Smith & Wesson Forum

Go Back   Smith & Wesson Forum > >


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-07-2010, 02:48 AM
whitecoyote's Avatar
whitecoyote whitecoyote is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: MI
Posts: 1,509
Likes: 26
Liked 818 Times in 207 Posts
Exclamation Help identify "Alfa" revolver?

I have this strange revolver, and I need help identifying it.
It looks very much like a five screw M&P S&W. My best guess is it was made in South America.
What I have is a six shot revolver with a 4.25" barrel, caliber ".38 Long" (.38 Special fits in the cylinder). Overall condition is good, it has some slight pitting. Bore, and action are excellent. Functions, and locks up excellent! It appears to be very well built.
On top of the barrel it is marked "American best cartridges are those that fit best the Alfa revolvers".





__________________
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

Last edited by whitecoyote; 07-07-2010 at 02:52 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-07-2010, 04:11 AM
gaucho1's Avatar
gaucho1 gaucho1 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Farrrrrrrrrr West
Posts: 1,454
Likes: 1,057
Liked 588 Times in 279 Posts
Default

Somehow when I looked at the grips, I thought German.

Alfa is a Czech product. Wiki

Probably a fine and well made revolver. The Czech firearms
I have seen are very well made.

Google and you will find some informative sites.

Are you going to chop it?
__________________
I Love This Site
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-07-2010, 06:50 AM
stonehorses's Avatar
stonehorses stonehorses is offline
SWCA Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 767
Likes: 1,397
Liked 178 Times in 81 Posts
Default Alfa revolver

In my research for a friend, I found that these are Spanish made but distributed by a German, A.L. Frank Co. I hope this helps.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:07 AM
gaucho1's Avatar
gaucho1 gaucho1 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Farrrrrrrrrr West
Posts: 1,454
Likes: 1,057
Liked 588 Times in 279 Posts
Default

Alfa is listed as a Czech company. They show a line of revolvers under that name currently. None in .38 long.

Upon further checking, another source shows Alfa as a German
distributor that branded Spanish revolvers with the Alfa name.
These revolvers were considered low quality knock offs.

Does your revolver have markings showing location of maker?
If Spain fits with story # two, if Czech, story # one.

In any case,appears to be well made from the pictures.
__________________
I Love This Site
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:20 AM
JcMack's Avatar
JcMack JcMack is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Deepest, darkest, Indiana
Posts: 4,901
Likes: 1,078
Liked 2,241 Times in 876 Posts
Default

Gunbroker info FWIW

Google Image Result for http://www.collectiblefirearms.com/Pictures/mlp_0276.JPG
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:37 AM
walnutred walnutred is offline
US Veteran
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Ohio
Posts: 3,644
Likes: 70
Liked 1,113 Times in 464 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JcMack View Post

That seems a very ......optimistic....price.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:46 AM
Texas Star Texas Star is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 14,261
Likes: 11,840
Liked 7,126 Times in 3,554 Posts
Default

I'm almost sure that these are Spanish, and among the brands that S&W sued. This led to the Marcas Registradas marking being placed on S&W frames.

I don't think the Czech guns are from this firm.

Don't shoot it. May be dangerous.

T-Star
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-07-2010, 09:02 AM
deadin's Avatar
deadin deadin is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Ocean Shores, WA, USA
Posts: 4,232
Likes: 75
Liked 2,108 Times in 817 Posts
Default

The logo on the frame and the grips belongs to
Armero Especialistas Reunidas of Eibar, Spain.
__________________
Dean
SWCA #680
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-07-2010, 09:05 AM
JcMack's Avatar
JcMack JcMack is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Deepest, darkest, Indiana
Posts: 4,901
Likes: 1,078
Liked 2,241 Times in 876 Posts
Default

Could it be .38 COLT caliber?.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-07-2010, 09:30 AM
deadin's Avatar
deadin deadin is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Ocean Shores, WA, USA
Posts: 4,232
Likes: 75
Liked 2,108 Times in 817 Posts
Default

