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  #51  
Old 09-24-2020, 04:35 PM
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Thx for posting , this is a great read.

Lessons learned :
first and foremost ..........composure
& a G19 w 18 x 9mm beats a 7 or 8 shot 380 every time
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Old 09-24-2020, 05:21 PM
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Folks collect all kinds of cool stuff. Sometimes their collections are firearms. It's a hobby; like with other hobbies, a person can get a little carried away. The whole 'self-defense' industry needs firearms hobbyists to get carried away in order to sell more stuff.

Some people really need a firearm in order to stay alive. Nearly all firearms owners don't; it's instead our right and our hobby - trying to make it into something else is nonsense. Or fantasy.

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Old 09-24-2020, 05:34 PM
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Quote:
Nearly all firearms owners don't.............
Indubitably correct. The operative term is "nearly all". When you find yourself on the opposite end of "nearly all" and your hobby has to save your life you can thank Larry Goldstein (see story above) and remember to send biku324 a smiley face.

Nothing personal, biku324, but I have to quote Joe Biden to you - "COME ON, MAN!!!" Firearms collectors/hobbyists are, in the main, shooters. Shooters, more often than not, have guns for self defense. Nobody is making it into something else - it is WHAT IT IS!
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Old 09-24-2020, 06:03 PM
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We won't agree, so there's no need to argue.
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Old 09-24-2020, 06:04 PM
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Iffen I owned a glock it would be a commode gun.
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Old 09-24-2020, 06:16 PM
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My waistband and pocket.
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Old 09-24-2020, 07:49 PM
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Exclamation SAFE LOCATIONS

Well, for my money, no where is safe these days. Without entering in to the no no area, I will just say, I stay armed when ever I am awake. asleep, I am about one or two seconds away for my needs. The dogs will alert me when needed and then some. Between the druggies, and the current other problems, I just refused to be a victim End of story here.

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Old 09-24-2020, 07:58 PM
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But not often.
Once is enough...
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Old 09-24-2020, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by biku324 View Post
Rationality. If you live in a safe place, prepping for deadly threats is a hobby, not reality.
Wrong.

I live in a safe area. My preparation kept my family alive.

To think otherwise is a denial of reality.
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Old 09-24-2020, 08:22 PM
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Before the China Virus our grandkids visited often so things were locked up, w/the exception of my EDC which was in my pocket. I haven’t changed anything and have no plans to.
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Old 09-24-2020, 08:32 PM
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Originally Posted by ContinentalOp View Post
... Why do some people, not just you, automatically think someone who wants to be better prepared lives in a bad neighborhood?
You’d think living in a gated community would be safe but it wasn’t safe enough for that attorney and his wife that the corrupt DA is trying to railroad in Saint Louis...

Personal defense, like religion is a personal decision.
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Old 09-24-2020, 09:31 PM
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There may be a few firearms around here. As for living in a safe space I have never heard that such really exists. Some may be(emphasis on may be) safer, but different people will have different opinions on the danger. You just do as feels comfortable for yourself and family.
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Old 09-24-2020, 10:06 PM
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My lit'l corner of Eden, twenty years ago was a "Mayberry' kinda place.

And then Meth came to the rural route. Just being aware of what lies on the fringe.

Like another poster relayed, when a sheriff's deputy or state trooper may be 30 minutes to an hour away.

Ya on your own. Preparedness prevents piss poor performance.

.
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Old 09-24-2020, 10:12 PM
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Originally Posted by keith44spl View Post
My lit'l corner of Eden, twenty years ago was a "Mayberry' kinda place.

And then Meth came to the rural route. Just being aware of what lies on the fringe.

Like another poster relayed, when a sheriff's deputy or state trooper may be 30 minutes to an hour away.

Ya on your own. Preparedness prevents piss poor performance.

.
That is absolutely true. I don't think there is a room we spent any real amount of time in where there is not a firearm that is not within 10 feet and ready. Last thing I want for myself and especially Wendy is to have to say wait here whilst I go into another room to find a gun. We may get hurt or killed but it will happen while shooting back.
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Old 09-24-2020, 10:50 PM
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Originally Posted by biku324 View Post
Rationality. If you live in a safe place, prepping for deadly threats is a hobby, not reality.
And just how would you define a "safe place"?
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Old 09-24-2020, 10:56 PM
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No right or wrong answer to this one. It depends on your situation and what you are comfortable with. I have two or three guns that I use all the time so I don't put them in the safe when not in use. I have a couple of places within the house where I stash these when not in use where they are readily accessible but it would be rather hard for someone breaking in to find them. They do happen to be in areas where I frequent in the home so that I have them in addition to the one I am carrying. I don't choose to go to the gun safe every time I want to switch guns. That's just me.
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Old 09-25-2020, 12:01 AM
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And just how would you define a "safe place"?
Places without much violent crime in the past several years.

