This is what's known as an impulse buy. I have no earthly idea what I'll do with this gun, but I was in an LGS the day after this one came in. I have a fondness for old Model 12s, and I sorta homed in on this one, I guess.

I think this was someone's special order shotgun, someone's idea of the perfect bird gun. It was made in 1914, and is in good condition. Two barrel sets...one a 26-inch in cylinder bore (!), and the other a 30-inch choked modified. Seems to me the cylinder barrel would be perfect for close flushing game and the modified barrel...well, there aren't too many things you can't do with a modified choke, except maybe shoot high-flying ducks and geese. It's kinda moot to me, anyway, since I don't hunt.

And all serial numbers match. "MOD. 1912" is on the barrels instead of the later "Model 12". And the address and patent numbers are on the opposite side of the barrels.

I'd be interested in hearing opinions on what the gun might have been used for. It even came with its original leather "leg o' mutton" case, with a separate compartment for the stock/receiver, and separate sections for each barrel set.

Why, it's even got one of them new-fangled Jostam "anti-flinch" recoil pads on it. What more could anyone want?

Anyway, here's a photo or two. Thought you guys might like to see it.

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Watchdog,
Can't say why but i do like it.
Nice grab.

Chuck

__________________
They hold no Quarter

I have a set like yours. Mine from 1917. 2 bbl.s, one a 27" cyl. bore & the other a 32" full choke with solid matt rib. Lots of deer fell to this old gun from my Dad and me after I inherited it. Bores still look like new(nickel steel). Values have dropped on Mdl 12's & browning A5's as a result of the new generation of shooters wanting the new gas/inertia autos. Cost of mfg. killed both of these fine guns. Also the mdl. 12 is not steel shot compatible. Enjoy them for what they are..........The generation coming behind us probably won't care.

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S&W Accumulator

Thanks for the reply. It's interesting you say that about values falling. I'm just north of you in North Carolina, and what Model 12s you can find are still going for a pretty penny. But yeah, all the younger folks want a gas burner. I'm not sure why. I have a Mossberg that's for sale on this forum just cause I've discovered (decided?) I do not like gas operated shotguns. Guess I'm old fashioned.

Thanks. The Model 12 has often been called "The Perfect Repeater", and it's mentioned as such in a short article in The American Rifleman in 2009.

I think one reason the pre-'64 M12s were so popular is their lack of a trigger disconnector. And the gun does have a well deserved reputation for strength and dependability...not to mention its longevity.

A long time ago, I did hunt animals. I'm not bragging about it now, okay? I did a lot of crow hunting...calling them in over decoys. My Model 12 with a 28-inch modified choke barrel was my go-to crow gun. In 12-gauge with #9 shot, it made crows just vanish in a puff of black feathers that almost looked like a puff of smoke. It was the smoothest and most natural pointing shotgun I'd ever fired. It seemed I couldn't miss with it. Of course, I did miss. A lot. Crows aren't stupid. They are one of the few birds that can see color, and they also have the ability to recognize a human face. But the gun make me look like a better shot than I actually was.

Nowadays, I appreciate the gun for its streamlined shape and pure functionality. It's a piece of art in steel, wood, and perfectly synchronized moving parts.

I agree with you about the "one gun to do it all" part. And really, in 1914 lots of folks didn't have the money to spend on multiple guns...deer guns, bird guns, and so on and so forth. They needed strength and versatility more than they needed diversity. And if I remember correctly 1914 was the first year the Model 12 was made in 12-gauge. When it first came out, it was strictly a 20-gauge gun.

I forgot to mention balance in my comments...and again, you're absolutely right. Maybe it was that balance...the way the gun moved and followed through, and the gun "making me think I was doing it right" that fooled me into thinking I was a better shot than I am.

That's a really nice score. I never knew they offered two barrel sets. I was even more surprised it had the magazine tube attached to the second barrel. I guess back then they knew what customer service was really about.

I have four M12s. A Cylinder bore that some dummy put an adjustable choke on, ruining it's collector value. My Dad bought it for me 35 years ago. I kilt a lot of pheasants with it. I bought a 20 Gauge a few years ago. Modified choke. Haven't shot it much, but kilt the first pheasant I flushed with it. Almost 20 years ago I bought a 16 gauge with a Cylinder bore. Wasn't too sure a choke that open would be a good pheasant killer. Boy, was I wrong! That sucker shoots like a laser. Federal 1 1/8 ounce loads of #5 shot are deadly on Iowa pheasants. Longest shot I made was about 40 yards. Bird dropped like a rock. I had always had a soft spot in my heart for the 16 gauge. They built them on a smaller receiver than the 12 gauge. I feels perfect in my hands.
Last one I have is a 12 gauge Riot Gun. It is my home defense gun.

The M12 is a classic. They last forever. I also have a PERFECT M42 my Dad bought for me about 35 years ago. Paid $150 for it. It is worth at least 2 Grand today.

Oh, and might as well bring up the other Winchester that is a classic: The M97. My Dad had a 12 gauge with Modified choke. He was deadly on pheasants with it. I never shot it until after he died. I've killed a lot of pheasants with it over the years.
Think of Dad every time I pick it up.
Jim

Ive only seen these with a long barrel and a tight choke,very nice! Maybe it was the original owners idea of the all around shotgun.Trap,skeet,ducks and quail.

