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  #151  
Old 09-02-2018, 03:15 AM
Whitwabit Whitwabit is offline
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Originally Posted by Breakaway500 View Post
When I leave home I assess my potential threat level and carry accordingly. Usually it's the P32 that goes for a pocket ride. I can put 8 rounds in a half dollar size target at 5 paces very rapidly (I practice often) so that should take care of self defense.Threat level higher..I'll take a J frame in .38, IWB holster. Anything else I leave to law enforcement. I'm no hero..sorry someone robbed your store,stole your car, your pocketbook etc etc. Maybe you should carry a gun. The 12 gauges keeps me safe while at home.
How can you assess a threat to where your going before you get there an know what is going on ???
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  #152  
Old 09-02-2018, 11:51 AM
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I've carried many different guns at one time or other over the last 40+ years, 1911's, BHP's, Colt and S&W 38-357 wheelguns, S&W 9mm, SIG 9mm and 40, Glock 9mm and 40. Some by personal choice some by department regulation. I've never felt inadequately armed with any of them. I still own examples of each but these days 99% of the time I carry a Glock 19 by choice. It's light, concealable, easy to shoot, provides 30 rounds when carried with a spare mag and if the worst happens and it ends up damaged, lost, or setting in a property room as evidence, then less then $500.00 (blue label) at any gun shop and I'm back in business without me mourning the loss of one of my custom 1911's, or S&W's. Just my .02
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  #153  
Old 09-02-2018, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by BC38 View Post
This is one of those every-other-week, beat-it-to-death, opinions-are-like-orifices, topics.

I'm with officer Callahan on this one - you'll get responses from all the types he cited - 'nuff said.
Ain't that the truth.
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  #154  
Old 09-02-2018, 04:25 PM
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I have the utmost confidence in my old BHP which I carried for over 40 years backed up by a model 36. I have since retired and replaced the 36 with a 649-2 which I pocket carry. If I were going out to a place where I suspected trouble I would bring both guns. Today however, I avoid troublespots like the plague and for SD being a very close encounter I just carry the 649-2 with an extra speed strip. If I could only carry one it would always be a revolver.
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  #155  
Old 09-02-2018, 05:47 PM
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Considering the number of realistic possibilities I've read or heard about and that criminals often work in pairs (or more) - not to mention 4 legged attackers, I am more comfortable carrying a higher round count than my chiefs special allows. Thus, I carry a Shield 9mm.
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  #156  
Old 09-02-2018, 06:25 PM
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For me, lighter and smaller is always better, That is why my carry gun is a .25 ACP Galesi that fits in my front pants pocket. I have never been in circumstances where it was needed and do not expect to be. If I ever find myself in such circumstances, that pistol will be enough.
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  #157  
Old 09-03-2018, 09:20 AM
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Still hoping I can find a .357 Sig barrel for my S&W Performance Center "Shorty 40" (first issue 1993)

I know there are a few out there in 2 barrel sets and, at one time in the past, there were drop in barrels from outside manufacturers.

DANG, if I could just find one !!
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  #158  
Old 09-03-2018, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Protected One View Post
Considering the number of realistic possibilities I've read or heard about and that criminals often work in pairs (or more) - not to mention 4 legged attackers, I am more comfortable carrying a higher round count than my chiefs special allows. Thus, I carry a Shield 9mm.
Do you really think 2 more rounds makes a difference?
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  #159  
Old 09-03-2018, 12:00 PM
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When hiking on my hunting lease which has an active wild boar population- a S&W model 19 loaded with 180 grain hard cast bullets. At home, a 12 gauge mounted with a good flashlight or the model 19. When I feel I need to carry concealed, a S&W 3913 due to weight and size considerations.
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  #160  
Old 09-03-2018, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Rastoff View Post
Do you really think 2 more rounds makes a difference?
You forgot the chamber. Make that 3 or 4 depending on which magazine. Plus way quicker reloads. So you're talking, at minimum, more than half again the capacity of your J frame 38.

