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  #51  
Old 10-03-2017, 07:16 PM
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Will someone who has one please do a video of actually shooting it out of a car window?

Let us know how that works out for your face and ears!
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  #52  
Old 10-03-2017, 08:25 PM
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I'm considering one. LGS has them for $364.00. My buddy bought the Remington version. In addition to holding 1 less round my buddies Rem. isn't drilled and tapped which I believe the Mossberg is. I don't know how big a concern that is since its a close quarters weapon. Still it may be handy to mount a laser or light. My reason for considering is I had to clear my house one time at about 2 AM with an 870 field gun, and can see where the Shockwave would be a handy gadget to have just in case. Luckily I didn't need the shotgun, but I think the intimidation factor of a 12 ga. would be beneficial. But then what do I know, I also own a Judge.
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  #53  
Old 10-03-2017, 08:42 PM
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Ya know, the last election cycle I tried to pull off the perfect "bank shot" with AR 15's. For this lifetime, I'm done. Won't be part of a circular firing squad, no matter how righteous the target. Joe
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  #54  
Old 10-03-2017, 10:23 PM
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Possible FED future ban or not,
Mossberg will likely be sued after the first
person blows off a hand and it will be discontinued.
That firearm is an accident waiting to happen.
Just my 2cents.

Last edited by Xfuzz; 10-10-2017 at 11:01 AM.
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  #55  
Old 10-03-2017, 11:14 PM
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The only unique use I could see for one was to carry loaded in a GHB. However, here in CO, you are issued a concealed HANDGUN permit, so my interest in the Shockwave faded.
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  #56  
Old 10-04-2017, 05:43 AM
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Some of y'all are a bit off the mark about the legalities. The Shockwave can't be put on a list, or added to the NFA, or declared to be an SBS. The NFA, and the ATF in general, has a set of definitions for this and that and that's why the Maxim 50 is okay because it's not defined as a firearm. The Shockwave does not meet the definition of an SBS. (State laws are another matter.)

In order for the Shockwave to be declared illegal, congress would have to pass a law specifically banning it, and/or pass other laws changing the language of the NFA. I'm guessing if there is a push to do such things, it won't concern extreme short range pump action shot-throwers.


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Originally Posted by HeavyDuty Ken View Post
This is a twofer - it attracts people that hate the Shockwave and people that hate speculation. A perfect thread...
I lol'd.
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Old 10-04-2017, 06:23 AM
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I might be interested in this as a truck gun, but the state law says handguns are permissible in a vehicle but uncased rifles/shotguns are not. The Shockwave is technically neither but the dealer says he gets them shipped as long guns.
My birthday is coming up. I could splurge on one, it's cheap entertainment with game loads.
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  #58  
Old 10-04-2017, 07:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessie View Post
IF I ever bought one,it would be ONE to throw under the seat of my vehicle.
I wouldn't like to shoot it, but would like to have it handy.
Shoot one, Jessie. I bet you will like it. A 44 magnum recoils harder than a Shockwave loaded with OO buck.

Last edited by Shark Bait; 10-04-2017 at 08:02 PM.
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Old 10-04-2017, 08:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xfuzz View Post
Possible FED future ban or not,
Mossberg will likely be sued after the first
person blows of a hand and it will be discontinued.
That firearm is an accident waiting to happen.
Just my 2cents.
The only way that can happen is if the shooter willfully misuses the gun - thatís why there is a hand loop. Remington has more to worry about.
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  #60  
Old 10-04-2017, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by pharmer View Post
Ya know, the last election cycle I tried to pull off the perfect "bank shot" with AR 15's. For this lifetime, I'm done. Won't be part of a circular firing squad, no matter how righteous the target. Joe
I was sold on the Hillary walk over by the Media and started buying AR's before the reinstatement of the Clinton AWB.

Now I've got a few AR's with the value spiraling in the wrong direction. Win some and lose some.

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  #61  
Old 10-04-2017, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Kent View Post
ParadiseRoad and others have a valid point about the recoil of conventional pistol grip shotguns, they do seem to have enhanced recoil. I have used them since putting one of the Remington factory folding stock on one of my 870's many many years ago. I also have a pistol gripped Ithaca 20 Ga. model 37. Both of those have more perceived recoil than the shockwave Mossberg or the Remington. The shape of the "tear drop" grip does work..
That's also been my experience.

