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07-31-2018, 06:14 PM
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1911 in .38 Special?
I think I already know the answer to this question but does anyone make a 1911 in .38 Special?
Ed
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07-31-2018, 06:36 PM
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All I can think of is the Coonan that comes in .357 . but can shoot 38 special with an 8 LB. spring. Other than that I don't know of any actual 1911s that would even fit a 38 special sized magazine in the frame.
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07-31-2018, 06:41 PM
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Colt made the Gold Cup National Match .38 Special Mid Range. Still plenty available on the auction sites. Probably cheaper than the Coonan, and you have a collectable piece to shoot.
Last edited by 824tsv; 07-31-2018 at 06:43 PM.
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07-31-2018, 06:41 PM
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Not really but it had been an aftermarket conversion decades ago.
Closest thing in production today is a Coonan, which is not a true 1911 pattern but does follow the 1911 and shares a few parts... will digest warm .38 Special when it's included accessory 10-pound recoil spring is installed.
I have have MANY through mine. Not a true 1911 though.
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07-31-2018, 06:42 PM
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Colt and several Bullseye gunsmiths like Giles and Clark Custom Guns made them in the past. Magazines can be hard to find and tune. At one time they were very popular. Some bullseyesmiths will still make them if requested.
Now that reamers and barrels are more available most bullseyesmiths will recommend 38 Super instead.
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07-31-2018, 06:42 PM
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Currently? I think not. You probably know Colt chambered the 1911 for 38 wadcutters in the 60's and 70's.
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07-31-2018, 06:59 PM
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There was a .38 AMU (Army Marksmanship Unit) a few years ago that was basically a rimless .38 spl - better feeding that way.
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07-31-2018, 07:35 PM
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..and then there is the S&W model 52. Not quite a 1911 but extremely accurate and likely easier to find
(and fund ) than a Coonan.
Love mine but be aware that any semi auto in 38/357 is going to be somewhat ammo selective. That's where revolvers shine. FWIW, the 52's will only shoot 38 wadcutters.
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07-31-2018, 09:33 PM
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Jim Clark Sr converted 1911s to shoot 38 Special way back when.
Coonan made a 38 Special conversion for its 357. Different mag and spring. Think it used same barrel.
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07-31-2018, 10:24 PM
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As said, there are some around. They are truly a niche gun and serve little if any purpose outside the niche. (IIRC, they were made for the centerfire class in NRA Bullseye, but that is not even close to my lane and I could be completely wrong.)
There are good quality 9mm 1911s, and a few in .38 Super - both would be similar to .38 special but better performing for defensive use. Neither is cheap in a quality platform. My understanding is that it is easier to make a .38 Super 1911 pistol work well, as the cartridge length is the same as the 45ACP, or so close it does not matter.
My days of spending a lot of cash to have such a nice platform are over, I suspect. For 99% of all uses, my Glocks do just as well as my Wilson KZ9 and custom Commander size .45 (BBQ gun, really; the serial # is my Bar #). My one truly custom revolver is really nice, but a poor use of cash in an objective analysis. I could buy several cases of ammo and attend good training classes for the money spent.
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08-01-2018, 10:59 AM
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Clark Custom Guns Model 61-S .38 Special
"Jim Clark Sr converted 1911s to shoot 38 Special way back when."
This one was built in 1966 using a Colt .38 Special Kit pistol.
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08-01-2018, 01:46 PM
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If anyone has in stock or will build one for you it would be Clark Custom Guns.. Jim Clark , Sr. built the best ...Jim Clark, Jr. might still do them.
(318) 949-9884 Call them boys and see.
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08-01-2018, 02:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M E Morrison
There was a .38 AMU (Army Marksmanship Unit) a few years ago that was basically a rimless .38 spl - better feeding that way.
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I used to have a few pieces of .38 AMU marked brass. IIRC, the rim was reduced and had a slight bevel. There was enough rim left to head space correctly in a .38 special or .357 Magnum revolver.
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08-01-2018, 03:34 PM
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I have three. The new Clark guns are around $3800 and a good used is $1200 up. Magazines are fitted to a custom 38 gun to function properly.
Last edited by 4barrel; 08-02-2018 at 08:55 AM.
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08-01-2018, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwpercle
If anyone has in stock or will build one for you it would be Clark Custom Guns.. Jim Clark , Sr. built the best ...Jim Clark, Jr. might still do them.
(318) 949-9884 Call them boys and see.