Melvin Clouse kept guns everywhere in his house in Virden, NM; also in his car. David Van Horn and Diane Lynn Wilson dropped by his Virden, NM home, stole his car gun, then captured, tortured, and killed Norma, Melvin's wife, and nearly killed Melvin - they left him for dead in his burning house. They next shot HCSO Deputy Ali Salinas in the forehead and Chon Trujillo in the shoulder before my troops caught them both.

Virden hadn't had a violent crime since the 1930s, and wouldn't had that night either but for Melvin's car gun. Melvin liked guns, was an excellent shot, and a fine man. He just had one too many of his guns outside of his immediate control.

That little bit of specificity is for all of those who grimly imply something awful that they prevented without providing replicable details.

Hobbies, whether guns, horses, skiing, boating, and wild-country birdwatching, can all be dangerous. They are still, however, hobbies, not vital activities.

Last edited by biku324; 09-25-2020 at 12:14 PM.
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Old 09-25-2020, 12:24 AM
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That's the difference between an armchair opinion and fact. Diane Lynn Wilson provided extensive, later verified testimony of the night's events to avoid the needle; the murderous pair chose Clouse because he reportedly had gold coins in his house. However, they weren't up to trying to capture him to rob him until they found his loaded 9mm when sneaking into his car to steal it. Once armed they just walked up to the front door with smiles and knocked. Taking the Clouse couple into captivity immediately with the aid of Clouse's stolen 9mm was effortless, especially since Clouse knew and recognized Van Horn from his summers with an aunt there.

Clouse was able to provide extensive information about the crime as well, once the shock wore off.

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Old 09-25-2020, 04:49 AM
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biku324,
My impression from past posts across a few threads is you’re pro-2A when it comes to gun ownership and “in your own home” self-defense. It seems like your against non-LEO concealed carry. Is that close. Just trying to figure out more broadly where you’re coming from.
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Old 09-25-2020, 08:22 AM
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Old 09-25-2020, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biku324 View Post
Places without much violent crime in the past several years.

All that can mean is ripe for the picking, people become lazy about their safety

Hobbies, whether guns, horses, skiing, boating, and wild-country birdwatching, can all be dangerous. They are still, however, hobbies, not vital activities.
Gun ownership is NOT a hobby
Specific gun collecting can be a hobby.
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Old 09-25-2020, 08:56 AM
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I've read of others who adhere to the hidden gun philosophy. I don't agree, but that's me. I dress in the morning, my sidearm slips into the holster. It goes where I go, and I always know where it is.
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Old 09-25-2020, 09:18 AM
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I could go out to fill bird feeders and get killed by a falling piece of space junk. I live in the least populated counties in Ohio and there is very little crime except petty theft. I try not to shoot more than one bad guy per week because I hate paper work. I have friends who are obsessed with this SD & HD gun play. They will talk for a week about a bullet, just a bullet. It drives me to drink. They have loaded guns stashed around the house. They have shotguns in corners near outside doors. To repel intruders. I hope their tin foil hats protect them.
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Old 09-25-2020, 09:21 AM
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I no longer keep a rifle mounted over the doorway, as some did in the days gone by.
By experience, I have found I might need it before I reach the door.

Now for a true story from out on the rural route;

A young man and his wife were just finishing breakfast when a
man wheedling a machete broke in their front door.

The home owner grab'd his 9mm pistol from atop the nearby refrigerator
and repelled the attacker, sending him fleeing for his life.

Oh, the home owner, put one round though the ne're-do-well's hat brim and the round exited out the crown...
His second shot grazed the perp's shirt pocket as he turned.

So, as Roseanne Roseannadanna would say...It's Always Something !!!

.
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Old 09-25-2020, 09:22 AM
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So does anyone else have firearms placed in strategic locations?
Yes. I have loaded handguns and a fighting shotgun available as backups to what I carry on my person.

They are secured in locked, metal safes/cabinets with quick access Simplex push button locks—no batteries. The safes are hidden and also secured so they cannot be taken without a lot of time and tools.

