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  #51  
Old 03-02-2018, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Pisgah View Post

But my main defense against encountering any sort of problem with police was -- I avoided getting stopped. I learned long ago that it takes 18 hours to make the drive whether I keep to the speed limit or push it, so while I avoid delays wherever possible I basically strive to conduct myself as the safest, most low-profile driver on the road. So far, so good!
^^ This.

When we lived down in SC and would make the trip back home here to spend time with family, i'd occasionally bring along a couple toys for some "fun on the farm" during get-togethers. As our drive took us thru IL, I'd be the one driver on the hiway not speeding lol. In fact i probably didn't even stop for gas or any pitstops either until I hit WI, esp when bypassing Chicago......

It's amazing, dont do anything to draw attn and one can get by without being hassled.
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Old 03-03-2018, 03:18 PM
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CH4 (or methane?), what is a typical reasonable time? I've often wondered how long they can detain someone...
*
In a Terry encounter, the answer is, long enough to confirm or dispel the suspicion of criminality. If the State has a reasonably good LE computer system, and/or adequate training, the added time in a traffic based vehicle stop should be about impossible to discern. Some states have primitive/slow/crummy systems, and some have subpar training, neither of which is excusable.

In this State, WAPA (Washington Association of Prosecuting Attorneys) does a LOT to improve the training on such issues. The change in the quality of training on this and other issues as a result of Pam's (our staff attorney and all around first rate nerd) efforts over the last decade has been truly impressive.

You can go to "http://70.89.120.146/wapa/manuals.html" and look for the 2015 (latest edition) Search and Seizure Manual - it's the fifth one down on the list. Don't print it - put on your desktop if you really want it, as it is a 435 page PDF. (I do, and teach our deputies to do so, too.) For those outside Washington, some of our search and seizure rules will be more restrictive on LE than yours because of our state constitution. That provision (Article 1, section 7) is more protective of privacy than the 4th amendment.

For a good general discussion of Terry issues, go to your favorite search engine and search for "Routledge Doug Mitchell". I know the authors - ugly as can be, but great folks and really smart. It is designed to be approachable but valid for a broad potential audience, from cops of all ranks, to prosecutors and LE legal advisors and private citizens who want to be more informed. The authors are also available to do day long seminars for the same audience(s). If you are really crazy, you can spend the time and money to get a copy of LaFave's search and seizure treatise, but it's several hundred dollars and 6 volumes with the index. The portion on Terry is well over 700 pages in a small font.
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  #53  
Old 03-04-2018, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Pisgah View Post
L
But my main defense against encountering any sort of problem with police was -- I avoided getting stopped. I learned long ago that it takes 18 hours to make the drive whether I keep to the speed limit or push it, so while I avoid delays wherever possible I basically strive to conduct myself as the safest, most low-profile driver on the road. So far, so good!
That's what the cruise control is for. Plus driving what looks like an unmarked police car.
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Old 03-06-2018, 01:40 PM
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I haven’t been pulled over by the Police since 1986. Must be doing it right.
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Old 05-24-2018, 03:06 PM
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There are valid online places to verify reciprocity. Assume the LEO will NOT know & be polite. It will go way further to solving a question that attitude. Kali requires I tell the LEO during any investigatory interaction, including traffic stop, that I am legally carrying with a valid permit. Even if the state I am in does not require this, my permit does, so failure could cost me my permit.
Know the laws of the state you are visiting before you go. Today it is a click or two & you have all the info you need.
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Old 05-24-2018, 03:53 PM
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This thread makes me appreciate Dubya and LEOSA even more.
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  #57  
Old 05-24-2018, 04:15 PM
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I have a Michigan Concealed Pistol License, and was stopped by the Arkansas State Police while carrying a loaded concealed pistol. I provided the officer with my Michigan Drivers License, Concealed Pistol License, Registration, and Proof of Insurance. I also informed the officer I was armed, and the location of the pistol. The officer took my materials, and went back to his vehicle. He returned approximately three minutes later, and asked why I was driving so slowly (65 in a 70.) I told the officer my vehicle got 20% better gas mileage at that speed. He laughed and told me to have a nice day. (There is reciprocity between Arkansas and Michigan.)
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Old 05-24-2018, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Ivan the Butcher View Post

BTW, There is no quota on tickets. The police can write you as many as they think you need! So keep your Big Mouth Shut! (That is a line from my 27 year veteran training sergeant F-I-L!)
Whenever I get a comment about ticket quota Isay that quotas are for things like fishing where you have to stop after reaching a certain number. I don’t have any quota so I can keep working all day.
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  #59  
Old 05-24-2018, 05:34 PM
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Remember who you are dealing with the OHSP there does not seem to be a happy middle ground with them all I have delt been great but they do have there a______s and they are the ones that keep people on edge. You never know who you get stopped by. Check handgunlawus and print a copy of there chart showingg where your CCW is good
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Old 05-24-2018, 05:54 PM
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You sure get pulled over a lot... and I was in Oak Hill yesterday and came through unscathed. Generally, if you do nothing to call attention to yourself, you don’t have to justify anything.
Funny how those with the most to hide/loose will often be the first to call attention to themselves.
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Old 05-24-2018, 06:04 PM
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That's what the cruise control is for. Plus driving what looks like an unmarked police car.
Not sure what US vehicle cruise controls are like but here there is quite a variation in quality.