I tried a pistol grip on my Winchester Defender. It was significantly more punishing than the Shockwave with it's Raptor grip. The angle of the wrist combined with the forward hold as demonstrated in the Thunder Ranch video makes the Shockwave fast, accurate and surprisingly less fatiguing during practice than I thought it would be.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xfuzz View Post
Possible FED future ban or not,
Mossberg will likely be sued after the first
person blows of a hand and it will be discontinued.
That firearm is an accident waiting to happen.
Just my 2cents.
I think that's a valid safety concern. There have been a couple guys send their hand down range with the Kel-Tec KSG over the past few years. KSG is a bullpup design but for purposes of pump action and hand/muzzle position it's similar. Having a strap is one of the reasons I went with the Mossberg.

For decades people have been lamenting about how unsafe Glocks are. Plenty of people have shot themselves with Glocks, blaming it on the striker-fired design and no safety. They're still for sale.

Last edited by ChattanoogaPhil; 10-05-2017 at 01:19 AM.
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  #62  
Old 10-04-2017, 11:26 AM
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What is the intended purpose of this weapon and how is it superior in that role compared with more conventional options?
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  #63  
Old 10-04-2017, 01:08 PM
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Self defense.

I wanted an option in my truck in a addition to a handgun.
The size of the Shockwave makes it preferable to my Winchester Defender where compact size is a plus.

On a personal note, my minor neck ailment much prefers practice with the Shockwave compared to the neck-jarring of the Winchester on my shoulder. Hand, wrist, elbow and shoulder joints absorb recoil well and quite differently compared to the conventional stock. I didn't understand that until I began shooting the Shockwave. Best $300 I've spent on firearms in a while. Very pleased.

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  #64  
Old 10-04-2017, 01:39 PM
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I see car/truck gun frequently mentioned in threads about these types of guns, but in what type of defense scenario is it the best option or even a practical choice?

I think it would be extremely awkward and infeasible to use one from inside a vehicle even in scenarios where the the door is open. If having to quickly exit the vehicle, even if it's kept fairly accessible, it would still be relatively slow to bring into action compared to a handgun worn on the body. It would also be comparatively clumsy to maneuver around the vehicle as well as fire while on the move.

Some people keep AR's in their vehicle with the intent being to intervene in some type of active-shooter situation, but the shockwave is a short range weapon and wouldn't be a very effective option in such cases.

I'm just trying to figure out even a niche role where this gun makes sense to me.
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Old 10-04-2017, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shark Bait View Post
All these comments against the Shockwave sound a lot like comments we all get from anti-gun people. "What do you need one of those for? I don't need one, so neither do you."....
My response to the anti-gun people who ask me that question is, "I need only four things in life; food, clothing, shelter, and good health. I don't need a gun, but I want that gun." That usually stops them, but if they want to continue, I can start picking apart their "wants".
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Old 10-04-2017, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jag312 View Post
My response to the anti-gun people who ask me that question is, "I need only four things in life; food, clothing, shelter, and good health. I don't need a gun, but I want that gun." That usually stops them, but if they want to continue, I can start picking apart their "wants".
Actually I only need food plus good health. Got no problems going nekkid and shelter is just a bridge away.
As far as guns...yea, I want them!
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  #67  
Old 10-04-2017, 03:30 PM
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My Post No. 7 received the most "Likes," 21 so far.

So, there!
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Old 10-04-2017, 03:51 PM
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I think it is a toy, too. I have a standard Remington 870 with a pistol grip and I plan to give it to my brother as soon as he obtains the correct paperwork for his gun unfriendly jurisdiction. He needs something as small as possible to hide in his home and he wants it as cheap as possible. I warned him about recoil. He can't get a gun cheaper than me giving him one.

My point is, I simply think that to properly use a shotgun you need a stock. I have seen my share of sawed off shotguns, short barrels and cut stocks. I wouldn't think of firing one. If I need a small gun I can reach one of those other contraptions. I think they are called pistols or revolvers or handguns or something like that.