My perimeter is very hardened, and my ADT alarm system notification is displayed outside in a few places. Response time is under 4 minutes. I have visible cameras. I have some decoys around to slow down the 90% who are smash and grabbers. I live in a wonderful, safe neighborhood with friends who watch out for each other. I am neither fearful nor paranoid, just prepared. To my knowledge, I have never had an attempted break in during the 35 years I’ve lived here. This is a place which when cased says, “move on—there are easier pickings down the street.”

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Old 09-25-2020, 10:41 AM
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About those "nice neighborhoods". I was once the intended victim of an armed robbery essentially right across the street from a Federal Courthouse. About 10:30 in a weekday morning with a traffic cop at the intersection maybe 100 yards away.

Where exactly do some of y'all think the thieves go to find "nice stuff"?
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Old 09-25-2020, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Ziggy2525 View Post
For me, I’m never sure what “leftist arguments” actually are. It’s a label without a context.

My impression from past posts across a few threads is you’re pro-2A when it comes to gun ownership and “in your own home” self-defense. It seems like your against non-LEO concealed carry. Is that close. Just trying to figure out more broadly where you’re coming from.
We all have a right to own and, where legal, carry. We all have the right to stash guns all over the house and car. That's fine with me. What my experience taught me is there are very few people who actually NEED guns. If you don't need, as in must have for a specific purpose or to counter generalized, objective risk, a firearm (or 15) is a hobby. I don't NEED guns anymore, but thoroughly enjoy every aspect of firearms, from ballistics to reloading, to shooting at targets, varmints, and occasionally medium to large game.

Not sure how that got all tangled up. I do know from many, many examples that unsecured guns outside a responsible party's immediate control are tragedy awaiting an occurrence.

Helpful?

Last edited by biku324; 09-25-2020 at 01:59 PM.
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Old 09-25-2020, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keith44spl View Post
I no longer keep a rifle mounted over the doorway, as some did in the days gone by.
By experience, I have found I might need it before I reach the door.

Now for a true story from out on the rural route;

A young man and his wife were just finishing breakfast when a
man wheedling a machete broke in their front door.

The home owner grab'd his 9mm pistol from atop the nearby refrigerator
and repelled the attacker, sending him fleeing for his life.

Oh, the home owner, put one round though the ne're-do-well's hat brim and the round exited out the crown...
His second shot grazed the perp's shirt pocket as he turned.

So, as Roseanne Roseannadanna would say...It's Always Something !!!

.
Well, let me offer a different outcome.

In Deming, a family's adult nephew came to see them. They were just having a nice afternoon football, snack and beer time, but no drunkenness was involved. The nephew brought his new acquisition, a new 32 H&R magnum that he got cheap (it turned out to be stolen in a local burglary), and showed it to his uncle.

Once they admired the purchase, they put it up on a cupboard shelf about 6 feet high. Unbeknownst to them, the 5 year-old cousin saw that; while the adults were watching football, the 5 year-old put a chair up to the cabinet and got the revolver. He climbed down and was apparently playing TV shooter when his 20 month old sister toddled into the room - he pointed the revolver and shot her, striking her upper pelvic girdle through the lower abdomen. She nearly bled out, but the local hospital got her stabilized; they airlifted her to El Paso for surgery that saved her life, but also ensured she would never have children.

This is but one of many, many sad incidents I'd be glad to recount; in my limited experience, nothing good comes of unsecured guns outside a responsible person's immediate control.

Last edited by biku324; 09-25-2020 at 12:10 PM.
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Old 09-25-2020, 11:56 AM
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When I was young and single with my own place I could not abide a loaded gun unless it was on my person. I could have a dozen loaded in my pockets and belt but not one out of my control. We had guns all over the house when I was a kid. Shotguns and rifles. My dad didn’t believe in accidents and guns were just tools. He was very safety oriented there was never any lose ammo around. He also cautioned us on kids we may have visiting. The ones who didn’t have guns at home would be the ones fascinated and want to fool with gun, while kids who had them at home paid no attention to them. Most people in our area had guns and never remember any problems. Once a kid got shot playing on town dump when they found old shotgun. It went off when they were pulling it out of a pile of trash. That kid never had children either and died in his late 40s from complications of the shooting.
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Old 09-25-2020, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
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Well, let me offer a different outcome.

In Deming, a family's adult nephew came to see them. They were just having a nice afternoon football, snack and beer time, but no drunkenness was involved. The nephew brought his new acquisition, a new 32 H&R magnum that he got cheap (it turned out to be stolen in a local burglary), and showed it to his uncle.

