired in training, qualification courses, etc, but in general those elements would effectively meet the most rigorous permit requirements in states that issue permits on a shall issue basis.

The payoff would be not just increased reciprocity, but automatic reciprocity.

It is however one of those issues that causes problems for conservatives. On the one hand, it's promoting a conservative value of greater freedom in exercising 2A rights. On the other hand it's infringing on the conservative value of states' rights - specifically the right of a state to decide not to allow concealed carry.

Despite Republican majorities in both houses, it hasn't happened, and it hasn't happened in large part due to the conflicting "conservative" values, augmented by the concerns of constituents in various states that they'd face more rigorous requirements for a permit that met a common federal standard (and presumably might not qualify for one).

That's unfortunate as one permit does not preclude the other. For example, SD for example has a basic permit that requires a $10 fee, a basic back ground check and 2-3 days for the local sheriffs office to process it. SD also has an enhanced permit with a $100 fee, training requirements and a minimum 98 round live fire training requirement intended to get broader reciprocity, particularly, with surrounding states who have more stringent back ground and training requirements.

A common federal standards permit could be handled the same way, with states offering their own basic permit, and an "enhanced" federal compliant permit.

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Old 06-22-2016, 10:09 AM
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IMHO the 2nd Amendment already did that. All else is hooey.
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Old 06-22-2016, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Bob T View Post
IMHO the 2nd Amendment already did that. All else is hooey.
The original 2A applied only to the federal government. States were free to control guns. The theory was that a federal government would get too powerful and that the states needed to be able to match the power of the feds, and the way to do that was an armed citizenry free from federal control. That ship has sailed. Money is speech, corporations are persons, super pacs are legal, the Patriot Act exists.
There are enough nations with citizens with no right to arms to disprove the theory that guns are a right from God and that the state can control and even eliminate them if it so chooses. It has happened, so it can happen again. You don't need guns for self defense. They help, but the right can be limited if the government so chooses. We have a procedure set up to modify the constitution and its amendments.
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Old 06-22-2016, 10:20 PM
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...There are enough nations with citizens with no right to arms to disprove the theory that guns are a right from God and that the state can control and even eliminate them if it so chooses. It has happened, so it can happen again. You don't need guns for self defense. They help, but the right can be limited if the government so chooses. We have a procedure set up to modify the constitution and its amendments.
The same can be said of all the other unalienable rights. They can and have been infringed upon by over-reaching governments - including our own. Some governments prevent people from speaking freely, or the press from publishing anything other than the party line.

None of that changes the fact (not theory) that these are UNALIENABLE RIGHTS, that are our natural birthright as human beings (bestowed on us by our Creator IMO).

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Old 06-23-2016, 12:18 PM
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A Federal or National carry permit is a very bad idea. Along with all the previously mentioned reasons, consider this. Do you really want politicians and bureaucrats a thousand miles away and from vastly different areas making the rules about who, how, when and where you can carry your handgun in your own home town?
I think not.
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Old 06-23-2016, 01:24 PM
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Thanks again, folks. More good points, all. I was looking at it this way. All states have gun laws in one form or another that address open and concealed carry, and the requirements for obtaining a permit...if one is needed in the state. Some states are more strict than others for getting a permit, I get that. Fortunately my state, Texas, has permit reciprocity with most other states. I am lucky in that sense. However, what if I want to travel to a state that does not have reciprocity with my state? Unless that state has no law prohibiting open carry (Nevada, for example), I'm SOL for carrying there. This is what brings me to my original point. Rather than having to wade through the various state laws to see when ,where, how, or if at all I can carry there (which I certainly don't mind doing), it just seems it would be much easier to have one federal license that is recognized by all states. Of course there would need to be stringent requirements for obtaining such a license (i.e., background checks, fingerprinting, classroom training, range qualification). We already have to do that in Texas. I'm thinking most people wouldn't have a problem with going through the qualification process if it could be guaranteed that under normal circumstances, your permit could not be revoked without just cause. But again, this is the federal government we are talking about. Their "just cause" might be they don't like the color of my hair, or something similarly ridiculous. I know, I know, this is something that will never ever happen. Just wishful thinking.

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Old 06-23-2016, 01:27 PM
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I'll throw my vote to the "no federal CC license" group.

* The constitution does not empower the US government to license carry. As mentioned, it is already addressed by the 2nd.

* The way our system of government works, everything is legal unless specifically made illegal by statute. By empowering the government to issue licenses, you in fact making carry illegal except through their permission. And now you are headed down that slippery slope. No Thanks.

* Despite the claims that it would not replace state licenses, I expect it will. When the Feds have assumed the power to regulate an activity, they tend to claim the EXCLUSIVE power to regulate said activity. They don't like to share, and pull out the 'Federal law trumps state law' thing...

* Reciprocity? It will come with all kinds of strings attached, such as some sort of mutually agreed upon minimum training standards, which could end up to be onerous - for example, IL vs IN.

* States don't need the Fed's help for reciprocity. As mentioned with drivers licenses, the states did that themselves. However, the previously mentioned 'minimum standards' came into play.