There are two exceptions I would consider making to that rule. One is the so-called "Mare's Leg" short rifle that is qualified as a pistol. The other is the new Pedersoli "Howdah" .45/,410, defined as a handgun because of its rifled barrels, so it is not a short barreled shotgun, and capable of firing .45 Colt cartridges or .410 shotgun shells. An old fashioned, newly resurrected, former hunting weapon from the days of the Raj and just really cool. Way more cool than the Shockwave.
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  #69  
Old 10-04-2017, 03:52 PM
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I just liked it now, so its official and now the OP liked it.


Speculation, the worst case is I make 50 dollars off of each one of the rems I bought due to the 50 rebate.........Buy low sell high.

I cant argue about some of the political and NFA rules regs and what congress MUST do etc. Fact is it has happened before and it has paid off well for me doing small things like that. 4K is a small amount to drop for a MINIMUM 50 dollar return on 300 investment. Supply and demand works wonders. If you can make money any easier and still have fun doing it, its a gold mine.

Usefulness!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You guys must be kidding me. Are we day dreaming about SHTF or mega intruders, zombies? This about pulling a trigger and it going boom. blowing stuff up, and having fun. Trying to put rationale on one guy owning several guns and he only has 2 trigger fingers Is like screaming in space.

LIGHTEN UP FRANCIS'S lets have fun. Its a seriously cool shotgun that makes a big loud sound and blows up milk jugs , car doors and whatever else you want to shoot at. Trying to make a discussion of the "actual" usefulness of any SINGLE weapon is ALWAYS subjective. YMMV.

its a fun gun for 3 bills. Just another one to add to the arsenal.






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My Post No. 7 received the most "Likes," 21 so far.

So, there!
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Old 10-04-2017, 03:54 PM
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As a further note, if the ATF decides that the Shockwave guns need tax stamps I will wager that they will not grandfather any of them and every single one will require a $200 tax stamp unless the ATF says they are "AOWs", in which case it is just extra paperwork and $5.00 tax stamp. Every owner of every single one of them will have to pay the tax or become a felon. There will be a grace period for it, presumably.
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Old 10-04-2017, 03:58 PM
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I cannot disagree with this sentiment:

Quote:
Usefulness!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You guys must be kidding me. Are we day dreaming about SHTF or mega intruders, zombies? This about pulling a trigger and it going boom. blowing stuff up, and having fun. Trying to put rationale on one guy owning several guns and he only has 2 trigger fingers Is like screaming in space.

LIGHTEN UP FRANCIS'S lets have fun. Its a seriously cool shotgun that makes a big loud sound and blows up milk jugs , car doors and whatever else you want to shoot at. Trying to make a discussion of the "actual" usefulness of any SINGLE weapon is ALWAYS subjective. YMMV.

its a fun gun for 3 bills. Just another one to add to the arsenal.

I said it was a toy. If you are going to use it as a toy to "blow stuff up" then it is exactly the right gun at the right time.
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Old 10-04-2017, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister X View Post
I see car/truck gun frequently mentioned in threads about these types of guns, but in what type of defense scenario is it the best option or even a practical choice?

I think it would be extremely awkward and infeasible to use one from inside a vehicle even in scenarios where the the door is open. If having to quickly exit the vehicle, even if it's kept fairly accessible, it would still be relatively slow to bring into action compared to a handgun worn on the body. It would also be comparatively clumsy to maneuver around the vehicle as well as fire while on the move.

Some people keep AR's in their vehicle with the intent being to intervene in some type of active-shooter situation, but the shockwave is a short range weapon and wouldn't be a very effective option in such cases.

I'm just trying to figure out even a niche role where this gun makes sense to me.
In general, not just for storage/use in a vehicle, but anywhere that is similarly cramped where the first choice would otherwise be a handgun.

