what's it worth - model 12 trap?

[crsides]

I looked at a small gun collection yesterday. One I left there was a model 12 with a Y serial number. Not marked trap, but it had the high stock dimensions of a trap gun, 30" full, rib. Beautiful wood, bluing. porter about 8-10" back from the muzzle. I think after market pad. I got no idea what its worth other than model 12's in general are stacked up at gunshows at depressed prices and still not selling.

He's looking for $1000.

thanks

[Drm50]

Buying M12 Trap Guns can be good place for a novice to get scuffed proper.
There are more M12 Traps put together by Simmons and like firms and individual smiths than factory jobs. I’m rusty on them but one way to spot aftermarkets was the tapped hole for front bead. You could see it in bore. As far as price $1K would be fair price for hi condition original trap. As with all guns from target games they could have a lot of wear that would detract from price. If it’s aftermarket gun $1000 might be a tad high. $500 or $600 would be more like it.

[H Richard]

The aren't bringing what they used to. Even in really nice condition I have seen them in the $600 range.

[pjpjr]

Originally Posted by H Richard

The aren't bringing what they used to. Even in really nice condition I have seen them in the $600 range.

Here in NE Ohio I have recently seen M12 trap guns for less than $600.......$450-$500 for nice condition guns.
They do not sell well here. I just purchased a very nice condition field grade for less than $200.
You can get alot of gun for the money in used M12 shotguns!

[2152hq]

'Y' ser# Model 12 is a Post-64 mfg.
That usually makes a difference in the price as it does with all Winchesters pre and post 64 mfg.

IIRC the Y series Model 12 was made from the early 70's into the 80's when Olin sold off Winchester to USRAC.

They made several different grades during that time, but the TRAP Grade was made during all the years the Y was mfg'd.
So you commonly see more Yseries TRAP grades than any other Y grade.

They changed some small parts to stampings that were orig machined parts. Standard stuff in the post 64 mfg'g changes to other models.
The biggest change was the use of investment casting parts for the recv'r and the trigger group.
That turns a lot of people off.
But Winchester supposedly used the same investement cast frame and trigger group for the final 2 years of the pre-64 Model 12 as well.

The blueing and polishing on the Y isn't usually up to pre-64 standards.
You can pick on them just like any other post 64 vs pre 64 Winchester.

They are decent shotguns all around. They just suffer from Post64 syndrome.

Don't get too deep into them and you're OK.
ANY Model 12 is a hard sell right now.

[dave1918a2]

Around here a Model 12 trap will bring maybe $600 if pristine. Standard Y serial # gussied up maybe $400. Friend of Mine just bought a 1913 vintage 20 Ga in pristine condition for $300. At $1000 it should be a Black Diamond Trap.

[crsides]

Thanks guys. Worse than I thought.

[n c rod]

I’ll use my pristine model 12’s for oars on my jonboat before selling at those prices. If it’s a original m-12 trap $1000.00 and up depending on condition. Do not expect to find old Winchester Shotgun prices on a Smith and Wesson forum. Keep looking, just somewhere else. Model 12’s are great guns. The Y in the serial number means produced after 1964. Not the kiss of death.

[Bill Bates]

Heed what Drm50's words.

In my years of buying and trading firearms I've seen more upgrade and gussied up Model 12 than originals of the more rare versions. When I pickup a Trap, Skeet, Heavy Duck or Pigeon grade M12 I grab my loop and start looking for signs of upgrade.

Honestly, Winchesters, along with Colts and Lugers, are guns one can get burned on very badly.

Oh and Model 12s have been flat to declining in value since 2008. I'm not sure I would pony up $1000 on M12 Trap Y gun.

Of course this is just one guys opinion.

[Drm50]

Y in serial does kill interest for serious Win people. In fact they have no interest in post 63 Wins of any model. A post 63 is just another gun. The remakes of 12s and 42s had a market back when they came out. That market is drying up. There are know more 12s and 42s on market than ever. The old guys who have them are passing and new generation don’t want them. Collector grade will always be desirable. Shooters not so much.
Rem 31, Ith 37 and M12 all about even in shooters.

[6518John]

Originally Posted by n c rod

Do not expect to find old Winchester Shotgun prices on a Smith and Wesson forum.

I think we have some of the most knowledgeable gun experts in America on this forum and across all brands.

I have absolutely no doubts about the quality and beauty of the Model 12 and I would hate to imagine what they would retail for in today’s market if you could replicate their built (which I doubt you could). And I can’t think of another gun that has dropped as precipitously in price over the years.

[Mike, SC Hunter]

No mdl 12's were ported by the factory. I'd pass.

[Drm50]

Generally, I would say most pre 64 Wins have dropped considerably in price. The 1897 shotgun has a little traction because of Cowboy stuff. The 22 rifles do well but so are all the others of same era. The model 70 market is soft in standard chambering and models. The old Winchesters prices are nuts. They are getting big bucks out of what were parts guns 20yrs ago.
About the only Win that crosses all this is 1894s. They hang in there and are still being made by somebody. They go from antique, to post war, to post 63 and beyond.

[Mike in Reedley]

Porting destroys value. A ported Y model is in the $300 range. Go to any ATA shoot and look at the guns. You won’t find many (if any) model 12s or any other pump guns.