I have a chance to pick up a stainless 7" Essex 1911 in .45 from the estate of an old family friend. The gun looks to be in about 90% condition from the pics that I saw but the pics weren't very good. I know the Essex gun parts were kind of hit and miss on the quality but that's about all I know about them. This one is supposed to have "safety issues". I'm going to be able to get this gun for around a c-note and at that price I couldn't say no.

I guess my first question is what in the world was a 7" 1911 used for? Target, pins or what?

Any opinions on Essex quality? Is this thing even worth a hundred or am I burning a Benjamin for nothing?

__________________
"I gots to know"

The frames of military pistols were often enough destroyed and the left over parts, including frames were assembled on Essex frames. Value depends a lot on the frame and how well the work; the fitting was executed. Even the parts are worth more than $100 and I used to have the typical "Messex", a Remington Rand on an Essex frame that shot as a service 1911 is supposed to.

Don't overthink it. You got a deal for $100.00.

__________________
Ad Astra Per Aspera

I have an Essex frame with mostly Colt parts. The end result is a totally serviceable and reliable pistol!
Jim

Good deal buy it.

OP, I think that is an absolute fantastc deal.

I would buy every complete 1911 style pistol I found for $100, regardless of slide/barrel length, frame size or manufacturer.

I've never seen Essex slides but the few pistols that I have seen built using Esssx frames have been serviceable at the very least.

Is there a source for good used 1911 frames? Been looking, and not having much luck. Want a .45 for building a Ciener conversion .22. Do not want to break the bank. Conversion, was as new w/2 magazines for $100. (stainless) Bob

Thanks for all of the replies.

I'm going to go Friday and pick this thing up. I remember seeing pics of long barrel 1911s in G&A back in the eighties but never had the desire to own one but I guess I'll have one now. There is a lot of reloading supplies including three presses for sale in this estate as well so I may come home loaded down, so to speak.
When I get the gun home I'll post a few pics of the details.

__________________
"I gots to know"

For about $300 you should be able to put a 5 inch unit on it. Essex made good frames. I have a few with Colt slides.

Essex was an earlier manufacturer of aftermarket .45 frames for DIY gun builders. Other than seeing quite a few of them, I don't know much else. I think Essex was located somewhere in Vermont. At one time, you could buy about everything else needed to make your own GM for maybe $50. The long slide is a little unusual. I have seen competitive bullseye shooters use long-frame GMs, and there was a custom gunsmith in Louisiana, Jim Clark, who had a specialty trade in making up long slides from two short ones for competitive shooters. Regardless your money will be well spent.

The more I think about this gun the more I want it, and not just because it's cheap either.
The guy that owned it was a close neighbor for many years. By trade he was a master machinist and tool maker. For the last 40 years of his life he made his living in his own shop on the back of his property. I know very little about machine shops but there were two Bridgeport mills in there along with lathes and other equipment. At one time I heard a rumor that he made some kind full auto machine pistol from more or less scratch, fired it a few times and then cut it up. The old guy did it just to see if it would work. I never saw the gun but an old buddy did.

__________________
"I gots to know"

Essex steel is good quality, but machining can be hit or miss. Ten years or more ago, I bought an Essex frame to permanently mount my Ciener .22 unit on. Every single part had to be carefully hand fitted. All the way down to the main spring housing. It was a real PITA.
However, the gun turned out just fine, shoots great and I still have it.

I also have a gun a lot like your's. It came from an estate and the owner built himself a 6" .45 Longslide on an Essex frame. Unfortunately, he botched the job. The gun was both inaccurate and unreliable. I got it cheap, but spent about two years tweaking on it here and there before I got it working properly. But again, once I got it straightened out, its a fine gun and I still have it.

The quality of your gun will just depend on who built it and how much care they took in doing so. But hey, for $100 you can afford to tinker on it and learn. Think of it as an educational opportunity.

The " 7 inch " description alone makes it almost worth a "Benjamin".

