How to make a 1911 with a hacksaw and a file...

I've access to a tool shop & I'd be pressed to make one with hand tools.

I just don't believe it.



Ghost Guns: Illegal Hand Made Colt 1911 Pistols




.

__________________
"IN GOD WE TRUST"

I'd sure be interested in how they make the springs and sears.

__________________
Eccentric old coot

I was watching one of the natgeo specials on guns and it was mentioned that if guns got stolen they could fall into the hands of criminals (no kidding). I turned it to another channel. I like some of the natgeo programs but that one was too much

If memory serves me correctly there's also a long standing gun manufacturing city in Pakistan.There they make everything from pistols up to full autos using only the most basic of hand tools. There was a video put out at one time on this but I've forgotten what it was called.
Jim

One of the mainstream gun magazines did a couple page article about this place many years back. The author described it as a large gun bazaar! Sorry I do not remember any more details!

__________________
14 S&W Revs none with locks!

I was watching a show a while ago , and they followed these Philippino's that made Colt .45's by hand . They made them up in the mountains , then brought them down to ship off . They showed these guys in a shack doing this with hand tools . I swear when they were done you couldn't tell one from a real Colt . They shot them , so they knew they worked . Amazing what you can do when you have to .

I handled a number of "Khyber Pass" Martini-Henrys while over in Afghanistan. Crude, but they worked. I believe it was Guns and Ammo many years ago that published pictures from that part of the world and the hand crafted firearms.

__________________
John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Springs can be made using what is called music wire, you have to heat treat it. Same goes for a sear. Use tool steel and then get it hot enough that a magnet won't stick and quench in oil.

A bunch of good files, a simple drill press, some drills, a vise, and a whole lot of time.

My step dad made several muzzle loader barrels. The only thing he used electricity for was turning the blank while he drilled it. He rifled them by hand using a homemade bench, a pull through tool that rotated via a piece of pipe with a piece 1/4" x 1/2" flat bar screwed to it in a spiral. The flat bar road in a groove that made the pipe turn, The cutter was a small tooth in a slot in a piece of round stock that fit the bore, after each pass of the tool a piece of thin paper went under the tooth then another pass. after one groove was cut the barrel was turned 90 degrees and another groove started. Time and labor. After all the grooves were cut he made a slug and used valve grinding compound to lap it rifling smooth. They shot fine. He just wanted to make his own gun.

I believe that if I wanted I could build a gun. Joke is I think an open bolt, sub machine gun similar to a grease gun, would be easiest.

Piece of round stock that fit in a tube. Internal threads in both ends of tube. I could do away with the threads if I welded piece in place or even used cross pins or small counter sunk machine screws. Piece to fit one end of tube setup with a chambered barrel with a good ramp in its bottom section. Piece of round stock gets a groove down sides 180 degrees to each other. One gets a small hole drilled into the bolt 3/4 the way away drum face. This groove is for a extractor hook that would need to pivot using a cross pin, the hole in bolt being loaded with a spring to cause the hook to operate. The other groove would ride on a small piece of flat steel running length wise inside one one was of tube. This keeps the "bolt" from turning and the front shoulder of it is set so when bolt is slammed back and extractor hook pulls back case the other side of case head is struck by the bars leading shoulder and kicks the case to complete ejection. The bottom of the bolt has a small square shouldered notch faced with a piece of hardened steel. that the sear. The bolt face has a small tit that is the firing pin. Right behind barrel location, underneath, a cut is made in tube and a mag well (rectangular tubing) is tig welded in place. behind that another small slot is made and a handle with a simple spring loaded pivoting trigger is installed. In front of the pivot the trigger has a hardend piece that sticks up and goes down as trigger is pulled. Bolt is installed with a good spring behind it. Bolt is pulled back by a bolt threaded into bolt block. Trigger holds it back. Magazine is inserted. To fire trigger is pulled, bolt goes forward, stripping round and slamming into chamber, tit on bolt face slams primer, bang, recoil slams back bolt and case which is hooked by extractor, other side of case head slams into small bar and it is flipped out through port in tube, bolt hits end of travel, spring drives it back forward as trigger has not been released to engage notch in bottom of bolt, it strips another round and bang. If operator releases trigger it's sear pops up and catches bolt at limit of its rearward travel and stops the cycle. You would need to spend some time on balancing spring, travel etc, but the method has been proven to work well and it is actually extremely simple. If it weren't for the laws I would love to play around making a functioning model in 22lr, then 45 acp. Guns are not rocket science. Look at some 22 semi autos. Pretty simple, as open breech submachine gun doesn't needed lock up, dis connector, a hammer or a firing pin.

