Hi,
I have loaded a lot of .45LC loads for my revolvers. However...my shooting bud bought a mod 25-4 with bbl cutdown to 2 5/8". He is going to carry this while hiking in Alaska and wants it to handle a griz, up close and personal, if necessary, for a brain or spine shot. I figure he probably should use 300-335gr hard-cast LBT/LFN or WFN, gas-checked, from Beartooth or Cast Performance. But my barrels are all 4 5/8" or longer, and realize he will lose velocity with his short barrel if he uses "my" H110 and LIL-Gun powders. Perhaps need slightly faster burn-rate like Blue Dot? Did not find any loads for short-bbls in John Taffin's Big Bore SIXGUNS; would appreciate your help. Need heavy hard-cast bullet, powder and load. Thanx...Sonny

Three years ago, I went to Alaska on a church mission trip. A couple of us took a day off and went to Talkeetna for some fishing. The preacher was our guide, Paul Trissel (?).

Anyway, he carried a .44 mag loaded with solid copper slugs. If the bear gets close enough for the .45 colt to be effective his momentum will probably kill you anyway.

just a thought

Yeah, I imagine you're right. My wife and I hiked there several times. I carried my .500 Linebaugh and she had one of my .45's with 325 hard-casts. The woods were wet, it was fall, and I was nervous, and the bull moose were in the rut, so we'd been warned that the bears were all hibernating, but watch out for the moose. So didn't enjoy the hike nearly as much as we should have. We saw other hikers who had no protection at all. So who knows? Sonny

I saw some moose during my trip and even ate some moose road kill. That is one big freaking animal. I'm not sure that there is such a thing as overkill when arming yourself against very large dangerous creatures.

I carry .45 colt rat shot for rattlesnakes in my area. It is certainly overkill, but I haven't had one leave the scene yet.

I once read how to practice shooting a charging bear.

Get a 5 gallon bucket and 100 feet of rope. Tie the rope to the bucket, and stretch it out in front of you. Have your buddy grab the rope and take off running behind you, and you try to shoot the bucket as it comes toward you.

The thought of HAVING to make that shot scares the crap out of me. I might save the last round to guarantee that I'm not going to be eaten alive.

I have to agree, while I'm a fan of the .45 Colt it's really not up to Grizzly duty. While the bullet is heavy enough it won't have the needed velocity to penetrate deep enough to do serious damage. If you could somehow get a hold of a .454 Casull you could still use your .45 Colt rounds for practice and light trail work. I know the cost is high but if you want a snub nose revolver Ruger does make the Alaskan in both .44 Magnum and 454 Casull. I wouldn't carry a 2.5" revolver for SD against a big bear but if that's your choice there is one when a heavy enough caliber to do the job.

I have done a serious amount of back packing over a period of many years. For the life of me, I cannot understand why ANYONE would exchange adequate velocity and sight radius necessary for a life saving activity to save 2" of barrel. It doesn't make any sense whatsoever to me.

I was a light packer who would be out as much as two weeks (carrying ALL food and shelter with me) but I always had room and weight for the REAL necessities. And yes, I have packed a revolver in bear country. I would NEVER go below a 4" barrel for defense against a large animal and 5"-6" is better yet.

Dale53

In .45 Colt, I would prefer a Ruger Blackhawk (4-5/8 in. bbl.) or Redhawk (5-in. bbl.) to a S&W Mod 25, especially one with with a snubbed barrel. I would prefer a 328-gr LBT-style bullet for big bear. If I had to use a 2-5/8 inch bbl, I would probably go to the 350-gr. LBT. I don't think Blue Dot is so good in the short barrels. It squibs for me in a 2.5-in. Mod 19, but works O.K. in a 4-inch .41 Mag. Mainly I use H110 or Unique in .44 Mag and .45 Colt. Check the reloading manuals for heavy .45 Colt loads. I have to recommend Ruger-only for big bear. Sorry, guys. If you want to use a S&W for big bears, go to the .500 Mag.

Keep the short-barrel Mod 25; It is good for two-legged pests. Load it with 200-gr JHP. IMHO, of course.