Once they admired the purchase, they put it up on a cupboard shelf about 6 feet high. Unbeknownst to them, the 5 year-old cousin saw that; while the adults were watching football, the 5 year-old put a chair up to the cabinet and got the revolver. He climbed down and was apparently playing TV shooter when his 20 month old sister toddled into the room - he pointed the revolver and shot her, striking her upper pelvic girdle through the lower abdomen. She nearly bled out, but the local hospital got her stabilized; they airlifted her to El Paso for surgery that saved her life, but also ensured she would never have children.

This is but one of many, many sad incidents I'd be glad to recount; in my limited experience, nothing good comes of unsecured guns outside a responsible person's immediate control.
In that case it was not the homeowners gun. It was the responsibility of the visiting nephew. He should have unloaded it. It was not stashed for home protection. Try again.
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Old 09-25-2020, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by biku324 View Post
Well, let me offer a different outcome.

In Deming, a family's adult nephew came to see them. They were just having a nice afternoon football, snack and beer time, but no drunkenness was involved. The nephew brought his new acquisition, a new 32 H&R magnum that he got cheap (it turned out to be stolen in a local burglary), and showed it to his uncle.

Once they admired the purchase, they put it up on a cupboard shelf about 6 feet high. Unbeknownst to them, the 5 year-old cousin saw that; while the adults were watching football, the 5 year-old put a chair up to the cabinet and got the revolver. He climbed down and was apparently playing TV shooter when his 20 month old sister toddled into the room - he pointed the revolver and shot her, striking her upper pelvic girdle through the lower abdomen. She nearly bled out, but the local hospital got her stabilized; they airlifted her to El Paso for surgery that saved her life, but also ensured she would never have children.

This is but one of many, many sad incidents I'd be glad to recount; in my limited experience, nothing good comes of unsecured guns outside a responsible person's immediate control.
That's a tragic accident, that could have been averted for sure.
If, if, only folks were responsibly 100% of the time.

That's as irresponsible as folks leaving their children in hot vehicles to die.

The incident that I related....No children were present.
(I don't recall that couple having any children. I knew them personally)

Everyone's home and security needs are different...
What folks do to provide that security is their business.

I just stay in my lane and let other's do the same.

.
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Old 09-25-2020, 12:34 PM
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Pawngal

Sure!

A nice Texas family had and still has a vacation home in Angel Fire, near a ski area, but also only a few miles from the Eagle Nest (youth) Reintegration Center where juvenile offenders nearing release completed a variety of reintegration (to society) courses. The Center was nearly invisible to the resorts in the area.

A young man approaching release walked away from the Center. After walking and hitching short rides, he ended up at the Texas folks' vacation home. Seeing no one around, he broke in and eventually found a single shot 22 rifle and ammunition they left in a closet. He promptly tried to commit suicide, but couldn't get it done easily - as he leaned to pull the trigger with the muzzle in his mouth, it misaligned the rifle with his brain, so shots one, then two, then three ended up with holes through his upper left cheek and some grazing injury as well. He got the fourth shot through his palate into his brain, but not cleanly - he lived long enough to bleed out through the small wounds.

The Texas folks meant no harm. They had a right to leave their rifle in their closet. But they still ended up with a corpse on their floor that stayed long enough to ensure the carpet, floor, and subflooring had to be ripped out to get rid of the smell.

I have more if you need them.

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Old 09-25-2020, 12:51 PM
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biku324

That young man was VERY determined to end his life, 4 shots with a single shot rifle? If he had not found that rifle he would have found some other way.


So, is every firearm in your home locked up 24 hours a day whether you are home or not? whether it is loaded or not?
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Old 09-25-2020, 01:00 PM
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biku324

That young man was VERY determined to end his life, 4 shots with a single shot rifle? If he had not found that rifle he would have found some other way.


So, is every firearm in your home locked up 24 hours a day whether you are home or not? whether it is loaded or not?
Solution, keep firearms in a safe, surrounded by a locked cage or jail cell, then in a bank vault to keep them really, very secured so nobody unauthorized can get to them. I would say surround it with barbed wire and landmines but believe that would be overkill.
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Old 09-25-2020, 01:02 PM
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biku324

That young man was VERY determined to end his life, 4 shots with a single shot rifle? If he had not found that rifle he would have found some other way.


So, is every firearm in your home locked up 24 hours a day whether you are home or not? whether it is loaded or not?
And we were discussing unsecured firearms in homes.

