I need a .22 auto for my son &I I. I'm trying to get him to the range more and he's expressed an interest in steel shooting.

We looked at the Victory and Buckmark and he preferred the latter ( I liked the Victory.)

But I'm also looking at the Ruger .22/45 lite (blue anodized).

We'll probably mount a red dot sight before long and the Ruger looks ready to go, although the Browning looks like mounting a rail would be hard.

Is the Ruger worth the extra money? Also is there any reason to get a threaded barrel other than to mount a suppressor?

Which has the best trigger?

The Ruger trigger isn't the best,but there are plenty of parts to improve it.Have him try the Mark and the 22/45 to see which feels better in his hand.No experience with the other two.

I have a Buckmark and love it. Scope mounts can be found on eBay for $30 or so and mount easily.

Happy shooting!

Buckmark rail replaces the standard top piece. Two screws, it's easy to do. There are both factory and aftermaket rails.

Browning - Base, Buckmark One Pc, Matte - 12328 - Big Country Sporting Goods

As far as Buckmark versus Victory versus Ruger it's really whatever feels best to you. You really can't go wrong with any of them.

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Straight shootin'
SWCA#2439

Will your son be cleaning the pistol after a range session? If so, he will appreciate the ease of disassembly and cleaning of a Ruger Mark IV.

Sorry I meant to say "would NOT" be hard to mount a rail on the BuckMark.

I have different brands. I like the older High Standards. If I had only one it would probably be a Ruger. They will feed any target or long rifle. My oldest 22 Ruger was made in 1956 before the Mark 1 and still shoots like new.

Ruger 22/45 Mark IV. It's their latest model and extremely easy to maintain.

Both the new Mark IV and the S&W Victory are great pistols. Easy to clean. Ruger is a bit more $. Problem is that 22LR is still in short supply. What there is is about .10 / round. Used to be able to get the 525 packs for 14$ or so at wally world. Havent seen 22LR at WM in a very long time.

I'm a huge fan of the Buckmark. I've got two of them.
As for optics, check Browniing's web site. They offer several models with both sights and a rail from the factory.
There's really no need for a threaded barrel unless you plan to mount a suppressor. However, if current proposed suppressor legislation does managed to get passed, they will be pretty cheap and easy to get. No harm in being prepared.

.22 is very available and there are deals if you shop around.

Federal AutoMatch 22 LR 40 Grain Lead Round Nose

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Straight shootin'
SWCA#2439

Not taking away from other pistols but:

- My browning buckmark contour has chewed through any ammo I have put through it and without a hiccup.

- I bought a tactical solutions barrel (threaded), Trail-Lite 5.5" Buckmark Barrel, Threaded End, Green

- some hogue grips...Browning Buckmark G10 - G-Mascus Green | Hogue Inc.

- I would go with threaded barrel, never know...

I wish I had looked at the Ruger MK IV more closely. My new Victory is a disaster.

Keep us posted on your search.

Dadgum, I've been looking at the Buckmarks, there's a zillion versions.

I too prefer the old High Standards.

I've not held or fired the Victory, but never would I pay more for a Ruger than a buckmark. What you can do with a Ruger is replace all the parts easily as there are a ton of third party made upgrades--and then wonder why you put $700 into a pistol that resembles a ruger. Out of the box, the buckmark is a superior firearm, mostly due to the superior trigger. I've heard the Victory trigger is similar.

A Ruger 22/45 was my first handgun and I almost gave up the sport immediately. Eventually, I sold the Ruger and replaced it with a used S&W m41.

Since then I've bought:
Browning Buckmark
Browning Medalist
CZ Kadet
High Standard Victory & Supermatic
Sig/Hammerli (sp?) Trailside (I really regret selling that one)
Pardini SP olympic pistol
Beretta m71
Walther P22
a slew of revolvers in 22 (I prefer revolvers currently)

My advice is to get a buckmark. YMMV as there are a LOT of ruger fanboys who will tell you different.

