Thoughts on coverage? I was thinking about getting USCCA coverage but I saw a video by a lawyer going through their contract with a fine toothed comb and it had some disturbing things.

The one that bothered me most is that they won't cover you if you are charged with a crime. My first thought was, "Well, that's so you won't be protected if you try to rob a store." However, the language doesn't say that. So, if you defend yourself and get charge with menacing or brandishing they can decline coverage.

So who has what and how happy are they with it?

Insurance generally protects against loss resulting from negligent or unintentional conduct, not intentional conduct.

Criminal conduct is usually intentional, not accidental.

Most homeowners policies will cover claims related to firearms (you drop your gun, it goes off and you shoot someone: you miss your target and hit the innocent bystander in an otherwise legal shoot).

I'm certainly no expert, but it appears to me that coverage would be denied in every circumstance except when you would be under no threat of a judgement against you anyway.

It would be interesting to know if there has actually been a case where such an insurance policy actually paid a judgement.

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Common sense isn't so common.

CCW Safe is who I use.

My take:

Its all a scam. CCW classes are like time-share demos to scare you into buying this stuff.

You’d be better off with meteorite strike insurance.

You do you.

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“What you got, ain’t new.”

You sound angry.

Not a bit.

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“What you got, ain’t new.”

I agree, they are all pitched by guys who I can only assume sold used cars at one point in their past.

I will say, depending on location, this opinion changes a bit.

Here in Florida its not something I would consider, we have laws protecting people in use of force situations from civil liability if the use of force is justified.

Second, here in Florida, the chances of a justified use of force being prosecuted is slim when all the facts are in.

If you are in California or NY, it may make sense given their track record.

The issue with these policies is they are, at the end of the day, insurance by a big company whos sole purpose is to make money.

I will say this, some policies are $40 a month give or take, if you can afford it and want it, get it. I just dont think they are worth the paper.

I ask all the time when these threads surface for somebody to detail a claim experience. No takers this far, and I see nothing spectacular in the testimonials offered by the various companies. There’s a couple stories here that always surface, and when reviewed critically, they’re a lot of form over function . . .

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

I saw the same thing with “professional liability” insurance when I was with the Feebs. I knew a ton of guys who paid for it for twenty years, and not a single guy who used it.

If your shoot was deemed line-of-duty, the Bu lawyers would cover you, so the private insurance didn’t. If it was “outside the scope of employment” then neither would cover you, so why have it?

If it makes some folks sleep better, then it may be worth it to them.

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“What you got, ain’t new.”

Question: What is the primary function of any insurance company?
Answer: To make a profit.

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VCDL, GOA, NRA

Illegal in New York — the state’s not big on insurance to cover intentional acts… or scam insurance that doesn’t actually cover anything.

CCW Safe is who I have. They have defended a member in a criminal case
and won. If I recall the cost was around $300,000 thousand dollars at no
cost to the insured.
There are a number of post on this forum that covers this subject at great
length. Use the search tab at the top of the page to find them.
The chance that I will ever need this product are probably slim to none (I pray never) but
I sleep better at night knowing that I have it.

Well, as long as you're not a member of a rival biker group with an ongoing beef with the guy you ultimately had to shoot, and you don't keep going to places you know he'll be, you should be okay . . .

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

The people robbing you are the ones selling you the insurance.

I was a member of USCCA until they made you buy their insurance to be a member. I didn't like the way the insurance was written so I dropped out of USCCA. The guy who ran USCCA would have made a good used car salesman.

Before I made up my mind about gun insurance I consulted 2 attorneys who specialize in gun crimes. I also talked with 2 nay sayers and asked them one question, " have you ever had to fire a weapon at a human being?"

So, don't keep us in suspense. What did you learn?

Here in Indiana there have been numerous reports of SD shootings over the last forty years or so that I can remember reading about. None that were ruled as actual SD have ever resulted in charges filed. One actually surprised me. A guy who worked nights was awakened around noon by the sound of his front door being kicked in. He came out of his bedroom with a .357 magnum. The perp ran back out the front door and as he did the home owner shot him in the back with the .357. The perp was lifelined barely alive. No charges.

I have learned 2 things in 74 years that relate to this thread.
1. Never say never.
2. It will never happen to me.

Car insurance. I would never be in a car accident ( I was twice ).
Home insurance. ( damage from earth quake in ky. What were the odds? ).
Health insurance. ( creeping up on 1 million over 41 years, healthy as a horse (( 32 years)) until 1979 ).
CCW Safe. ( so far so good, but who can tell the future ).

That’s the point. If you legally carry a gun, can you guarantee 100% that you will never use it in defense of your life or someone else’s?
Most criminal attorneys require around $25,000 as a retainer just to take a case. Are you willing to gamble everything you have to
Pay for a criminal/civil trial and civil award? Im not!

