Hello ladies and gents.

I hope we are all staying healthy and well. I know we all want to get back to shooting ASAP!

My questions are as follows:

• Who here has AR-15 pistols and what barrel length did you choose and why?
• What was your budget?
• What is the intended purpose of the firearm?
• What is the weight of the firearm?

Just based on my research, I have been leaning on getting at least a 10.5" barrel up to a 12.5" barrel for ballistics and reliability purposes. I also want to keep the weight down to a minimum. Again, 5.56 caliber is the intended choice for myself.

The pistol would be used predominately by my wife as it would be lighter and more maneuverable to use. Could even substitute as a home defense firearm.

As far as models go, I have looked over the Sig, Ruger and BCM models. I have been leaning more towards the BCM brand as the barrel length and features (and obviously quality) are superior to the other brands I have looked at. It also comes standard with the SBA Tactical Version 3 brace. I have thought about building the pistol, but it might end up costing around the same as the BCM. Yes, I have checked out PSA but their pistols are mostly all sold out.

I really appreciate your input.

All the best

Several comments regarding your question... IF you haven’t fired an AR pistol, then go find one or rent one for a range session. If you are not well above an average shooter, then do not expect to hit much of anything with it. These things are extremely loud with the anywhere from 7 to 10 inch barrels and very hard to hold for a sight picture. You could get one with the elbow stock or whatever they are calling that thing designed to circumvent a short barrel rifle tax stamp. You comment about it being primarily for your wife should be seriously reconsidered... A range session with one of these will scare here away from the idea. The list of better options is way too long to type here.

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S&W factory revolver armorer

I'm currently in the process of piecing together a 10.5" AR pistol myself. I've read a bunch of articles and watched a ton of Youtube videos on them. Originally I was intending on building a fullsize AR so I could paint one up with a custom camo job, as a side project to fill in the lockdown time. I decided on the length after handling the Springfield Saint Victor at the LGS and handling a PSA build that the local Range Officer hand last time I was out.

I haven't really set a hard budget. I am going part by part, looking for quality parts at a good price. The RO told me about the first PSA AR pistol upper he had. It started having problems with the projectiles not hitting the targets, and when they did they were key holing after only 3-4000 rounds thru the barrel. He ended up scoping the barrel and seeing that the riffling had been almost completely smoothed. He ended up swapping the barrel for a Cold Hammered Forged by FN, and said he hadn't had issues since.

After hearing that, I decided to spend more of the "Virus funds" to get this.
https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-...bcg-or-ch.html

I also picked up a PSA 3.5 lb flat face trigger. as a splurge item. I like the CMC Triggers, but they are still quite pricey.

So far I've gone no name on the grip, and ordered an over sized one that got good reviews on a few of the forums. I can shoot the standard A2 grips alright but always felt they were a bit on the small side.

I'll probably go with a PSA BCG, but haven't looked into it too much. Undecided

Leaning towards a Anderson lower to mount the upper on partially to help the LGS, and because they are price competitive with the prices online.

Odds are I'll grab a SBA3 brace, but have liked the idea of the simple tube setup as well. Undecided

Purpose would be more of a range gun than any dedicated house gun, however it would be the go with when I go camping, or bugout for a hurricane scare.

Eventually it will end up with a red dot and a supressor, but that'll be way on down the road

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John 14:6, Luke 21:11

I have one with the 10.5 inch barrel that I shoot suppressed. Without suppression, the muzzle blast is a non-trivial issue for sure. If you miss with the bullet, you might cook the target with the flame.

If you ever shoot one, the thought of firing it inside a room without serious hearing protection is daunting. You will need hearing aids afterward.

Bottom line from my perspective is as a range toy or perhaps a varmint weapon they are "fun" but as a home defense weapon, marginal at best.

This opinion is probably worth exactly what you just paid for it (nothing) and is just my view.

I have a custom built: Stag lower, 7.5" .223 Wylde AR Pistol, that I intend for range time and fun. After getting a red dot sight for it I decided to replace the double star trigger that came as a kit with a 2+ lbs Timney match trigger for AR15. It also now has a linear muzzle break that does not seem to be as loud as the birdcage type I had on before (it still is loud tho).
I also got a .22LR conversion kit for it and that's the set-up I've been using lately.