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Sadly Jim Jr has joined his father in heaven. The Company is now run by his Son's.
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08-01-2018, 04:21 PM
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Many thanks for all the replies. I do just want to shoot wadcutters with it so that opens the option count a little, I guess. Sounds like a nice used Colt might be the best choice, cost-wise and for parts availability as it should be a "true" 1911.
I already have an S&W PC1911 in .38 Super, a DK edition.
Ed
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08-01-2018, 04:31 PM
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Another thought is to purchase a nice used 1911 and have a local gunsmith convert it to .38 Special. There is a young man locally who has done some fantastic work for me and I'll run the idea past him.
Ed
Last edited by Tom S.; 08-02-2018 at 07:22 AM.
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08-01-2018, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 824tsv
Sadly Jim Jr has joined his father in heaven. The Company is now run by his Son's.
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Thanks for the heads up , I well remember Jim Sr's passing and now Jim Jr...... I'm so glad to hear the grandsons are carrying on the legacy of Clark Custom Guns .
All of this is making me realize how old I've become...I don't feel old !
Gary
Last edited by gwpercle; 08-01-2018 at 06:59 PM.
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08-01-2018, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AveragEd
Many thanks for all the replies. I do just want to shoot wadcutters with it so that opens the option count a little, I guess. Sounds like a nice used Colt might be the best choice, cost-wise and for parts availability as it should be a "true" 1911.
I already have an S&W PC1911 in .38 Super, a DK edition.
Ed
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Ed, the .38 mid-range Gold Cup is not a "true" 1911. Colt changed many parts to make it work with .38 wadcutters. There is no barrel link, and the barrel does not tilt down in the manner of all other 1911's.
In my opinion, the S&W M52 is a better choice in today's market. It was more recently manufactured, is cheaper, and feeds more reliably. The "cheaper" part especially applies to magazines. Parts availability is scant for either gun.
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08-01-2018, 07:49 PM
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As others have already covered, the closest thing is the Coonan 1911 in .357 Magnum.
However, if you just want a 1911 chambered in a cartridge which is ballistically similar to .38 Special, consider one of the 1911s chambered in .380 ACP like the Browning Black Label 1911 or RIA Baby Rock.
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08-01-2018, 08:06 PM
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Good thought but I have many thousands of good .38 Special cases plus a complete .38 Special tool head for my Dillon 650. I know, I can use that brass in my Model 66s and 686s but the idea of a semi-auto just tickles my fancy.
I've investigated Model 52s in the past and found that as noted, parts availability is somewhat chancy - even the takedown tool is hard to find. But a nice one might just trip my trigger.
Ed
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08-01-2018, 08:59 PM
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The Colt 1911 is a blow back design . It shoots the same load as the 52. A Clark shoots a bullet spaced out 1/8 inch or so with a taper crimp and a little more powder. Also when a 1911 38 special is built you need to use a 38 super or 9mm firearm. There were only about four or five gunsmiths that could make a 38 special 1911 shoot bullseye matches.
Last edited by 4barrel; 08-03-2018 at 08:04 AM.
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08-02-2018, 06:29 AM
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I have a Colt NM 38 Special and several 52s. The Smith is the better of the two. It has a lot better trigger and the magazines are much easier to load. I do shoot the Colt better though, probably from many years of shooting 1911s.
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08-02-2018, 08:11 AM
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IN the 60s, a retired BorderPatrol friend loaned me his .38 NM1911. His had a really good trigger. I actually shot 1911s a little better than my tuned 28. They just seem natural to me.
As others have said, the 52 may be a better choice, from both price and function perspectives. My friend's NM worked fine, but not all did.
Jack
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08-02-2018, 11:50 AM
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FWIW, as a reference point, the mod 52 pictured above was purchased a year or so back for just under $1K. It was in excellent condition w 3 mags. The wrench was missing but I easily found one on the net for less than $20.
Spits HBWC 38's WAY better than I can hold it.
That said, I do love my 1911's and would jump on one in 38 if one came along at a similar price.
As I always say,
"The heart wants what the heart wants."
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08-02-2018, 12:37 PM
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I have several of the Colt Mid-range 1911's and they are a retarded blowback system. None of them are very accurate and a Mod 52 shoots much better.
I did buy a Clark 38 Special conversion and it out shoots the 52. It is a fun gun to shoot. This one was built in 1968 by Jim Sr.
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08-02-2018, 05:28 PM
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That's the same model (61-E?) that is on GunBroker currently.
Ed
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