Quote:
Could it be .38 COLT caliber?.
Yes. Very common on Spanish revolvers of this type.
(Also known as the .38 Long Colt or "U.S. Service Ctg.")
__________________
Dean
SWCA #680
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 07-07-2010, 11:00 AM
Alk8944's Avatar
Alk8944 Alk8944 is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sandy Utah
Posts: 5,581
Likes: 453
Liked 2,947 Times in 1,419 Posts
Default

I have a basically identical revolver to yours with the exceptions that it is a round-butt and .32-20. There are no medallions or any identification whatsoever on it except an import roll-mark behind the trigger guard of "Spain". No doubt it was sold/imported after the S&W lawsuit was settled.

Mine has the same barrel marking as yours except for the O.V. "American best cartridges are those that fit best the O.V.

Thanks to deadin for the lead to the manufacturer. I have been able to find nothing about this revolver based on its markings (lack of). I will let you know how that pans out.

It seems, contrary to the comment by "Texas Star" of "Don't shoot it. May be dangerous.", that it is of much better quality than the more commonly seen Spanish revolvers such as Orbea, etc, and a far better copy of a S&W cosmetically than any other I have ever seen. I wouldn't hot-rod loads for it, and mine runs about 100 f.p.s. slower with the same loads than my 6" and 6 1/2" S&W .32-20s, but part of this is the difference in barrel length. I need to compare it to my 4" 1909 Smith.

Your revolver is definitely Spanish, and the .38 Long is .38 Long Colt as deadin said.

Last edited by Alk8944; 07-07-2010 at 11:03 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 07-07-2010, 11:26 AM
deadin's Avatar
deadin deadin is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Ocean Shores, WA, USA
Posts: 4,232
Likes: 75
Liked 2,108 Times in 817 Posts
Default

Alk,

The total lack of markings is curious, even on Spanish revolvers. Does it look as if the grips have been changed out? Sometimes the only manufactures mark is on the grip panels. The barrel marking ending in "O.V." might be a clue that could point to "Ojanguren y Vidosa", another Eibar Spain maker.

As to the quality of Spanish revolvers, they seem to run the whole gambit from **** to pretty nice. The main problem with a good number of them is that the quality of steel they used was not up to standard. It can be somewhat soft and the guns will "shoot loose" fairly rapidly. Just take it easy on the loads and if they start getting sloppy, hang them in a display....
__________________
Dean
SWCA #680

Last edited by deadin; 07-07-2010 at 11:30 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 07-07-2010, 12:06 PM
whitecoyote's Avatar
whitecoyote whitecoyote is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: MI
Posts: 1,509
Likes: 26
Liked 818 Times in 207 Posts
Default

The ALFA revolver seems to be of good quality. There is a lot of attention to detail. Fit, and finish appear to be excellent. All parts match, including the grips.
The only markings on the revolver is the side "trade mark", and the inscription on top of the barrel.
Would a .38 Special cartridge be safe to shoot in this revolver?
Thanks for all the reply's.
__________________
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 07-07-2010, 12:43 PM
linde linde is offline
US Veteran
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Ozarks of Missouri
Posts: 2,792
Likes: 1,563
Liked 1,648 Times in 668 Posts
Default

[QUOTE=deadin;135536244]The logo on the frame and the grips belongs to
Armero Especialistas Reunidas of Eibar, Spain.[/QUOTE

I have a similar Alfa and agree with "deadin" on the owner of the logo.





My Alfa is clearly marked "Made in Spain" on the grip frame just behind the trigger guard.



Similar barrel top marking




The lockwork, however, is clearly unique



I also agree that this Spanish copy of a 1920's S&W is of relatively good quality compared to many.

Russ
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 07-07-2010, 12:47 PM
walnutred walnutred is offline
US Veteran
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Ohio
Posts: 3,644
Likes: 70
Liked 1,113 Times in 464 Posts
Default

ALK, part of the reason you Spanish revolver may shoot slower than you S&W made ones is the bore. Many are actually 8mm rather than proper bore size for 32-20. The Spanish gun makers learned early that a revolver chambered and bored for 8mm Lebel Revolver could not only be marketed in France and Spain, but stamped 32 Winchester and sold in the US.