Even when using cruise control, which I do almost always, you need to watch your speed and modify your settings.

In my 2006 Ford runabout car speed will go up and down with undulations in the road. On any decent downhill slope I need to brake to keep speed under control.

Same with our last “for good” car, a 2015 Hyundai Accent.

Our 2017 Mazda CZ3 is almost perfect, mostly no more increase than 3-4 km/h, but there are still a few places you need to watch it.

My 2017 patrol car, and it’s 2015 predecessor, like my Mazda are almost perfect, but there are still down slopes where I shift the transmission into manual mode and set it in 3rd, otherwise I’d pick up 15 km/h by the time I hit the bottom.

Twice in the past few months I have stopped people driving the same model of car as my patrol car and drivers have told me that it’s impossible to keep them at the speed limit, I tell them Ikve been driving this model of car for 15years, since we changed from Ford, that it’s fitted with cruise control and easy to keep at or under the limit.
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Old 05-24-2018, 06:24 PM
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No issue. Reciprocity recognized, speeding ticket issued, have a nice day.

I was the passenger.
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Old 05-24-2018, 06:33 PM
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In Illinois we don't have to declare we are carrying but one of the first things out of a LEO's mouth will be are there any weapons on you or in the vehicle .. Our Conceal Carry License will show when they run your Drivers license ..

So if I was pulled over I would declare immediately .. Handing my CC license to him as I give him my Drivers license ..

Saying -- I have a Conceal Carry License and I am carrying at 4 o'clock how would you like to proceed .. after a reply by him I would continue with - my License is in my left back pocket opposite of my weapon ..

I will not say "GUN" ever and WEAPON" only after getting a reply from him after telling him of my CC License .. while initially talking to them ..

But neither me or my wife have been pulled over since 1976 .. as we both follow speed limits and all other driving laws including making a complete stop at a Stop sign .. no rolling stops !! so there is little to no reason to be pulled over .. Going thru a road block on vacation in Arizona .. the State police there looked in the back of my Jeep and waved me thru not even looking at my license ..
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Old 05-24-2018, 07:02 PM
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I was traveling from Oklahoma thru Texas on the way home to New Mexico. I had just crossed into Texas and was 3 MPH over the posted speed limit. A Texas DPS officer, turned out he was a Corporal FTO, stopped me. Before he even asked for my license etc. his first words were, "Sir do you have any weapons in the vehicle?" I answered "Yes officer I do." OK where are they? I have a locked and loaded 1911 on my right hip and multiple long guns and carbines in the back.
THAT got his attention! Oh BTW Officer I have about 2,000 rounds for each of those weapons! Not the brightest remark at the time. He never missed a beat, hand never went to his weapon he only asked "Why do you have all those guns and ammo."
Simple explanation officer I've just completed a week long tactical long range rifle/carbine class in Oklahoma. Of course the handgun is part of the class as well.
Now he asks for my licenses, registration and insurance - he got my NM carry permit at the same time!
Sir Texas has a no tolerance ordinance for speeding, slow down and have a good day! Thank You Officer be safe and WY6.
Having been a Reserve Police Captain I learned one thing real fast...give respect get respect!!
Getting pulled over for 3 mph over the limit is ridiculous and does nothing more than create animosity towards police. I’m retired and love cops but any cop who pulls someone over for less than 5 mph over the limit should have much better things to do. And there’s no doubt that it’s a shakedown or out of state drivers. Pay fine no questions asked and no points on license.
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Old 05-24-2018, 07:47 PM
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Getting pulled over for 3 mph over the limit is ridiculous and does nothing more than create animosity towards police. I’m retired and love cops but any cop who pulls someone over for less than 5 mph over the limit should have much better things to do. And there’s no doubt that it’s a shakedown or out of state drivers. Pay fine no questions asked and no points on license.
In New Zealand we have a 5 kms/3mph threshold for heavy vehicles, around schools during school times (including for Saturday sports) and during public holiday periods.

It is not universally liked and we get a lock of grief about it.
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Old 05-24-2018, 08:16 PM
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In Texas, your CHL and D/L shows up on the Officers computer screen in his patrol car. He knows and sends his dispatcher this info also.
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Old 05-24-2018, 09:05 PM
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In New Zealand we have a 5 kms/3mph threshold for heavy vehicles, around schools during school times (including for Saturday sports) and during public holiday periods.

It is not universally liked and we get a lock of grief about it.
And how much money is generated from this practice? And how many off duty cops pulled over get tickets for it?
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Old 05-24-2018, 09:06 PM
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I travel out of state to visit relatives, and hope that reciprocity from their home states regarding the permits I have will protect me. When Ohio finally decided to honor Pa. Licenses to Carry Firearms, I wanted to find out how my License would be recognized.

