This old guy has been in the family for as long as I can remember. My Dad is a WWII vet, but this isn't a bringback. It dates from whenever you could buy one for forty bucks, because that was about all my Dad would pay for any gun.



Its an Enfield No. 2 Mk1*, chambered for what we call the .38 S&W. Being British, it is covered in mysterious stampings and hieroglyphs of numbers and arrows and crowns. I suspect this one means it was made in Sept of 1950, or it could mean something else entirely like Six Pence Truffle #50:



The grip has been broken forever - more stuff stamped under there.



It is double action only, no spur and no single action notch.



Top break, of course - break it in half, empties fly out, fill in the holes, snap it shut, and shoot some Hun.



The DA pull is stout. I'd say with no spur and a heavy pull, this gun is almost childproof.

I really need to start loading .38 S&W. I'm up to three or four guns chambered in it and factory ammo is pretty steep.

Anybody else have one? What would be a correct holster for it?

I have a Webley MkVI .455 - I think I'd have a hard time if I was told to hand it over and carry this little guy instead.

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“What you got, ain’t new.”

Got this at a local show a few years back for $100 because the action was locked up. Poured some solvent through it to wash out the dried grease and it worked fine. The 38 S&W is a caliber that demands reloading.

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No life story has happy end.

Bought one back in 1974 for $35. It was the first gun my son shot in 1976 when he was 6 years old. I think they called them British Tank Commando pistols back then. Never underestimate the 38 S&W. I would still have the gun today except my secretary needed it. She would come in beat up at least once a week. I just figured that since she was a SGT in the National Guard, getting knocked around a little came with the territory. Turned out it was an estranged boyfriend/husband who did it on a regular basis. Since she was black, nobody would sell her a gun (as in all the LGS and pawn shops). The little 38 with round nose lead bullets worked quite well the next time he kicked in her door and tried to rape her. Best gun I ever sold. I charged her what I paid for it. The box of cartridges was free. So, by 1978, I no longer had the gun.

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Dr. B

I've been doing some Googling in between trips to the door to hand out candy. Apparently the SPT 50 refers to a particular batch of steel. The ZF serial number means this gun was made in early 1944, so maybe it did see some action.

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“What you got, ain’t new.”

I had one for a while that I picked up in a multi-gun transaction that also oncluded a really nice old Ruger Single Six and a 1922 Browning. It eventually got away from me, like many have, but it was a neat old gun and really enjoyable to shoot.

Here is a link to a closed auction and the holster and belt for your .38:

Enfield .38 S&W Cal Tanker Model WWII w/Holster and Belt For Sale at GunAuction.com - 12648051

I have seen these in tan (khaki?) and blue, and I seem to recall the latter being associated with the RAF. At present, .38 S & W ammo is available at about $20/50 rounds, so it may be a good time to stock up. Enjoy!

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

I've always thought those were neat old revolvers, especially the Albion Motors mfg'd ones, thanks for sharing.

Here's the earlier version: both DA and SA and wood grips. This one made in 1936. Also the proper holster for it. I handload 38 S&W; it's an easy round to load. A little difficulty finding either .360" bullets or a bullet mould to cast them, though.

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Here's the one I gave to a buddy who was wanting one. He Was a Warrent Officer with 101st. Flew Chinooks in Afghanistan.
He traced the numbers down, it was a RAF pilots during WWII. (I had no idea)

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Halfway and one more step

At age 13 in 1989, my dad bought me a 1939 Enfield to use as a carry and HD gun. That Enfield accompanied me almost daily after school and numerous hikes/camping trips in high school/college. We used both new production Win/Rem LRN and FN FMJ loadings- both will get the job done. It was pulled from holster many times when the local mountain lions got too close, and still is frequently carried.

Forget that Tanker and Commando ad stuff. Een the snubs were made up as such and so advertised by postwar surplus dealers.

Colin's ost shpws the later real tanker holster. Older ones had a much loger frop strap ad hung kow on the leg.

It is true that tamnkers carried many, ad tey complained that the hamer spur hung up on thins in te tans, to the hamer spurs came off. Many were never converted to the newer style and still ave normal hammers d SA capability.

The most common holster is the Pattern 1937 webbing one, seen in the linked ad here, whcih mis-ID'd it as the tanker model.

Sort of sage green ones are for the Army and probab. the Royal Marines. The RAF holsters and belts are sort of blue gray.

Navy and some MP units had white. Look at the Royal Navy men at the last of the James Bond movie, "Dr. No", made about 1962. Those were white. I think that rescue boat crew were real RN men, working as actors. At the time, Jamaica was still a Crown Colony, so they'd have been available. Despite the official adoption of the Browning 9mm Hi-Power automatic in 1957, the British and Commonwealth forces were still using stocks of .38 revolvers, some Enfield's like these, some Webley MK IV's, and many S&W's.