Last edited by oink; 09-03-2018 at 01:05 PM.
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  #161  
Old 09-03-2018, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rastoff View Post
Do you really think 2 more rounds makes a difference?
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post
You forgot the chamber. Make that 3 or 4 depending on which magazine. Plus way quicker reloads. So you're talking, at minimum, more than half again the capacity of your J frame 38.
But then... If you use the MagGuts replacement springs, depending on the Spring set you get (the original, or the +2), you're talking 10-11 rounds per Shield mag.
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  #162  
Old 09-03-2018, 01:44 PM
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I'll relate a short story some may find relevant: On my last visit to the range with my new 69, which I like very much, I fired about 40 rounds and then the gun locked up. I had just cleaned it before my range session so I knew it couldn't be lead or gunk, besides I was shooting jacketed bullets. I opened the cylinder to look for a high primer (my reloads), nope. Closed it up again. Nope, still won't turn. Opened again, looked again, nothing. Try again but still no go. OK, open again, dump rounds, both fired casings and unfired rounds. Aha! the extractor/star has a small piece of what looks like lint but upon closer examination is found to be a very small shred of a couple of short threads of cleaning patch. That was locking up the gun, that tiny piece of patch. Picked it out with my fingernail and all was good. Just where the heck was it hiding during the previous 40 or so rounds.

The bigger issue is that it's a bit concerning that such a tiny little scrap could lock up the gun. Hows that not an issue with pocket carry. Does no one besides me ever have a thread come loose from inside their pants pocket. Well, apparently that thread is enough, given bad luck, to find the perfect spot to lock up your gun and be darn near invisible while doing it.

Don't get me wrong, I love revolvers and I have an AIWB holster for the 69 and speed strips for it too. It's really a pretty easy carry. And I do use it for my carry gun sometimes. But not because I think it's the wisest thing to do. I accept that my reasons for using it for the occasional EDC are because I can, although retired I'm still a better shot than the majority of current crop of cops (I used to enjoy outshooting the younger guys and their wonder 9s with my wheelguns), I love revolvers and carried one on duty most of my career, and I like big bores.

A small or medium size quality 9mm or similar really does, IMHO, make more sense for EDC and in my experience the reliability of Glocks is unsurpassed.

So there! That's my opinion on the topic that everyone was waiting so impatiently for.
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  #163  
Old 09-03-2018, 01:59 PM
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I used a fly rod and reel when trout fishing.

A spinning rod and reel when bass fishing.

I could use either one if I wanted too.
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  #164  
Old 09-03-2018, 02:00 PM
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I started out with the BG380 after many probs I sent it to Galloway Precision and had em do the full treatment it is now a very good weapon.I then got a 327 8 shot 357 revolver I love it but it is somewhat hard to carry I now have a Kimber K6s,which is a joy to carry with a remora holster So sometimes I carry the 327 or the K6 with the BG as backup.
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  #165  
Old 09-03-2018, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DWalt View Post
For me, lighter and smaller is always better, That is why my carry gun is a .25 ACP Galesi that fits in my front pants pocket. I have never been in circumstances where it was needed and do not expect to be. If I ever find myself in such circumstances, that pistol will be enough.
I agree ! if ever you need something, quick easy and ready, the .25 autos (depending on your preferences) fit this need, perfectly.

My only concern in reliability. The Beretta 950s and baby Brownings, seem to have this market cornered, other than the clones. Both are nice, neat, petite, easy to maneuver, shoot rapidly and accurately at close range.

Inside the front pocket holster is just perfect.

Back in the early 1990s a Company in Florida "Felicci" made a mini 25 in stainless that looked almost exactly like a Seecamp .32.

See some patent material: Semi-automatic pistol with a dual safety - FELICCI; JOSEPH E.
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  #166  
Old 09-03-2018, 09:13 PM
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I'm eighty years old. I have congestive heart failure, atrial fibrillation, stage 3 COPD, slow-progressing pulmonary fibrosis, and less than 45% circulation in my right leg. I have degenerative disk disease and head-to-toe arthritis. I use a four-wheel walker and 24/7 oxygen. I am the poster child for easy pickings. It's too late to say I should have lived a cleaner life and stayed in shape. I'm not inclined to consider mat training in CQC even if I could afford it. I know a few really nasty little tricks if they are needed. But I also always carry a gun.

And silly me, I thought this thread was going to be a discussion of which kind of firearm to carry, and why. Which, if I think about it, pretty much could have ended for me with Inspector Callahan's thoughtful post, much earlier. Carry the gun with which you are familiar, comfortable and proficient.

I'm out. Carry on.
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  #167  
Old 09-03-2018, 10:38 PM
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I prefer the G19 rather than the revolver. Smaller size and weight, almost three times the capacity, less felt recoil, quicker reloads, etc., etc.
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  #168  
Old 09-03-2018, 11:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Holliday 1950 View Post
I posted this question on a different forum & would like to include

the S&W forum in this question.



What would you want to carry for SD, a 357 in magnum revolver(6 or 7 shot) or a Glock 19 you can sub any pistol & any 357 in magnum for this discussion.



