Old School vs. New School

blues7 · #51 10-23-2020, 05:25 PM

I like the stuff coming out of Heaven Hill... Henry McKenna, Elijah Craig, and recently, a gifted bottle of J.T.S. Brown.

Bourbon for the win.

Echo40 · #52 10-23-2020, 06:34 PM

I prefer a little of both, but I lean towards old-school, if for no other reason than it being a time-proven method, and I'm an "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." kinda guy.

Protected One · #53 10-25-2020, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ContinentalOp

I was recently watching some videos on WWII hand-to-hand combat training, and it got me curious...Which is better, Old School or New School? So, I made this poll to get everyone's opinion.

For the purposes of this poll, this will be focused on "software," i.e., training and tactics, rather than "hardware," i.e., guns and weapons.

By Old School, I'm referring to fighting arts that are from the late 19th-early 20th centuries, such as boxing, wrestling, WWII "gutterfighting," point shooting, etc.

By New School, I'm referring to fighting arts that have been developed or popularized in the last 30-40 years, such as BJJ, MMA, Krav Maga, Kali/Escrima, modern shooting techniques (for example, "The Modern Technique" or modern Isoceles stance + sights), etc.

And by "better," I mean which one you think is better suited for today's world.

I'm just curious to see what people think.

Split decision here. On the hand to hand issue I would say "new school", because they - particularly Krav Maga, incorporate the "best" of all martial knowledge available. "Whatever works" is their motto. As to shooting techniques, I say BOTH have equal merit and are "situation dependent".

dr. mordo · #54 10-25-2020, 05:00 PM

I have never received any training in hand to hand, but I remember clearly a exchange with a friend's dad from 25 years ago.

The son explained how his dad had sent them to martial arts training when they were kids and he never understood why his dad didn't teach them to fight. His dad, who was a Vietnam Airborne vet with lots of combat experience and plenty of PTSD, heard him say this and replied "the problem is I never learned to fight, I learned how to kill."

I would argue that is the difference from most modern martial arts and "old school" techniques. I'm certainly no expert - is there a martial art you can study at a private school that is simple and focuses on rapidly killing or disabling someone like Defendu?

ContinentalOp · #55 10-25-2020, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dr. mordo

is there a martial art you can study at a private school that is simple and focuses on rapidly killing or disabling someone like Defendu?

I recall there being at least one school/instructor teaching Defendu, at least a few years ago, I think in Canada.

I believe there's also a guy in NJ who taught gutterfighting (WWII H2H combat). Cestari?

And there was a school, I believe in VA, that taught WWII-style fighting techniques. I want to say it was called American Combatives.

I recall there being a martial artist in WA that taught "old school" combatives and point-shooting. Bradley J. Steiner, I think?

It's been quite a few years since I've looked into it, so I don't know if any of these are still being taught.

I imagine Krav Maga would have some potentially lethal techniques in its syllabus, at least at the more advanced levels. My KM training was limited to fundamentals.

Ranger514 · #56 10-25-2020, 05:40 PM

KISS. Whatever you choose, it has to become second nature through repetition.

Ziggy2525 · #57 10-26-2020, 03:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dr. mordo

... is there a martial art you can study at a private school that is simple and focuses on rapidly killing or disabling someone like Defendu?

If you found that school, how would you know what they taught actually worked and that you could effectively use what you learned?

Didn’t the Army go to an MMA style system in the last 10 years or so just so they could have competitive matches to test competence?

Protected One · #58 10-26-2020, 07:05 AM

Instructor: "Mr. Wilson, karate is the oldest form of self-defense known to man"

Mr. Wilson: "It ain't older than running"

Ziggy2525 · #59 10-26-2020, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dr. mordo

....
His dad, who was a Vietnam Airborne vet with lots of combat experience and plenty of PTSD, heard him say this and replied "the problem is I never learned to fight, I learned how to kill."
...

I wanted to think about this a bit before I responded. At least based on my time in the Army from '73 to '76, the "I never learned to fight, I learned how to kill" phrase is technically correct, but for most people it didn't have anything to do with hands-to-hand fighting skills.

In the Army (at least when I was in), unless you were in some specialized unit like Special Forces or Rangers, you learned "how to kill" people by shooting them with rifles, pistols, and machine guns. By stabbing them with a bayonet. By blowing them up with grenades, rockets, and claymores. And killing them from afar with artillery and air strikes. Not much hand-to-hand.

From what I've read, during Iraq and Afghanistan they've had to come up with better hands-on skills because they were detaining people, not just trying to kill them.