As a RSO I see them all. Personally I shoot Ruger MKIII with Volquartsen innards. The new Ruger MKIV is a single button takedown and a Volquartsen trigger kit makes it a truly wonderful shooter. If you are alt all handy, the MKIIIs are selling at great prices but they still need a Volquartsen trigger kit. Take down is a bit more complicated but after you have done it a few times it can be done is seconds.
My observations on the 22/45 lite tell me it is not nearly as easy to shoot accurately as the steel versions. I have seen good solid shooters decline using the lite version. Something about steel forces one to hold steady.

my 2¢

I don't have a Ruger .22 at present, but if I were looking for another .22 semiauto, absolutely no question it would be a Ruger, probably a standard 22/45.

As background, I have a DEEP loyalty and affinity to Browning....as a brand. When my dad and I would go to gun shows many years ago I loved and marveled at Browning O/U shotguns, their engraving and the gold trigger. I just loved them. I have an old BT-99 12 ga and Hi Power pistol and whoever gets them will have to pry them from my cold dead fingers.

That being said, I have a Buckmark and I really dislike it. I cannot find ammo that works well consistently. (Except CCI mini-mags - and I think it's unreasonable to have to have that be the only ammo a gun can take.) I also frequently get what I presume is an incompletely burned ember that lands on my hand when I'm shooting it. This happens with probably 5-10% of the shots.

As if this wasn't enough, it is not easy to break down.

I'm seriously considering selling it and getting a Mark IV. Although this string and me typing this response is making me thinking maybe I should have someone look at it to see if something can be adjusted to make it perform better.

OR

I really wish that the Colt Woodsman was still made. If Colt is so interested in resurrecting their old Colt designs, the Woodsman would be a good place to start. There never was a better .22 pistol.

I'm partial to Rugers. This one is my favorite.

The only 22 handgun that I have owned for near 15 years is the S&W Model 22S. It has never had a problem with cycling, firing or keeping clean.

Really? Can you explain how?

I bought the Ruger 22/45 when they came out, put an Aimpoint on it right away. It's still a tackdriver and has put more than a few pounds of lead out over the years. That Ruger got me wanting something a little better. Hammerili Trailside answered that for me. The Hammerili has also served me well. There are many fine old .22 autos that are the best to teach the new shooter with and keep skills up with with the seasoned.

old 1911 fan

We all come to solving problems with our specific prejudices and knowledge. I'm no different. I became a pistolsmith specializing in customizing Colt M 1911s at the heights of IPSC and IDPA. I have owned and shot extensively Buckmarks, all versions of Ruger Mks in 22 LR, High Standard Supermatics and even Colt Match Target Woodsman. When I obtained my first Ciener conversion unit for the Colt M 1911 and its clones, I thought I had gone to shooter's heaven. Now, I could have a lower that had "my" trigger job, the ergonomics of the M 1911 and a superbly accurate and reliable upper that shot 22 LR. I wound up with three of them and they all have been accurate and reliable. The only 22 LR semiauto handgun currently manufactured IMHO that comes close to my Colt M 1911s with the Ciener conversion is the S&W Victory heavy barrel. I think S&W has hit a home run with the Victory and with a few bugs ironed out will go on to be a top flight competitor to all other 22 LRs. I wish some manufacturer had made a 22 LR conversion for the S&W 3913s and its close relatives.

I like multiple problems being solved by one solution. The Colt M 1911 or a clone with a conversion unit can be used to easily solve problems developed or never mastered by the shooter that is using that platform for self defense. I would never look down on the self defense shooter trying to perfect shooting technique by using a Victory, a Buckmark or a Ruger on the range, but I think the optimum solution is the use of a conversion unit on top of the very self defense handgun the shooter has elected to run with. ..............

Don't know how old your son is, your budget, or where you see this going down the road...just plinking? A higher caliber? or .22 competition? Some things to consider:

At an entry price the Buckmark, Victory and Ruger are the right three .22 pistols to look at. They all get high marks so, at the end of the day I'd go with what feels best in his hand. The Victory is new and I have no experience there. As for the other two, I preferred the Buckmark to the Ruger and bought a Camper model. It just felt right and pointed more naturally. I also preferred the trigger. But everyone is different. When I pick up a new gun I shut my eyes and pick it up and see how it feels and points.. your body will tell you when it's right.