Just Sayen !

Apparently this is a very divisive topic for some folks. Hey, I don't like spending the money either. But I'm not an evangelist for the product. If you don't want it...don't buy it. And I wish you the best, sincerely.

But I can easily afford the $399 the CCW Safe HR 218 plan costs me annually. Think of it as potentially amortizing a huge legal bill...whether on the civil or criminal side.

Do I expect to ever be charged with a criminal act with a firearm? Of course, not. But I sure as heck don't feel like forking over our comfortable retirement to pay an attorney's fees and all the associated costs of a protracted trial.

Folks are free to hold differing opinions...and that's just fine with me.

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642-1, M&P15 TS

I hope I never use any Insurance I have. But, what if……………..?

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Two Handguns every day

No insurance carrier will ever reveal how many claims they have paid or how many disputes they have defended against. Intuitively the number of such incidents is vanishingly small compared to larger insurance markets such as auto, homeowners, health and professional liability. In this information void, we're all left to make individual value judgements. I use the meteorite insurance metaphor often.

There is another consideration. The very existence of insurance protection invites bogus, jackpot justice claims. No sane person or business ever divulges the existence of insurance or limits of coverage, but who knows what's discoverable. There are a lot of professionals "running naked" with the predetermined decision to hand the keys to any serious litigant. The absence of indemnity insurance can condition better behavior.

Way back in 1984, I was out of college but unemployed. I'd fallen off my father's insurance because I had graduated and I was carrying my own insurance. That insurance was running about $100 or $150 a month, a chunk of change for an unemployed guy in 1984.

One Friday evening, I was having dinner with my father and I commented, "I don't know why I carry this insurance. I never get sick and I don't get injured." My father said to keep it and if I couldn't pay, he'd pay it. Ok, whatever.

Two days later, I was hit by a train and got to spend ten days in the hospital. No MRIs in 1984 but they were doing CTs of my head every hour. I don't even want to think of what that bill was.

As you said, never say never.

You forgot to add "an armed society is a polite society" for completeness.

(Some sarcasm may have been intended.)

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642-1, M&P15 TS

Solid statement IMO

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Is that a gun No a lifesaver

Typically, they will claim that they have attorneys available 24/7for you to call and they will be there for you. Well the only attorneys that would consent to doing this are the hungry ones. The ones that maybe are not all that great at what they do. Or maybe the kids that just got out of law school. Good attorneys are never looking for work. and they do not go on call for 24/7 call out.

If one wishes to consider something like this. Ask the outfit that is attempting to sell you the policy for the names of the attorneys that might be called upon to represent you.
And then check them out on Martindale.com. Check their peer ratings. Customer ratings mean zero as they can be cherry picked. As for me I would only want a four or five start peer rated attorney to represent me in a tight situation.
Now this came up here on this forum a while ago. And a forum member claiming to be an attorney. I think that they likely were but. They claimed that Martindale was no longer relevant. Subsequently I have researched this a bit and found out that his statement was complete BS. Martindale.com is still widely respected as a resource in the legal community. My extended family has some seriously heavyweight attorneys contained within it. Do your own research. Draw your own conclusions.

Great Thread and even Greater Posts!!!

CCW Safe for both my wife and me. They won a case a few years ago where their client was arrested and charged with murder. He was acquitted during a jury trial. It’s described on their website.

I also have 4 fire extinguishers that I have never had the need to use. As well as home owner’s insurance, and car insurance I have never had to use either.

Waste of money?? At least I will never regret NOT getting protection for my family.

That's my concern. Civil suit, meh. I don't have anything worth taking so no worries there. Criminal charges can bankrupt you in a heartbeat.

The man defended by CCW Safe was Stephen Maddox. The cost for his defense and acquittal was over $300,000 and he did not have to pay one penny.

Many good videos on YouTube that explains his self defense shooting, arrest and trial.

https://www.youtube.com/results?sear...en+maddox+case

I agree with you! But if you ever need representation you'll probably wish you had it.

Well, as long as you're not a member of a rival biker group with an ongoing beef with the guy you ultimately had to shoot, and you don't keep going to places you know he'll be, you should be okay . . .

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

Insurance companies are like ladies of the night. First they take your money then they ———— you. I’ve never had a good experience with a insurance related matter.

I have seen many, many threads addressing this topic. In all of them the boiled down general consensus was; if it helps you sleep better and gives you peace of mind then do it.

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Music/Sports/Beer fan

Insurance companies will find any loophole that they can to deny you coverage.

And I've never had a bad one . Vehicles , Homeowners , even Federal Flood Insurance . Everybody has always covered what they were contracted to cover . I wish the premiums were cheaper but that's a different discussion .