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07-21-2016, 03:57 PM
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I Wonder What Has Happened To Kimber?
Received the August, 2016 issue of the American Rifleman.
For the first time in months, Kimber doesn't have the back cover. It's gone over to Benelli. It seems strange...like not seeing a roll of toilet paper next to the commode or something.
Matter of fact, unless I've somehow missed it, there isn't even one single ad for Kimber in the entire magazine. Colt, Ruger, S&W, and even Les Baer all have full page ads as usual. Even cheap cigars and bargain basement watches have full pages.
I wonder if Kimber had a contract and it expired? Or...what? Sales haven't justified ad prices? Kimber has a beef with American Rifleman or the NRA? Or vice versa?
I can understand cost cutting, but to not even do a half-page or a quarter-page ad in a mega-circulation firearms-dedicated publication seems counter productive to me.
I don't read gun magazines any more, so haven't noticed if Kimber has dropped out of those.
Anyone else notice this? Just curious.
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07-21-2016, 04:14 PM
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Not 100% sure if this is spot on, however the source, a Kimber dealer, is generally very reliable- One of Kimber's major suppliers hasn't delivered a single part to them in months effectively stopping production of many Kimber models. Why continue to spend large amounts of marketing money to build demand for a product that can't be delivered.
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07-21-2016, 04:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steamloco76
Not 100% sure if this is spot on, however the source, a Kimber dealer, is generally very reliable- One of Kimber's major suppliers hasn't delivered a single part to them in months effectively stopping production of many Kimber models. Why continue to spend large amounts of marketing money to build demand for a product that can't be delivered.
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That's interesting, I haven't heard that. But now that I think about it, I was in one of the LGSs I visit on a weekly basis, and there wasn't a Kimber to be found in the whole place. Their space in the display shelves was full of (Gasp!) Colts.
I just did a fast Kimber Google, and almost the whole first page is full of nothing but Kimber production and QC problems. I'm not bad mouthing Kimber...plus I have zero experience with them...never even held one...just always thought they made a quality product.
Starting to wonder what the whole story is for real now.
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07-21-2016, 09:16 PM
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Aside from their entry level guns, Kimber 1911's are ugly and over priced. Their corporate attitude will be their undoing because more and more gun makers are offering better guns for less money.
Just ask many of the "Master" Kimber dealers that can't get their hands on any guns because Kimber sends them all to big box stores.
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07-21-2016, 09:55 PM
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I have a 20 year old Kimber Custom II .45 that is about as accurate as any 1911 I have ever fired including high end Colts and custom jobs. Kimber lost a lot of the 1911 crowd because of the Schwartz grip safety that locks the firing pin but I thought that was a pretty good idea. Springfield and many others use a light weight firing pin and no firing pin safety. I will also say that I bought an American Classic 1911 that was made in the Phillipines that is dang near as good as the Kimber for a whole lot less money.
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07-22-2016, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Farmer17
I have a 20 year old Kimber Custom II .45 that is about as accurate as any 1911 I have ever fired including high end Colts and custom jobs. Kimber lost a lot of the 1911 crowd because of the Schwartz grip safety that locks the firing pin but I thought that was a pretty good idea. Springfield and many others use a light weight firing pin and no firing pin safety. I will also say that I bought an American Classic 1911 that was made in the Phillipines that is dang near as good as the Kimber for a whole lot less money.
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If there's one thing most 1911 fans hate, it's messing with John Browning's original design.
I'm probably one of the few who like Series 80s because I can safely carry them hammer down. I know I'm speaking heresy to those who like to carry cocked and locked, but I don't carry a 1911 for concealed carry. I carry it open in the field when hunting. (It's a stainless Delta Gold Cup 10mm). I'm used to revolvers like single actions and I'm faster cocking the hammer than fumbling with the safety. The point is, unless you are one of the few oddballs like me, there is no need for Series 80 style safeties and many feel the trigger pull is inferior.
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07-22-2016, 02:10 PM
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I have owned my Series 1 (Yonkers) Kimber Classic Custom and Ultra Carry since early-2000. Both are basic guns with no adornments and I have fired thousands of rounds through each of them with no problems to speak of. I am comfortable with them and rely on my Kimbers in my EDC rotation.
I have followed the changes made to Kimber models - such as the move to external extractors and the additional firing pin safety - and also read with some concern the issues pertaining to rusting barrels and fit/finish. Thankfully, I have not encountered any of these issues with my examples.
Based on all of this, I, personally, would hesitate to lay out the funds for a new Kimber as I do not feel that they are the "premium" handgun producer they once were.
Very sad.......
Last edited by MetalMan; 07-22-2016 at 02:14 PM.