My thought for the Shockwave environment was an RV or camper or a tent, where a carbine length weapon, like a full-stocked 18.5" barreled shotgun, would be difficult to maneuver. May also be a good choice for a small hunting cabin as well, where bringing your longarm to bear (To bear! Get it? I crack myself up.) would be difficult. An awful lot of people talk about carrying a .22 like an AR-7 type in a backpack, I'm thinking if you can carry that you can carry a Black Aces folder, which would be a hekuva lot faster to deploy. Now I gotta go and search to see if anybody's tried any longer range slug shooting from one of the Black Aces guns.

If I lived somewhere it was legal, I'd probably get a Shockwave until I had enough disposable income to get one of the Black Aces guns, then sell the Shockwave.

BTW nobody fires on the move off the range in the civilian world, and dang few in the military one. At least not if you want to avoid both getting shot and throwing wild shots around.
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Old 10-04-2017, 04:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codenamedave View Post
In general, not just for storage/use in a vehicle, but anywhere that is similarly cramped where the first choice would otherwise be a handgun.

BTW nobody fires on the move off the range in the civilian world, and dang few in the military one. At least not if you want to avoid both getting shot and throwing wild shots around.
Why would the shockwave be better than a handgun in those situations?

How does movement make it more likely you'll be shot? I've spent too many years hashing things out in Force-on-Force and analyzing civilian self-defense encounters to believe that some type of movement isn't beneficial in nearly every type of defense encounter(whether it's vs a gun, blade, club, fists). Shooting while in movement is incorporated in every trip to the range and I'm confidant in my skills in that area.

Last edited by Mister X; 10-04-2017 at 05:55 PM.
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Old 10-04-2017, 04:58 PM
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Shhhhhh...the current classification of the Shockwave is just fine.
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Old 10-04-2017, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Scotiapilot View Post
I have purchased as many as I can......I have a feeling they will be listed on the NFA soon.


Whats your opinion?
Foolish, but you asked.
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Old 10-04-2017, 06:12 PM
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Oh GAWD, I don't need images of Caje nekkid. He should just put his pants back on. Too much for my diseased mind.

And now we have gun people, presumably, making suggestions about the ATF classifying them. Just wait until some idiot makes a bump stock for them! (don't laugh, the old M12 would just keep firing if you held the trigger back and pumped the thing!) Just wait till the media hears about auto shotguns!

I've already bought all I can afford...One. And I broke my old rule about not buying off brand guns.

On the news as I was typing the above the gun expert/reporter was asking if we thought the government should ban devices to increase the trigger speed. Obviously the station was implying they should. I thought S&W did that back in 1940 with the Speed Hammer improvement. It upsets me that we've got really stupid reporters making suggestions about things they know nothing about. And from the past, I know she just idolized the Obamaination.
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Old 10-04-2017, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotiapilot View Post
I just liked it now, so its official and now the OP liked it.


Speculation, the worst case is I make 50 dollars off of each one of the rems I bought due to the 50 rebate.........Buy low sell high.

I cant argue about some of the political and NFA rules regs and what congress MUST do etc. Fact is it has happened before and it has paid off well for me doing small things like that. 4K is a small amount to drop for a MINIMUM 50 dollar return on 300 investment. Supply and demand works wonders. If you can make money any easier and still have fun doing it, its a gold mine.

Usefulness!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You guys must be kidding me. Are we day dreaming about SHTF or mega intruders, zombies? This about pulling a trigger and it going boom. blowing stuff up, and having fun. Trying to put rationale on one guy owning several guns and he only has 2 trigger fingers Is like screaming in space.

LIGHTEN UP FRANCIS'S lets have fun. Its a seriously cool shotgun that makes a big loud sound and blows up milk jugs , car doors and whatever else you want to shoot at. Trying to make a discussion of the "actual" usefulness of any SINGLE weapon is ALWAYS subjective. YMMV.

its a fun gun for 3 bills. Just another one to add to the arsenal.
Hahaha! You have completely won me over with this post. I think I'll get one too!
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Old 10-04-2017, 08:46 PM
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I always kind of chuckle when the usefulness question comes up with guns but doesn’t come up with the Camaro SS or Mustang GT cars. The speed limit is the same weather you’re in a Kia or a muscle car.