A quick check to see if your revolver is 32 caliber or 8mm is to insert a loaded 32-20 ctg into the muzzle bullet first. 8mm Lebel uses a .330 projectile so if the bullet of the loaded ctg goes into the bore very far,the bore is probably 8mm rather than 32. .
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 07-07-2010, 03:12 PM
2152hq 2152hq is online now
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 4,238
Likes: 162
Liked 1,722 Times in 927 Posts
Default

I did a double take on the OP revolver pics. It looks identicle to one offered to me at a small show a couple of weeks ago. That was pending another buyers first right of refusal,,and he took it for the asking price of.... $75. Gotta buy it for that.

The lock up was as tight as any S&W or Colt I've handled. Perfect timeing both SA and DA and the polish and fitting up of the gun was excellent.
The pics of lindes revolver show their typical lockwork,,a mix of Colt and S&W.
The pics of the OP gun here show nice sharp polishing lines and flat surfaces. Not all Spanish guns met that goal but there are a few that do and this is one.

I like the early Spanish semi autos but rarely look at the revolvers they made. But that one piece that was trolled in front of me and the one posted here are definate examples of the quality that they can be found in.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 07-07-2010, 05:45 PM
smith revolver cop's Avatar
smith revolver cop smith revolver cop is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: SW Ohio
Posts: 825
Likes: 0
Liked 30 Times in 19 Posts
Default

I did a few seconds of 'Google' research. Check this website- I couldn't tell if it was just historical information, or if they are actually still in production!

Revolvers | Revolvers, Pistols, Flobert, Gas pistols, Air guns, Handcuffs
__________________
LEO since 1981.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 07-07-2010, 07:15 PM
haggis haggis is online now
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Aiken, SC
Posts: 1,185
Likes: 13
Liked 177 Times in 74 Posts
Default

The lockwork is very similar to the Model 1892 French Ordnance Revolver, except that it is a mirror image (the French revolver opened to the right while most revolvers open to the left). The most striking similarity is the combination of rebound lever and V-mainspring. The biggest difference is that the Spanish revolver has a single cylinder bolting system, whereas the French revolver used two locking bolts.

I found another reference (Zhuk) that suggests the revolvers were made by Orueta Hermanos (Eibar) for Armero Especialistas Reunidas, suggesting that AER were more a marketing firm than a maunfacturing firm.


Buck
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 11-26-2010, 10:52 PM
wdbrown wdbrown is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default barrel on ALFA 38 long ctg

a friend of mine has one these and the barrel is loose can it be fixed

tks
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 11-27-2010, 01:36 AM
deadin's Avatar
deadin deadin is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Ocean Shores, WA, USA
Posts: 4,232
Likes: 75
Liked 2,108 Times in 817 Posts
Default

See my earlier response about the quality of steel used in some of the Spanish revolvers. Sounds like this one has already been stressed. Even if you tightened it up, it would probably just shoot loose again.
Sounds like a candidate for a display piece.
__________________
Dean
SWCA #680
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 01-28-2011, 11:18 PM
texdaddy texdaddy is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHERE I CAN GET A SCHEMATIC OF THE ALFA REVOLVER. CAN ANYONE HELP?
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 05-09-2011, 06:11 PM
deanwise deanwise is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

I have an alfa revolver much like yours in 32.20 (well not as good condition). Which S&W frame is this a copy of. I want to install a Crimson trace grip on it for a night stand weapon for my wife since I travel alot?
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 05-09-2011, 07:15 PM
therevjay therevjay is offline
US Veteran
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,354
Likes: 1,964
Liked 912 Times in 512 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by deadin View Post
Yes. Very common on Spanish revolvers of this type.
(Also known as the .38 Long Colt or "U.S. Service Ctg.")
Also some are marked .38 Largo (long) The real problem is some arn't marked at all, adding to the problem is that .38 SPL will fit into the cyl.. This is what most likely has loosened up a lot of them. .357 mag also fits just fine in my "Orbea". (which is scarey)
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 05-10-2012, 09:30 PM
23 m91 23 m91 is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

i have a alfa revolver i inherited from my grandfather. on mine the top of the barrell reads " use US standered ammunition" and on the side of the barrell it reads 32 20 cig. it that a possible change from the dates it was made?