I have a friend who owns two of them, 8.5” & 12” barrels, IIRC. Neither are suppressed. As stated above, these things are loud, not acutely accurate, and cost him more than a carbine would of. I put a few mags through each and they are not for me. Unless you are in the business of scooting and shooting; boarding planes/trains/buses, or executive protection I do not think an AR pistol offers anything that a carbine can not do better.

they make a nice car /truck in case of....well,never mind

When contemplating an AR pistol I had all the same questions. For me shooting 5.56 from a 7-10 inch barrel made no sense. I ended up going with a 9mm that accepts Glock mags. To my mind even a 9mm AR is gimmicky; I can accomplish the same thing with my G26. Nonetheless, I bought the AR pistol because it looks cool and someone in the future may tell me I can’t have it - I bought my Tac 14 for the same reasons.

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213th FBINA

I had an Aero Pistol in 5.56, 10.5 inch with a Dead Air break/mount on the muzzle, Lantac BCG. Great range and HD weapon, worked 100% every time. I traded it for a S&W MP 15, 16" along with a few other items. Since then I've purchased another Aero upper in 10.5 and saving up to finish it.

I went with the 10.5 inch due to the ballistics of the barrel length, meaning not as much velocity gets lost as in a barrel shorter than 10.5", as I understand it. Plus its easier to handle in home or vehicle with or with out a can, just don't let your hand slide off the rail onto the suppressor...

I had added a Vortex 1:1 red dot before I traded it.

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Isaiah 41:10

OP -

I bought the Ruger version a few months back, for no particular reason other than I just wanted to try one. About 500 rounds of mostly 55 grain ball ammo thru it w/o any issues. About 2 inch groups at 50 yards w/ a Vortex red dot. Muzzle blast is loud, but so is a 16 inch carbine as well.

Couple thoughts. If you plan on firing it like a pistol, it is poorly balanced and hard to hit with. The SBA3 brace, when used as intended, makes for an awkward and out of alignment grip.

If you use the SBA3 as a collapsible rifle stock, it works well, and gives you a SBR without the tax stamp. Also consider it is a handgun, and all that goes along with that.

For example, in most states, it is illegal to carry a loaded rifle in a motor vehicle. NOT so my Ruger, as being a handgun, its no different than carrying a loaded 38 spl revolver under my seat. Can't hunt with a semi-auto handgun here in PA though, so forget coyote plinking with it.

Plusses and minuses...

I like mine for what it is, enjoy shooting it, and that's reason enough for me to own one.

Larry

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I'm heavily leaning towards a 9mm build as my next project.

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John 14:6, Luke 21:11

I've built two AR pistols. One was a PSA parts kit. That was when they were offering free shipping and weren't charging sales tax. All said and done, I was just under $400. 10.5in barrel

I then built an 11.5in barreled pistol. I lucked into a $100 upper. It took me about six months to piece all it together as I was being cheap and kept checking the auction sites and classified sections on various forums. I was under $350 all said and done.

The main difference between the two, apart from the barrel length was that 11.5 has an A1 carrying handle upper and skinny round hand guards. I like the them much better than the fat oval M4 style.

Also both have flash cans on them and it makes shooting them a whole lot more enjoyable to shoot as the blast isn't right in front of your face.

Being cheap and patient, I think kits or piecing one together is the way to go especially if you want to save money and build it exactly how you want it. Quality parts can be found cheap if you know where to look and are patient.

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Thread Killer.

5.56 10.5 500.00 carry in the car its one of my ccw you won t be under gunned

I have an 11.5” PSA kit. It’s a fungun right now, but a suppressor is planned for it or more likely for the .300BO upper i bought.

Ruger PC charger W/Glock mags.

Just curious, not in search of an argument - I fail to see any practical use for these, but perhaps I'm overlooking something. If so, what is it?

No argument from me. I have no idea what they're for but I am having one built solely because the rules are so stupid and I can have one now before someone says that I can't, just like others - see above.

Not sure yet - because we are in the early stages and this thread is going to be reviewed closely. I can see it in a pistol caliber or even .22LR. We shall see.

