I spent the majority of my afternoon at the Range today shooting my WWll era US Army Colt 1911. I love that gun!

I met one of my shooting Buddies down there and he pulls out a new gun - a Kahr .380. After looking at it and listening to him tell me how small and compact it was to carry, he loaded it up with 6 rounds of Federal Factory Ball ammo. The first round did go bang, but that was it for the day. All the rest of the rounds in the magazine were hit so lightly the primers barely had marks on them. Each one had to be cleared out manually. After grumbling a few words that I can not mention here, he put the gun away and said he was going to bring it back to the LGS later on. I'll find out tomorrow what they told him.

Not ten minutes after he left the Range another fellow came down with yet another Kahr - I am no Kahr expert but I believe it was a 9mm because it was slightly larger than my friends .380. This guy loaded up with Factory Winchester White box factory ammo, took aim and I couldn't believe it but he had the same problem!!! Light hits. He tried that ammo a few times and had the same results. He then pulled another box of ammo out ( I think it was Federal) and the pistol seemed to work OK, although there was one jam.

I do not own any Kahr Firearms so I am not familiar with them. Are they that ammo sensitive or is reliability just a problem with them? Both these guns were brand new, but geezzzz, that was unacceptable in my book. What do you guys think?

Chief38

I've owned many, many all metal framed Kahrs and all were good guns. I have nothing to say about their polymer framed guns.

THESE WERE BOTH POLYMER FRAME GUNS.

I got rid of my 9 mm Kahr because of too many fail to feed. I would rather carry a good revolver that I know will work than an auto I have doubts about. I had some Kel Tec problems also so I got rid of it. I don't like the long trigger pull anyway. The smallest auto I will carry now is a S&W M&P c (currently own a 40) or a Glock 26/27. No problems with any of them.

I have a pair of MK40's. They act like Glocks which is to say they run like scalded dogs.... I think that there is still a K9 here too if one of my sons hasn't absconded with it.

I owned 5 different Kahr pistols. No problems. I trust what happens to guns in MY hands not someone elses.

Maybe those 2 came from used kahr salesmen.

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Thirty characters. Exactly...

I have a plastic frame stainless slide 9mm. Kahn tells you to shoot 200 rounds for break in. Just because I don't ask directions does not mean that I don't follow directions. Shot several brands and bullet sizes including Walmart's cheapest. The only problem I had was the slide failed to forward to full battery bout 3-4 times in 300 rounds. Always with the Blazers. Steel cases.
After the fire in, a fully reliable handgun with good Winchester and Federal ammo.

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NRA LIFE MEMBER

You need to hold the gun firm when you shoot

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Buy American
Vote Responsibly

Plastic belongs in starlets, not in guns.

I have a CW9 and have never had a problem with it.

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Corripe Cervisiam

Were either cleaned and lubed before their first firing?

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Hold my beer and watch this!

I owned a PM9 for a few years. Sold it because I had other small nines that I personally shot and liked better, but reliability was never a problem with mine.

I've put a few hundred rounds through my Kahr PM9 without a hitch; accurate and reliable. I'm comfortable enough with her to make her my second most carried CC gun. Here she is:

I carry a Kahr PM9 in the summer, a CW45 in the winter, I am satisfied with the reliability of both of them. I shot an IDPA match with the 45 and not a hiccup at all, maybe I got the only two good ones but I'm thrilled with mine.

I had a Kahr CW9, for a while, and never had any FTF or FTL. It was light and accurate.

It was my first polymer pistol. Polymer is nice, for a carry gun. I sold it because it was a little too small for me, and it didn't look to be wearing well. It was beginning to show wear after 300 rounds. My Magnum Research MR9 Eagle on the other hand, is built like a tank. It shows no signs of wear, after a thousand rounds.

Thanks for the reply's:

I do not know if they were cleaned & lubed prior to firing since they were not mine and I did not ask, but I did see the ammunition after they cycled through the gun manually after the light hits. The Primers only had the slightest hints of a mark on them. I am suspect that either the firing pins are not the correct length or the springs in the guns are not the correct weight. In this particular matter I doubt that cleaning a new gun would have solved this issue.

Like I originally posted, one of the guns worked half way decent with different ammo, It just doesn't explain the light hits..........

