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01-27-2018, 06:13 PM
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Sig P365. Shield Killer
For 3 years in a row the shield was the top selling stingle stack 9mm striker fired. The 3rd most selling gun of 2017.
The new P365 with 10+1 and a slightly smaller profile looks to change that in my opinion. I myself am likely going to get one as I cant resist the idea of 10+1 in a pocket carry gun.
Screw waiting for a bodyguard 2.0, this little Sig has my full attention. With summer coming I think I am sold on it.
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01-27-2018, 06:23 PM
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It has a MSRP of about twice the current selling price of a Shield...of course the actual selling price may be lower. The Shield is proven, but I think I'd wait awhile before considering one. As for me, I will stick with my Shield 45.
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01-27-2018, 06:28 PM
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I held the P365 today. I didn't like it because the grip cuts into the palm of my hand, hate that feeling. The Shield grip is more full and just feels great in my hand. Sig will sell them, but I don't see this gun dominating in anyway.
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01-27-2018, 06:45 PM
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If it's free I'll get one. If it's not then I'll wait a few years to see what it actually is
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01-27-2018, 06:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GKC
It has a MSRP of about twice the current selling price of a Shield...of course the actual selling price may be lower. The Shield is proven, but I think I'd wait awhile before considering one. As for me, I will stick with my Shield 45.
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MSRP for shield 2.0 is $479 standard sights.
MSRP for 365 $599 with night sights.
Put some night sights on the shield and where do you stand?
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01-27-2018, 06:51 PM
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It will definitely cut into Shield sales, but I do not think it will be a Shield "killer" in that S&W will drop the Shield to come up with a 10+1 subcompact 9mm in a similar footprint.
Regardless, I won't be running out to buy one, as I already have what I need.
To me, the bottom line is that this healthy competition among gun companies is forcing them to innovate, and we consumers are reaping the rewards.
We are living in a Golden Age of handgun weapons.
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01-27-2018, 07:40 PM
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I want one but I will not be giving up any of my Shield(s).
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01-27-2018, 07:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by comiskeybum
Put some night sights on the shield and where do you stand?
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Same as with regular sights...behind it. I make it a policy to never stand in front of a firearm.
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01-27-2018, 10:54 PM
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I thought the Glock 43 was the Shield killer? And wasn't the Shield the Walther PPS killer? For being dead there are a lot of living gun.
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01-27-2018, 10:57 PM
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I like what I'm seeing with the SIG and will likely get one. I have a soft spot for SIGs and I have yet to be disappointed with one I've bought.
Now will they offer it in .357 sig
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01-27-2018, 11:21 PM
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On a serious note, I've owned a few SIGs: P220, P228, P239, P238, a 1911 (can't remember the model), and an SP2022 in 9mm. They are good guns, with a hefty price tag (for the metal frame guns, anyway) and it seems like I remember the mags being super expensive. Or maybe I'm recalling the H&Ks I owned whose mags were so expensive. Anyway, at the time I owned them, SIG's service was in a slump, but I was fortunate not to have any problems. I don't know how their service rates now.
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01-28-2018, 12:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GKC
They are good guns, with a hefty price tag (for the metal frame guns, anyway) and it seems like I remember the mags being super expensive. Or maybe I'm recalling the H&Ks I owned whose mags were so expensive.
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Most Sig mags run $40, even the single stack ones for the P290 guns. Bad joke, IMHO.
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01-28-2018, 01:01 AM
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The cost of mags means nothing to me.
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01-28-2018, 01:38 AM
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I don't see it killing the Shield but if it works I can see other manufacturer's emulating this mag design. More rounds in the same space = better
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01-28-2018, 01:45 AM
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Will be real difficult for anything to break my affair with my shield 45... talk about a gun that feels good in your hand and oh by the way is accurate (at least mine is)
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01-28-2018, 10:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GKC
On a serious note, I've owned a few SIGs: P220, P228, P239, P238, a 1911 (can't remember the model), and an SP2022 in 9mm. They are good guns, with a hefty price tag (for the metal frame guns, anyway) and it seems like I remember the mags being super expensive. Or maybe I'm recalling the H&Ks I owned whose mags were so expensive. Anyway, at the time I owned them, SIG's service was in a slump, but I was fortunate not to have any problems. I don't know how their service rates now.