The late gu nwriter Geoffrey Boothroyd mentioned in his epochal book, "The Handgun" or in a letter to me (I forget which) that the S&W M&P .38-200 was preferred by British focres who could get one. Part of the reason was the lighter, usually smoother trigger pull.

Re the above post, I can't reliably type on this board, which has problems with some program running and maybe problems due to the profuse ads.

What I'm typing fractures and becomes illegible. You can probably figure out what I tried to say above, but I can't see it to correct errors as I type, so you get what posts. This is the ONLY board where I have this problem.

YouTube may still have a film, The Drum, seen also in some releases as, Drums. Made in the mid to late 1930's, it shows the webbing holsters already in use. B&W film.

It's set in India, so the holsters were already in wide distribution.

The Enfield .38's then all still had normal hammers. The first DA-only ones were adopted in 1938.

I think you're fortunate not to have had to shoot a cougar or a bear with a .38 S&W bullet.

Does this 1939 gun still have the hammer spur?

I think in one of the books by Ian Hogg, he described this Enfield as requiring the finger muscles of Hercules to shoot accurately in DA. They are fairly pricy guns at present, and not seen too often.

I would take a .38 S&W any day over "wave your arms and make yourself look big"!

I believe my gun was made as a DAO. Since then, I have acquired an earlier RAF issued Enfield that is still DA/SA.

How's the trigger pull on the DA/SA one?

I agree that the .38 S&W is better than nothing. If it's what you've got, it's what you've got.

Anyone else remember when those Enfield .38's sold for $12.88?

Yours is actually a Webley. The Enfield was a later, simplified design. I'd rather own the Webley, it has a much smoother action. 😉

In the 1950s mail order gun houses (gold state, kleins, etc) sold Enfield .38s for $14.95. IIRC Montgomery Wards sold the Enfields .38 and French Model 1935A1 .32 for $16.95

Neat revolvers,,!
Should have a butt swivel,,those are kind of hard to find last time I looked for one.
The front sight has been re-profiled a little,,not much though.
IIRC the front sight blade was available in 3 'different stand offs',,Center,,and .00X" left & right. Replaceable (only by the Armourer of course) to get the revolver to shoot better POA.
I think the correction R & L from center was about .005 or 6".

(Like it makes a lot of difference shooting these DA only 17# pull revolvers anyway!!)

The cylinder usually has the steel batch number on it tool.

There's a rebounding hammer in these, but no hammer block in that position IIRC.
The hammer rebounds & the DA strut just sits on top of the trigger extension.
Something to be mindful
of when carrying.

Steel disc on grip was for stamping Unit and ID #'s. But in doing so, usually cracked the somewhat fragile grip material. So many/most are marked on the frame or backstrap. The latter up high on the strap where it meets the frame was a common place.
These or the 38Webleys had 3 sizes (widths) of grip panels also,,can't remember which.

'BNP' proof marks on this one are Birmingham proofs applied when the gun was surplused and sold on the commercial market.


Wolf Gun Springs did sell replacement thumb latch springs for these and the .455 MkVI Webleys. Don't know if they still do.
I've replaced a few over the years,,they just give it up after a million or so rotations.

I reloaded 38S&W for quite a long time with a set of LEE dies, but used standard .357d bullets., usually 158gr LSWC.
At the ranges these are generally shot, they worked fine. In fact were quite accurate and avoided a separate bullet order.
One thing I did do is size the cases in the 38S&W FL die, but did NOT expand them. That left them just right to seat and hold the .357d bullets firmly.
I did bell the cases lightly in an extra step by punching the mouth of each as they lay on the bench. I used a lathe center and hammer, jumping from case to case with one educated blow to each.
50 cases done in about a minute.
You could also replace the 38S&W expander in the LEE die with the expander from a 38Sp/357 for the operation and get the same result.

I used RedDot, but most any pistol powder will make it go bang and hit the targets to your satisfaction.

IMA (International Military Antiques) has some original and some repro Brit (and other) equipment. I'm sure there are other sources too.
These holsters were as common and cheap as bank-run gravel not that long ago. But like everything else....
British WWII Dated Royal Airforce Holster- Genuine WW2 RAF ima-usa.com

I reload for .38 S&W. However, ammo is readily available, though not at Cabela's. Privi Partisan is good at about $19.00/50. Remington, Magtech, and Fiocchi also make it.
I don't know your bore dia. but FWIW Remington is .357 and Privi is .358.
My Webley Mark III has a .356 bore and shoots great with .357 or .358 158gr SWC using Titegroup or W231.

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"from my cold dead hands" C.H.

Mine has the date 1941 stamped right on it.