What REALLY amazed me here is that this happened all in the same day at the same Range strictly by chance with two of the same brand guns! Whew!!

I do state-mandated CHL classes that include firing, and I constantly get people who bring new or borrowed guns that have never been cleaned nor fired by the student.

Last Sat a couple showed up with brand-new guns, an M&P and a Kahr CW9. I asked if they had cleaned the guns, and they said "the guy at the gun store said they were ready to shoot as is."

You guessed it: both were cranky, and the slides were as dry as a desert. A quick strip, wipe, and a touch of lube got both going fine. A dry slide on a new gun can cause the slide to not quite go into full battery. Also, just dumping lube in a striker channel can cause misfires.

I have a much-used Kahr P9 that is utterly reliable and scary accurate. There is not a "design problem with too short firing pin" or any such issue. The Kahrs are tight when new and should be cleaned and lubed before firing.

Problem I see most is people who don't know how to maintain a polymer handgun-- who often also can't hit a paper plate at 5 yards. People who show up with a well-used and maintained handgun of any brand typically breeze through the shooting part of the course with ease and no problems of any kind.

I let one student use my Kahr P9, and she couldn't hit a standard target at 5 yds with it. The guy with her starting badmouthing the Kahr, so I took it and knocked down 3 steel plates about 20 yds away to shut him up and got back to helping her.

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Science plus Art

During my 50+ years on this rock, I've noticed a few things.

1). Blame the tool.

2). Technology is better than training.

3). Re-invent everything like it was your idea.

4). Never let the fact you don't know something keep you from being an expert.

People that know would rather face a lunatic with an AK-47 than me with a flintlock.

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James L. "Jim" Rhiner

Kahrs and Kel Tecs are a love hate relationship.

"They are like a box of Chocolates, you never know what you are gonna get"

I could go into my whole dealings with Kahr, but there is not enough room.

I do carry a PM9, it only went back to them 3 times before it worked (after the 250 rd "break in) Lite strikes was one of them.

The PM 45 went back 4 times and was finally replaced with a new gun, which I sold at a loss.

With a $200 gun I would not care as much, but $600+ the damn things should work.

The PM9 is still the smallest best pocket 9 for me. The Beretta Nano is very good but just a tad bigger for the pocket.

Anyway, I will not deal with Kahr Arms or the Moonies ever again. They have now taken over Auto Ordinance.

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Still Running Against the Wind

This is just my personal opinion of course, but when a Gun Manufacturing Company puts a new gun in a new box for shipment it should be ready to function PROPERLY right out of the box.

The customer should NOT have to fire 300 - 500 rounds to get it to function correctly, and should NOT have to start stoning, adjusting, using special lubes etc. I know in the good ol' days when you took a S&W,Colt or Browning out of the box it worked. I purchased MANY new Auto Loading Pistols over the years and had no functioning problems like what seems to be happening these days. JUST SAYING.......

I am singing in the Choir with ya

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Still Running Against the Wind

I followed the directions and broke in my Kahr and my car.
Both function just fine.

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Pete.

My Kahr CW 9 has performed absolutely flawless for a lot of years and several hundred rounds ( I don't keep count). I can't imagine a better, more dependable carry gun. I have never personally witnessed anyone having problems with Kahr, and until I do, I will judge the product from my own experiencen not from hearsay.

I carry an MK40 in the winter, and a P380 in the summer. I have put 500+ rounds through the MK40, and about 300 through the P380 without any problems. I have been very happy with Kahrs.

I owned a CW9 and it was a fantastic pistol. Sold it only because i went away from small single stack pistols to slightly larger double stack.

A friend own a Kahr something, forget the name but similar to the CW9 but with a polygonal rifling. Anyway, it too is an awesome little pistol. Very accurate and reliable.

I also dont believe in a "break in period" it should work from the factory but what i did with my Kahr was load several mags of various 9mm (light, heavy, fmj, hp, +p) and just shot it. Worked 100% from the first round.

Too bad this happened to your friend. Maybe Kahr had a bad batch if firing pins or something.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

"Hearsay"
I can hear and I can say. I can also say they number of complaints and returns at my local gun shop and the reviews on line.