At this present time I'm going between my new & improved 686 + revolver & my G19 gen 4 &/or my G43. My G19 is by far an easier pistol to shoot with accuracy that my G43.



However, my 686 + with my new trigger job is now my first choice to carry 24/7

even though its a monster to carry. My feelings are quality always trumps quantity no matter what your weapon de jour is.



As always, all responses are welcome.


Why choose? I carry a revolver AND A pistol, and a NAA 22 Magnum with Gold Dots.

Kimber K6S 6 Shot with 125 gr 357 Magnum in the right front pocket, and the NAA in the left.

Then, I have a Glock 19 or a Sig P365 Appendix Carry using Hornady Critical Defense.

Pocket carry is my first option to draw, as I have my hand in the pocket on the gun while I walk. I can draw faster than some can react in that mode. Faster than IWB Appendix by 0.25 sec.

Revolvers can’t be easily grabbed. Double action is hard to have a ND. 6 shots of 357 Magnum is not a slouch. The trigger is a smooth 9 lbs. there is nothing to snag, and my wood grips from Altamont are smooth and thin.

Appendix doesn’t interfere with the pocket carry, whereas 3:00 does. I don’t like 4:00 as it can be potentially grabbed from behind if someone felt it.




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  #169  
Old 09-04-2018, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shawn mccarver View Post
I prefer the G19 rather than the revolver. Smaller size and weight, almost three times the capacity, less felt recoil, quicker reloads, etc., etc.
I carry a G22 while riding the motorcycle, just because if I fall down it is expendable. Though I have thought of buying a Hi Point for that duty, it also would be expendable.
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  #170  
Old 09-06-2018, 02:19 AM
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The bigger issue is that it's a bit concerning that such a tiny little scrap could lock up the gun. Hows that not an issue with pocket carry.
Yet another reason I don't pocket carry. Of course a good holster would prevent this, but that's not what this thread is about. It's surprising what a tiny piece of debris can do to any gun, revolver or semi.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobzGuns View Post
But then... If you use the MagGuts replacement springs, depending on the Spring set you get (the original, or the +2), you're talking 10-11 rounds per Shield mag.
You're dodging the question. Do those few rounds really make a difference? Just for the record, I carry a semi, but extra capacity is not why.
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  #171  
Old 09-06-2018, 06:52 AM
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Glock 19 with an extra magazine
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  #172  
Old 09-06-2018, 08:23 AM
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I have CC’d either a Walther PPS or a Kahr P380 for many, many years. Every time I think I ‘need’ something better, newer or different, some careful consideration brings me back to the fact that these will do everything I need them to do, are reliable, and are perfect for their intended purpose. And at my age.......l am no longer concerned with the latest wonder product some gun writer or YouTube star is enamored with, or that my aged holster doesn’t color coordinate with my belt, shoes, nail color and expensive imported handbag.......
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  #173  
Old 09-06-2018, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
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But then... If you use the MagGuts replacement springs, depending on the Spring set you get (the original, or the +2), you're talking 10-11 rounds per Shield mag.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rastoff View Post
You're dodging the question. Do those few rounds really make a difference? Just for the record, I carry a semi, but extra capacity is not why.
You obviously disregarded the Big Grin emoji I used in my comment.

I carry the Shield and use the MagGuts kit, but (as I know you've seen in my comments in the MagGuts threads) not because of the extra capacity.
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  #174  
Old 09-06-2018, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
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Do you really think 2 more rounds makes a difference?
I'll let you know if I ever have to shoot. Until then, it is ALL just speculation.

One things for sure though....having them won't hurt.
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Old 09-07-2018, 07:15 AM
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Quote:
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Ain't that the truth.
I disagree. This can be quantified. We can deduce using reason and logic which is superior for self-defense.

Put another way, what handgun is superior for saving your life: a 5-shot J-Frame, 6-shot K-Frame, or a Performance Center 1911 9-shot 9MM?

We can do the metrics & factually determine superiority w/o opinion. Just the facts, ma'am.
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Old 09-07-2018, 09:34 AM
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I've tried the 357 and 9mm, but they jest left me feelin' somewhat light.

Now, it's 44's and 45's in the carry corral.




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Old 09-07-2018, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Holliday 1950 View Post
I posted this question on a different forum & would like to include
the S&W forum in this question.

What would you want to carry for SD, a 357 in magnum revolver(6 or 7 shot) or a Glock 19 you can sub any pistol & any 357 in magnum for this discussion.

At this present time I'm going between my new & improved 686 + revolver & my G19 gen 4 &/or my G43. My G19 is by far an easier pistol to shoot with accuracy that my G43.

