I just got their latest ad today. They are listing fairly good looking Star Model Super pistols in 9mm Largo (9x23) for $295, also 9mm Largo ammo for $30/100.

They should digest .38 Super ammo OK if you don't want to order any Largo ammo.

Unless I am just missing it you forgot to mention which "they" it is that has them for sale.

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Send lawyers, guns & money...

He didn't forget, he's just teasing us.

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Release the Kraken

AHHH, like a fan dancer - only reveal a little at a time!
Well played!

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Send lawyers, guns & money...

I saw that ad too. I already have a Super B, which I like.

Can you really shoot 38 Super in the Stars? I thought I read somewhere NOT to do that.

The Star Supers I've owned in the past you had to use a Drimel to on the barrel to allow for the slight rim on 38 Super. Not much metal removed but a little.

Got the ad as well. Look nice!

Done the same thing many times.

Yep, I'd be real interested to know who "they" are!

Found it!

SARCO

Here's the ad: (you have to buy a pistol, or Destroyer carbine to get access to the ammo)

Pistol:

Star Modelo Super Pistol - SARCO, Inc

Ammo:

9x23 Largo Ammunition - 100rd Box - SARCO, Inc

I had one of these guns 30 plus years ago. Had a machinist friend make an interference fit spacer for the chamber to shorten it to fit 9mm. It worked for a hundred rounds or so before it blew out. 9 largo was unobtainium so the Star went down the road.

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Made it, Ma! Top of the world!

If the only problem with using 38 Super is the rim then 38 Super Comp should work, but low pressure hand loads may be the safest way to go.

peh_7

Nice pistols IMO.
The Model A&B and the Super Models of each.
The Supers are very smooth functioning, at least the ones I've had.

The 9mmLuger and the 38Super both have max chamber pressures posted at 33K on the SAAMI chart.
IIRC, a Speer(?) reloading manual with 9mmLargo data in it gave it's working pressure at 30K.
IF my memory is correct, it would seem that all three of the current loadings would be just fine in the fairly recent built Super A and B

I think the problem with the use of 38Super in some of the Spanish semiautos came about with early production and models built in the early 20th century.
STAR Model 1920, the early Llamas, the Campo Giro Spanish service automatic,,ect. There's quite a number.
Nearly always chambered for 9mmLargo and would be also stamped '38' under that 9mm designation when later surplused and sold. Or stamped as such if the pistol was a commercial mfg meant for export.
That 38 was meant to note the use of 38acp ammunition as an alternative especially for USA customers.
38acp is a weak round. The caliber faded when 38Super came on the scene and just about disappeared.
38Super is the same case spec as 38acp.
Why not just use the Super round in the old girl,,it fits.

Much of that old Spanish steel was not the best fit and quality and 38Super was not kind to it, Some of the designs were weak when compared to the 1911 style later adapted.

Loading the 9mmLargo is easy. Brass from Starline. You can use 9mmLuger dies though they won't resize the bottom 3/16" of the case for you. 38Super dies work perfectly.

I used to buy and shoot Spanish surplus 9mmLargo in both a STAR A and a Steyr 1912. Century sold it very cheaply.
(The largo is very close to the 9mmSteyr round.)

The surplus ammo was packed in 25rd paper packets marked with the caliber and I think they were from SantaBarbara Arsenal (sp?).
I have a few around yet. They were corrosive primed. But a simple hot water/soap cleaning and no rust problems. Berdan primed of course.
The stuff was a bit hot I suppose just judging from the recoil. But the STAR took it in stride. The Steyr too, but I limited the amt I shot through the Steyr as I didn't want to damage it. Really snappy out of an Astra 400!
That's the reasons I started reloading it when I did.

I used 9x23Winchester brass at the time. No Starline offerings then.
Same case but less internal space as it's heavy walled. I kept loads in the low 9mmLuger range and they were just fun shooters. No paper ever walked away.

CCI made the aluminum cased Blazer ammo in Largo. Very weak round when compared to the surplus stuff but functioned the guns well enough. Once in a while you may run across that at a show or shop.

The Star will handle 38Super cases but much use and you will have extractor problems. I thinned rim on 38Super brass. At the time I had Spanish Destroyer in 9mm Largo also. I shot same loads in it. I know guys that say they shoot 38Super factory in the Star but I haven’t. I did shoot a few 38acps but quit because I was worried about extractors.

My Star Super B is in 9x19. It makes an excellent training gun for new shooters. Heavy, but that kills recoil and the trigger is pretty good.

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Release the Kraken

[The surplus ammo was packed in 25rd paper packets marked with the caliber and I think they were from SantaBarbara Arsenal (sp?).
I have a few around yet. They were corrosive primed. But a simple hot water/soap cleaning and no rust problems. Berdan primed of course.
The stuff was a bit hot I suppose just judging from the recoil. But the STAR took it in stride. The Steyr too, but I limited the amt I shot through the Steyr as I didn't want to damage it. Really snappy out of an Astra 400!]