Last edited by 23 m91; 05-10-2012 at 09:32 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 05-10-2012, 10:43 PM
old bear's Avatar
old bear old bear is online now
US Veteran
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: R.T.P., Nc
Posts: 6,235
Likes: 12,522
Liked 9,720 Times in 2,922 Posts
Default

The logo on the frame and grips looks similar to the logo on the old Rossie (Sp) revolvers I've seen in the past. In the 60's and 70' they generally were a decent quality budget revolver.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 08-17-2016, 01:00 AM
Alk8944's Avatar
Alk8944 Alk8944 is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sandy Utah
Posts: 5,581
Likes: 453
Liked 2,947 Times in 1,419 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by deadin View Post
Alk,

The total lack of markings is curious, even on Spanish revolvers. Does it look as if the grips have been changed out? Sometimes the only manufactures mark is on the grip panels. The barrel marking ending in "O.V." might be a clue that could point to "Ojanguren y Vidosa", another Eibar Spain maker.

As to the quality of Spanish revolvers, they seem to run the whole gambit from **** to pretty nice. The main problem with a good number of them is that the quality of steel they used was not up to standard. It can be somewhat soft and the guns will "shoot loose" fairly rapidly. Just take it easy on the loads and if they start getting sloppy, hang them in a display....
I hate posting on a 6 year old thread, but some may appreciate it.

I have been trying to identify a Spanish revolver that I own. Periodically I have searched the "net" and finally got a hit on Armslist. Looks like deadin was right that my gun was made by "Ojanguran y Vidosa" in Eibar, Espana. The description is correct right down to the "American Best Cartridges are those that fit best the O.V." on the barrel! The photos with the listing do not seem to have any identifying marks whatsoever, except the "O.V." in the barrel legend.

Thank you, deadin!
__________________
Gunsmithing S&W since 1961
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 08-17-2016, 10:04 AM
Inusuit Inusuit is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: SE Wyoming
Posts: 1,042
Likes: 1,076
Liked 1,259 Times in 480 Posts
Default

I have nothing to offer regarding your revolver, but that red font makes my brain hurt. Difficult for these old eyes to read.
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Like Post:
  #28  
Old 08-18-2016, 10:55 PM
da gimp da gimp is offline
Member
Help identify "Alfa" revolver? Help identify "Alfa" revolver?  
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: mid Missouri
Posts: 1,708
Likes: 7,109
Liked 2,004 Times in 865 Posts
Default

agree with Inusuit .... that red color & the funny blue one some use are too hard for me to read...I was able to convince one old retired officer to change his colors here to the standard colors... his posts are now very easy to read now.

Now if we can only get some folks to use paragraphs in a full page of text.........
__________________
be safe,enjoylife,journey well
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
cartridge, colt, crimson, lock, winchester

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Help identify this 29-2 4" Blue jamesr14 S&W Revolvers: 1961 to 1980 7 02-09-2012 11:33 PM
Please help to identify "older" Model 41's el camino Smith & Wesson Semi-Auto Pistols 3 07-15-2011 09:00 PM
PLs help me identify 2.5-3" Rd Butt K frames bushmaster1313 S&W Revolvers: 1961 to 1980 9 03-11-2011 11:00 PM
Finding "Old Harry's Side Arm" a 1925 Regulation Pol. Revolver with a Ton of History Hammerdown S&W Hand Ejectors: 1896 to 1961 37 08-03-2009 04:00 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
smith-wessonforum.com tested by Norton Internet Security smith-wessonforum.com tested by McAfee Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:20 PM.


S-W Forum, LLC 2000-2015
Smith-WessonForum.com is not affiliated with Smith & Wesson Holding Corporation (NASDAQ Global Select: SWHC)