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Old 04-04-2021, 05:32 PM
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Default Iowa passes Constitutional Carry

Just read that Iowa passed Constitutional Carry. The law becomes effective July 1st! Yeah!
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Old 04-04-2021, 06:34 PM
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Glad to see the Gov finally signed it.
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Old 04-04-2021, 07:42 PM
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Just remember, that means EVERYONE. Drug dealers and gang members alike.
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Old 04-04-2021, 08:16 PM
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Just remember, that means EVERYONE. Drug dealers and gang members alike.
They already are. No big deal to them.
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Old 04-04-2021, 08:24 PM
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Not legally. We took plenty off the streets for gun violations that led to perps rolling on other perps, other crimes.
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Old 04-04-2021, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by biku324 View Post
Not legally. We took plenty off the streets for gun violations that led to perps rolling on other perps, other crimes.
Well, you'll just have to work a little harder now.

"Shall not be infringed"

Last edited by luvsmiths; 04-04-2021 at 10:27 PM.
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Old 04-04-2021, 10:35 PM
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Not me - I'm retired.
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Old 04-05-2021, 05:13 AM
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Originally Posted by biku324 View Post
Just remember, that means EVERYONE. Drug dealers and gang members alike.
Are you telling me that NM gives these folks a pass?

If I caught someone here in Oregon open carrying (legal pretty much statewide here, no permit required) and they had a possession prohibiting conviction, restraining order, or were in the act of committing a variety of other crimes, they'd be arrested for being in illegal possession of a firearm. Though open carry is generally legal, doing so doesn't negate the fact that they were prohibited from being in possession to begin with.

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Old 04-05-2021, 06:16 AM
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I am sure that in Iowa, that if you have a felony record or any of the things that would keep you from getting a permit in most states your prohibited for concealed carry.

There is a clause in Montana's law that states it only applies to a person eligible to possess a firearm under state or federal law.

I have a permit and I am sure it would be worthless if I was carrying both a gun and drugs. I know it is worthless if I am intoxicated.

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Old 04-05-2021, 06:31 AM
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In fact here is Iowas new law and if you will go to sections 17 and 18 you will see that persons who would normally be ineligible to have guns or get a permit are not allowed to carry them and their information is in the system for LEO access.

Iowa Legislature - BillBook

So, no of course it does not cover criminals and drug dealers. In most shall issue states I can not see how you could legally withhold a permit from someone based on their associations. (gangs) I am sure if they denied a gang member with a clean criminal record a good lawyer could have fun with it in court. A 4473 certainly doesn't ask if you belong to a gang

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Old 04-05-2021, 09:41 AM
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I live in Iowa and have a permit to carry. We can openly carry or carry concealed. The new law is for carrying in Iowa ONLY! That's why I will continue to renew my permit every 5 years so that I can carry legally in States that recognize an Iowa permit!
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Old 04-05-2021, 09:54 AM
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Just remember, that means EVERYONE. Drug dealers and gang members alike.
So, no changes then.
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Old 04-05-2021, 11:05 AM
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Are you telling me that NM gives these folks a pass?

If I caught someone here in Oregon open carrying (legal pretty much statewide here, no permit required) and they had a possession prohibiting conviction, restraining order, or were in the act of committing a variety of other crimes, they'd be arrested for being in illegal possession of a firearm. Though open carry is generally legal, doing so doesn't negate the fact that they were prohibited from being in possession to begin with.
Nope. But many, many gangsters and street dealers have no felony convictions and could legally carry under a law like Iowa's.

As I've also mentioned before, nothing in my life experience leads me to believe that most people have the requisite legal information, judgement, and will that serious armed carry.requires. I know that angers some folks here, but what I've seen is what I've seen.
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Old 04-05-2021, 11:07 AM
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Oh please.
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Old 04-05-2021, 11:07 AM
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Glad to see the Gov finally signed it.
Indeed.
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Old 04-05-2021, 11:10 AM
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Nope. But many, many gangsters and street dealers have no felony convictions and could legally carry under a law like Iowa's.

As I've also mentioned before, nothing in my life experience leads me to believe that most people have the requisite legal information, judgement, and will that serious armed carry.requires. I know that angers some folks here, but what I've seen is what I've seen.
Here in the USA, every non-felon has that right, whether you "think" they should or not.

If that level of individual liberty scares you or makes you nervous, this may not be the country for you.
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Old 04-05-2021, 11:11 AM
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As I said, my view angers some here.
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Old 04-05-2021, 11:19 AM
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As I said, my view angers some here.
I'm not angry whatsoever. Just reporting realities.

I'd be interested in your thoughts on the matter though. How do you "determine" if someone passes your litmus test in order to get their constitutional rights?
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Old 04-05-2021, 11:36 AM
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As I said, my view angers some here.
Indeed...illustrated by some of the snark aimed at you. While I may not agree with your view, your concerns are legitimate. Here in my state, arrest record expungement is all the rage. This includes expunging felony records, the result being yesterdays felon being today's legal gun carrier. And before this thread runs its course, how many members that will will criticize you here have also lamented in other threads all the "new gun owners" buying plastic guns and not taking what they consider adequate training?
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Old 04-05-2021, 12:03 PM
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Indeed...illustrated by some of the snark aimed at you. While I may not agree with your view, your concerns are legitimate. Here in my state, arrest record expungement is all the rage. This includes expunging felony records, the result being yesterdays felon being today's legal gun carrier. And before this thread runs its course, how many members that will will criticize you here have also lamented in other threads all the "new gun owners" buying plastic guns and not taking what they consider adequate training?
Most gun people don't agree with expunging criminal records. Also, most don't lament new gun owners or not taking training.