* The feds are only empowered to regulate INTERSTATE commerce, not INTRA-STATE commerce - They have no authority to dictate to the state what places are and aren't off limits for carry. It would not alleviate the responsibility to know and obey local laws.

It is a state issue, and should remain so.
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Old 06-23-2016, 02:53 PM
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I'll throw my vote to the "no federal CC license" group.

* The constitution does not empower the US government to license carry. As mentioned, it is already addressed by the 2nd.

* The way our system of government works, everything is legal unless specifically made illegal by statute. By empowering the government to issue licenses, you in fact making carry illegal except through their permission. And now you are headed down that slippery slope. No Thanks.

* Despite the claims that it would not replace state licenses, I expect it will. When the Feds have assumed the power to regulate an activity, they tend to claim the EXCLUSIVE power to regulate said activity. They don't like to share, and pull out the 'Federal law trumps state law' thing...

* Reciprocity? It will come with all kinds of strings attached, such as some sort of mutually agreed upon minimum training standards, which could end up to be onerous - for example, IL vs IN.

* States don't need the Fed's help for reciprocity. As mentioned with drivers licenses, the states did that themselves. However, the previously mentioned 'minimum standards' came into play.

* The feds are only empowered to regulate INTERSTATE commerce, not INTRA-STATE commerce - They have no authority to dictate to the state what places are and aren't off limits for carry. It would not alleviate the responsibility to know and obey local laws.

It is a state issue, and should remain so.
A couple of final thoughts, then I'll quit beating this dead horse. It was only a "what if" question to begin with.

As I have repeatedly stated, I realize this is something that will never happen for lots of reasons. For one, I seriously doubt all the states would ever agree upon a minimum set of standards deemed good enough for them to dump their state permits in favor of a federal permit. As for leaving it up to the states to decide and work out reciprocity amongst themselves, you are correct, they already do that...just like driver's licenses. But unlike driver's licenses, every state does not recognize every other state's carry permit...at least not at this time. That's where the rub comes in. What I'm saying is, all a federal permit would do is allow you to carry in any state. Obviously you would still have to obey state and local laws regarding such...the same as with driver's license and driving within any state.

Of course if all states would adopt constitutional carry, this whole argument would be unnecessary. Yeah, like that's ever gonna happen.

Cheers, everyone! Happy shooting!

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  #36  
Old 06-23-2016, 03:56 PM
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Since the 2nd Amendment to the US Constitution guarantees me, a citizen the right to KEEP AND BEAR ARMS,doesn't that mean I don't need a special license either state or federal to do so???? Keep means own and bear means carry... Case closed.
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  #37  
Old 06-23-2016, 04:09 PM
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I have a LEOSA permit. It is not quite the panacea everyone thinks it is because although you can carry nationwide, you must obey the laws where you are carrying. So if you are carrying in a state like CA, or NY what are you going to do? Depends on if their law exempts retired law enforcement officers.

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Old 06-23-2016, 05:49 PM
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Not sure what you're saying. LEOSA preempts state CCW laws with very few exceptions. (Like carriage in government buildings.)

And it absolutely DOES cover retired LEO's who qualify per LEOSA standards..

For the record, I have carried in New York (including NYC) and California on many occasions. Chicago and DC, too.

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I have a LEOSA permit. It is not quite the panacea everyone thinks it is because although you can carry nationwide, you must obey the laws where you are carrying. So if you are carrying in a state like CA, or NY what are you going to do? Depends on if their law exempts retired law enforcement officers.
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Old 06-23-2016, 06:49 PM
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If another state refuses to recognize my Handgun Permit, then I just don't go there. I'll spend my money in friendlier places.
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Old 06-24-2016, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by dougb1946 View Post
The original 2A applied only to the federal government. States were free to control guns.
Read the actual wording. 1st: Congress shall not….
2nd: The right to keep and bear shall not….
States can't deny a Constitutionally guaranteed right.
Nuff said.

Last edited by Bob T; 06-24-2016 at 10:23 AM.
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Old 06-24-2016, 11:04 AM
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As a retired federal agent, I recall that it took a full twelve years to get HR 218 passed from its inception. Even then, we may not carry in establishments in those states where individual proprietors may post legally enforceable "no guns" signs. Also, we are not exempt from magazine limits unless we qualify periodically with the same or substantially identical handgun we carried on the job.