I believe I read about some guy in England that made a sub machine, sometime after their ban on handguns- 10-15 yrs ago. He did it to show the government that people could make their own weapons, but they would be sub guns, not a fine S&W 15. I believe he got arrested and I do not remember final status. Your right it is not rocket science, but you still need skills. Be Safe,

__________________
I BACK OUR BLUE

Here is another thing. I am pretty sure the CNC codes are out there and available for ARs.

"Bulk parts" are readily available from a multitude of sources. These folks are resourceful on a "life and death" level. They weigh "difficulty of manufacture" vs smuggling, a suitcase will hold enough small coil springs for a couple hundred guns. The bigger lesson should go to the "hoplophobes"/ gun banners, who would see way better QC coming out of "USA neighborhood sheds", should they get their wish. Joe

__________________
Wisdom chases me; I'm faster

yup For the life Of me, I Seem to remember some nook or Cranny of the web some time Ago that hosted it Dang if I can remember though

__________________
it just needs more voltage

I have seen photos of Khyber (sp?) Pass Afghans making SMLEs out of a piece of railroad track using mill files and holding the stock between their feet. There used to be significant paranoia among collectors not to get fooled by a counterfeit.

3D printed guns are now legal… What’s next? – TechCrunch

__________________
On the whistle draw and fire 6

The local media in ABQ, NM did a story last week about "ghost" guns and supposedly made one.

Ghost guns: How criminals circumvent firearm laws
https://www.kob.com/investigative-ne...-laws/4997115/

The reporter said that over $1200 was spent to make the ghost gun.

Umm, there are far, far, cheaper ways of getting an illegal firearm a straw purchase or simply going into what is known as the "war zone" in SE ABQ and finding a someone who knows someone are the easiest.*

*disclaimer: me mentioning this behavior doesn't mean I condone nor take part in ANY criminal activity.

__________________
Thread Killer.

my last couple of 1911 builds look like I banged them out with rocks and rubbed them with sand. sadly they started out with store bought parts so from bar stock I don't think I could get there from here.

Attached Images

	100_1613_zpsaadczr7j.jpg (171.0 KB, 58 views)
	100_1611_zps21ejncej.jpg (239.1 KB, 57 views)

__________________
Expert at not being an Expert.

The place in Pakistan is Darra.

Natgeo did an hour program on the place back in the 90's IIRC. It was quite interesting. I believe they wrote it up in one of their print issues as well.
I distinctly remember the back alley bluing tanks (probably using sodium
nitrate fertilizer & lye) and a heat treatment process where they brought common oil based paint to a boil in an open bucket. At that boiling temp, it would draw back/temper what ever the specific part(s) was they were using it for.
Plenty of worn files, chisels, hammers, home made anvils, forges and human power.
No1 Lee Enfields were a big hit at the time.
But if you wanted an RPG,,then you could pay the price and get one of those too.

Just about anyone could make those, thr true craftsmanship is getting that internal lock thing right. No ghost gun is worth it's weight in salt without an IL.

should have added:

Attached Images

ghostbusters.jpg (21.4 KB, 14 views)

__________________
Expert at not being an Expert.

IIRC back when the guy that designed the first 1911 was about 14, he built a rolling block rifle on his older brother's workbench, from scratch, that induced a Mogul from the Connecticut Valley to travel to Utah to meet him.

__________________
Certified Curmudgeon

I watched a video several years ago about the homemade guns in the Phillippines. They ranges from obvious **** to some that looked pretty good. I wouldn't have trusted any of them to shoot, but some would have sure fooled a lot of buyers. I can only imagine some of the soft steel they were using.