Some people want something. If it don’t hurt me, I say go for it. I’ll stick with my lever rifles and revolvers for my “fun” and defense. But if you want an AR or a shockwave, more power to you!
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Old 10-04-2017, 09:55 PM
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Getting added to the NFA means price on used ones will drop. Have you ever tried to sell a used suppressor?

If they ban them and grandfather in existing ones then the prices could go up.
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Old 10-05-2017, 04:44 PM
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Why would the shockwave be better than a handgun in those situations?

How does movement make it more likely you'll be shot? I've spent too many years hashing things out in Force-on-Force and analyzing civilian self-defense encounters to believe that some type of movement isn't beneficial in nearly every type of defense encounter(whether it's vs a gun, blade, club, fists). Shooting while in movement is incorporated in every trip to the range and I'm confidant in my skills in that area.
Perhaps there are a few more things you could maybe hash out.

Like the difference between being shot with a 12 ga load of buckshot or a 9mm from a handgun.

Like the different reactions you'll get from an average punk who sees: A. (What he thinks is) a sawed-off shotgun come up at him v. a pistol, or B. His cohort get shot by (what he thinks is) a sawed-off shotgun v. a pistol.

Like how you don't move unless you're going to better cover, or if you're part of a team doing the shoot scoot & shout routine to press an objective. If you never go anywhere without trained armed friends you can trust not to get too stupid under fire, then MAYBE such movement would be ok, although many including the authorities and pretty much every rational civilian firearms instructor would say otherwise. We're talking about defending against a criminal or a whack job on the American street, not closing with and contacting enemy combatants in some other country.

Like how if you do move to better cover, you haul a**, you don't "groucho" or whatever the current fad is so you can shoot accurately. If you can run flat out as fast as you can and still shoot accurately, by all means carry on.



But anyway, stocking up on Shockwaves may not bring riches, but at least, like most guns, they'll always be worth something, as opposed to buying stock in your neighbor's solar-powered snow-blower start up or sumtin.
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Old 10-05-2017, 07:38 PM
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Perhaps there are a few more things you could maybe hash out.

Like the difference between being shot with a 12 ga load of buckshot or a 9mm from a handgun.

Like the different reactions you'll get from an average punk who sees: A. (What he thinks is) a sawed-off shotgun come up at him v. a pistol, or B. His cohort get shot by (what he thinks is) a sawed-off shotgun v. a pistol.

Like how you don't move unless you're going to better cover, or if you're part of a team doing the shoot scoot & shout routine to press an objective. If you never go anywhere without trained armed friends you can trust not to get too stupid under fire, then MAYBE such movement would be ok, although many including the authorities and pretty much every rational civilian firearms instructor would say otherwise. We're talking about defending against a criminal or a whack job on the American street, not closing with and contacting enemy combatants in some other country.

Like how if you do move to better cover, you haul a**, you don't "groucho" or whatever the current fad is so you can shoot accurately. If you can run flat out as fast as you can and still shoot accurately, by all means carry on.
Obviously the greater power factor is the primary advantage of the shockwave over a handgun. No dispute there. However, that greater power is of no benefit if it can't be brought to bear or you lose control of the weapon.

In what type of scenario would you be using the shockwave for "defending against a criminal or a whack job on the American street"?

I have to expect any personal defense encounter I'm involved in away from my home will be reactive. Obviously the shockwave is not a practical concealed carry weapon so all those scenarios are excluded. That leaves defense scenarios in or around your vehicle. I don't think too many people would make the case that the shockwave would be more effective or practical than a handgun to use from inside the car so that's out as well and only leaves grabbing it and exiting the vehicle.

The handgun can be kept more readily accessible, is quicker to bring into action, offers better retention and can be operated effectively while in movement. The degree of movement necessary varies and I never referenced any particular type, but movement is nonetheless often a key component is such instances since at least one party will try to maneuver around the vehicle to get a better shot. There are plenty of videos to verify what typically occurs. And it's not all about gunfights. Scenarios involving unarmed assailants or those armed with contact weapons occurring at extreme close-quarters must be considered. With a handgun, I have a free hand to utilize in ECQ encounters and better retention compared with a two handed weapon. Creating separation is often the best response and is much easier to do with a handgun.