If your son is young, the Buckmark has another advantage in that it is much easier to clean.. in fact Browning no longer provides field stripping instructions.. just swab out the barrel and you're done.

Yes, there is a much bigger aftermarket for the Ruger, and the Victory was made with customization in mind, but to my thinking I'm not sure that's an important feature. Here's why: All three will be very accurate firearms out of the box..certainly for training and plinking. If eventually he wants to step up a notch in .22 performance (e.g. for benchrest) investing in a competition grade firearm is where you'll wind up so that's where you should put your money. Almost to prove my point I just read a review of the Victory where the author tested the stock 5.5 in barrel against a custom 6" Volquartsen. To my reading of the data, the standard barrel did better. This shouldn't really be a surprise as S&W also makes the Model 41 (which I also own and recommend if budget and weight aren't issues).

I really like my Buckmark Camper. It's incredibly accurate, well made & reasonably priced. I rarely get any mis-fires or FTF, even with the inexpensive bulk ammo.

Another vote for any of the Ruger Mark series, a great first handgun, thought I think I would make sure he can do well with open sights before adding and of the red dots/scopes etc. getting the basics down now will serve him well for the rest of his life.

This is a common question here. Based on my ownership of a couple of buckmarks and "a few more" Ruger MK II/III/IV pistol's. I'd give the Ruger's the clear edge. They are pretty much the standard in many types of rimfire competitions. ( In the sub-$700 catagory anyway.) They also have the best aftermarket support if you want to tweek them in any way. A search here or on the big rimfire internet forum will support this position.
Assuming you decide on a Ruger, there are multiple decisions to be made.
Go with the MK4 flavors if you feel the need for simplified takedown. ( The MK II/III's aren't hard to tear-down but they do take an understanding of the guns internals. In truth, they can run thousands of round between cleanings anyway.) Lots of great deals on new and used MK II/III's since the MK IV's hit the streets these last few months. The K IV's also add improved controls IMHO.
As for the lite version, they dominate is Steel Challenge but I am not a fan. Barrels are shorter which produces a significantly louder gun with a little more muzzle flip. It also has less sight radius. Consensus in the rim-fire world seems to be that they give up some accuracy too. My Lite version is my least favorite Ruger MK series (although still a nice little plinker)
IMHO a 5.5 " target version (in standard or 22/45 frame) would be the best and most versatile choice. The MK IV, would also

p.s Worth noting is that the new blued Ruger MK IV target model uses a machined aluminum frame which puts it at only 1 oz heavier than the polymer framed 22/45 MK III's. The stainless target model is a full 5 oz heavier.

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Dave

Not a lot of experience here with different brands. I only have two 22 LR pistols, both old High Standard Victors. I have shot some steel matches and love the experience, so I think you and your son will enjoy the challenge on nice spring days at the range. I have shot friends Ruger 22/45 lite with a red dot and it shoot very good, easy for me to handle and put on target and was impressed with accuracy and handling.

Go with what feels good in your hands and you can teach the son to shoot it also. No one mentioned threads. I would overwhelming suggest purchasing a gun with threads. We play a lot at the local range, pinking steel targets with suppressors. About as much fun as one can can have with a firearm. No hearing protectors required and everyone knows if you hit the target. It is possible they will be removed from the current restrictions on purchase in year or so, which means you may be able to just purchase one for a few hundred bucks.

Shooting steel - last month we added gongs at the 50 yard set up. we have a 12, 8. 6 and 4 inch gong hanging in a line. Game is to offhand ring steel until you miss. 4 inches with a red dot at 50 yards is tough offhanded. Great game and we were all doing a great job with my friends 22/45 lite a few weeks ago on the gongs. Good luck, I see a suppressor in your future. Do not try one at the range, it is addicting when shooting steel.

I've had a S&W model 41 for 20 years, but they are far too expensive for a "starter" .22. I'd go with the Ruger MKIV for quality, and ease of taking apart. The trigger action is not ideal, but not a deal breaker IMO.

Ruger SR22 is a nice, reasonably priced .22lr pistol. It is not a high end "target" pistol but a fun plinker and very accurate out to 15 yards. DA/SA with a safety-de-cocker combination. Comes with two size grips (easily changed) and magazines with changeable floor plate if more length is needed.