I already have the lower (they're dirt cheap). I'm guessing 500 bucks.

They have no purpose. They look cool and I can so i will. With a brace and something to suppress sound, perhaps even a suppressor itself (that will raise the cost, that's for sure!) I'll have a cool, not good for much, "handgun". Yippee. Hurray for me. It's an ATF joke just like the 12 gauge "pistol firearm".

Unknown.

If I didn't have guns that I like just for grins I'd own only a half dozen firearms, 2 rifles, 2 handguns, and 2 shotguns. But I own a ton more just for fun, and because I can, just like YOU.

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Come and take it!!

This is a project I keep kicking around.

Earlier this year I took a AR with 16” barrel with me on a long trip. I found it to be inconvenient taking in and out of my truck along with the extra time it would take to deploy it if needed. Since then I been looking for ideas for lighter, shorter PDW.

Since then I have built a AR in 5.56 using a Anderson Smooth Side Upper Receiver, 16” pencil profile barrel with .625” gas block, MFT Stock and Grip and a 15” Free Float handguard. Several people that have handled it like it’s balance and weight.

I have another Anderson Smooth Side Upper waiting to be built. My experience is the Forward Assist and Dust Cover are not needed so they just add weight and bulk. I can shave weight with a MFT stock and a pencil barrel but that still leaves the overall length.

A SBR might be the best choice but I don’t want to pay $200.00 for a tax stamp. So considering the muzzle blast and noise of a short barrel 5.56 the 9mm might be more practical but that opens up the debate about what a PDW 9mm or 45 should be to be a true advantage over a conventional handgun.

60k psi round from a 7.5" barrel. Umm....NO.

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Release the Kraken

WOW!

Thank you all for your experiences and opinions!

I might just go with a BCM Enhanced Lightweight AR for her in 5.56.

I already have a Stribog in 9mm with an 8" barrel, so that's why I was not interested in that caliber for an AR platform. The Stribog is solid, reliable and built with such amazing QC. Downside is it is kinda hefty with the blowback action. Whatever.

Anyways, BACK to the 5.56 discussion!!!

I went the braced Glock pattern 9mm AR Pistol direction. 8inch barrel and the ability to use any doublestack 9mm Glock magazine were big factors. It was also on sale at AIM Surplus for $549 around the beginning of this year. I wanted something I could pair up with a Polymer80 style Glock and use the same magazines.

I put together a 300 BLK pistol on a PSA pistol lower. My deer gun. I didn’t want to wait a year for a tax stamp.



Then the BATFE went Efile, cutting the wait period to just over 30 days, so I took a spare rifle lower and SBR’d it.
I like having the forward grip also.



So now I have a pistol lower looking for a mate. I’ll probably pick up a 10 1/2 inch 556 upper from PSA when they run their next big sale.

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Sure you did

I've got AR pistols in 9mm, 6.8 SPC, and 350 Legend - all custom builds by me. The 6.8 is a 7.5" barrel with a MI blast can that sends most of the sound downrange. There is a fireball, and some concussion but it is nothing compared to shooting magnum rifles. My 9mm is also a 7.5" barrel, has a linear comp on it, doesn't have much blast and no felt recoil. Every woman that has ever shot it thought that it would be perfect for home defense as it is both easy to handle, and easy to shoot accurately. The 350 Legend is a recent build and is going to be my primary hunting weapon this fall. It has a 13" barrel.

I have two 5.56 AR pistols. I find them easy to shoot and accurate with a caveat - I shoot them from the shoulder like a rifle.



The bottom is a 7 inch ATI Omni Hybrid. The receivers are polymer reinforced with metal at stress points. It came with a blade brace for $450. I spent another 125 or so and added a different grip and an SBA3 brace.

The middle is a 10.5 inch kit I bought from PSA. I think the kit was just over $500 including the complete upper and "enhanced" lower parts kit with a polished trigger and SBA 3. The lower is a generic PSA stripped lower. My son and I did the build on our kitchen table in about 30 minutes.

Both weapons are easy to shoot, reliable, and accurate. The ATI has the best factory trigger pull I've ever seen on an AR despite its low price. The fire control group is composite rather than steel, though.

