Colt 1917 .45 Revolver ID Help....and Thanks

Redcoat3340 · #1 06-21-2018, 09:54 PM

Many thanks for all the info provided by member here....it really helped. I bought the gun and now have begun to research it.

Here are some pics. If anyone can shed some light about it, it will be deeply appreciated. (NOTE: While all my revolvers are S&Ws and I only have two Colts [a 1903 and 1911 in 9mm) I couldn't find a 1917 in Smith I could afford and then tripped over a Colt in my LGS.

JH1951 · #2 06-21-2018, 10:20 PM

Is the serial number missing or is the image on my computer just bad?

Redcoat3340 · #3 06-22-2018, 12:31 AM

I think it's the image. Here's some others. Also, anyone know if there are target grips for this gun...or Hogues or Pachmyers?

The number on the butt is 118581. One the yoke and crane...268448, or 288448, it's hard to read. Here's what was said from a fella on the Colt forum:

Your Colt M1917 with service number 118581 was delivered to the Government during the week of October 5, 1918 as part of a weekly shipment of 3000 revolvers. The number 3974 is an arsenal rebuild stamp required to keep all of the hand fitted parts together during a rebuild. There are many parts with this number on them. It appears that the cylinder and/or crane was replaced during the rebuild with another cylinder/crane salvaged from pistol 164600 which was restamped with the Colt serial number of this pistol, 268488. The rebuild was probably done in the early 1920's by Springfield Armory (it could have been by Augusta Armory or Rock Island Armory). I think that's the only time it was rebuilt.

Absalom · #4 06-22-2018, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redcoat3340

.....
The number on the butt is 118581. One the yoke and crane...268448, or 288448, it's hard to read. Here's what was said from a fella on the Colt forum:
...... It appears that the cylinder and/or crane was replaced during the rebuild with another cylinder/crane salvaged from pistol 164600 which was restamped with the Colt serial number of this pistol, 268488.....

I see 268448 pretty clearly.

The fellow loses me with the number 164600. Where does he get that? Am I overlooking that in one of your pictures?

It looks like someone at least got started on scrubbing the butt serial, but then stopped without finishing the job.

Redcoat3340 · #5 06-22-2018, 03:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Absalom

I see 268448 pretty clearly.

The fellow loses me with the number 164600. Where does he get that? Am I overlooking that in one of your pictures?

It looks like someone at least got started on scrubbing the butt serial, but then stopped without finishing the job.

The 164600 is on the crane, on the bottom, XXXXed out...but you can read between the Xs and see the numbers.

I'm not sure that they tried to scrub the number on the butt or it's just heavy wear. Under a loop it's a bunch of very fine lines, all in one direction...but doesn't look like a steel brush, file or steel wheel.

I'll try the pic with the xxxed-out serial again.

Absalom · #6 06-22-2018, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redcoat3340

The 164600 is on the crane, on the bottom, XXXXed out...but you can read between the Xs and see the numbers.

I'm not sure that they tried to scrub the number on the butt or it's just heavy wear......

Ah, I wondered whether it might be the x-ed out number, I just couldn’t make anything out. On the butt serial, I just find the difference in depth between the No. and the digits unusually dramatic for that to be just normal wear. But that’s just a matter of perception, I guess

LoboGunLeather · #7 06-22-2018, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redcoat3340

I think it's the image. Here's some others. Also, anyone know if there are target grips for this gun...or Hogues or Pachmyers?

The number on the butt is 118581. One the yoke and crane...268448, or 288448, it's hard to read. Here's what was said from a fella on the Colt forum:

Your Colt M1917 with service number 118581 was delivered to the Government during the week of October 5, 1918 as part of a weekly shipment of 3000 revolvers. The number 3974 is an arsenal rebuild stamp required to keep all of the hand fitted parts together during a rebuild. There are many parts with this number on them. It appears that the cylinder and/or crane was replaced during the rebuild with another cylinder/crane salvaged from pistol 164600 which was restamped with the Colt serial number of this pistol, 268488. The rebuild was probably done in the early 1920's by Springfield Armory (it could have been by Augusta Armory or Rock Island Armory). I think that's the only time it was rebuilt.

You have received definitive and accurate information from the Colt Forum member. Frame serial number (inside frame under the cylinder yoke) is the Colt factory serial number (as part of the sequence of Colt New Service production). The number on the butt is the Army-required number for the 1917 revolver series (including both Colt and S&W production). Further information on the rebuild explains everything else about this revolver.

Overall, a decent representative sample of the Colt Model 1917 US Army that, while not completely original, is certainly accurate historically for military service.

Absalom · #8 06-22-2018, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoboGunLeather

......Frame serial number (inside frame under the cylinder yoke) is the Colt factory serial number (as part of the sequence of Colt New Service production). The number on the butt is the Army-required number for the 1917 revolver series (including both Colt and S&W production).

Colt's US military revolvers can be a bit confusing.

As said, the butt number on your M1917 is not the legal serial number, and even if someone had removed it, that wouldn't be a problem. By the way, I no longer think it was an attempt to remove it, it also wasn't wear, but the No. and the digits were struck at different times with different strength and dies. I've found other examples.

But on the earlier US Army DA .38 series, that same number WAS the only complete and legal serial, and only its last four digits were used elsewhere as the assembly number. That caused a lot of Model 1892, 1894, and 1896 guns to lose their serials when they were upgraded to 1901 specs with the swivel; they just got restamped with four digits, misleading the uninformed to think they've got a first-year gun.

The M1909 version of the New Service had the full serial stamped in the crane cut; in contrast to the M1917, that matched the number on the butt.

LoboGunLeather · #9 06-22-2018, 07:26 PM

By the way, any grips made for the Colt New Service should fit properly, but you will probably have to remove the lanyard loop and stud to accommodate such a change. In any event, be sure to keep the original grips, lanyard loop, etc, as those parts have a great influence on future value of your revolver.