However, my 686 + with my new trigger job is now my first choice to carry 24/7
even though its a monster to carry. My feelings are quality always trumps quantity no matter what your weapon de jour is.

As always, all responses are welcome.
HEY DH1950, WELCOME TO THE FORUM......

IMHO, THE ENHANCED M686+ IS A SUPERB WEAPON. YOU STARTED WITH A MODEL WHICH IS THE VERY BEST .357 MAGNUM REVOLVER IN CURRENT PRODUCTION, AND ACTUALLY MADE IT BETTER ! ! !

THE ICING ON THE CAKE IS THAT YOU CAN CARRY IT 24/7, WITH CONFIDENCE IN BOTH THE WEAPON AND YOURSELF......
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Old 09-07-2018, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMP3 View Post
I disagree. This can be quantified. We can deduce using reason and logic which is superior for self-defense.

Put another way, what handgun is superior for saving your life: a 5-shot J-Frame, 6-shot K-Frame, or a Performance Center 1911 9-shot 9MM?

We can do the metrics & factually determine superiority w/o opinion. Just the facts, ma'am.
I agree to a point, but it depends on the scenario. What's inherently better in one situation may not be better in another. I'll take an enclosed hammer J-Frame over any auto or full sized revolver in an ECQ scenario, but in a ranged gunfight, I would prefer a high capacity auto.
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Old 09-08-2018, 12:27 AM
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Hi Mister X,

While it might've been true in a bygone era, revolvers are not more reliable than good quality semis. I can tell you from direct knowledge of 3 catastrophic S&W revolver failures. When a revolver fails, it's outta da fight. I've never seen any good quality semi fail, and I have no clue of how many I fired and seen fired. The S&W 5904 was one of the very best handguns I've ever carried. The Sig P229 might just be the best self-defense double-action semi ever created. I've never seen a P229 experience any type of problem. I have no clue of how many thousands of rounds I fired through my P229.

I love J-Frame revolvers. I don't own lightweight J-Frames. I prefer all steel. With the FBI load, recoil ain't fun. I couldn't imagine shooting a .357 Mag outta a J-Frame, assuming a magnum round would have appreciable advantage at belly gun distance. My guess magnum founds in J-Frames would define diminishing returns.

Double-action revolvers are more complex and with more moving parts than semis, even double-action semis. A tiny spring breaks in a revolver, and it becomes a throwing weapon.

At best, The Chief Special is a one threat handgun. It takes far too long to reload another 5 rounds. The FBI load is at the apex of J-frame self-defense cartridges.

If I were to buy another self-defense handgun, it'd be a copy of Performance Center 1911 3" 9MM. I can reload a semi inside a few seconds while never taking my eyes off of a bad guy who's putting rounds on me.

Self-defense is a very personal decision. One has to choose the right way for him, not the right way for another. I love the Chief Special, but it's not a good choice for saving my life.
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  #180  
Old 09-08-2018, 12:31 AM
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IMO, the .380 is much better than nothing, but you could do better. It's not just the round, it the shot placement and your ability to hit you target under stress. I had a .380 semi-auto for a few years, but the more I learned (and saw), the less confidence I had in the .380 as an effective EDC. If my opponent has a gun and is trying to kill me, I don't want a .380. I want a heavy bullet at least 158 gr and preferably 180-230 gr. Consider either a .38 special +P or a compact .45 ACP. The bigger the hole (wound cavity), the more bleeding and the faster the target is incapacitated.
My take on the .380 Auto is that recent technology that has facilitated creation of 100% reliable sub-compact 9MM such as the Performance Center 1911 3" 9MM will cause the .380 Auto to become less attractive.
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  #181  
Old 09-08-2018, 12:41 AM
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The "shot placement is king" thing is so over done. Why every LEA teaches COM hits, because the avg shooter can deliver true accuracy in a combat situation. A 22lr in the heart is likely fatal but the guy can kill you long before he dies. So we use bigger calibers & multiple hits to stop an attack sooner than later. The bad guy needs one lucky shot to your CNS for you to lose the fight, just one. Bigger guys have lots of nonvital area to put bullets into, so having more before a reload is always better than having less.

^^^This is the best post I've read in this thread^^^
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  #182  
Old 09-08-2018, 01:22 AM
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Rastoff,

There's a reason martial arts are known as arts.

I've yet to meet a martial artist who didn't think he was a trained killer. Then they run into a dude who has never stepped into a dojo but knows how to fight and does not know losing. Martial arts ain't worth bandages when the opponent is an authentic bad dude who has done it many times.