While I don't ever see a federal firearms carry license in the future, a national reciprocity program could work because, like drivers' licenses, states rights are not usurped by the federal government. Many adjoining states have reciprocity but don't hold your breath in the wake of the firestorm following the Pulse Nightclub tragedy in Orlando.
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Old 06-24-2016, 11:04 AM
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Generally, I think that if we're going to rely on the federal government to give us permission to do something its going to turn out to be a bad idea that we can't undo.
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Old 06-24-2016, 11:54 AM
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I heard a little snipet on the news the other day about a move afoot to adopt a federal license to carry that would be good anywhere and everywhere. I just heard it in passing and didn't hear any details. I realize something like this would probably never pass congress, let alone be signed into law, given our current political environment and gun control arguments underway, but it makes sense. I also realize there are some states and local municipalities that would likely never accept it. Personally, I think it's a good idea...one federal carry permit that covers the entire country. Then you could eliminate the plethora of state and local rules governing (translated as prohibiting) licensed carry. Does this make sense to anyone else?
Will never happen, at least not in my lifetime. Chicago, NYC, Philly honoring permits? Maybe after The Rapture.
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Old 06-24-2016, 11:57 AM
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I heard a little snipet on the news the other day about a move afoot to adopt a federal license to carry that would be good anywhere and everywhere. I just heard it in passing and didn't hear any details. I realize something like this would probably never pass congress, let alone be signed into law, given our current political environment and gun control arguments underway, but it makes sense. I also realize there are some states and local municipalities that would likely never accept it. Personally, I think it's a good idea...one federal carry permit that covers the entire country. Then you could eliminate the plethora of state and local rules governing (translated as prohibiting) licensed carry. Does this make sense to anyone else?
And now, the Feds have a list of every gun owner in the US? That doesn't sound good to me.
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Old 06-24-2016, 01:21 PM
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States can't deny a Constitutionally guaranteed right.
Looks to me like a bunch of 'em are doing a pretty good job of it. And not just regarding the Second Amendment, either.
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Old 06-24-2016, 04:13 PM
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And now, the Feds have a list of every gun owner in the US? That doesn't sound good to me.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if you have ever bought a new gun and filled out those federal forms they ALREADY have a list. The FFL dealers keep records that the issuers of that FFL can request at any time. So unless all you have is a gun bought off the street you're in the database.
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Old 06-24-2016, 04:31 PM
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I have a question,wouldn't that mean the Fed's would be replacing the States rights to control who carry weapons in their states?
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Old 06-24-2016, 05:03 PM
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Also, we are not exempt from magazine limits unless we qualify periodically with the same or substantially identical handgun we carried on the job.
You should have stopped when you wrote "we are not exempt from magazine limits". LEOSA does not exempt from mag limits. LEOs/retirees are limited to whatever the state or local govt limits on mag size. It doesn't matter what you qualified with or anything about what you carried on the job. Read LEOSA. It says nothing at all about such. LEOSA doesn't care what you carried on the job nor if what you carry now is substantially identical. None of that is anywhere in LEOSA.

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I have a LEOSA permit. It is not quite the panacea everyone thinks it is because although you can carry nationwide, you must obey the laws where you are carrying. So if you are carrying in a state like CA, or NY what are you going to do? Depends on if their law exempts retired law enforcement officers.
Not at all true. You really need to have someone knowledgeable with your dept explain LEOSA to you. LEOSA exempts LEOs/qualified retirees from state and local exemptions. That is the exactly purpose of LEOSA. Read the very first paragraph of LEOSA. That's what it says.
It also doesn't matter what state/local govt says about retirees. Again, that's the very purpose of LEOSA, to exempt LEOs/retirees from state/local restrictions.
Please, read LEOSA. It's very plainly written. Simple to understand. We continually get LEOs who interject totally erroneous information claiming LEOSA says such and such or this and that. It's like they've never read the statute. It's been law for almost 12 years and we still have cops who can't understand a simple law like LEOSA.
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Old 06-24-2016, 05:21 PM
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I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if you have ever bought a new gun and filled out those federal forms they ALREADY have a list. The FFL dealers keep records that the issuers of that FFL can request at any time. So unless all you have is a gun bought off the street you're in the database.
Having purchased new guns, obtained a carry permit, purchased NFA items and buy most everything gun related with a credit card... I have cleverly limited my name to only the following government agencies- local Sheriff, Tenn Dept of Homeland Security, ATF and FBI. My name is only in about a dozen FFL books. Only VISA, AMEX and Discover and maybe a 100 Net dealers of guns, ammo and accessories know I own guns. Low profile dude... low profile. Oh yeah forgot... I am quite regularly reminded that I'm on the NRA's list.
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Old 06-24-2016, 05:49 PM
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Ding ding ding... we have a winner!

States are making good progress. Shall Issue swept most of the country during the past 25 years, now Constitutional carry is slowly coming around. Idaho just became the 9th Constitutional carry state. Here in Tennessee we're moving in that direction slowly... recently it became legal to carry loaded guns in vehicles absent a permit.

The Feds have no Constitutional authority to be fiddling with the right of the people to bear arms, and no good will come of it.
NOT so fast in Texas though. Just noticed this TODAY as I was attending to business in town:

Texas Law That Allows Prohibition of Concealed Carry

I try to stay legal and safe, however, sometimes that is not clear! I keep things in the vehicle in the parking lot, however... (not all things are as simple as they wish they to appear). I am not so safe when handling my health care,... never mind that my needs are directly related to my efforts to protect this Country.

BTW, having the blues in a red State is not the easiest way to live!... Especially when you love gun ownership and all that goes with it!
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