__________________
wanna do right-- not right now

I doubt the "safety issues" are related to the Essex frame. As stated in other posts in this thread Essex was a supplier of 1911 frames for the DIY gang long before building 1911's reached the level you see today. For $100 you can't go wrong, you may just want to disassemble and start from the ground up, you find the "issue" and fix it easily enough.

Pictures?

At one time SARCO sold RIA frames, not sure if they still do. But in the long run just buying a new RIA. I can't remember the name, but there was a manufacturer that made a 22lr 1911 for about 300 bucks.

Sarco, Inc. - Search Inexpensive frames from SARCO.

Gallery of Guns has complete 1911 22 lr for probably less than the cost of building one. Firearms accessory optics magazines search find buy at galleryofguns.com davidson's Firearms Wholesaler – Firearms Distributor – Gun Wholesaler – Gun Distributor guaranted lifetime replacment warranty

Iver-Johnson offers complete 1911 frames from around $325.00 and up.

Caspian Inc also sells new 1911 frames.

You don't mention what brand slide or barrel the thing has. But a 7-inch barrel? And an Essex frame? And unknown "safety issues"? And a hundred bucks?

I wouldn't touch it.

I think just a 7" .45 barrel would be worth much more than $100, let alone the rest of the parts.

Go for it!

My first true 1911 style .45 was an Essex frame, topped by a Remington-Rand slide. I added a Bomar rear sight. I was very accurate.

BTW, my first .45 auto was a Star. It shot fine too, but a buddy of mine wanted me to have a true 1911 style auto and found the Essex framed .45 at the Birmingham AL Gun Collector's show.

__________________
John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

In the early 80's I built around 40 1911's from GI parts on Federal Ordnance frames and sold them for $130. These aluminum frames lasted 800-1000 rounds. My personal 45 was then put on a $99 Essex frame in about 1986 and I still carry it in the woods and prefer it to the 2 like new Colts I own.

The "safety issue" Most common on parts guns is an issue with the sear/disconnect interface. The easiest fix it to buy those 2 parts from Colt or Wilson and drop them in. (you can get these parts from Brownelle's or Midway.) You might want to get a new Wilson 4 fingered flat main-spring at the same time, these do wonders for the trigger pull and grip safety being a little "off". It shouldn't take you more than an hour to detail strip and reassemble with the new parts and completely clean it at the same time (the second time you do it will take 10-15 minutes). These parts a machined to very tight specs, where old GI parts were looser and then worn! Just about every book on gunsmithing has instructions on 1911 detailed disassembly plus for free on the WWW.

Ivan

Ok, here this thing is. No name on slide or barrel with the frame marked Essex. Slide, barrel and frame appear to be stainless, the rest look to be GI parts and plated with nickle I think. It was well worth a hundred just for the cool factor but to be a shooter it's going to take some work.

Attached Images

	45-2.jpg (124.0 KB, 125 views)
	45-1.jpg (124.4 KB, 113 views)
	45-4.jpg (125.0 KB, 109 views)

__________________
"I gots to know"

I would've dropped $200 without batting an eye, just for the parts. That's going to be a unique project, and I imagine a real head-turner when you take it out.


There are 80% aluminum frames out there, available in GM size. I always thought they would be perfect for a .22 kit.

__________________
TEAM DNF

I like it! Ya done good there Bubba!

I took the time yesterday to tear the gun down and address the safety issue thing. Some of the good (or bad depending on your point of view on AMT) news is the slide looks to be one from an AMT Hardballer that has had the lettering polished off. Slide, barrel and bushing seem to fit together well but the recoil spring feels weak to me. The slide fits the frame pretty well but may be a little on the tight side. The main thing wrong with the thumb safety was the fact that the spring loaded safety plunger was seized in the housing. Some heat applied to the housing with a soldering iron and I was able to push out the plunger. Grip safety engagement is a little iffy so I'm going to do as Ivan says and replace the sear disconnector and main spring and see what it feels like then. It will feed and eject all of the rounds using 230 grn ball dummies I made up at 1.250". So far so good. I may go and put a few rounds through it tomorrow just to see if it will run.

__________________
"I gots to know"

With all that slide weight it probably doesn't have much slide velocity, so a light spring may be normal.