Some work, some don't, for a niche company their track record is not good.

That being said,

My PM9 works now and is scary accurate, I carry it.

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Still Running Against the Wind

I have carried a PM 45 for just over a year now and love it. It's a handful, but it has yet to fail. I also have a little North American Arms Guardian in 32NAA caliber. It says Kahr Arms on the side. No problems with it either.

Kahr's a generally well made guns with good quality control.
I don't think a light primer hit would be shooter induced. Shame.
Kudos for the 1911.

Now that right there is funny. I don't care who you are.

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Now That's Bullet Maintenance!

If Sip is correct, those two Kahrs might be covered under the Lemon Law.

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I'm with the banned ...

I had a K-9 and a CW-45. The K-9 was utterly reliable and quite accurate but was a bit heavy for a compact 9MM. The CW-45 took nearly 600 rounds, a new recoil spring and a couple of other parts to become reliable. The grip angle and I didn't get along. I always hit low with the darned gun so I sold it.

My LGS has had a bad run of Kahrs lately, all polymer frames. Said he's sent back 5 out of the last 8 9mm's and 40's due to failures to fire. He will cease to sell their guns once his current stock is sold.

UPDATE:

Well my friend brought the Kahr .380 into the LGS last night and they cleaned it and lubed it and told him all should be well now.

We went out to the Range again today (it's great to be retired) and guess what?

It was the same **** all over again! About 50% of the rounds failed to fire and they had extremely light hits.

Tomorrow he is returning the gun to the LGS again and this time insist they send it back to the Factory for repair. He is also sending in the spent cases because even when they managed to fire the hits were still way too light.

My personal opinion is that either one of two things are wrong...........

1) either the main spring is too weak
2) or the firing pin is too short - even when the round did fire, the hit was still quite light.

Well, we'll see what they say.........

Just a guess here, but there could have been an engineering change. Smith was shipping some 45 ACP revolvers with too short firing pins... Is there a Kahr forum? If so, those guys may have an idea.

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Proud anachronism

Sorry to hear about your friend's troubles. I'm actually a big fan of my Kahr pistols. I carry a PM9, and a P380 and both have been 100% reliable. I've had the PM9 for over 6 years and the P380 for a few years.

To me, they are excellent quality, great triggers, good sights, accurate, and the best size to power ratio out there (which is what brought me to Kahr to begin with).

As they say, YMMV, but I think they are great guns. I do hear that some people have issues with them, but I'd buy another without hesitation.

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NRA Life Member

Well this was my first experience with a Kahr pistol. The gun seems fairly well made, and despite all the light hits, it never jammed or mis-fed when it did fire. For my friends sake, I hope it's something simple.

I guess I'll stick to my Model 60-7.



Chief38

Kahr new gun break-in directions need to be followed

just bought two

followed directions

no problems

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Professional Trainer

Still...... hard to break in a gun that won't fire.

Didn't have any prior experience, but I got interested in the CW-45 after reading some of the reviews. Figured that I'd give it a try as I liked it as a pocket (?) howitzer. It is a remarkably good shooting little gun but the execution leaves something to be desired. I was aware of the 200 round break-in. I have had some feeding and mag drop issues with it that may be resolved; the Kahr forum was helpful on the latter. The cure was to modify the follower slightly and then a Velcro strip to reduce magazine slop. Then I got trigger reset issues; lots of polishing where the trigger bar rubbed the mag. The pistol is now up to 250 or so rounds and may have achieved reliability. It is on probation with me as an unreliable piece is anathema to me. Its future is uncertain as we speak. One more inexplicable failure and it will probably be gone.

Too bad as the concept is great.

My PM9 has been a good little gun, and I don't have any problems with following the manufacturer's instructions. Maybe I am just dumb and old fashioned but I figure they are the experts. They ought to know something about what they are selling you. They just make the things, day in and day out - that's all. If they build the gun tight and think it needs 200 rounds to settle in, that seems logical enough to me. It's no great hardship. I am going to shoot the thing anyway.

Any human-made product can experience a hiccup now and then. If there is a problem with the friend's gun, I bet Kahr will get it fixed right up. Guns are simple things. It's the operators that are another matter.