Martial arts theory fails miserably in reality of a street fight. Size of opponent does matter. The bigger they are, the harder they hit.

Action is faster than reaction, which messes with martial arts strategy. A very bad dude who has already decided to drop you with a straight right to your chin will do it before you know you're on concrete.

Martial arts movies are choreographed. Bruce Lee was an actor. Chuck Norris is an actor. He used to compete in regulated competition. Regulated competition should never be confused with a street fight. There are no rules in street fights.

A couple weeks ago I met a petite woman in an upscale sports bar. She was a trained killer. She told me so. She had been trained by a few "masters" of trained killing. I asked her if she had ever been in a fight. She hadn't. I asked her how she thought it'd work out for her were a well put-up, studly dude to grab her. She was clueless. She was set up for failure. Someone had taught her enough to become a very real danger to herself. I told her to buy pepper spray.

Mike Tyson was the most overrated heavyweight to ever enter a ring. In the late 80's before he went to the joint for rape, he had signed to fight Holyfield. Ali said there was no way Tyson had a prayer against Holyfield. Holyfield was not a bum of the month. For his limited intellect, Tyson did manage to come up with a winner when he said, "Everyone has a plan until they get hit."

I've known a lot of martial artists, some famous including in many, many films. Put Chuck Norris in his prime against a 6-6 350 pound Hell's Angel, and Chuck would have been lucky to have survived. A street fight is a whole lot different than regulated ring competition.

In a former line of work, I've been in my share of what were supposed to be controlled application of use of force. When a bad guy doesn't want to go to jail, it becomes a street fight. There are no choreographed moves. The idea is to rock his world before he lands a straight right to your chin.

I will not fight. I've had far too many orthopedic surgeries. A third-grader could whip me. I do have pepper spray. Even though I can carry a handgun everywhere I choose, I don't carry. Carrying a handgun is like having a child with you that has to be constantly watched. In So Cal, should someone see a handgun, cops will respond. They will be aggressive and seize control immediately. The sooner they can gain control, the greater the chances they'll survive. Hence, cops will prone out a man with a gun until they figure out what they have. But were I to feel a need to carry, I would. However, my primary strategy for remaining vertical is avoiding bad places. The only known way of surviving a gun fight is to not get in one.

A 10th degree black belt in trained killer martial arts won't be guaranteed an 11th were he to run up against a really bad dude who knows there are no rules in street fighting. Avoid them at all costs, which could be expensive and painful.

When you meet an authentic murderer who'd kill you as soon as look at you, it'll make sense to you.

There's a reason it's called martial arts.

Nothing more that my opinion based upon experience and what I know to be true...

Last edited by EMP3; 09-08-2018 at 01:30 AM.
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  #183  
Old 09-29-2018, 10:43 PM
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That is what everyone who lost to Hoice Gracie thought in the no holds barred fight, didn't matter the size, superior technique won every time.

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  #184  
Old 09-30-2018, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Sol-Invictus View Post
That is what everyone who lost to Hoice Gracie thought in the no holds barred fight, didn't matter the size, superior technique won every time.

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Hoice Gracie was a has-been and never-was. He was a juicer (steroids).

MMA/UFC has referees. They're not "no holds barred" fights.

A journeyman boxer would have retired Hoice by the 2nd round.
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  #185  
Old 09-30-2018, 10:45 PM
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Originally Posted by EMP3 View Post
Hoice Gracie was a has-been and never-was. He was a juicer (steroids).

MMA/UFC has referees. They're not "no holds barred" fights.

A journeyman boxer would have retired Hoice by the 2nd round.
I am referring to the original fights not the sanitized version today. Sorry Royce Gracie. I noticed you didn't challenge the skill statement.

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  #186  
Old 10-01-2018, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Sol-Invictus View Post
I am referring to the original fights not the sanitized version today. Sorry Royce Gracie. I noticed you didn't challenge the skill statement.

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Exactly right. I've got vids of the old UFC. No weight classes, you fought whoever was across from you. The only rules were no biting or eye gouging. Grapplers ruled the early days. Ken Shamrock, Dan Severn, Ivan Taktarov, and most notably, Royce Gracie. Strikers had little or no ground skills. Once the fight went to the mat, it was only a matter of time. Oh yeah, there were no rounds or time limits, it went till it was over. I suspect most people's exposure to Royce Gracie was when he was dismantled by Matt Hughes under the new rules structure. Had this match taken place under the old format, when Gracie was in his prime, it would've been a different story.