And yes, I have spent a lot of time training to be able to put rounds on target while GOTX or more accurately, while exploding off the X although that degree of movement isn't always what's necessary.

In terms of home defense and having to move through a home or otherwise being forced to maneuver in confined spaces and negotiate corners, a pistol grip shotgun still requires two hands to operate and lacks the weapon retention capabilities of a handgun. The handgun also retains it's functionality even if the free hand is busy doing something else(opening/closing doors or windows, operating lights, ECQ defense, calling 911, carrying a child etc.). Not so with the shockwave.

Last edited by Mister X; 10-06-2017 at 03:41 PM.
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Old 10-05-2017, 10:04 PM
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Could it be that the reason that the bird's-head grip of the shockwave is so much less punishing than a pistol grip is due to the fact that it is being held with the hand and arm perpendicular and the wrist joint parallel to to the thrust vector of the recoil. This means that the wrist joint doesn't experience compression, and the arm can absorb the recoil impulse with a rotating motion from the shoulder.

With a pistol grip your hand and arm are inline and your wrist joint is perpendicular to the thrust vector of the recoil impulse - which means your wrist joint DOES experience compression, and the recoil impulse is transmitted in an inline fashion directly down your forearm and to the rest of your body.

Kind of like the difference between an underhanded "basket" catch of a fly ball, vs. a stiff-armed overhand catch of a line-drive headed right for your face.

Looking at the mechanics of the situation, it makes perfect sense to me that the shockwave grip would be a lot less punishing than a pistol grip.

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Old 10-05-2017, 10:55 PM
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In what type of scenario would you be using the shockwave for "defending against a criminal or a whack job on the American street"?
Is there another class of person you anticipate trying to kill you here in Estados Unidos?

The rest is just too tacticool for me to handle. Go with God.


BTW you still haven't posted anything in response to the whole point of this thread.
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Old 10-06-2017, 12:05 PM
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I finally set up my first keeper. talon tape, pic rail and a freaking laser. Devastating to 20 yards accurate with OO, Slug, even bird. Set up with laser its a def keeper for home defense. Girlfriend soon to be wife will get the green laser type but set up the same way. Ill use the opsol attachment for minishels for her she 110lbs soaking wet red head LOL.
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Old 10-06-2017, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by codenamedave View Post
Is there another class of person you anticipate trying to kill you here in Estados Unidos?

The rest is just too tacticool for me to handle. Go with God.


BTW you still haven't posted anything in response to the whole point of this thread.
"Defending against a criminal or a whack job on the American street" implies to me you're referencing defense scenarios occurring while out and about in public and I can't imagine why you would be armed with a pistol grip shotgun in such scenarios.

Tacticool? A lot of folks will throw out that term to dismiss something they don't understand and I suspect that's the case with you. If anything, the label "tacticool" fits the shockwave like a glove.
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Old 10-06-2017, 03:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister X View Post
"Defending against a criminal or a whack job on the American street" implies to me you're referencing defense scenarios occurring while out and about in public and I can't imagine why you would be armed with a pistol grip shotgun in such scenarios.

Tacticool? A lot of folks will throw out that term to dismiss something they don't understand and I suspect that's the case with you. If anything, the label "tacticool" fits the shockwave like a glove.
Not sure I agree, I think in order to fit the bill the person handling he weapon needs to be wearing tactical socks, tactical skivvies, and 5.11 clothes. Blacked out face, and atc vest.......

The above is sarcasm BTW
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Old 10-06-2017, 05:13 PM
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I bought a Mossy Cruiser 500 which came with the hand grip and a full stock. The hand grip was okay but it IMO wasn't for accuracy. It wasn't made to hold up at eye level to shoot. It is a waist held shooter IMO.