It is not ammo sensitive. Easy to field strip and clean. If I was buying a young person their first 22lr pistol for learning to shoot it would be the SR22.

Really like mine and never ad an issue with it.

Don't overlook older guns, the High Standards graced many years the shooting line at Camp Perry shooting for the National Championship. One of the reasons the new S&W Victory is so good is it looked at all the reasons the HS was so popular for so many years and incorporated those features in the gun.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

I've sold all of my .22 Rugers, and now prefer the Victory.

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- Post No Bills -

The Victory for me. Goes nice with a red dot as well.

upload pictures free

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Mike
S&WCA #3065

I have a stainless Ruger Mark II target with the Volquartsen innards and it's an awesome shooter. I also have a S&W M&P 22 and it is a solid shooter and has never failed to fire. Of the two the Ruger is my favorite but people I let shoot the S&W also really like it.
Ruger mark II

S&W M&P 22

OMG - That is GORGEOUS! I think you just defined the bar for what I should go look for.

Nice piece!

OR

Hey Rick, thanks for reminding me about the 22S. I've become so enamored with suppressed shooting the last few years I forget about other great rimfires I've got.

My 22S shoots exceptionally well for a budget target gun. I guess I've had this for close to 20 years. The Tasco was made in Taiwan at the time. I've got a couple others made in Japan.

Since the Ruger Mark IV has come out there are a lot of Mark II and IIIs on the used market at a very good price. I'd go for one of them. I love my Mark III. It's trigger was very good stock. Mark II is nice too.

I have the Mark IV and it's a joy to take apart to clean but the trigger needs attention. A Volquartsen trigger kit will set you back another $100. You may not need it but for my Steel Challenge shooting I wanted the VQ trigger.

I also like being able to add a silencer or a compensator to the Mark IV.

Attached Images

22 45 Stoner grips.jpg (88.1 KB, 15 views)

Although I am a big Ruger MK fan with several in my collection, I think the OP would be best served with a S&W Victory.

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- Change it back -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Autonomous
I wish I had looked at the Ruger MK IV more closely. My new Victory is a disaster.

Keep us posted on your search.

Thread here.

jtcarm, any progress in your search?
Inquiring minds want to know.

Yes, what have you decided?

I have owned the a Ruger MK I, II and a 22/45, Colt Woodsman Standard version, & Match Target, S&W 41, High Standard Victory, Sharpshooter,& Olympic, Walther GSP & OSP, Browning Medalist and several others that I can't remember their designations. I do shoot the Steel Challenge and I do it with the Buckmark. Just my $.02............

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

Hi forum;

Only saw one mention above (Dwalt) but not knowing your personal situation as to heirloom value, son's basic training level, future desires, etc. I have found that my families first trainer and still today the most enjoyable .22 semi out there is the pictured Colt Woodsman.

Probably pricey these days, but value wise they don't lose and what a joy to learn, train, plink, paper punch, whatever floats your boat. Next favorite .22 plinker, trainer, male/female alike? My Smith Model 34-1....also a treat to hold and shoot.

Attached Images

	Woodsman 1.jpg (45.1 KB, 14 views)
	Woodsman 6.jpg (69.2 KB, 12 views)

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Charlie B
SWCA#3083, SWHF#570

I recommend the Ruger.Great prices,plenty aftermarket parts.
A blast to shoot. I have owned 3-4 over the years.

22 league I shoot in has some of everything.
One of the top shooters uses a S&W 22A(!).
Other top competitors use S&W 41s, a lot of Buckmarks and a few High Standards.
There are also a number of Rugers, various marks. Interesting that many of these are full of aftermarket parts.
Only consistent winners are the 41, High Standard and Buckmarks.

Take all that for what you will.

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-jwk-
US Army '72-'95

Many thousands of rounds of fun through my Ruger MKIII. So, obviously, my recommendation

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John

.22LR is actually available at .05 to .07c per round...check slickguns for daily prices. I'd recommend the Ruger SR22, as have others in the thread. Accurate to 15 yards, easy to strip, etc. The Ruger 22/45 is a GREAT shooter as well, but can be difficult to disassemble/assemble for cleaning purposes.