__________________
Release the Kraken

You may very well be right about that. Not being a 1911 guy I just have to feel my way along with this thing. I'm going to start out with some mild 230 grn target loads and go from there. Wolff has recoil springs for the longslide guns but it's trial and error as to which one you need, as it is with any custom deal.

__________________
"I gots to know"

I remember the AMT Longslide Hardballers. People seemed to love or hate them, not much in between! For an AMT, I thought they shot better than the 5", but some people expected them to shoot like a Brown overhauled Gold Cup! Then there is the problem of the marksman! There are very few people that will actually shoot better with a top end gun (probably the top 10%, maybe only the top 5%, and I'm not one of them!)

AMT made early stainless steel guns at reasonable prices. The AMT Back-up and the Hardballer and Longslide were their successes, there were some failures too! (I'm thinking of their pocket sized 45ACP.) As the company went downhill so did their basic quality.

When I was building 1911's I used surplus parts, cheap frames and the cheapest slide I could get; sometimes a take-off, but mostly de-milled ends rewelded together (usually pretty straight?). This guy also had rewelded 7" slides for about $10 more. I might have built a Longslide but the barrels & return springs were way to pricy for my market! So I have no experience to share about how to make them run! But I know the return spring and the hammer spring need to be matched to each other's tension (there is a +/- of about 15% on the hammer spring) like any other 1911 design. Wolff springs should be able to set you right up! The guns were "Hardballers", so the idea is full power loads or even +P loads. Setting one up for "Mouse Fart" target loads, would be counter productive!

The Photo shows the Mainspring housing and the magazine both have lanyard loops. That is probably a refinished GI MSH. The magazine could be pretty interesting. If you experience feeding issues, start with a Wilson mag (around $30) that seems to solve the most problems. (When I set my sons up with 1911's, they each got 3 GI mags for shooting with, and 1 Wilson for trouble shooting.-there's a hint there!)

You said you're not a 1911 guy, well you picked a fun way to become one! Welcome to the club!

Ivan

Yep I figure that the mainspring housing is GI refinished in nickle as are the rest of the small parts. Take a look at the hammer, it's looks like an early 1911 hammer to me and for all I know that old mag was in a gun that took a shot at the Kaiser! I'm not a 1911 guy but I've had a few, this is just the first one I've ever had to work on.

__________________
"I gots to know"

What magazine did you score with that one? Did you stumble into an original with the lanyard loop? or is it a later reproduction? That alone could more than justify the cost....

I believe that the mag in an original but how do you tell?


I took the gun out today and it did better than I thought it would. Had some FTFs with standard velocity 230 gn lead loads but when I stepped up to some near +P 230 ball it ran fine. This is the first one of these longslides I've ever fired and I'm impressed with how easy it shoots. When it gets all sorted out it's going to be a real nice piece I think.
I still have some work to do to get the trigger like I want it. Right now its way to light for my liking and I like things on the safe side. After replacing the hammer and sear I'll see what it feels like then.

__________________
"I gots to know"

Very early magazines are blued, the feed lips were hardened with cyanide, and have an lack of finish at the top for a little over an inch. Often referred to as two tone mags! The lanyard loop mags, in two tone are rare! rare! rare! They are thought by some to have been issued to air crews for vary early aerial gun battles. I have seen WWII loop mags (dark phosphate single color finish) still issued to Ohio Guard units just before Desert Storm with a 10" lanyard from the mag to the MSH and a lanyard from the MSH to the man. The ammo pouch mags had no loop!

Ivan

All of my parts came in and I had a chance to sit down and work with the old gun a little. Put in a new Wilson sear, disconnector and mag with a new C&S trigger too. The sear took a little stone work to clear the safety but other than that everything worked OK.
The gun has a nice clean break on the trigger at I would guess around 6 pounds and no hammer drop now when the slide is released.
Took it out to the range and it seemed to like a load of 5.5 Unique under a 230 LRN or Berry's plated the best.

I still have a long way to go with this cannon but things are looking up.

__________________
"I gots to know"