I don't see a run on this gun even if it gets banned, but who knows what people will do. Making a hand grip out of a block of wood wouldn't be that hard to make either. I tried the hand grip on mine for a little while but then it went back in the box.
From what I read years ago the anti gunners wanted all pump shotguns banned but it didn't happen.
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Old 10-06-2017, 05:28 PM
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I built mine like this:
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Old 10-07-2017, 02:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Scotiapilot View Post
Same kind of laser setup? I love lasers, but really want one to be instant on/off with a grip, like CTC Lasergrips. When I saw the AOW Serbu Super Shortys, the first thing I thought was that was an app that cried out for a laser. Seems to me they'd be a lot harder to aim from eye level than a Shockwave.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister X View Post
"Defending against a criminal or a whack job on the American street" implies to me you're referencing defense scenarios occurring while out and about in public and I can't imagine why you would be armed with a pistol grip shotgun in such scenarios.

Tacticool? A lot of folks will throw out that term to dismiss something they don't understand and I suspect that's the case with you. If anything, the label "tacticool" fits the shockwave like a glove.
You again? I thought I told you to go with God.

Okay, just for you, the textbook definition of tacticool is somebody who says things like this:

"I've spent too many years hashing things out in Force-on-Force and analyzing civilian self-defense encounters to believe that some type of movement isn't beneficial in nearly every type of defense encounter(whether it's vs a gun, blade, club, fists). Shooting while in movement is incorporated in every trip to the range and I'm confidant in my skills in that area."

And this:

"The degree of movement necessary varies and I never referenced any particular type, but movement is nonetheless often a key component is such instances since at least one party will try to maneuver around the vehicle to get a better shot. There are plenty of videos to verify what typically occurs. And it's not all about gunfights. Scenarios involving unarmed assailants or those armed with contact weapons occurring at extreme close-quarters must be considered. With a handgun, I have a free hand to utilize in ECQ encounters and better retention compared with a two handed weapon. Creating separation is often the best response and is much easier to do with a handgun.

And yes, I have spent a lot of time training to be able to put rounds on target while GOTX or more accurately, while exploding off the X although that degree of movement isn't always what's necessary."

Now maybe you should start your own tacticool discussion and leave this poor man's thread alone.
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Old 10-07-2017, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by ISCS Yoda View Post
I think it is a toy, too.
This is a toy.


There's no such thing as a 12-gauge toy.
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Old 10-07-2017, 01:51 PM
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Are y'all still fussing about the Shockwave?

Just yesterday me and Coondog jumped out of the tuck for a short explore in the woods and tossed the Shockwave on my shoulder. I haven't got a sling for it but I think I'll get one. That'll give me a project next week to noodle on.

I suppose it makes for entertaining discussion, but agonizing over an endless list of 'what if' scenarios and high-speed low-drag maneuvers isn't necessary for me to appreciate the compactness of the Shockwave allowing it to be easily stowed in the truck for any need that might arise versus my Winchester holding down the safe at home.

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Old 10-07-2017, 02:30 PM
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I'm just curious here about a legal point-

If a smoothbore handgun is classed as "Any Other Weapon" and a short barrel shotgun is classed as AOW, how did Mossberg or whoever get ATF to class this as just a firearm??
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Old 10-07-2017, 05:47 PM
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Here's the letter of inspection and classification by the ATF.
http://www.mossberg.com/wp-content/u...ATF-3-2-17.pdf

Here's the shorthand version.

To be classified as a shotgun it had to be designed to be fired from the shoulder. With the Bird's Head grip originally installed by the manufacture it isn't classified a shotgun.

It can't be classified as a short barreled shotgun because it isn't a shotgun to begin with.

The overall length is greater than 26in. Over 26in inches is considered not concealable on the person. So it isn't an AOW.

So.... it simply does not fall within their definitions and is not a firearm regulated by the NFA.


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Old 10-09-2017, 11:54 AM
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I'm just curious here about a legal point-

If a smoothbore handgun is classed as "Any Other Weapon" and a short barrel shotgun is classed as AOW, how did Mossberg or whoever get ATF to class this as just a firearm??
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChattanoogaPhil View Post
Here's the letter of inspection and classification by the ATF.
http://www.mossberg.com/wp-content/u...ATF-3-2-17.pdf

Here's the shorthand version.

To be classified as a shotgun it had to be designed to be fired from the shoulder. With the Bird's Head grip originally installed by the manufacture it isn't classified a shotgun.