I was at a gun show in Ohio and there was a booth for an Ohio firearms association. I asked them how a PA License to Carry would be treated. The people there really didn't know and suggested talking with the State Trooper who was there. So I asked him what would happen if I was pulled over in Ohio and found to be carrying a concealed firearm while holding a license from another state. He said that the license would be checked to see if it was issued by a reciprocating state. So then I asked, "Is that a 5 minute or a 5 hour process?" He then proceeded to give me a boatload of attitude that I shouldn't carry a loaded gun in a vehicle and should carry the gun and ammunition separate. I thought I asked a legitimate question to see if I got stopped in Ohio whether I would soon be on my way or spending a night in jail.

So my question to all is have you ever been pulled over while carrying concealed using a permit issued by a state different from the one you were pulled over in? How were you treated? What was the end result from the stop? Thank you for your time.
I live in central Pennsylvania, near Harrisburg. I have a PDF copy from the Pennsylvania Office of Attorney General called Concealed Carry License Reciprocity, dated April 16th, 2018.

P.M. me with your email address and I will be happy to send you a copy as an email attachment. As a side note, Pennsylvania recently dropped Virginia as a state having reciprocity with Pennsylvania, so it's good to have the current list of states where concealed carry is OK, just in case.

Good luck,
Mike
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Old 05-24-2018, 09:13 PM
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"States where Pennsylvania Residents with only a Pennsylvania Concealed Carry License can carry a concealed Firearm"

***This is DIFFERENT that other states that require a PA. resident to APPLY for the other state's carry permit***

Other states recognize Pennsylvania concealed carry licenses through reciprocity agreements, statutory reciprocity, or unilateral recognition. Pennsylvania residents with only a valid Pennsylvania concealed carry license may carry a concealed firearm in the following states without applying for a separate concealed carry license in that state:

1. Alabama +/∞ 2. Alaska */∞ 3. Arizona */∞ 4. Arkansas +/∞ 5. Colorado + 6. Florida * 7. Georgia * 8. Idaho */∞ 9. Indiana +/∞ 10. Iowa +/∞ 11. Kansas + 12. Kentucky */∞ 13. Louisiana + 14. Maine ∞ 15. Michigan +/∞ 16. Mississippi */+/∞ 17. Missouri */+/∞
18. Montana + 19. New Hampshire */∞ 20. North Carolina * 21. North Dakota */∞ 22. Ohio +/∞ 23. Oklahoma +/∞ 24. South Dakota */∞ 25. Tennessee * 26. Texas * 27. Utah */∞ 28. Vermont ∞ 29. Virginia ∞ 30. West Virginia */∞ 31. Wisconsin +/∞ 32. Wyoming *

Pennsylvania residents with a valid Pennsylvania concealed carry license may carry a concealed firearm in any of the states listed above regardless of the type of reciprocity. The above chart is for informational purposes only. Pennsylvania residents should contact any state they are going to visit to verify whether there are any additional restrictions in that state’s laws.

The type of recognition for each state above is noted as follows: * = Written Reciprocity Agreement + = Mutual Statutory Reciprocity ∞ = Unilateral Recognition by another state.

Direct quotes from the PA. Attorney General latest hand out.
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Old 05-24-2018, 09:46 PM
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Go to “Handgunlaw.us”,it gives you all the info you need on what state recognizes your permit plus that states handgun laws. It is updated about every 2 weeks. Last update was 5/18/2018.
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Old 05-24-2018, 09:49 PM
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Go to “Handgunlaw.us”,it gives you all the info you need on what state recognizes your permit plus that states handgun laws. It is updated about every 2 weeks. Last update was 5/18/2018.

I did not read the above post,so I apologize if someone has already posted the above information.

Be SAFE and shoot often!
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Old 05-25-2018, 02:42 AM
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And how much money is generated from this practice? And how many off duty cops pulled over get tickets for it?
$30 fee for 0-10 km/h over the limit.

Back in May 1984 when I started I was told it cost $30 to process a $25 fee. Must cost well over $100 these days.

Don’t know how many off duty cops get nabbed. I try not to be one of them.
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Old 05-25-2018, 04:59 AM
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Another thing you might want to find out before you travel though different states is if you have an obligation to disclose you are armed. Here in NC you must disclose to the officer upon contact that you are armed. Some states I understand you have no duty to disclose.
Maine has Constitutional and permitted carry. Your choice.
If pulled over by law enforcement CC must disclose, permitted aren’t required to.
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Old 05-27-2018, 02:20 PM
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from my research when a plate or drivers license is run it will show the OWNERS information including
whether He/She have a CC License or not .. seems that info is on all police records .. the LEO making
the stop might not see it on his computer but the dispatcher will ..

I would think most officers would appreciate the heads up !! And as others have said if not reporting and
a gun is seen things could go bad very quickly ..

Last edited by Whitwabit; 05-27-2018 at 02:28 PM.
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