Edited to add - a funny story about the lower. We visited or called every local gun shop looking for a stripped lower. None were in stock, so I ordered the PSA. I asked for it to be shipped to a shop nearby where I've done transfers before. PSA supposedly had their license on file. I got an email a few days later that the shop's license was invalid so I needed to choose another. I went to the shop, and sure enough they had lost their license. A few days earlier they had display cases full of guns. Now they were gone. I chose another shop.

All this delayed shipment somewhat, and when I finally went to pick it up and do the transfer, guess what was in the case at the local shop? That's right a dozen or so stripped lowers ranging from 47.50 up to 125 or so. Yup, I could have saved money on the transfer if I'd been patient. Lesson learned I guess.

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Or something like that . . .

An AR pistol in .223 is extremely useful. They're easy to wield in close quarters, powerful in a defensive situation, very easy to control in recoil, and if built properly, very accurate. See mine below.

Are they loud? Sure thing! But no louder than a 12 gauge shotgun indoors, and the shotgun is recommended all the time for home defense. But the truth is that pretty much any gun of worthwhile defensive caliber is loud indoors. That's why I also keep electronic muffs right by mine, which I will hopefully have the time to put on. Same goes for my 12 gauge. Or my 9mm.

Is it right for the OP's wife? I don't know, because I don't know her. If she wants an easy-to-use gun for home defense, either the .223 AR or a similar platform in 9mm is a great idea.

I have a 7.5" AR pistol that I bought as a Rock River turnkey 6 or so years ago.

Stock, the thing was not fun to shoot in the slightest. Like others are saying, they are LOUD...and before I put a Smith Vortex on mine, it was a flamethrower as well.

I added some parts/pieces here and there over the years. I'll admit that it's been a massive money pit. Here it is a currently set up:



5.9lbs as shown.

It's easy to shoot, 25-50 yds are perfectly fine. I do need to chrono the thing though, I imagine that velocity out of the thing is darn near useless...maybe.

If could get out of it what I have into it...I'd sell it in a heartbeat....but that's not going to happen.

It's an ok firearm. I really need to swap it to 300 BLK to make it worth a darn.

This is the kind of gun that's fun to accessorize. It just is what it is.

There are plenty of YouTube videos about certain rounds fired out of short barrelled .223 ARs because there are a lot of these guns around. The velocity of the ammo is far from useless, and the bullet performance tends to be great. I'm using 55gr. Speer Gold Dot in mine, and the performance I've seen in other 7.5" barrel guns has been excellent.

Crh - good post and well reasoned questions.

My experience-
1) Had a 7.5” barreled DPMS Kitty Kay upper but found it blasty. Also found it uncomfortably short to shoot, to the extent it felt a bit unsafe with so much weight forward. Needed to be run wet and I installed a DFender to fix extraction issues.
2) Have a 10.5” LMT upper that runs very well over the last 8 years. I made the choice to go with a higher tier manufacturer and have been satisfied with trouble free performance. It is still loud and has some blast, but much improved over the 7.5” barrel. 6lbs with a Troy forend. Purchased to be an occasional truck gun but that has been pretty rare. Don’t recall what I have in it, but likely $800 over time for the upper/lower/brace.
3) Personally, I like 9mm carbines a lot. My experience is 9mm ARs are compromises compared to purpose built platforms. Regardless, they are fun.
4) The Firearms News that arrived this week has a fair sounding assessment of the new Springfield Saint takedown AR. Normally I would be wary of Springfield quality and the 8.5” barrel, but there are some neat features that might be worth considering if you are willing to spend $1300.

i have a 7.5" upper that I bought complete from cdnn for $279. Another 100 for the bcg. I had a lower and a lower parts kit in the safe for ages, so all went together pretty cheaply. I found the brace on ar15 for $80. Fun toy, use-full for home defense as even if I miss then just look for the deaf guy in the emergency room.

I built a dedicated 5.56 upper with a CMMG .22lr conversion kit. It loves Aguila HV ammo.