I bought a CW-40 a coupla years ago. Liked the size, trigger, design, trigger, fit to my hand, trigger, and accuracy (I really liked the trigger pull). The feed reliability was horrible, as in the worst I've ever experienced. 500 rounds, 2-3 trips back to the factory and I still couldn't count on getting through two magazines without a FTF. Sold it with full disclosure to another brave soul.

Still, I really liked the features of the gun so I threw some more money Kahrs way and bought a K40. I set the gun up to fail. Shot it straight out of the box with no prep and didn't clean it for 300 rounds. No failures. It ate both FMJ and hollowpoints like a fat kid with M&Ms. I relented and cleaned it, then shot it some more, still no problems. I'm happy. To this day it hasn't had a single failure.

The K40 is now my primary off-duty weapon.

Maybe you're asking too much? Ever see a car manual that provided instructions to break in the engine?

It's only 300 freakin rounds! With any new gun, you SHOULD be shooting at least that many rounds to get familiar with the gun.

Well I was just curious about the Kahr 380 light primer strike issue andj so I did a Google search on it and found that this is a relatively common problem with this pistol.

Some posters have even said that Kahr had shipped some of these guns with frames that were out of spec. and they had to be replaced. Apparantly this little .380 pistol has had more than its share of problems and my friend is sending his pistol back to Kahr in a few hours with a few of the cartridge cases showing the light primer strikes.

When he gets it back and tests it I'll post the results.

Chief38

For some reason Kahrs seem to come in two flavors. Cherries and lemons.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

Chief38, I have similar problems with my BG380. Any of the European-made .380 FMJ cartridges that I can buy locally at fairly attractive prices will misfire about one per magazine. If Federal American Eagle ammunition is used, the gun runs fine - have yet to have a fail-to-fire.

I wonder if we are not seeing a confluence of factors that cause the problem? Maybe firearms manufacturers are being a little more careful about the length of firing pins these days, in an effort to avoid piercing primers, and maybe the inexpensive European cartridges that are now commonly available here in the U.S. have a bit harder primer cup?

I haven't tried Remington or Winchester cartridges in my BG380 (Remingtons are next) but I won't be surprised if the U.S.-made ammo works fine. There is more than one piece in any puzzle. Unfortunately, it does sound like your buddy's Kahr is a little out of spec.

Not really the same thing or analogy. First most new cars no longer require a "break in", just drive normally.

Second, your car is not mal functioning during the so called "break in". Is it failing to start, backfiring, brakes don't work, will not shift? Will continuing to drive the vehicle cure these problems.?? First thing you would do is take it to the dealer. .

A master Gunsmith and owner of a Gun company once said "Continuing to try and fire a mal functioning weapon will not fix it"
Sure trigger pull may loosen up.But the customer should not need to "fluff, buff and put hundreds of rounds through it to get it to function. To get used to it,fine.

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Still Running Against the Wind

Are we talking Kahrs or Kimbers? ;D

Well, I can tell you that the good ole days of S&W wasn't in the eighties. A few of us (I believe it was eight) ordered some S&W model 66's. There were many problems including sights and more serious, cylinders machined incorrectly. Kahr have had their problems, too. All new guns should be cleaned and lubed before firing. One good thing about S&W and Kahr is that they make good on any problems with their guns. I recently purchased my first Kahr, a CM 9. I did buy it gently used, but so far I have been very impressed with it. Although like all small handguns, it isn't easy to shoot, I was able, from a standing unsupported position, to keep all of my shots in the 9 ring of a B-27 target at 25 yards.

Actually, it quite possibly would have helped. New, unfired Kahrs quite often have crud in the striker chanels left over from the manufacturing process. Any new gun should be clean and lubed before it is used for the first time.

It is not all that difficult to strip the slide and clean it. See
http://glocktalk.com/forums/attachme...1&d=1250637090

It also helps to lube them properly. See
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...LubePoints.jpg

OP,
sorry to hear about the issues your buddy had with the KAHR.
Over on the kahr forum is great info on the prep(cleaning & Lube) needed with the new Kahr's, the 380's have been known to give there owners fits.

Ive owned both an older E9 function was flawless,
and also a cm9 I used the posted prep recommendations for the CM9 and had no issues what so ever.