It can't be classified as a short barreled shotgun because it isn't a shotgun to begin with.

The overall length is greater than 26in. Over 26in inches is considered not concealable on the person. So it isn't an AOW.

So.... it simply does not fall within their definitions and is not a firearm regulated by the NFA.
Yeah, I had read the letter. (got some help with tha big words )

I sell a lot of guns, but I don't do a lot of 4473s since I'm usually transferring to an FFL or C&R. I had a shop in the 90s and did a lot of 4473s. Back then, I had to choose either handgun or long gun on the 4473. My confusion here stemmed from my memory of that fact. This gun did not fit either category.
In examining a current 4473, I see that they have added "Other Firearm" to the type of firearm section.
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Old 10-09-2017, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by codenamedave View Post
Same kind of laser setup? I love lasers, but really want one to be instant on/off with a grip, like CTC Lasergrips. When I saw the AOW Serbu Super Shortys, the first thing I thought was that was an app that cried out for a laser. Seems to me they'd be a lot harder to aim from eye level than a Shockwave.






You again? I thought I told you to go with God.
yes exactly the same. I haven't seen the CTC laser grips I may look at them to set up the mrs shotty. I also may go to the green laser in the truglo, it shows up better in daylight and I most the PCC shooters are using them on the range. You have a link to the ctc? I still don't know what laser is the best. With this shockwave set up the laser is AMAZEBALLS! Keeps the shotty low and controllable. I also have to buy some minishells and see how they run. My mrs is a tiny thing and I want her to be able to use this shotty with confidence.


I think the number one way to rid boards of keyboard warriors is to challenge hot heads to a USPSA/IPSC or Steel challenge to see who shoots best.......

That being said I am open to these challenges at Ben Avery or Cowtown any Wednesday or Thursday. That is in PHOENIX ARIZONA, LOL

It seems these days if you read on the net or watched the you tube you suddenly become a tactical specialist........or a tacticool wet dream lol.
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Old 10-09-2017, 07:49 PM
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This Shockwave is not a new technical break through. Guys that
have messed with guns their whole life have shot similar guns.
There just isn't much practical use for it other than a stake out
weapon for cops or home defense. More to the power to the guy
who wants one. I don't know about sporting uses, state laws
may not allow it for game animals. I file it with guns like the
Tech-9. I had a Hi Standard m10 with built in lite, gun was a
auto 12 with a crude metal butt plate bolted right on the
reciever. It was vicious kicker and had no practical use. I think
if a company came out with a 20g single shot that was balanced
as well as a handgun, with screw in chokes they would have a
winner. Not a convention single fitted with pistol grip and short
barrel. Would be a useful camp/ hiker/ boat gun. Having shot
similar guns, the 20 is biggest practical and a lot better than 410
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Old 10-09-2017, 08:29 PM
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Duly noted . . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drm50 View Post
This Shockwave is not a new technical break through. Guys that
have messed with guns their whole life have shot similar guns.
There just isn't much practical use for it other than a stake out
weapon for cops or home defense. More to the power to the guy
who wants one. I don't know about sporting uses, state laws
may not allow it for game animals. I file it with guns like the
Tech-9. I had a Hi Standard m10 with built in lite, gun was a
auto 12 with a crude metal butt plate bolted right on the
reciever. It was vicious kicker and had no practical use. I think
if a company came out with a 20g single shot that was balanced
as well as a handgun, with screw in chokes they would have a
winner. Not a convention single fitted with pistol grip and short
barrel. Would be a useful camp/ hiker/ boat gun. Having shot
similar guns, the 20 is biggest practical and a lot better than 410
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Old 10-09-2017, 08:35 PM
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Just like the Governor threads.Most of the haters have never held much less shot a Shockwave.
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Old 10-09-2017, 11:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by handejector View Post
.
In examining a current 4473, I see that they have added "Other Firearm" to the type of firearm section.
Don't buy many guns these days, do you Lee?
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Old 10-09-2017, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drm50 View Post
Would be a useful camp/ hiker/ boat gun. Having shot
similar guns, the 20 is biggest practical and a lot better than 410
Haven't shot a Shockwave, have you?
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