I have around 900 rounds of this surplus ammo (for an Astra 400 I sold) available in the Denver area if anyone is interested. $75 for the lot, can't ship pick-up only.

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Jim
Many K and N Frames

Several years ago I had a Super B in Largo.
Occasionally Starline runs a batch (best choice).
Fun shooter and reliable. I used 9x23 dies.
Anyone buying such will not regret it.

I wonder what brand and age the 9mm Largo they are offering for $30/100 is ? I took a quick look at Ammoseek.com and the current (Coronavirus era pricing) is ridiculous.
They show Steinel Ammunition, whatever that is, for $12.50 to $14.95 per 20 and PCI brand for $49.95/50.

I bought a lot of the Santa Barbara and Seville arsenal 9mm Largo in the little square 25 round boxes back when it was $2/25 rounds so I'm pretty well set for my Modelo Super.

The CCI Aluminum cased Blazer ammo was great when it was available, I even have a few boxes that came loaded with Gold Dot HP's but I haven't see that ammo in years.

Stop.
The Spanish pistols, Star and Astra, were converted to .38 Auto (acp), not Super. This was done by expanding the bolt face. These pistols are marked 9mm/.38 or similar.
This was done with surplus pistols to be sold in the U.S.
The .38 Auto ammunition was more common here at the time.
Use of a Super round is dangerous.

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and what his trumpet saith

I had a Llama "Extra", basically a M1911 knockoff, also marked 9mm/.38. I fired LOTS of .38 Super through it, no problems at all. Don't know about the Stars.

I'm too lazy to run outside into my shop(where my reloading books are)but if I remember correctly,the 9mm Largo and .38 Super don't operate at the same pressure,far from it.
But if you reload the Super brass,you can tame it down to Largo pressure safely.
I won't be mad if somebody stands me corrected though!

I have a Star BM, it is the only gun that I have that does not cycle perfectly. If I can get that to work consistently, I may someday look at another Star.

You've been really unlucky, Rick. I have six Stars, including a BM, and they all run 100%.

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Release the Kraken

I did some searching & I see a lot of different number mentioned but I can't find anything "official".

It's not a SAAMI round & I don't see where it's even listed in the CIP tables.

In Speer #14 they set their load data to 30K psi max (due to the Astra's low-teching breeching system) but they also mentioned they previously tested some Spanish military ammo lots that averaged over 35K psi.

SAAMI 38 Super +P is 36.5K psi.

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Waiting for the break of day

The 9mm Largo is not a puny round. With a 128 grain bullet, its MV is usually given as 1150 ft/sec. That's only slightly lower performance than the .38 Super factory load.

No real trick to loading 9mm Largo yourself. I haven't checked recently, but Starline offered both the 9x23 Supercomp and 9x23 Winchester cases, both of which are rimless and dimensionally very close to the 9mm Largo case. Any 9mm bullets will work.

"In Speer #14 they set their load data to 30K psi max (due to the Astra's low-tech breeching system)"

Regarding the 9mm Largo Astra 400 (and also the Astra 600 in 9x19), they were not locked breech guns but blowback, just a very strong slide spring and a heavy slide. Anyone who has ever disassembled and re-assembled an Astra 400 or 600 wouldn't want to do it again.

Starline has 9mm Largo brass in-stock.

9MM Largo Brass - Small Pistol - Brass Cases

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Waiting for the break of day

I haven't checked Starline's offerings for a long time. Apparently they no longer sell 9x23 Winchester brass, and they have re-named 9x23 Supercomp as 9mm Comp. The 9x23 Supercomp brass was designed for higher pressures, but not as high as the 9x23 Winchester. 9mm Comp and 9mm Largo cases would also work for loading 9mm Steyr. Fortunately, I have about 1000 cases each of both 9x23 Win and 9x23 Supercomp, both of which will also work in any .38 Super pistol. I have both .38 Super and 9x23 reloading dies, but I find that the .38 Super dies work satisfactorily with 9x23 cases, so I use them for both .38 Super and 9x23 Winchester. The only differences are that the 9x23 cases are rimless and have a slight taper.

Describe your ammo and tell us what the slide lettering says.

I had a Model B in 9mm Luger that ran flawlessly with various US factory loads. I never use old surplus ammo.

Yep, at a glance they're hard to tell the difference between them.

As far as I know Starline came up with the 9x23 (Super) Comp name to avoid paying trade-mark royalty fees to Winchester for every case they made that said 9x23 Winchester on it.

(Same reason why Triton, & later Double Tap, "invented" the .450 SMC, to avoid royalties on the 45 Super name.)