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  #187  
Old 10-01-2018, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMP3 View Post
Hoice Gracie was a has-been and never-was. He was a juicer (steroids).

MMA/UFC has referees. They're not "no holds barred" fights.

A journeyman boxer would have retired Hoice by the 2nd round.
As the poster wrote above, the early UFC's were pretty much no holds barred with strikes to the groin, stomps to the head, and most other things being legal.

That boxer wouldn't have lasted one round in a no holds barred fight with Royce or any of the Gracies. James Toney found out how much his boxing helped against Randy Couture.

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  #188  
Old 10-01-2018, 10:12 PM
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i like to carry full size autos when possible. Sig 220 is really my favorite. The 220 compact is a little sweetie that i shoot as well as the full size.
My 1994 Sig 229 in .357 Sig is one that gets a lot of carry time.

Then I have some J frames that like to tag along with the bigger guns when we go to the hood. I will up the capacity when we have to go to less friendly places.

66-8 2.75” will get some carry in the future, but I need to shoot it a lot more. The M69 is more of an up north carry, woods or no.

I have bought and sold quite a few over the years and have found the ones that work best for me, the ones I shoot the best.

Only one plastic gets a spot, the SP01 Phantom. Classic CZ feel and performance, full size fun.

There is no auto vs revolver in my world, I need some of each.
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  #189  
Old 10-06-2018, 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Lou_the_welder View Post
Just shot 250 rounds in my kframe. Cylinder got so hot I could barely touch it and turn knob on speed loader! And it got too hot to touch period.
+1 for the auto


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How fast were you shooting? I'm not arguing, just genuinely curious. I generally shoot about 100 rounds in 20-30 minutes and have never had a cylinder get too hot to touch. Barrels yes, but not the cylinder.
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  #190  
Old 10-06-2018, 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by wadcutter1 View Post
How fast were you shooting? I'm not arguing, just genuinely curious. I generally shoot about 100 rounds in 20-30 minutes and have never had a cylinder get too hot to touch. Barrels yes, but not the cylinder.
250 rounds? For me. Should be about 40 minutes. I've shot 600 rounds in an 1 hour 40 min? 500 rounds being the nominal per week @ 1 hour 30 min. Give or take.
All depending also; which three guns I take. Which rounds..
Pictured : loading speed blocks from safariland. Hks#10s. 38 short colts loaded with 124 gr 9mm's@ starting 9mm loads. The day it did get real hot , I took two racks of those safariland filled with 38s and finished off with 50 magnums. I wouldn't touch the barrel because i knew it was hot by then. Radiating heat. But i had to touch the cylinder to put in the speedloaders. Not wearing gloves.
If it weren't for loading blocks or moonclips; forget it. I would never be able to shoot that many rounds.
And if i do keep the model 66 around, I'd probably limit it to maybe 150 rounds.

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Last edited by Lou_the_welder; 10-07-2018 at 11:44 AM.
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  #191  
Old 10-07-2018, 01:51 PM
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So. We're in October getting ready for Halloween.
Wanna hear a scary story?
Imagine pulling the trigger on your revolver and the cylinder doesn't move. Then that whole,"on a semi-auto, when it jams, at least on a revolver all you gotta do is keep pulling the trigger!" Bs, nonsense is totally out the door!
Have that little pin on the hand break, that keeps the tension on that spring that keeps it forward. Whataya got? An expensive weight.
+1 for the auto
For all you goblins and ghouls out there. Have a happy Halloween!
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  #192  
Old 10-07-2018, 07:37 PM
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Rastoff,
Since this was directed at me, I guess I should respond.

Reading your rant shows that you have a general disdain for anyone who practices defending themselves. That's a shame because it also shows that you know little about martial skill. So, let's start with this erroneous statement:
Quote:
Originally Posted by EMP3 View Post
There's a reason martial arts are known as arts.
This can only mean that you think martial arts are something to look at and be entertained by, but have no real fighting value. While they are entertaining, don't make the mistake of thinking a practitioner isn't skilled in fighting. Look at both words:

mar·tial
adjective
-of or appropriate to war; warlike.


art
noun
-a skill at doing a specified thing, typically one acquired through practice.


Yes, art is something visual, but in this case it is the skill that is being referenced, not the visual aspect.

There are only three types of martial arts schools in the world:
Traditional/Historical
Here they teach whatever was taught 2,000 years ago whether it works or not. Their goal is preservation of the teaching and remembering their roots.

Sport
Here they teach how to fight in the ring, cage or any competition. The goal is to beat an opponent in a controlled match. They fight for points or submissions (a knock out is a kid of submission).