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07-22-2016, 04:00 PM
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Just about anything new from Kimber is junk in my opinion. They crank out every color, to include rainbow, they can...when they should focus on making a quality product again. The old Kimbers when they first got up and running were outstanding pistols. I had a few, from the shelf model up to a few from their custom shop. They were outstanding! When they came out with the TL/TLR guns was about the time they started going downhill.
They sent me a few of the TLR guns for testing for use by our team at work. We had already worked a special run deal with custom serial numbers, where I had collected a lot of money up front from the crew. We couldn't get either of the test guns they sent us to run. From ball to duty ammo, a full magazine without a malfunction was a rare occurrence. They swapped pistols out and we had the same result. They refused to work any further, claiming it was our ammo and not their pistols. That same ammo, which we had years of history with, ran fine through every other 1911, Sig, Glock, you name it on our team. Long story short, we cancelled the deal and never looked back.
They moved the factory location, messed with the design and started mass producing quantity over quality. I sold my old versions out of spite and never looked back. (secretly wish I had kept the one custom shop elite version...some lucky gent in Montana I believe is now the lucky owner)
Not sure any of this applies to this thread about their advertising, but I feel better telling the story again.
The available supply is even shorter yet, after some crooks broke into a local shop yesterday and made off with a shelf full of Kimbers...... hopefully if I come face to face with one during a recovery, it'll be one of the new ones and give me an edge in my favor.
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07-22-2016, 04:05 PM
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Never owned one of their handguns. Have several of their rifles and they are top notch!
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07-22-2016, 04:18 PM
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Kimbers have always been over-rated and over-priced. I've seen more Kimbers choke that any other 1911.
Now with RIA and Armscor importing pistols that work for far less money, I can see where Kimber could be having problems.
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07-22-2016, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grayfox
Kimbers have always been over-rated and over-priced. I've seen more Kimbers choke that any other 1911.
Now with RIA and Armscor importing pistols that work for far less money, I can see where Kimber could be having problems.
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Exactly what he said. Kimbers here are bad JUJU. I have had the opportunity to see a lot of them. One of our shooters paid $1,500+ for a stainless 9mm and we NEVER got it to feed, extract, or eject properly. Got 4 Wilson 10 shot mags that worked in everything on the range but the Kimber.
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07-24-2016, 12:38 AM
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I have 2 Kimber rifles, very nice except the ramp had a sharp edge at the top and you had to keep one less round in the magazine or the 2nd round would jam. My dremel tool corrected that.
I have an early Custom Classic. I have not owned any new ones but have read all the bad press by folks who repeat rumors, lovers of other brands and guys who actually have had the problems. For the last reason I probably would not buy a new one.
My old one is super accurate, loads, fires smaller groups than I can hold off hand and ejects. I do love it, everyone who has shot it loves it. In the past several years I bought 2 Colt National match 1911's. a 1959 and a 1966. Using new old Stock Winchester 185 gr match ammo I can not get them to group as well as the Kimber using cheap ball ammo.
I am not a fan of the firing pin lock they went to nor the external ejectors. That and bad experiences by those who used them will prevent me from buying a new pistol.
I had an early Thomson 1911, it was accurate, was reliable and cheap. I traded it in on the 1st National Match. Now I wish i'd kept it. It was the perfect truck and woods walking gun. But I understand Thompson QC went south with later 1911's and they lost their customers. Wise up Kimber.
It has not been that long ago when a few magazine articles mentioned the high quality and accurate Kimbers drove Colt to make better 1911's. I guess Kimber forgot what made them elite.
When I find a little extra cash I want a Colt Competition in 45 and perhaps a 9 mm for fun.
I'll have to ask Arjay if there is a limit on how many 1911's one should own at one time.
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07-24-2016, 12:50 AM
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Seems that if you want a Kimber....
Seems that if you want a Kimber, an older one would be a wise choice. Bad management can ruin even a a good product.
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07-24-2016, 02:58 AM
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I have bought 4 Kimbers since 2012. All brand new. No rust issues. No FTFs. No problems. 1 9mm and the rest in .45 ACP. I like mine.
Oh. I also have new and old Colt's, an RIA, and 2 Dan Wesson's. The only two that have issues are the DWs. And yes, I shoot em.
I know nothing about their advertising issues or parts issues.
ALL my 1911's are more accurate than I can hold.
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07-24-2016, 06:58 AM
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Kimber
I haven't read or heard anything lately of that "goofy" over priced revolver that was supposed to be THE new thing in concealed carry Has that gone the way of the "new" Remington R51 ?