In revolver cartridges the fastest loads tend to be fastest reagrdless of barrel length.-"slow" powders may have awful muzzle blast and flash in a snubby but they still post the highest velocities. Inasmuch as the ,45 Colt has been used in the past for big bear defense it seems a bit overreaching to categorically state that it is inadequate. All pistol cartridges are less than optimum, many can work. Happily, most bear defense planning is an indulgence in fantasy.(I don't dismiss the wisdom of going armed in bear country, but am acknowledging the reality that most people who do so never have to even try to shoot a bear off of themselves.)

Fantasy for sure. If you're truly thoughtful you'll carry a wooden gun. The bear's gonna be picking his teeth with it one way or the other. May as well make things easier on his dentures. There's a school of thought that advocates .357, saying your best chance (next to none in any case) is a head shot, where the smaller caliber has it's advantages. The best advice I've heard is never to go into bear country without a buddy who runs slower than you do.

quote:

Originally posted by pinkymingeo:
Fantasy for sure. If you're truly thoughtful you'll carry a wooden gun. The bear's gonna be picking his teeth with it one way or the other. May as well make things easier on his dentures. There's a school of thought that advocates .357, saying your best chance (next to none in any case) is a head shot, where the smaller caliber has it's advantages. The best advice I've heard is never to go into bear country without a buddy who runs slower than you do.

The buddy thing is the best advice yet. Only make sure he is a cool cucumber that can shoot well under stress. He may need to shoot when you are hanging from the jaws of Mr. Griz and you want someone who most likely won't hit you!

I have a friend that hunts in the Bob Marshall Wilderness of Montana. We have talked about this kind of thing. There have been times when the fellow that was supposed to be your backup, didn't do a very good job. Serious problems in the friendship occurred after that!


One thing you fellows are leaving out about the short barrel though. It would be easier to get down the bear's throat as he gobbles on your arm! At least you couldn't miss!

Tell him to take a semi auto of some sort and shoot at all the crazy drivers around him. They pose a much greater threat than any bear.

OK, flame if you must, but IMHO the 625 and the 25 are NOT stout enough to handle a full power bear stopping load from a 45 Colt.

The frame is fine for once and a while, but not for extended shooting. That is not only my opinion but that of S&W.

If you want a stout bone breaking 45 Colt load, go with a Ruger.

Or use a 629 in 44 Mag.

OK, flame away. (I had a 625 MG in 45 Colt and sold it because it wouldn't handle the load.)

Thanx to all you folks for your rather diverse opinions. Some of you have said okay to short barrels; others haven't. I saw a new Smith at the gunshow today in 3" bbl-length, but that doesn't mean it's designed for hunting. I agree that short-bbl is marginal. I have passed this info to my buddy. Don't know what he'll do yet. Appreciate you guys.
Sonny

quote:

Originally posted by ArchAngelCD:
I have to agree, while I'm a fan of the .45 Colt it's really not up to Grizzly duty. While the bullet is heavy enough it won't have the needed velocity to penetrate deep enough to do serious damage. If you could somehow get a hold of a .454 Casull you could still use your .45 Colt rounds for practice and light trail work. I know the cost is high but if you want a snub nose revolver Ruger does make the Alaskan in both .44 Magnum and 454 Casull. I wouldn't carry a 2.5" revolver for SD against a big bear but if that's your choice there is one when a heavy enough caliber to do the job.

I'll have to a gree & disagree. I also don't see much benefit in a snub nose heavy in any caliber. A 4" will carry & draw just as fast & provide better recoil control, accuracy & higher vel. I disagree on the 45colt not being upto the task though. It is pretty easy to get 300grLFP moving along @ 1000fps from a 4 5/8"RBH. They will penetrate 20" in wet phone books, that's as good as I get from my 338-06 heavy loads. SO penetration won't be a problem w/ heavy 45colt loads. DOn;t handload, BuffaloBore & DoubleTap can set you up w/ suitable 45colt "bear" loads.

I would much rather put up with the discomfort of slinging this up in bear country:



Marlin 1895G .45/70 Government.