Self-Defense
Here they teach how to defend against an attack. In this school they look at the larger picture because on the street there are no points. Your only goal is to walk away.

Any school you walk into will contain aspects of all three, but each school will focus on one aspect more than the others. If you want to learn to defend yourself, find a school that focuses on self-defense. Learning to effectively defend yourself will involve pain. That's just a simple truth. This is why the vast majority of martial arts schools don't work on real self-defense; they'll lose students.

Yes, size matters, action is faster than reaction and the best fight is no fight. These are all concepts we teach at my school. Not all schools are the same. Maybe you just haven't met enough martial artists?



The same applies to guns. Not all are the same. Revolvers are not better than semi-autos, they're different. Thank God we have both available to us.
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  #193  
Old 10-15-2018, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Sol-Invictus View Post
I am referring to the original fights not the sanitized version today. Sorry Royce Gracie. I noticed you didn't challenge the skill statement.

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Gracie had very little skill. Muhammad Ali mastered skill.
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  #194  
Old 10-15-2018, 11:51 AM
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Rastoff,

You're desperation at defending urban legend, myth, and entertainment reveals a lack of practical knowledge.

My childhood friend (we're still friends) was heavyweight kick boxing champion of the world. He's been in movies & TV shows. He knew Chuck Norris when Chuck Norris was an unknown. He knocked out the former world champion in the 8th round with a straight right. He reverted to his boxing skills to win. He told me that when a fighter attempts a kick, he exposes himself to easy KO. You're strongest when standing on your feet at shoulder width apart.

My friend would've kicked Gracie's rear end back to Lisbon. Gracie was a Tysonesque chump. He was a huge self-promoter with very little skill.

Good street fighter will whip a martial artist every time. Street fighters don't use arts. They bring pain.

In the late 70's, when kung-fu was all the rage, a wold champ boxer, Mondo Ramos, I believe, fought the then reigning martial arts champion at Hawai'i. The first round was even. Ramos was measuring the artist. Ramos knocked him out in the 2nd.

Martial arts is an art. Boxing is brutal. Sugar Ray Leonard, Marvin Hagler, Tommy Hearns, and the Golden Boy would've knocked Gracie into the cheap seats.

But you can retain your fantasy. I'm good.

Gracie had a plan until he was hit. Taking a straight right from a professional boxer will rock your world. Hopefully you won't fall off of it.

Gracie would drop deuces in his jock strap were an EME banger to get in his face. He'd faint were a Hell's Angel to be in the same city.

I don't care what you think you know. You're lack of exposure is going to get you hurt were you foolish enough to try your choreography on an authentic bad dude. And just about all martial artists love to start fights. But they won't start fights that they know they can't win.

It a street fight, you won't be able to turn to a ref for help.

Last edited by EMP3; 10-15-2018 at 11:57 AM.
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  #195  
Old 10-15-2018, 11:54 AM
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BTW,

There is no doubt in my mind that Mayweather carried McGregor into later rounds. Mayweather could've knocked him out in the 1st round.
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  #196  
Old 10-15-2018, 11:56 AM
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One more BTW, comparing martial arts to guns is one of the most silly lines I've read. It reveals a total lack of knowledge.
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  #197  
Old 10-15-2018, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Holliday 1950 View Post
I posted this question on a different forum & would like to include
the S&W forum in this question.

What would you want to carry for SD, a 357 in magnum revolver(6 or 7 shot) or a Glock 19 you can sub any pistol & any 357 in magnum for this discussion.

At this present time I'm going between my new & improved 686 + revolver & my G19 gen 4 &/or my G43. My G19 is by far an easier pistol to shoot with accuracy that my G43.

However, my 686 + with my new trigger job is now my first choice to carry 24/7
even though its a monster to carry. My feelings are quality always trumps quantity no matter what your weapon de jour is.

As always, all responses are welcome.


WELCOME TO THE FORUM, Doc......

I HAVE TO ROLL WITH YOU ON THIS ONE. I CARRY A PERSONALIZED M686 NO-DASH. IT WAS FITTED WITH A 7 ROUND CYLINDER AT THE FACTORY. IT HAS A "DELUXE TUNED ACTION", AND A SMOOTH RAISED TRIGGER, BY DENNIS REICHARD, OF THE SAND BURR GUN RANCH--MASSAD AYOOB'S GUNSMITH OF CHOICE. A PAIR OF REFINISHED PC MAGNAS WITH A TYLER-T, REPLACES THE COMBATS, AND COMPLETES THE PACKAGE......