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07-24-2016, 09:32 AM
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The NRA is introducing a new magazine for it's members. That may be where their advertising money is going. I am sticking with the American Rifleman.
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07-24-2016, 09:43 AM
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I have owned several Kimbers. I would not buy any of their pistols with the "Kimpro" finish. It literally flakes off the frame. Their stainless steel finishes and their charcoal blue finish is excellent.
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07-24-2016, 10:09 AM
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There was a Kimber ad on the back of the NRA's Shooting Illustrated magazine cover for August.
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07-24-2016, 11:11 AM
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I own three Kimber 1911 pistols. Zero problems with any of them, though none are recent purchases or recent production.
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07-27-2016, 10:28 AM
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I bought one of Kimbers stainless ultra carry II in 9mm . I did changed grips as I'm not a wood grip fan but other wise its a great pistol for what I thought was a good price . Not many 3" lite weight 1911's to pick from . I could have bought a EMP but for that price not hardly a deal or a colt defender and I not much of a fan of current colts ether .
I think I got a good deal . I paid $729 for my kimber . Its got a tight slide to frame fit with no perceivable wiggle along with barrel to slide fit . Trigger pull is 4lb 6oz average and istsnot ammo picky with carry ammo or reloads I've used in all family 9mms .
It also runs reliably with Wilson 8 , 9 and 10 round emt mags . Only have 600 rounds thru it so far but not a single issue with it.
http://i331.photobucket.com/albums/l...&1469629590389
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07-28-2016, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Farmer17
Kimber lost a lot of the 1911 crowd because of the Schwartz grip safety that locks the firing pin but I thought that was a pretty good idea.
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Somebody who is a hell of a lot smarter and more knowledgeable than I am once explained to me that the Schwartz safety was a gizmo that required quite a bit of hand-fitting in order to work reliably. It was not compatible with mass production. Which is why it went buh-bye over 75 years ago when the Army wanted a lot of new 1911A1s.
The upshot of the discussion was that if a heavy firing pin spring and a titanium firing pin wasn't enough to get into one's comfort zone, then a Series 80 system was the only way to go.
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07-28-2016, 05:24 PM
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Kimber Ultra CDP II
I purchased my 3" Ultra over 16 years ago. Fired well over 2 thousands, replaced a recoil spring, but never had a FTF or a FTE. The small Kimber is the most reliable .45, in my opinon, that you can buy. I use it as my daily carry.
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07-29-2016, 01:00 AM
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I guess I haven't paid attention to Kimber ads lately, or their absence. Perhaps its kind kind of like Colt not spending money on ads for years since they couldn't supply guns to meet any additional sales ads might generate anyway? I see a lot of negativity toward Kimber, perhaps deserved, I don't know. I've owned, and experienced warranty issues of one kind or another with most major manufacturers' 1911 type pistols. Most recently a couple of Colts. Though I've owned a half dozen Kimbers over the last ~15 years, I've never had to send a Kimber in for any type of warranty service. Perhaps my recent production Kimber will disintegrate or begin malfunctioning tomorrow. If so, as a public service I will alert everyone here
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07-29-2016, 05:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Farmer17
I have a 20 year old Kimber Custom II .45 that is about as accurate as any 1911 I have ever fired including high end Colts and custom jobs. Kimber lost a lot of the 1911 crowd because of the Schwartz grip safety that locks the firing pin but I thought that was a pretty good idea. Springfield and many others use a light weight firing pin and no firing pin safety. I will also say that I bought an American Classic 1911 that was made in the Phillipines that is dang near as good as the Kimber for a whole lot less money.
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You can get a Kimber without the safety you describe (models without the II right after).
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07-29-2016, 08:56 AM
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After getting my first (and last) Kimber home I discovered that the main spring housing was plastic, I called them to complain about a $1,000 gun with a plastic part, she told me to send it back and for $35 they would replace it with a metal one.
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07-29-2016, 11:14 AM
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VAPA, Most of my Colts have for years had plastic mainspring housings,as did a couple of my STIs, and yes Kimbers. I was initially offended by the plastic MSHs and did replace some. Now, I don't get excited about it as none has ever given any trouble in any way. If a plastic MSH causes a gun to be your first and last, stay away from many of the Colt and STI models too...
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07-29-2016, 12:52 PM
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I bought a Kimber .45 custom classic when they first came out in 1994. Changed the front sight to "Ashley bigdot" and stay horn grips. T service s me well but my new favorite is Sig P320sc. Support NRA to protect our
Second. Amend rights!!!
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07-29-2016, 02:52 PM
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I have 2 Kimbers & have had no problems....VIS35,that "goofy"gun you are talking about has been given high marks for those who have shot it!Overpriced....maybe....but I think Wilson &Nighthawks are overpriced!