S-L renamed their 9x23 Super Comp to 9x23 Comp to avoid confusion with their 38 Super Comp.

I compared their dimensions & volume capacities & got some interesting results.

The S-L 38 Super+P & the 38 Super Com are essentially identical except for the 38S+P's extra dry weight, due to it having a semi-rim (the 38SC is basically rimless). Both have straight case walls, .380" to .379".

The 9x23C only has 1.1% less H²O capacity (17.0gr/H²O -vs- 17.2gr/H²O) than the 38SC & 38 Super+P despite it's 3.1% greater weight. It's case diameter tapers from .386" to .373", head to mouth.

The 9x23 Winchester is stronger (thicker web) than the S-L 9x23C & is better suited to unsupported chambers but the 9x23C is more than enough with supported chambers.

I've never had any S-L 9mm Largo cases & don't know how they compare.

FWIW, I checked in my copy of QuickLOADs & they show the max pressure for the 9mm Largo at (only) 19,580 psi !?
No idea where they got that from.

Are we confused yet?

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Waiting for the break of day

I got a 9mm Largo when they first were available from, I think, J&G Sales. With the pistol I bought 1000 rnds. of corrosive ammo for not much money, if I remember correctly. Available was 500 rnds. of non-corrosive for the same price. I went for the volume buy, just clean the pistol when thru shooting.

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Kevin in Oregon

Mine works flawlessly with hardball and is accurate. I shot one magazine of expensive Critical Defense just to see if it would feed and it did perfectly. I am very pleased with my BM.

I wouldn't mind a Model B at the right price; I have a Super B and a couple BMs. That's a lot of gun for the money spent, in a very aesthetically pleasing design.

Glad to hear it. When the range opens, I will continue to work on it. It may need new springs.

The slides marked 9mm/38 were marked at the factory when the pistols were built, and not added later for surplus sales to the US. As several have already said, the 38 references 38 ACP, and not 38 Super. The pistols that are marked 9mm/38 have a slightly larger cartridge bolt face cut, allowing the semi rim of the 38 ACP to seat properly against the bolt face. The 9x23 Largo is not as high pressure as the 38 Super is, but is IMO in the same performance range as the standard pressure 9x19 (Luger). Starline cases reload easily in .380 ACP dies, which easily resize the cases full length. The Star handguns I have owned have been inexpensive to purchase, a bit rougher than contemporary US pistols, and more accurate than the typical US semi autos of the 1980s. Star was ahead of Colt in many ways, offering beveled magazine wells, high visibility sights, swivel triggers, loaded chamber indicators and the easiest, fastest takedown I've experienced on a semi auto pistol while Colt was busy ignoring any ideas to make the 1911 more user friendly. Star and other Spanish makers get bad mouthed for quality often on the net, probably to the point of being a myth. Elmer Keith once commented that the firearms press was pressured by US manufacturers to criticize European guns instead of US ones. I suspect that some of the quality concerns are based on old, half remembered articles, but even so, it is still a good idea to make sure you know what you have before hot rodding it. IIRC, the most recent importer had a gunsmith put together many pistols from spare parts inventories. For years Interarmco (Inter Arms) imported new Star products as did Garcia prior to that. Sam Cummings of Inter Arms had a long business relationship with Franco's Spain, having purchased many firearms that had been used in the Spanish Civil War, then arsenal cleaned and refinished, for import and sale in the US.

I am not a hand gun shooter and have been practicing every day with a mag or two with .22, then a day or so with my Star BM 9mm. I have the target set up at 10 yds., just convenient for my shooting off the porch. I have a good group with the 9mm, but am shooting a couple inches high to the left. Is that anticipating the recoil, or should the sight be adjusted? I really like the Star.

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Kevin in Oregon

I have a stash of 9 mm largo ammo.

Look at this,
(Reborn) 9mm Largo Webpage

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Plant garlic in the fall

There are many different 9x23 cartridges which exist around the world, some of which are so obscure that few have ever heard of them. But there are only slight dimensional differences separating them. There have been several books written on the topic, including a pretty good guidebook to the 9x23 written by John Moss, available through the International Ammunition Association. There is also a German-published book which is an encyclopedia on 9mm cartridges of the world which covers much of the same territory regarding 9x23 cartridges. I have a copy of it somewhere but I don't remember the author.

Kevin, if you’re right handed the usual flinch shot goes low left. For awhile use two hands and try for a “surprise break” on each shot to try to eliminate anticipating the shot. Once you determine that the sights might need adjusting, look up sight change formulas on the internet and then use a brass drift to move the rear sight in the direction you want the point of impact to move. Don’t dry fire your Star unless you use snap caps or you can break the firing pin.
All the best - Dave