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HK mags run about $35 with a few exceptions
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01-28-2018, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by comiskeybum
The cost of mags means nothing to me.
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How so
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01-28-2018, 11:03 AM
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There are obviously pros and cons. I keep 10+1 in my Shield anyway. So that's no advantage. The only perceived advantage would be the smaller size, which might not be an advantage to some. Can I shoot the smaller Sig as well as the Shield (which took me a while to get the hang of itself)? The Shield is very soft shooting for its size, so I like to practice with it. Will I want to practice with the Sig? And then there are aesthetics. I think Sigs are ugly and the P365 is no exception. Some don't care about, but I do. With all that said, it might be awesome. If it is, then I may give a spin (Not getting rid of my Shield though)
Last edited by Bamabred; 01-28-2018 at 12:51 PM.
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01-28-2018, 11:06 AM
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I’d wait to see if it passes the drop test first.
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01-28-2018, 11:37 AM
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Time will tell. Sig guys will be all over it. My Shield's been dependable as the sun rising in the East right out of the box. I'll be sticking with it.
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01-28-2018, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by comiskeybum
The cost of mags means nothing to me.
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Me neither.
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01-28-2018, 11:42 AM
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Is the P365 trigger “safer” than the Shield’s? As in, longer travel or heavier?
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01-28-2018, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Telecaster
Is the P365 trigger “safer” than the Shield’s? As in, longer travel or heavier?
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If it's anything like the P320 probably not
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01-28-2018, 12:09 PM
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NICE looking gun on paper. Would love to handle one in person. That being said, last night I was rooting around in a drawer and came across my 638-2 with the magnas and tyler and to tell the truth, you really can't get any better grip feel than those old J frames Let us not forget the old ways young padowans!
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01-28-2018, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arik
How so
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Because I'm happy with the two it comes with.
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01-29-2018, 12:43 PM
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It would get a serious look from me if the barrel was 1/2 an inch longer. Until then I will keep my Kahrs. My Kahrs work for an old DA revolver shooter and my CW carries 9 of 9 mm and I like the slide/barrel length and the dot the i sight system.
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01-29-2018, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cardboard_killer
I thought the Glock 43 was the Shield killer? And wasn't the Shield the Walther PPS killer? For being dead there are a lot of living gun.
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A+ on that. Seems like with every new gun release the new model is suppose the be some killer of some other makes models.
I have no interest in it.
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01-29-2018, 01:44 PM
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I don't doubt.....
I don't doubt that it will be a great gun. I'm not going to run out and buy one to replace my Shield though. I like the Shield a lot.
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01-29-2018, 01:55 PM
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Last 10 Walther magazines (P99, P99c) have averaged $17.50 for me including shipping.
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01-30-2018, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GKC
On a serious note, I've owned a few SIGs: P220, P228, P239, at the time I owned them, SIG's service was in a slump, but I was fortunate not to have any problems. I don't know how their service rates now.
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With the P220, P228, & P239, one wouldn't have actual knowledge of Sig's customer service because those guns were as close to perfection as guns can get.
I'm a devotee of Sig P220, P229, & P239. But I'd be lying if I said that I knew they're better than S&W's Shield line. But I'm old school; hence, handguns are handguns if they have an exposed hammer. Blued steel (Model 60 exemption), wood, and exposed hammer and I pretty darn clam happy. But I know that others have differing beliefs. I'm good.
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01-30-2018, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rwsmith
I don't doubt that it will be a great gun. I'm not going to run out and buy one to replace my Shield though. I like the Shield a lot.
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While I don't own a Shield, I agree with you a million percent. Stick with what you know works and is reliable.
BTW, my ex wants a handgun. She wants a .45 ACP. She wants me to help her pick one that's suitable for her. I'm gonna expose her to a Shield first, although she loves the 1911-A1. Maybe a compact version of the S&W 1911-A1 might be perfect for her. She already knows how to shoot a 1911-A1.
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01-30-2018, 04:12 PM
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I think this gun will see the biggest impact/sales with people who dont already own a reliable single stack 9mm. I am one of those people. When I had my job at the gun store I always carried my XD9 MOD.2 SC in an OWB Flex from Stealth Gear.
I have wanted something other than my bodyguard that I can pocket carry and/or IWB and be comfortable. The Springfield isnt very comfy IWB for more than a few hours. As small as it is, its too heavy and too thick for a fat guy.