I'm no expert on Models 12s, but I like them a lot. I have a Model 1912 16ga., factory cyl. bore, made in 1915 that gets hunted every year. Wonderful gun--with respect to handling it's the equal of my SxS game gun which cost many times more.

And Model 12s harken back to a way of manufacturing that will never happen again.

The gun you have is really interesting, especially the differing forends. For a while I had the Riffle and Madis books which might have shed a little light on the gun...but the guy that loaned me the books had the weird idea that I was supposed to give them back. I forget if the longer forend was standard on the longer bbl. or if they discussed two bbl sets.

There are a couple of guys around here that know these guns pretty well. But I just wanted to stop by to say what a great find that is. I'd love to see picture of the case.

I must confess......I have a 20 ga. mdl 12 that I shoot doves & crows with. Also a 32" full choke 1897 that I use occasionally. Nothing today matches the mirror finish in the bores of these old guns. Machined steel and walnut........Not much seen today.
Hats off to Thomas(Tommy) Johnson for designing the mdl. 12.

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S&W Accumulator

The 16-gauge has seen a remarkable resurgence in popularity up around here.

That's very true. Probably one reason I like them so much. In my mind, I can visualize my Model 12s being built. The gun harkens back to a time that I consider to be better than the present.

That caught my eye, too. I'm gonna have to do some research on that.

I'll make a photo or two of the case. It's pretty beat up, but at least it isn't mildewed or rotting...just a lot of scratches and stitching that's come loose.

I want a '97 really bad, but so far have not found one in the condition I want at a price I want to pay. You are very fortunate to have and use one that belonged to your father.

SER #1585846 29 IN. 3IN. MAG BARREL REC MATCH JEWELED BOLT AND LOADING RAMP, BARREL SAYS FOR SUPER SPEED AND SUPER X IN MINT COND. WAS MY FATHERS I HAVE HAD IT FOR 30 YRS. NEVER SHOT IT.WHEN DRY FIRE YOU HAVE TO PULL TRIGGER THEN PUSH FORWARD BEFORE YOU CAN PULL BACK TO RECOCK THE GUN ? IS THAT NORMAL?

I wish I could point out a certain gun in my safe and say that back in 1961, I took my very first buck with that gun. But, such isn't the case. My first deer season was in Schoharie County, NY, a shotgun-only county. My Dad's friend loaned me a 16 gauge Winchester Model 12, with which I took that first buck, with Remington Foster slugs, at about 35 yards.

At the end of the season I felt especially sad at having to return that Model 12 to its owner as I would never have possession of the gun with which I bagged my first whitetail.

Yes. Recoil moves the gun against your hand and unlocks it. I CAUTION against dry firing it..........You can break the firing pin.

Forends were standard across the board. Long ones came later. In the early years there was only the "corn cob" type on all field guns regardless of barrel length.

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S&W Accumulator

So I guess that means one of the barrel sets with mine had the forend replaced, huh?

When you say "later" for the longer forends, do you have a specific year in mind?

The very first Model1912 forends were 5 in long. That was the first yr production and about 5K guns.
The next forend was 5 1/2" long. From 1913 production to sometime in 1918.
Same shape (so called 'corncob') it had one (1) more circular ring cut into it that that early first style used for just one year.
The Model changed in 1918 also from 'Model 1912' to 'Model 12'.

In 1919,,the forend went to a full 7 inch length 'corncob' shape w/18 rings cut into it.

These are all 'Field' type forends of course,,andalso used on the Riot Gun intro'd in 1918.

Pigeon, Tournament & Trap grade guns had hand checkered stocks and forends as standard.

The gun in the OP may well have been special ordered as a 2 bbl (assembly set) w/the two different forends. The factory would do about anything they could to satisfy customers requests.
Another possibility is that the gun was sent back at a later time for an extra bbl assembly to be fitted. It would have been ser#'s to the frameof course and would have gotten what ever forend stye was in stock at that later time. Slight differences in the ser# font stamping and even the proof stamp can sometimes provide a clue to this. Sometimes they just make collectors wring their hands and mumble more.

What ever the story,,it's a great set. A 26" cylinder is a wounderful all around upland game gun in 12ga.
The Model 97 was cataloged in 26" cyl 12ga as a 'Brush Gun'. I don't know that the M12 was even given that moniker.
But 26, 28, 30 and even 32" cyl bore 12ga was available in the Model (19)12. as a catalog # item.

Thank you so much for all that information. Do you mind me asking what reference materials you used to find the info? This Model 12 is actually the only one I have with barrels of a "normal" length. All the others are factory riot guns with 20-inch cylinder bore barrels, including a M12 WWII Trench Gun.

I hate M-12s. My dad bought a full-choke 20 for my older brother when we were kids. I doubt if he ever shot it.

It got quasi-handed down to me when I was 13. Stock was way too long, choke way too tight, and action way too stiff. I went to a shotgun clinic at one of the old Winchester ranges. I could barely open the fool thing and hit nothing.

