Smith & Wesson Forum

Advertise With Us Search
Go Back   Smith & Wesson Forum > General Topics > Firearms & Knives: Other Brands & General Gun Topics

Notices

Firearms & Knives: Other Brands & General Gun Topics Post Your General Gun Topics and Non-S&W Gun and Blade Topics Here


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 02-10-2016, 11:27 PM
bushmaster1313's Avatar
bushmaster1313 bushmaster1313 is offline
Member
ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde  
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: PRNJ
Posts: 6,748
Likes: 477
Liked 16,755 Times in 3,312 Posts
Default ArmaLite 223 Wylde

I have been shooting for close to 35 years, but only recently did I become educated to the nuances of barrel quality, twist, bullet weight, quality ammo and bullet design.

Recently I got an Armalite with a 20" 223 Wylde bull barrel 1:8 twist. It seems to prefer Black Hills 223 with a 69 gr Sierra Match King bullet.

This combo makes it worth my while to really start thinking about a useful front rest and hearing protectors that allow a repeatable cheek weld.

More than that, I need a checklist of things I can do as a shooter to improve accuracy!

100 yards from the bench off a sock stuffed with pinto beans:

__________________
Buy American
Vote Responsibly

Last edited by bushmaster1313; 02-11-2016 at 12:08 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 7 Users Like Post:
  #2  
Old 02-10-2016, 11:33 PM
prochi2k's Avatar
prochi2k prochi2k is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Central Kentucky
Posts: 349
Likes: 196
Liked 318 Times in 102 Posts
Default

What kind of scope are you using?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 02-11-2016, 02:07 AM
Ivan the Butcher Ivan the Butcher is offline
Member
ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde  
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Harlem, Ohio
Posts: 14,455
Likes: 23,502
Liked 26,378 Times in 9,144 Posts
Default

A late friend of mine, spent 2 of the last three years of his life experimenting with 1:7, 1:8, & 1:9 twist and Wylde chambers in a target action Savage bolt action. He just couldn't get the group size below 2" .......................at 1000 yards. His conclusion was 1:9 Twist either Wylde or standard 223 chamber ,77 grain Berger VLD, Remington 7 1/2 primer, and all the Varget it will hold. ( His preferd brass was Lake City from a batch intended for SAW ammo, with a little thicker head area, with Lapua Match brass second.)

I have one of his rifles, a stock Savage Target single shot 1:9, with his data it will do 3" out of the box. This load is too hot for an AR action and way too long for a magazine. It also has the same point of impact with A-Max 75 grain and almost as good accuracy with better varmint performance. Both of these bullets perform better in the wind than the ballistic programs (three different ones) predict their windage to be.

If you want to shoot 80 and 88 grain you should have a 1:7 or maybe you can get by with a 1:8 twist, but the Wylde chamber is the only way to get up to speed without deforming the BC. A lot of smith's use a Wylde chamber for fast twist 223's but just mark the barrel 223 Rem. to avoid confusion. I'm a little fuzzy but I think Mr. Stoner preferd the Wylde chamber for the platform. Some research will reveal a whole lot of the AR's and the 223's secrets.

Ivan
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #4  
Old 02-11-2016, 08:34 AM
bushmaster1313's Avatar
bushmaster1313 bushmaster1313 is offline
Member
ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde  
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: PRNJ
Posts: 6,748
Likes: 477
Liked 16,755 Times in 3,312 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by prochi2k View Post
What kind of scope are you using?
Leupold Vari-XIII 4.5-14x50mm AO cranked up to 14x
__________________
Buy American
Vote Responsibly
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 02-12-2016, 08:21 AM
Ivan the Butcher Ivan the Butcher is offline
Member
ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde  
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Harlem, Ohio
Posts: 14,455
Likes: 23,502
Liked 26,378 Times in 9,144 Posts
Default

Assuming your target has the ten ring at a standard 2", that's nice shooting. About a 3/4" tall and 5/8" wide. I like your model of scope also, all I ever got were Leupold's 40 mm objective, you should have a lot better light.

For purchased ammo, I don't think you can buy a better brand, that Black Hills. Before the "Run on ammo", the blue box was reloads (fired Military brass) and one of my rifles with a 1:12 twist liked cretin lots of the 50 grain A-Max loading, When I figured that lot out, I bought all the store had and ended up with a case and a half. I found latter, that my older Bushmaster AR 1:9 twist likes it also. If you can get a quantity of the same lot of ammo, That lets you shoot with one less variable when shooting day to day weather conditions.

Ivan
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 02-12-2016, 11:50 AM
DWalt's Avatar
DWalt DWalt is offline
Member
ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde  
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: South Texas & San Antonio
Posts: 33,636
Likes: 242
Liked 29,149 Times in 14,094 Posts
Default

"More than that, I need a checklist of things I can do as a shooter to improve accuracy!"
You have committed the far too common error of confusing accuracy with precision. Small groups = precision. Hitting the target = accuracy.

Not to belabor the obvious, but probably the best way to improve grouping is to experiment, experiment, experiment with different loads, cartridge OALs, and components. Uniformity is the key - case length, case weight, bullet weight, and propellant weight. That's what the bench rest shooters do. It is surprising what a change in case manufacturer can make. My best-shooting .223 loads are made with Israeli military cases. It has been well-established that uniform case length and finding the correct cartridge OAL for a specific bullet are the most important of the factors you can easily control. By the way, if you REALLY want to test and compare the grouping capability of your gun and loads, the most efficient method to achieve statistical confidence is to fire at least five 10-shot groups and average the extreme spreads of each. Anything less and you are fooling yourself while wasting ammunition.

Last edited by DWalt; 02-12-2016 at 11:52 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 02-12-2016, 12:05 PM
getoff getoff is offline
Member
ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde ArmaLite 223 Wylde  
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: FL Panhandle these days
Posts: 1,433
Likes: 941
Liked 526 Times in 270 Posts
Default

my competition AR is chambered in .223 Wylde. its a gun i built on Aero Precision matched upper/lower set. it was chambered in 5.56/.223. changed to the 18" FN 1 in 8 twist .223 Wylde bbl. and groups tightened up at 100 yards by about half... not me, but better quality bbl did make a difference.
__________________
why? why not?
Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Armalite AR 180 stuff paul s WANTED to Buy 0 02-19-2015 05:03 PM
ArmaLite DEF15F saltair Firearms & Knives: Other Brands & General Gun Topics 1 01-22-2015 02:39 PM
Armalite AR-18 and AR-180... PALADIN85020 The Lounge 8 12-30-2012 08:19 PM
ArmaLite M-15/22 samuraiadam17 Smith & Wesson M&P 15-22 14 02-20-2012 09:52 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
smith-wessonforum.com tested by Norton Internet Security smith-wessonforum.com tested by McAfee Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:44 AM.


Smith-WessonForum.com is not affiliated with Smith & Wesson Holding Corporation (NASDAQ Global Select: SWHC)