Every firearm in my home, loaded or not, is secured or in my immediate control whether loaded or not. Always.
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Old 09-25-2020, 01:10 PM
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There are no safe areas - only areas with varying degrees of unsafeness.
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Old 09-25-2020, 01:13 PM
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There are no safe areas - only areas with varying degrees of unsafeness.
Thank you - I wish I had phrased it as well. The lowest risk places require the least of one.
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Old 09-25-2020, 01:17 PM
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Members obviously have differing opinions. We expect you all to act like reasonable adults. Rational discussion and disagreement is fine, but the innuendo and insults are not acceptable.

I doubt any of you are going to change others minds. Your individual circumstances should dictate how you secure your firearms. In any event, take reasonable precautions to see that they’re inaccessible to unauthorized persons.

Posts deleted or cleaned up, dings issued as warranted. If you want this thread to remain open, keep things civil.
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Old 09-25-2020, 01:53 PM
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I de-gear myself when I get home. Gun, keys, wallet, and phone. I don’t carry a reload, knife, flashlight, Zippo, etc. When the kids were little the gun went in a wall safe. Now it goes on a shelf. That gun meant work, and I was off work.

I do have a pump shotgun in the bedroom, chamber empty, tube full of 00 buck. Just in case.

I’m not going to walk around my house carrying a gun. I don’t care what others do - that’s their house.

My doors are always locked, with an electronic combo lock. No keys to lose.

My main line of defense is Randy, a 140 pound Rottweiler who loves exactly ten people in the world and considers the other 7.8 billion as up to no good. He’s a fine boy.

Unless somebody comes in shooting, they will be dealing with Randy for a while.
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Old 09-25-2020, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
I have more if you need them.
And so does every police officer, sad to say. Sad stories abound, crime, accidents, whatever. According to the latest figures that I have seen There are almost 400 million guns in America and probably around 85 to 90 million gun owners. STUFF is going to happen. OUR job, should we choose to accept it, is to take all reasonable steps to avoid STUFF from happening.

That said, it is hard to argue with this logic:

Quote:
There are no safe areas - only areas with varying degrees of unsafeness.
Any place that has no crime is totally safe UNTIL some ne'er-do-well shows up intent on committing evil and then, suddenly, the totally safe place is not safe anymore.

How many times have you seen people on the news say "But Podunk is a safe town (or neighborhood); we never have trouble here; this is shocking!"

But none of that is a direct answer to the question of positioning firearms around your domicile. This is actually kind of the bottom line:

Quote:
Every firearm in my home, loaded or not, is secured or in my immediate control whether loaded or not. Always.
But how do you define "immediate control"?

I'll let y'all decide that on your own; my version of immediate control will differ from yours, I am sure.

But I am a big fan of Randy!
Quote:
My main line of defense is Randy, a 140 pound Rottweiler
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Old 09-25-2020, 04:44 PM
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... My main line of defense is Randy, a 140 pound Rottweiler who loves exactly ten people in the world and considers the other 7.8 billion as up to no good. He’s a fine boy... .
+1. A good dog is the best alarm system there is. Doesn’t even have to be a big dog, I’ve had terriers most of my life and they’re great watch dogs.
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Old 09-25-2020, 04:57 PM
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That wasn’t exactly a gated community. There was a gate, but only on one end.

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You’d think living in a gated community would be safe but it wasn’t safe enough for that attorney and his wife that the corrupt DA is trying to railroad in Saint Louis...

Personal defense, like religion is a personal decision.
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Old 09-25-2020, 04:58 PM
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I would love to have a large dog like our former Rez Fed. With six cats that is not possible so the best I can hope for is the interlopers dealing with static cling while I draw a bead.
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Old 09-25-2020, 05:02 PM
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+1. A good dog is the best alarm system there is. Doesn’t even have to be a big dog, I’ve had terriers most of my life and they’re great watch dogs.
Mine is a mid-size mix, but she barks and growls much larger. I honestly don't know if she would attack an intruder but I wouldn't trust her not to.
Which brings up another question, What is a home owner/dog owner's liability if a dog attacks during an attempted home invasion?
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Old 09-25-2020, 05:15 PM
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... What is a home owner/dog owner's liability if a dog attacks during an attempted home invasion?
I’m not an attorney but I doubt the bad guy would have a leg to stand on...
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Old 09-25-2020, 05:39 PM
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I will discuss "MY" preference for firearms storage and carry with law enforcement after the incident.
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Old 09-25-2020, 08:15 PM
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MODERATOR EDIT:

If you want this thread to remain open, keep the discussion civil. Insults and disparaging remarks are ill advised.
Sincerely,
s&wchad

———————————————————————————

So I live in a split level house with four floors.
Basement is a my game room with a bathroom.
Six steps up leads to ground level with a laundry room and door to garage
Six steps up lead to my living room, kitchen and family room
Six final steps to bathroom and three bedrooms

I shower and get ready in the basement. Since the boys moved out she claimed the upstairs bathroom and I gladly located my stuff for getting ready every day to the basement. No kids or many visitors these days.

I have a safe on the laundry level bolted to the concrete floor where I keep a majority of my firearms.

I have a small pistol safe in the closet that I keep my 36-10 carry gun.

I am one floor away from the big safe but I am slow to get in.
The pistol safe is on the top floor. Way too far away if something happens while in the game room.

So I made some decisions. I put a hidden holster in my downstairs bathroom. I figure with the humidity I placed my k frame 15-4 Nickel 4'' there so I have something handy. I have some nickel cased ammo too. I also have a speed strip with another 6 rounds. I lightly wipe down the guns once every two weeks with oil so not worried about rust.

I then placed the 36-10 j frame on top of a curio cabinet in our living room that has a natural indent - you'd have to be 7' tall to see the top and it is bolted to the wall so can't be tipped over. This puts a handgun on the main floor and easy to retrieve when we leave the house. I also placed an HKS speedloader there which I also carry when I go out.

I replaced the 36 in the bedroom sage with a 15-3 2" I recently purchased. I also have a speed strip and a speedloader.

I have Pachmayr grips on the 15-4 and 15-3 along with a Spring Kit upgrade so my wife is comfortable shooting them with her Lupus and Arthritis. Her hand strength is diminishing but she can now shoot both revolvers without any issue with the lighter triggers and rubber grips.

That puts a handgun within reach on the living area floors.
My wife says I'm getting paranoid in my old age but I'd rather have a way to fight back no matter where I am in the house.

So does anyone else have firearms placed in strategic locations?

Am I nuts for doing this?

My configuration is similar except SS J frames rather than nickel.
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Old 09-25-2020, 08:24 PM
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Well, let me offer a different outcome.

In Deming, a family's adult nephew came to see them. They were just having a nice afternoon football, snack and beer time, but no drunkenness was involved. The nephew brought his new acquisition, a new 32 H&R magnum that he got cheap (it turned out to be stolen in a local burglary), and showed it to his uncle.

Once they admired the purchase, they put it up on a cupboard shelf about 6 feet high. Unbeknownst to them, the 5 year-old cousin saw that; while the adults were watching football, the 5 year-old put a chair up to the cabinet and got the revolver. He climbed down and was apparently playing TV shooter when his 20 month old sister toddled into the room - he pointed the revolver and shot her, striking her upper pelvic girdle through the lower abdomen. She nearly bled out, but the local hospital got her stabilized; they airlifted her to El Paso for surgery that saved her life, but also ensured she would never have children.

This is but one of many, many sad incidents I'd be glad to recount; in my limited experience, nothing good comes of unsecured guns outside a responsible person's immediate control.
Sad, to be sure. My 5 year olds (and I've had several over the years) know not to mess with electricity, running machinery or firearms. Keeping interesting things secreted away makes them all the more attractive. Showing such items and what they do takes the mystery, and interest, away.
That's on the parents.
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Old 09-26-2020, 12:09 AM
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Thx for posting , this is a great read.

Lessons learned :
first and foremost ..........composure
& a G19 w 18 x 9mm beats a 7 or 8 shot 380 every time
great story and it made me rethink how to carry in vehicle, in addition to Console vault.

a similar story happened in a small town between Houston and San Antonio 7-8 years ago. a couple of young brothers went to home of a local bank officer at night. they rang doorbell and were allowed to come in house. they forced the bank officer at gunpoint to take them to the bank and withdraw money. they then forced the husband of the bank officer to drive them out of town. he had a pistol stashed in the vehicle and was able to draw it and shot both, killing one. the stashed pistol most likely saved his life.
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Old 09-26-2020, 06:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Drm50 View Post
I live in the least populated counties in Ohio
I know your area - Gods country
As a youngster , used to chase whitetail every fall.
Plenty of friends due south in Sistersville.
Derail over........
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