Some are probably soft steel, but good steel is not hard to find most old rail road rail was made of 1070 which is a fair tool steel that wold work for most guns. 4140 isn't all that hard to come by either. Industrial B7 and B16 studs are 4140 that has been heat treated to achieve high tensile strenth and yield points just like a receiver. I have tossed tons and tons of studs in metal dumpsters.

Thing about 4140 HT in this manner is it is still relatively easy to file, drill or machine.

As an aside: Firearms manufactured before 1968 that never had serial numbers(legal up until that time) fit the definition of "ghost gun" in that the cannot be traced.
Jim

Yes, I have 2 completely legal 22 rifles that were made well before the GCA of 68 that never had a serial number. One went through an FFL and in that slot on the form he just put none.

BTW, making and owning a so called 'ghost gun' is perfectly legal. Selling one without a having manufacturer FFL and adding a SN is the only way you'd break the law.

__________________
Chris
SWCA #2243 SWHF #292

I think it is a case of the media trying to, well, engineer public opinion. Yes, criminals should not be allowed to own guns. Period. If you are prohibited, you should not possess them. If a law abiding person wishes to exercise their 2nd amendment right...good for them. Most of us have been following this hobby for a lot of years and if it isn't one scary word or description, it is the next. It is what is in a persons heart and their morals...the object is just an object.

Separately, I recall my Grandpa (WW2 vet) telling me that in the old country his ancestors would get a shotgun made for them by the local blacksmith to deter critters from the farms. I guess those were 'ghost guns'. They simply used them to maintain their property and keep food on the table. From what my grandpa said, the story is that the fellas making them took a lot of pride in the shot guns and would often 'engrave' them (although very crudely compared to the professionals nowadays) and would have family initials and even the screws were engraved.

__________________
Rather be outdoors

I have two castings of 1911 frames that were in a tool box drawer I bought at an estate sale. I suppose I could sit down with files, emory cloth, etc., and produce working guns from them eventually, I'm certainly glad I don't have to.

Gov. Phil Murphy (Dem., NJ) is pushing for total ban on them (ghost guns) here. Making, possessing, anything he can come up with.
In one of the most restrictive states in the nation, he wants to make it worse for LAW-ABIDING citizens to be able to own even things they have had for decades. Not to mention acquiring new ones.
The 10 round limit he passed makes several firearms we possess all but outlawed, as no one makes magazines that are meant to carry 10 rounds. Hole lotta pinnin' gonna be goin' on heah!


Rant temporarily suspended,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Several years ago on the IAA website (I think) was a thread about how the Pakistanis were also making ammunition by the same crude means. But it works. I remember reading something long ago about what it took to become a gunsmith in Germany through an apprentice system. Basically, an apprentice was required to produce an acceptable rifle or shotgun by hand filing most of the metal parts out of raw steel and shaping wood with a rasp, "acceptable" meaning up to the standards of the master gunsmith he was working for. Meaning very high standards of craftsmanship. It might take an apprentice several years to produce an acceptable gun.

Back in the mid-1980s I visited the factory of a German manufacturer of mechanical pumping equipment. They also had an apprentice program where apprentices would spend up to five years designing and building pumping equipment, for the most part entirely by hand, before they could become full-time paid workers. Another thing that struck me - no computerized anything. Draftsmen worked at drafting tables standing up, and all of the machine tools in the factory looked like relics from the 19th century industrial revolution. But they produced some excellent precision pumps that would probably work forever.

I love to see this and I wish it happened more. What gives the governments of the world the right to monopolize and control everything...be it guns, or drugs or whatever???

As Australia and New Zealand proved in the 1940s. Just about any bolt action rife can be converted to full auto. Heck Browning converted a lever action to full auto.

A prediction. The word 'ghost' being hard to define may just end up deleted from the final act...

__________________
Certified Curmudgeon

Well hell, aren't those 80% 1911 frames and AR lowers being sold all over the place capable of being turned into ghost guns? I can put one of each together-scratch CAJUNLAWYER MANUFACTURING on it with serial #1 and I'm ripe for takeover by a private equity firm.

__________________
Forum consigliere

I hate the terms "ghost gun", "gun violence", "assault weapon" and a few other terms made up by the loony leftist anti-gun fanatics. I would like to say more, but it could upset some people here.