As more and more reviews pop up on youtube, especially the one comparing it directly to the G43, I am pretty sure you can pocket carry this gun. And that is ideal for me.
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01-30-2018, 04:32 PM
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If you see the gun boards awash in Shields for sale ....maybe...I tend to doubt it though.
The Shield was one of the fastest models to achieve a million in sales...a few scant years....hard to overcome that!
I don't own either as my 3913 is still the king of CC for me and many others as well!
Randy
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01-30-2018, 04:35 PM
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The p365 initially got my attention, but after reading about the ridiculous ongoing problems with the p320, my current interest in owning a striker-fired SIG pretty much dropped to zero.
http://www.dote.osd.mil/pub/reports/...my/2017mhs.pdf
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01-30-2018, 05:03 PM
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Every gun company runs into a PR issue at some point. They fixed the problem. No gun company is perfect.
Anyone else making a high capacity 9mm that small? Right....
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01-30-2018, 05:10 PM
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Your money, Your life.
I prefer years of proven reliability behind any gun I carry.
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01-30-2018, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SA1911
With the P220, P228, & P239, one wouldn't have actual knowledge of Sig's customer service because those guns were as close to perfection as guns can get.
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I never had any problems with mine...any "knowledge" I had of SIG service issues came from reading complaints on the SIG fora. As is often the case, these negatives were amplified because the positives were usually not posted. However, at the time, there were lots and lots of comments, with some credible issues.
For a number of years, I bought, sold, and traded guns...a lot. That I didn't keep a certain gun didn't really mean it wasn't good or was problematic...it was just turnover. I don't do that anymore...age and fixed income have slowed that down to a halt. I am content with what I have, and I don't have the urge anymore...well, if won the lottery, I might get that fully custom 1911 I've always thought I'd someday have, but beyond that, I am and would be content with what I have. I wish I'd felt this way a long time ago, because I sure never made any money with all those transactions...but I do have some memories of some good guns with only a few clunkers along the way.
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01-30-2018, 06:08 PM
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Sig is overpriced junk IMHO
The only model remotely worth the money is the 226 and that is still a boat anchor
If the 320 failures and problems are any indication of the future of the 365.... I'll pass
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01-30-2018, 06:33 PM
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One problem I'm repeatedly seeing come up with reviews by average joes on various forums who have shot the Sig p365 is the slide failing to fully return to battery.
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01-30-2018, 09:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTBL
I held the P365 today. I didn't like it because the grip cuts into the palm of my hand, hate that feeling. The Shield grip is more full and just feels great in my hand. Sig will sell them, but I don't see this gun dominating in anyway.
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I think what people don't realize if you already have a modern subcompact, it won't make much difference if you buy the latest and greatest. Yes the P365 is the smallest yet has a large capacity, but it's still going to flip and have more felt recoil than say a MP Shield or a Springfield MOD2 Subcompact.
They say the P365 is as small as a G43 and my Glock 43 is about the same size as my Springfield MOD2 Subcompact, but the MOD2 is much much thicker. Me personally the MOD2 is very easily concealable and comfortable to wear all day. I think this gun is perfect because it holds 13 rounds and a 16 round backup. It also has a decent trigger, it is soft recoil and ergo is tops. The P320 Subcompact I regret buying that because it is way too flippy. Therefore, I agree the Shield is probably a better choice because it is after all only 3 ounces lighter than say a MP compact 9mm. I don't mind weight because it will keep the recoil softer for quickly follow up shots
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01-30-2018, 09:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister X
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I concur and the only P320 that I like is the Compact in .357 Sig. The 9mm in spite of using same frame as .357 just does not feel right when shooting it. The Subcompact is terrible when it comes to balance. I think I made a huge mistake by buying two subcompact conversion kits. I wished I would have bought a another MOD2 springfield instead
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01-30-2018, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister X
One problem I'm repeatedly seeing come up with reviews by average joes on various forums who have shot the Sig p365 is the slide failing to fully return to battery.
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This is quite terrible news and I have heard Sig ever since they moved to the USA, their quality control went south.
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01-31-2018, 12:47 AM
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I'm not sure where all the SIG-bashing is coming from, but it's not from me. I own three of them, a P250 .380, and one of those "unreliable" P320s in both 9mm and.357 SIG. I have over 3000 rounds on the P250, and over 8000 on the P320. Total number of failures to feed/fire/eject over the 11000+ rounds of all three combined is 7.