I'm waiting to see how this Kimber performs before I make any judgements!
Jim
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07-29-2016, 03:13 PM
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I have but one Kimber, purchased new in 2001. This compact stainless model has been a perfectly-performing discreet carry pistol from the get-go. It's my favorite carry 1911-style pistol, and it conforms to John Browning's original mechanical specs.
I sent the slide back to Kimber to install some tritium sights; they did a great job and had it back to me within a week.
Can't speak for recent manufacture, but this one is just fine.
John
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07-29-2016, 04:56 PM
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I have also noticed the reduction in Kimber ads mainly because they seemed to own the back cover and inside front cover of many gun mags. I have two full size target models in 45ACP and a 4" stainless defense carry gun. All were bought in the 1990s and run great.
Also, you all may remember Colt went bankrupt in 2015(one of the many times they filed Chapter 11) and reorganized their debt. Since they came out of BK they have been introducing new models and advertising in the gun mags. Maybe they just out bid Kimber for space.
PS Don't throw dirt in Kimber's face yet. The new Guns and Ammo came in the mail today. Kimber has the entire outside back cover.
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Last edited by S&WIowegan; 07-29-2016 at 10:56 PM.
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07-30-2016, 11:12 AM
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I have a super match II. It was probably overpriced, has a lot of trinkets I can do without (mag well, ambi and extended safety, full length guide rod), lots of MIM internals. It has the Swartz safety, which I would prefer not to have. But it is accurate enough for bullseye at 50 yds and has never let me down.
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07-30-2016, 12:47 PM
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They don't seem to be the same quality that they used to be. Then again, not much is these days.
I'll stick with my S&W and Sig 1911's for current production out of the box quality.
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07-30-2016, 03:10 PM
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The September issue of GUNS & AMMO has Kimber's ad on the rear cover. All must be well in Yonkers.
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08-06-2016, 02:22 PM
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I own a TLEII because my wife wanted a Kimber
For about the same money I would have bought a STI Spartan. I had a Springfield Loaded but the black coating flaked off far too easily. Heresy, but for a single stack .45 I'd rather have a SIG P220 SAO. Like an idiot I sold my P220 SA/DA a few years back, the most accurate centerfire handgun I've ever owned.
I think it's a pretty good 1911, not a great value though and we all know about Kimber's (non) service department. Was disappointed by the in-the-white barrel on a $900 handgun.
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08-06-2016, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUFF
The September issue of GUNS & AMMO has Kimber's ad on the rear cover. All must be well in Yonkers.
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Speaking of Yonkers, I have to wonder, in anti-gun NYC where most people don't have the privilege of owning a gun, just how knowledgeable and skilled their workers are?
We're not talking about housewives slapping together a 10-22. This is supposed to be a premium handgun that's priced accordingly. You would expect someone assembling it to say, "Hmmm, no, I don't think the sum of these particular parts is going to reliably work out, let me try a different part."
If only they could get back to the roots of their Clackamas (Oregon) days.
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08-06-2016, 02:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian in Oregon
Speaking of Yonkers, I have to wonder, in anti-gun NYC where most people don't have the privilege of owning a gun, just how knowledgeable and skilled their workers are?
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Yonkers is not part of NYC. Even if it were, I can't see any correlation between local gun laws and intelligence and skills of the workers. Those sky-scrapers didn't build themselves.
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08-06-2016, 03:13 PM
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Except sky scrapers are not 1911s. Big Apples and oranges (pun intended).
The point is, what is the skill set of the workers making a premium 1911?
Are they skilled gun fitters who know all the nuances of how to properly build a 1911?
Or are they relying on unskilled or semi-skilled workers and are counting on ISO-9001 specs or whatever to make up the difference? If this is the case, it would explain a lot with 1911s from various premium builders that require break in periods.
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08-06-2016, 03:49 PM
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Geographic Advertising
Advertisers have the option of placing ads for magazine distribution right down to the zip code. I'm not saying that it happened in this instance but perhaps market research showed Kimber to have a weak customer base in your area so they pulled the ads---again, in your area.
I placed ads for a holster manufacturer I once worked for and ad space, especially in American Rifleman, can be frightfully expensive.
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08-10-2016, 04:16 AM
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I think they look good but I will not buy them . Had CDP few years ago the hammer would follow the slide down sent it back, had Cus tac 2 jammer ,friends Kimber broke hammer . I have 1st Warrior out and never had a problem with it but Iam afraid to buy any now .