All those things are done by anti-gunners usually.

Now the plastic gun thing: that is debatable.
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Old 04-05-2021, 12:35 PM
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The thing criminals fear most is a legally armed and trained citizenry as it is like walking in a field of land mines; they never know when they are going to step on the wrong one.
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Old 04-05-2021, 12:40 PM
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A felon is only someone who got caught.
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Old 04-05-2021, 01:12 PM
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I'm not angry whatsoever. Just reporting realities.

I'd be interested in your thoughts on the matter though. How do you "determine" if someone passes your litmus test in order to get their constitutional rights?
And is the litmus test consistent across all constitutional rights. e.g. If someone believes training and certification is required to keep and bear arms, do they feel training and certification is required to vote or use their free speech rights.
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Old 04-05-2021, 01:15 PM
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Questions for our esteemed members from Iowa:

Does your new law mention anything about the behavior of the people carrying? In other words, does it differentiate between legal "Constitutional Carry" and "Reckless Display", for example?

And if it does make that differentiation, does it say anything about who gets to decide what is "reckless" or not, or perhaps list certain specifics in those regards?

Also, does it grant property owners the right to limit the carrying of firearms on their property, such as in a church, residence or private business?

Thanks for any information.
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Old 04-05-2021, 01:18 PM
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And is the litmus test consistent across all constitutional rights. e.g. If someone believes training and certification is required to keep and bear arms, do they feel training and certification is required to vote or use their free speech rights.
We wait............
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Old 04-05-2021, 02:14 PM
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Good thread, and it validates my wisdom of making as few comments as possible here these past 21-ish years. Fortunately, there always seems to be a member or two who don’t mind stepping (or falling face first) into the cow pie . And many times, those cow pie members are making comments from “on high” about the rest of us ...
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Old 04-05-2021, 02:20 PM
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We wait............
My guess is we'll be waiting a long time.
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Old 04-05-2021, 02:32 PM
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We wait............
I have a good deal of respect for this forum and many, many of it's members. To respect the forum is to respect the rules, most particularly about political discussion. To respect other members is to not engage in fruitless argumentation.

I don't believe most folks should carry; I've explained why (without drifting into politics) on this and other threads.
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Old 04-05-2021, 02:39 PM
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I have a good deal of respect for this forum and many, many of it's members. To respect the forum is to respect the rules, most particularly about political discussion. To respect other members is to not engage in fruitless argumentation.

I don't believe most folks should carry; I've explained why (without drifting into politics) on this and other threads.
All we did was ask you a simple question of how would you determine who is bequeathed the privilege. No arguments whatsoever. We're just asking you to provide SOME logic.

Is that argumentation?
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Old 04-05-2021, 02:44 PM
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Why on earth would I make that determination? I'm in favor of folks using common sense, but too many seem not to have any.

I can have sex with 17 year-olds in New Mexico, but have the common courtesy (decency?) and common sense not to do so.

Last edited by biku324; 04-05-2021 at 02:47 PM.
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Old 04-05-2021, 02:57 PM
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Why on earth would I make that determination? I'm in favor of folks using common sense, but too many seem not to have any.

I can have sex with 17 year-olds in New Mexico, but have the common courtesy (decency?) and common sense not to do so.
So you say "Something should be done" (i.e. very few people should be allowed to carry concealed), but then you have no idea whatsoever how to determine who those people should be.

Ooooooooook. Gotcha.
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Old 04-05-2021, 02:59 PM
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A felon is only someone who got caught.
And speaking from 35 years of experience, we only catch the dumb ones . . .
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Old 04-05-2021, 05:14 PM
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Why on earth would I make that determination? I'm in favor of folks using common sense, but too many seem not to have any.

I can have sex with 17 year-olds in New Mexico, but have the common courtesy (decency?) and common sense not to do so.
How much opportunity. Just wondering. I can have sex with a 25 year old here in Montana and would have no real moral problems with it. Common sense tells me that not to likely without some cash.

I do have some concerns about just anyone packing a gun around. But, look at cars. No constitutional right to drive. Your supposed to have training, pass a test and have a license to drive. Yet 18 of auto fatalities involve non license drivers, lots of them are caused by plain old stupid and more by drunks who are not allowed to drive. I do not think people legally carrying guns without a permit will ever come close. Having passed some course and obtaining a permit is absolutely no guarantee that people will use common sense, in fact wee see permitted gun owners do stupid stuff. Explain to me why their stupid should cause me to be unable to carry. Who is going to set the standard? Some state standards are nearly impossible. Do you want similar ones setting those standards?

Also you state ''But many, many gangsters and street dealers have no felony convictions and could legally carry under a law like Iowa's." True and as I pointed out in most states with such a clear record they could get a permit and carry, so just how does going permit less change anything? Plus, as you know lots of criminals and drug dealers carry without a permit needed or not.

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Old 04-05-2021, 05:32 PM
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So you say "Something should be done" (i.e. very few people should be allowed to carry concealed), but then you have no idea whatsoever how to determine who those people should be.

Ooooooooook. Gotcha.
Where did I say 'something should be done?'

This is an example what I meant about not engaging in argumentation.
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Old 04-05-2021, 05:39 PM
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I don’t see how Iowa would be any different from other CC states.

Arguments against CC are usually reserved for people like Shannon Watts.
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Old 04-07-2021, 09:33 PM
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Well, here's the law: Iowa Legislature - BillBook

Seems pretty well balanced.
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