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213th FBINA

My son recently bought a Ruger 10.5" 5.56. He hasn't shot it yet, so I don't know about that part, but the cheapest ammo he could find was 240 rounds for $120. I told him to start putting together some reloading equipment if he plans on shooting it a lot. When he 1st asked me what to buy, I told him I have no idea, which I don't, but check the price of the ammo before you buy it. He didn't, now he's complaining about the ammo. I DID tell him to look at 9mm because of the more available/less expensive caliber ammo. He's a big boy now, and it's his money. Good luck, OP.

My Diamondback 7.5” 5.56 AR pistol is now almost 10 years old. After 2 trips to the home office for severe QC issues, it has run fine since through a few thousand rounds. I have an in-line muzzle device and almost always shoot it outdoors because of the blast.

After warning new shooters about the blast and with good ear/eye pro, I have found it is a great intro to the AR platform for new and young shooters. It’s well balanced, not heavy and easy to handle. Everyone has enjoyed shooting it with the Leupold red dot. The occasional fireball is actually a plus I tell folks to look for. It’s just plain fun, but it could be a very serious weapon if needed.

It weighs 6#. I chose 7.5” because I didn’t know any better at the time.

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Three AR pattern pistols here.

8.5" in 5.56
8.5" in 300 Blackout
6.0" in 9mm

All have braces. All have either a flash can or linear comp. All wear red dots and BUS. All are reasonably accurate.

I consider the 5.56 in that barrel length to be a range toy due to ballistic disadvantage. The other two are decent PDW's.

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Only a cold warrior

Please tell me what braces those are? I really like how they look. Do you have any complaints about them?

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John 14:6, Luke 21:11

They look like G-Rex braces. They are at the high end of cost compared to other braces, but they are nice. I believe the manufacturer is called Dead Foot.

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Or something like that . . .

I have several. The primary is a 10.5" RRA 223 pistol that has a MI slim forearm, it's hell on coyotes out to 300 yards with it's 2x ACOG.

One of my others is a 9mm Glock magazine lower with an 8.5" barrel for the kids to shoot. Soft recoil and a hoot with it's Trijicon RMR.

The other is on loan to friend, it's has an 11.5" barrel and straight A2 iron sights.

My recommendation is to go with a 10.5-11.5" barrel, a suitable optic, and practice man practice. They are very effective out to 300+ yards.

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Captain Dave Funk

These are the 1st Gen Tailhook from Gear Head Works. They are on the pricey side, but they actually work well as a brace, and are considerably lighter than most of the other options out there - despite being solid aluminum. Other than the price I've got no complaints with them. And occasionally you can find them used or on sale - I bought two "blemished" ones a few years ago at the NRA convention in Dallas for I think $75/piece. The only other brace I use is the Trinity Force Breacher brace. They are cheap but attach solidly - I noticed that even Springfield Armory is putting them on the Saint pistols.

-Side note, The G-Rex is a combination of the Tailhook brace and an adjustable sleeve/buffer tube.

20200319_175053.jpgPersonnaly I think a 5.56 AR pistol is a waste of the ballistics of that caliber. The shorter the barrel gets, the more it behaves like a .22 rimfire magnum, at the cost of fierce muzzle blast and flash.

You can feed a pistol caliber carbine (PCC) cheaper and get better performance than from a conventional pistol.

I did a PSA kit when they had their Betsy Ross lowers. (I'm thinking about doing one on their Rosie the Riveter lower too.) I did it mainly just for a fun project. I did a 10.5" barrel in 5.56 with a thin M-lock hand guard. It was a fun project. It has a red dot and flip up BU sights, a flash light with remote and a little red laser. My wife shoots it just fine. We haven't shot it indoors but I know short barreled 5.56 ARs are annoying at the indoor range. Of course my model 69 snubbie with full house magnums is pretty annoying to neighboring booths at the indoor range too. I'm sure either would be deafening in a home hallway. I might make another 10.5" or greater pistol to go under the truck rear seat, with a lock.

Thanks for all of the input gentlemen.

I'm thinking about leaning towards a LW 16" AR at the moment for her after several people's inputs. The fun shop I go to had recommended the AR Pistol for her, and I honestly never thought about it until that moment. My current AR's are around 8lbs and it can be a little much for a petite wife to handle for more than a few shots!