ITS MY EDC. ITS SLICKER THAN SNOTS, VERY ACCURATE, AND FITS ME LIKE A GLOVE.....
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  #198  
Old 10-15-2018, 12:25 PM
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I think it all depends on the crime rate in your area, and how criminals "work". You are going to face 2 bad guys or a gang of 5?

My late grand father use to tell me.....if you cant fix it with 6, then you are in trouble.....He lived in the times were law abiding citizens could carry legally here in Mexico.....He usually carry a S&W model 40, a PPK or for serious bussines a Browning HP. In those days no NARCOS in México (not the way things are today). Crime rate was so low that people use to leave their front doors unlock.

Now you all now that times have changed drastically.......very sadly indeed.

While I love revolvers (a lot), I carry (With god's blessing) a Glock 42 (with extended magazines), Sometimes my Custom SIG P250 Subcompact Slide on a Compact frame, and.....my S&W model 49 rest in my safe most of the time.

Statics in Mexico show that bad guys move in packs up to 5 guys.....in this case a Revolver limits your margin for self defense.

Just my 2 cents, guys
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  #199  
Old 10-15-2018, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMP3 View Post
Rastoff,

You're desperation at defending urban legend, myth, and entertainment reveals a lack of practical knowledge.

My childhood friend (we're still friends) was heavyweight kick boxing champion of the world. He's been in movies & TV shows. He knew Chuck Norris when Chuck Norris was an unknown. He knocked out the former world champion in the 8th round with a straight right. He reverted to his boxing skills to win. He told me that when a fighter attempts a kick, he exposes himself to easy KO. You're strongest when standing on your feet at shoulder width apart.

My friend would've kicked Gracie's rear end back to Lisbon. Gracie was a Tysonesque chump. He was a huge self-promoter with very little skill.

Good street fighter will whip a martial artist every time. Street fighters don't use arts. They bring pain.

In the late 70's, when kung-fu was all the rage, a wold champ boxer, Mondo Ramos, I believe, fought the then reigning martial arts champion at Hawai'i. The first round was even. Ramos was measuring the artist. Ramos knocked him out in the 2nd.

Martial arts is an art. Boxing is brutal. Sugar Ray Leonard, Marvin Hagler, Tommy Hearns, and the Golden Boy would've knocked Gracie into the cheap seats.

But you can retain your fantasy. I'm good.

Gracie had a plan until he was hit. Taking a straight right from a professional boxer will rock your world. Hopefully you won't fall off of it.

Gracie would drop deuces in his jock strap were an EME banger to get in his face. He'd faint were a Hell's Angel to be in the same city.

I don't care what you think you know. You're lack of exposure is going to get you hurt were you foolish enough to try your choreography on an authentic bad dude. And just about all martial artists love to start fights. But they won't start fights that they know they can't win.

It a street fight, you won't be able to turn to a ref for help.
Strange thread. I'm not Rastoff, but hopefully you won't mind me responding to your post.

First off, whose your friend?

Just so you know, the Gracie's have always accepted challenges from pretty much anyone and still do AFAIK. Have you never seen the first two UFC's? Royce did fight a boxer(Art Jimmerson) and defeated him easily. Jimmerson wasn't the greatest boxer, but he had some success and experience and was the only one that showed up.There were virtually no rules in those days, definitely nothing that would have limited a boxer from applying his craft. All the big names in boxing were invited/challenged to participate those early UFC events, but all declined. They even took full page ads in numerous magazines to publically challenges the biggest names in boxing(including Tyson) and kickboxing.

The Gracie's selected Royce for the UFC not because he was the best, but because they thought by defeating much larger opponents with his slight, unathletic physique would be a better demonstration of the effectiveness of their system than if they used a more talented, muscular, athletic member of the family. I don't think Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu is the end all be all like many people do by any means, but saying Royce Gracie had very little skill is ridiculous.

You have a very narrow definition of the word martial art and seem to be applying it to only certain Asian arts, which is incorrect. The origin of the word was first used to describe various European fighting systems. A good steet-fighter IS a martial artist by definition and a good martial artist, should really be a good street-fighter in my perspective. Boxing is a martial art BTW.

A boxer or kickboxer with no understanding or training of takedowns defense or ground-fighting will most likely easily be taken down and choked unconscious. That has been demonstrated countless times. And I say that as someone who was once a world-class striker. The most effective approach is definitely a well rounded one.

It's odd that you think Hell's angels are somehow elite street-fighters. One of my earliest instructors(Ray Dalke) was an ex-hells Angels. He was a legitimate bad-a** IMO, but it had nothing to do with him having been a Hells Angel.
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