Spent the rest of the summer mucking out stalls & clearing brush to buy a smooth Ithaca M-37 12 gauge choked IC. Never looked back.

Big bro has "his" M-12 (bet he still hasn't shot it), and he is welcome to it.

Often times "classic" means we remember something as being way better than it was. I suspect the reason so many old timers toted those "classic" M-12s is simply because they were available & affordable, not necessarily because they were that great.

Could have been the "all purpose" set. The cyl bore was an upland bird and skeet gun and the 30" Mod could have been a Trap, and other multi use gun.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

I still shot trap with a model 12.............

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Steve....

C'mon...tell us how you really feel.

That's a great set.

The M12 is inferior only to the M97 as a shooting pump gun.

They are wonderful shotguns.

For those of you who have never used one, I suggest you try: the older the gun, the better.

Most contemporary shooters have never shot the oldies and have no appreciation for the quality of the older pumps (I include older Ithica 37's in this group).

If I couldn't use a Parker side by side ( or an Ithica, LC Smith, Fox or an English bird gun) I'd chose a M 12 or 97.

Just my opinion, of course.

Thanks.

I love the old doubles. I had an L. C. Smith Ideal Grade...30-inch full/full, engraved, and with two ivory bead sights. What a gun. But believe it or not, one of my favorite old doubles was a plain ol' Winchester Model 24, improved/modified, in 16-gauge.

I Have Several Model 12's a Mid 50's Vintage Heavy Duck Marked "For Super X & Super Speed 3'' A 2nd Year Production 20ga,A Browning Reproduction in 28ga & The Model 12's Little Brother a Model 42,All ar Slick operating & Reliable The Only Shotgun that I am More fond of are My Browning Auto 5's

The M 24 in 16 or 20 ga were great guns. Much better handling than the 12 ga in M24
Well worth mentioning.

The mdl. 12 is SUPERIOR to the 97. I own and shoot both.

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S&W Accumulator

Most all of the info is from my now fading brain, as I worked on these for a long time as both standard repair but mostly as restoration jobs and upgrades. You have to know what's what and how the factory did things. Working in a couple gun factorys helped. Big difference between custom (re)finished and restoration.

The early guns still bring $$ if in great condition and especially in the 'graded' guns. There is much switching of parts, bbls, wood on M12's. No factory records around IIRC. I know there were none for the M42, another favorite. Buyer beware as always.
Dave Riffle's (sp?) book on the Model 12 is an excellent reference for a nearly year by year look at the changes, modifications, specs, ect. Paperwook, boxes, production #'s, special order, ect, ect.
(Just don't believe everything said about what you see pictured in the book.)


'Originally Posted by jtcarm
I hate M-12s.'

While I don't hate them, (they are a fine shotgun)... I've never found them the things dreams are made of.
With all the work I've done on them over the years and all the high grade M12's I've had in my hands and have shot,,,I've never found them interesting enough to buy one for myself. ,,and pump shotguns are a favorite of mine too.
Kind of partial to a Marlin 43T right now.

I own several md 12s in 12 & 16 ga. The 16s are really handy as they
are built on the same receiver as the 20 ga. I have used one of the
12s for pheasant hunting a fair amount and the old md 12 does point
and handle very well. Some people still use them for trap shooting but
I doubt you'll see any top shooters using one at the Grand. I like the
old milled steel construction but after having several of them apart
and back together I have concluded they are a complex design better
appreciated as relics of the past. A md 12 in good condition would
probably last a lifetime of hunting but I would not personally subject
one to the thousands of rounds a year fired on the trap range. I also
have four md 97s, two 12s and two 16s. I have to admit I like the old
97 somewhat better although they are anything but smooth. They
certainly have a distinctive appearance.

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I like them, too...even though when you pump one, it looks like several parts are gonna fly out of the receiver. And even in this day and age, the external hammer does not look dated or out of place.

LOL, yeah I tend to sugar-coat things.

There's nothing wrong with the Model 12, they're just not my cup of tea. Kinda like a Savage 99 .308 I once owned. I was positively in love with the styling of that gun till I shot it. The drop at heel + steel butt plate + light weight made that the most painful rifle I've ever shot, and my battery at the time included pre-64 .300 H&H. Even my unaltered 91/30 (7.62x54R) is more comfortable to shoot with 182-grain factory loads.

It was used for hunting and before screw in chokes a 2nd bbl was the way to go. What you found is super neat and probably pretty rare with all the goodies.

I had and should have kept a 1920's M-12 in 16 gauge that was a matching 2 bbl set. Full and CYL.

I had a lot of them at one time. 2 more I should have kept were a matched pair, Skeet 1 and Skeet 2. Matching beautiful wood on both. I do still have 2 in 12 gauge. A 1920's field and a late 40's 3" Duck.

Used to find 16 and 20 gauges cheap now I can't find one, 12 gauge prices seem to have dropped around here.

I had a reproduction M-12 in 28 gauge, full choke. Several times a quail would get up and a direct hit left only wings. I had to wait until they were further out to shoot. This is probably why folks wanted an open choke for quail.