I only wish my Shields were as problem-free. My Shield 9 has 5500 rounds with 27 failures, and will only fire reliably with Hornady Critical Duty or Federal HST 147. My Shield .45 had 15 failures to feed in the first 2000 rounds until I got it straightened out. S&W's out of the box reliability has equaled SIG's only with my excellent M&P 40 compact, which had only four failures in its first 8500 rounds.
If the new P365 is as unreliable as my P320 it will be a real winner.
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01-31-2018, 07:10 AM
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That is a LOT of shooting, 27,000 rounds at least. I doubt I've shot 27k rounds of 22 in my life, let alone the mix of 9/357sig/45/40 you have in the last ten years. You must be very happy to be able to shoot that much.
It seems like a lot of failures, though. My main self defense handgun is my CZ75 P01 and while I've only had maybe four thousand rounds through it, I've never had a failure with it. I bought a spring set to replace the springs (I've had it ten years and thought it was time) but with it so reliable I don't want to change anything on it, so the spring set sits in the box waiting.
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01-31-2018, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cardboard_killer
That is a LOT of shooting, 27,000 rounds at least. I doubt I've shot 27k rounds of 22 in my life, let alone the mix of 9/357sig/45/40 you have in the last ten years. You must be very happy to be able to shoot that much.
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Heck, I have over 28,000 through my Shield. If you figure it out, it's not that unrealistic of a number, if you shoot regularly.
I got my Shield back when they 1st came out in early 2012 (almost 6Yrs ago now). I shoot weekly and put at least 100 -150 round through it.
Do the math: 5.8 Yrs X 52 Weeks X 100 rounds = 30,160 rounds total.
Wow... I didn't realize I was at 30K.
Anyway... To the OP...
Will the P365 be a Shield Killer? To do so, it would need to sell over 1 Million rounds in it's 1st 4-5 Yrs on the market. As far as I know, the G43 hasn't done it yet, neither has the LC9S, or other "Shield Killers".
Time will tell, but I won't even consider buying one until I've had a chance to shoot one myself and it will need to feel a lot nicer to shoot than my Shield.
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01-31-2018, 11:27 AM
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I'm not here to bash Sig, just not a fan. I owned a p238 for a while. And only after probably 300-400 rounds the slide stopped locking back on the last round. And yes that's only one experience but that was enough. For close to $600 or whatever I paid for it I was disappointed. Traded it.
Also, just yesterday I was at my LGS and held a Legion. Guy was telling me about the great trigger... I dry fired it a few times and I mean really? I think that one was close to $1,300.
I'll pass and again I'm sure there are mostly positive experiences with these guns but just didn't happen for me.
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02-01-2018, 12:26 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 359
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I just ordered one from Brownells. $460 including taxes and shipping using a coupon code. I really dont think that price could be beat locally. If it is, I will simply cancel the pre-order.
__________________
Smith all the things
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02-01-2018, 02:09 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 956
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Quote:
Originally Posted by comiskeybum
Every gun company runs into a PR issue at some point. They fixed the problem. No gun company is perfect.
Anyone else making a high capacity 9mm that small? Right....
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The "fix" for the drop safe issue may have introduced a trigger that fails. The 320 also failed reliability with ball ammo, and may at times eject a live round when feeding.
Now the 320 woes may not have anything to do with the P365; but for these reasons I will no longer buy a new gun until it's had a year or two on the market. (Recall even the Shield and XDS had safety recalls).
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02-13-2018, 12:09 AM
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Member
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Join Date: Apr 2011
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Appears Sig is going to tweak the P365: Sig Tweaking the p365 Design - SIG Talk
Too bad, hopefully they get it ready for prime time soon.
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02-13-2018, 01:16 AM
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US Veteran
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,878
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pef
(Recall even the Shield and XDS had safety recalls).
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Just a clarification:
The Shield never actually had a safety recall. It had a safety alert ('safety' referring to the Trigger Safety). There was a Self-Check to ensure that the Trigger Safety Spring functioned properly. If it failed the check, owners could send it in for a fix.
LWC
The XD-S, on the other hand, did have a Mandatory Recall, relating to the faulty Grip Safety, which could (and did on several) cause the pistol to go Full Auto.
Last edited by RobzGuns; 02-13-2018 at 01:27 AM.
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