I have loaded the 38 S&W to 975 FPS (2" Terrier) with a 125 JHP. About 100 FPS faster than mainstream 38 Special +P from a 2" tube IME.

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No life story has happy end.

The SAAMI bullet diameter tolerance spec for the .38 S&W is 0.355" - 0.361" (0.361-0.006). Therefore, being within the SAAMI spec, there is no good reason that .357"-.358" diameter bullets as used for the .38 Special should not work fine in a .38 S&W revolver. In fact, I used .357-.358 bullets for many years in reloading .38 S&W, and I never had any problems.
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By the way, some years ago I pulled lead bullets from some antique .38 S&W dud rounds (various headstamps) I got at a gun show and miked their diameters. I think they were all around .357". I reloaded the cases and bullets with fresh primers and powder.

Actually, mine is an Enfield, just a fairly early one, dated 1936. It's marked on the right side with a crown , the name Enfield, and No 2 Mk 1. Note the front sight boss which is flush with the muzzle; the Webley's didn't have that. It has nice, checkered wood grips, one of which has the broad arrow. They gave way to plastic grips, probably when the war started. I don't see any marking on the cyliner indicating the type of steel. If I've counted correctly, it has seven grooves, so it's hard to slug the barrel: you're measuring from a land on one side of the bullet to a groove on the other side.

The original load was a 200 gr lead bullet. I don't know what th British were thinking when they adopted it. About the time the war started the went to a 175 gr ± jacketed bullet with the same outline. I have a mould for a 175 gr Keith type SWC bullet, that I shoot unsized. It seems to be about right.

Mine had a very smooth trigger pull, not all that heavy. Maybe 6 lbs

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Halfway and one more step

An incredible and wonderful post of a different (and better?) time. "...pulled from holster when the local mountain lions got too close." How cool is that?

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

A Webley Mk VI .455 from 1915 and a "War Finish" Mk IV .38 from 1946(?).

Both are good shooters. The .455 uses .452 dia. cast bullets. The .38 shoots .357 dia. bullets OK but .360 cast bullets have better neck tension and crimps easier in .38 S&W brass.

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They can be decent shooters. I had to do a few things to bring mine up to fully functional, but I only paid $95 for it.

I should of bought one of these back when they went for under $50, always had hind sight but, no fore sight?
Steve

I have one of those I bought at a gun show for $160. The barrel and frame have different serial numbers. The butt strap is stamped "RHKP" which I assume is Royal Hong Kong Police. There is a neatly stamped four digit number on the butt stfap which I'm guessing is a rack number. I assume that it has been buffed because they are little pieces of proof marks all over it. The grip looks like it might be homade out of wood or bamboo. Is is a good little shooter and a delightful gun to examine with a magnifing glass. I figure it has little collector value but its cool factor is through the roof.

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olafhardt

I have one cut down to a sunbnose

I have a Mk III Webley "Bankers" or security model with a 4" barrel. Great fun ! Not hard to reload for just keep the pressures low. It has a great single action trigger, a bit heavy sure but very crisp!

I bought mine from a cop in San Francisco for $13.00 about 1960 when I was in my early teens. Gave it to Sgt. Clark from Ohio about 1968. I had to practice keeping on target with that trigger pull.
The real point is that I bought it "on the street" with no background check and I never committed any crimes with that or any gun. I doubt if you can buy any gun in San Francisco under any circumstances because they kept adding laws and restrictions for "our protection." We now have very few rights left in California - PLEASE don't let that happen where you live.

I would not be surprised if the SEPT1950 was the date for an arsenal rebuild. I think by the mid 1950s these were replaced by Browning Hi-Powers.

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No life story has happy end.

The 'SPT50' is the marking of the particular steel lot the cylinder was mfg from. The frames also were supposed to be marked with the steel lot code. But some appear to not have been done.

FWIW,,
If you like the Enfield No2 revolvers, be on the look out for a No2 MkI* version (spurless) marked on the right side plate with 'H.A.C.'

Two styles of markings. One simple block H.A.C.
The other having large outline letters,,the A in the center being larger than the H and C on either side.

These are very rare and few to be found. They were made for a very short time during WW2 in Australia by the Howard Auto Cultivator Company.

The total produced is somewhere less than 300 or so as far as I can make out.
Some guns were later assembled by citizens from parts carelessly dumped in a creek behind the factory after production ceased in '43 or 44. Most of these won't have ser#'s or proper markings. Some may.

Production from the factory itself was ser#'d with an A prefix and got into the high 200's , exact # varies depending on who you read.

They look just like any other No1Mk2* Enfield revolver except for that side plate marking.
They do lack back strap serrations IIRC but are fitted with the standard bakelite grips and lanyard ring, ect.

Any H.A.V. No2MkI* is considered a very rare find by an Enfield collector regardless of condition. Even the assembled-parts guns have a place in collections.