The 9mm Stribog that we have is a good shooter, but because of the straight blowback recoil system, it is a bit stout out front with the beefy bolt. She likes that as well, albeit a bit heavy after a few shots for her. Even for me after about 2 mags of holding it out there, you can feel it. Weight is distributed differently than on a stock AR rifle.

That's why I ask the experts here!!!

Here’s a link to a small study of the effectiveness of 5.56 ammunition in gel at 10 and 83 yards. Conclusions? Based on this Limited performance test, 7” and 10.5” barrels still provide 100% expansion and beyond 12” of penetration, basically pistol like performance. They will not have the velocity to create the shock wave of the small high speed bullet From a longer barrel, but they have greater accuracy, capacity and range than a handgun.

AR-15 Pistol Ballistic Gel Testing | Active Response Training

I have a SBR lower with a few uppers; 10.5" & 14.5" in 5.56, 9" in 300BLK, 5" & 9" in 9mm. The 14.5 5.56 is the only one I shoot in 5.56, the 9" 9mm I shoot, and my favorite is the 9" 300BLK. If I were going with a AR pistol I would go with a 9" 300.

Finally got my last parts for the AR pistol build on July 2nd. This is what I ended up with
-PSA 10.5 FN barreled upper, 12" Mlok hand guard, Magpul Flip-up sights,
-PSA Nitride coated BCG (MPI & HPT)
-PSA flat faced drop in 3.5lb trigger
-Magpul hand stop
-Spikes Tactical Crusader 80% Lower (originally I was set on the basic Anderson Lower, but this wasn't much more at the LGS, and I just really liked the shield, not to mention a local Fl business)
-Spikes Tactical buffer tube kit
-UTG "Sniper" Over-molded AR grip



I haven't had the chance to shoot it yet, but I love how it feels. Compact, well balanced and natural. I also picked up a SBA 3 brace, for a good deal. If anything it'll get put on my next pistol build.

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John 14:6, Luke 21:11

I use a Kel Tec PLR-16.

Some would argue it's not truly an AR pistol but it works for me.

I put on it a cheap red dot that's really designed for the rail on your pistol but it fits great on the factory rail and works fine so far.

Short barrel AR's are just too cool.

One on the left has a 16" barrel. One in the middle is a CMMG with a dedicated 22 upper and 11.5" barrel. One on the right has a 10.5" barrel.

The CMMG has honestly never failed shooting CCI subs or SV ammo. Suppressed or not.

I have 10.5" .556. It's a Jeep gun for coyote hunting & short enough it doesn't bang on the roll bar or a pain pulling it from behind the seat. I've got about $350 into it including dot sight, back up flip sight, wrist brace & sling. Weighs 7.5 lbs. Part of the reason I bought it was a good price & 5.56 is a good coyote caliber (not good for much else including home defense IMO). For home defense I'd go w/ a 9mm - they're lighter, have fewer parts, little recoil, don't over penetrate, cheaper to feed. A plus in my mind is a mounted weapon light (try to open a door w/ a gun in 1 hand & a light in the other).

If you want something other than 5.56, check out the CMMG Banshee pistol in 9mm, 10mm, 45 acp, or 5.7. I have a 5’”barrel Banshee in 9mm and just bought another in 5.7. Took the 5.7 to the range yesterday for the first time. Ammo is expensive, but it shoots like a .22 rf (although louder and more powerful, virtually no recoil). Since it is centerfire, it is much more reliable than a .22 rf. I put a Silencerco Sparrow on mine and it is a real *****cat to shoot. Perfect AR format Hd gun for a lady or small person. I also have 5.56 in 7.5 and 10 inch barrels, but as others have said, I would hate to use them in an enclosed space without a suppressor. CMMG also sells 40 round 5.7 magazines that will fit a standard AR lower. This allows you to buy just the CMMG upper and use on any standard AR lower pistol, SBR rifle lower, or M16. Yes, I did put the 5.7 upper on an M16 lower yesterday and shot it in full auto. It was a hoot. (an expensive hoot, but still).

I had a few, but they're all SBRs now.

I'm not chancing the fickleness of the ATF.

I've worked with enough to know I dont trust their grasp of the law.

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Un-Reconstructed Southerner