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08-10-2016, 10:22 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 226
Likes: 27
Liked 140 Times in 68 Posts
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Kimber 45s
When I first read this thread a couple weeks back I was tempted to comment then but changed my mind as it is going to be a little negative but I decided I "do" have a few things to say about my Kimber experience. So here goes: I remember reading one of the earliest if not the earliest gun mag articles which I believe was in Shooting Times and I believe the article was by Metcalf in which he stated this was the most accurate standard production 1911 he had ever encountered. He also happened to mention something to the effect that it was shooting high or low(don`t remember which) but a "quick call to Kimber" and they would replace the front sight to achieve poa/poi. So based on this glowing recommendation I happened to purchase one of the first Kimber Customs. Well,mine was similar in a way to the test gun as it was shooting low by 6-8 inches at 25 yards...so I called Kimber service to inquire about a new front sight and this was the first they had heard of the supposed different front sights. I wound up filing the sight down myself to raise point of aim. Secondly,this pistol couldn`t have been akin to the most accurate standard production 1911 as it had a hard time feeding even hardball. Down the road that pistol went.
Some time later I acquired a NIB Kimber Heritage Edition. This pistol was after Kimber had switched to Series II but held to the original Series 70 model.It was named Heritage Edition as Kimber donated $200 for each of these(1100 units?) to the Heritage Foundation. It had 30 line checkering,ambi safety,beautiful grips. Shot and functioned great. Decided I wanted night sights and sent it back to Kimber for them and also had the slide KimPro`ed and an Ed Brown grip safety installed. To the person who earlier mentioned his dislike of KimPro I agree wholeheartedly. It didn`t look good from the get go and while it hasn`t flaked off it seems to wear off faster than the regular finish. An overall good shooting, never fail pistol...I`ll come back to this one later.
Somewhere in the in-between years of the above pistols I purchased a Kimber Compact(steel) that happened to have an external extractor. It did everything you would want a pistol to do. I liked it quite a bit and had night sights installed and sent it to Gemini Custom for 25 line checkering.I had earlier had an Ed Brown grip safety installed by Kimber. Shot and functioned perfectly except...it developed a bad habit with age of ejecting spent brass in my forehead. It didn`t do this in the beginning,it actually would pile up brass in the 2:00-3:00 o`clock area. But,with a little use and age it it started the forehead/eyes thing(thank goodness I always wear shooting glasses). I read on the web somewhere that Kimber essentially had a campaign on the external extractor and would replace with a conventional slide but it turned into a complete new gun as they would only do the work to return the frame to original(no Ed Brown). They made it as I had it with checkering and the night sights but no Ed Brown and if I recall I paid $275= new pistol. It runs and shoots great and the only thing I have done over the years is put a Wilson flat wire recoil spring system in as conventional springs are recommended to be replaced every 7-800 rounds.
Now,back to the Heritage Edition. I have been shooting striker fired pistols quite a bit over the last 10-15 years and probably have developed a little bit of trigger staging for follow up shots. I typically carry a M&P Compact or a Shield and whenever I go shooting I always shoot at least one or both of these pistols. Earlier this year I happened to bring along the Kimber as I had not shot it in quite a while. I had basically what you would call a 'double', a second shot that went off in the recoil arc. SCARY! So I made it a point to bring only it and the Kimber compact next time out and concentrate on trigger control. Well,it happened again. Had some part become so glazed/worn over or was it me ? I contacted Kimber, told them my "problem" and sent it in. They receive my pistol and if a `smith ever looked at it I could not tell you as they immediately went into sales pitch replacing it with a new Series II pistol (Series 80) at no cost. I asked them to look into it and they refused and I said send it back! They did and sent a service memo stating "do not load or use"and telling me I am responsible for all future use. They are definitely getting off the bus as far as liability goes. This is on a pistol that they birthed and sold and did all work on up to the point where they refused to look at it. Upon receiving it back I bent the trigger spring and created more tension and have had no problems since. Probably should have done that in the beginning and saved freight and insurance.
So to recap my Kimber experience I have owned 4 Kimbers. Still have 2 and consider them excellent pistols. The original Classic not so good. The first Compact was no doubt for them a trial to be better and probably cheaper in manufacturing that didn`t work out. I`m satisfied with the trade made from the service department for the 2nd Compact. Indeed I`m pleased with the service department until the last time when it appears a lawyer now manages it. The most notable statements from the reps for the Compact replacement and the Heritage non service is that the frame had been altered via the Ed Brown replacement parts...grip safetys which their service department did. It appears they want to disavow their previous work and possibly their initial first series 70 pistols. I wonder if Mr. Brown knows the disdain that his parts are held in by Kimber ? As for my Heritage, I consider it a wonderful pistol even with a slightly heavier trigger. But I`m done with Kimber. John
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